I started to title this thread "Gee, I wonder how bad I screwed myself?", but I figured something more descriptive was better. I build artificial reefs in the ocean. I do this with another contractor who owns the tug and barge, I own the trucks and equipment. I had left my 580 SK at the dock and he used it in the yard a little. When I got back, I saw that the exhaust pipe had rusted at the bottom and leaned over where it could hit the loader arm and gotten knocked off. He said he had already ordered a new one. I asked if he had kept it covered. He said he had except for once it had been in a light sprinkle for 3-5 minutes until he could get it covered. He had run it a few times since then, so I didn't worry about it. I cranked it up and let it run at about 11-1200 rpm for 15-20 minutes just to let it warm up and make sure the batteries were charged (no load at all). It ran smoothly with no smoke. I put a tight fitting plastic bottle on the exhaust pipe and we went to sea. Later that evening at the reef site, I cranked it up and began unloading the barge. It skipped when I first started it. After 3 or 4 minutes, I noticed I was getting a lot of exhaust fumes, and realized I had left the bottle on the muffler below the hood line. Once I took that off, I saw it was putting out a lot of grey fuel smelling smoke. At this point, if we had been on the hill, I would have shut it down and fixed it, but, my friend had $8-9,000 invested in getting me out there. It usually only takes me 40 minutes to offload a barge full. The machine had very low power which got lower as I ran it, and the smoke got darker. Every time I had to wait for the tug to circle back to the buoy, I shut it off. It always cranked right back up very well. I ran it for 3 or 4 fifteen minute sessions with about 5 minutes rest in between. By the end, it was so weak it could hardly lift the boom with no load, wouldn't turn but about 1000rpm-no load, and the smoke was black as coal. I really hope I didn't wash a cylinder or burn a piston. This is a 580 sK phase 3 with a naturally aspirated, mechanically controlled, Case 4-390. (Cummins B3.9) In the morning I will check the air intake system, loosen the injector lines one at a time to see if one makes less difference, pull and inspect the injectors, and do a compression test. Does anyone have any ideas I may have missed?
the plastic bottle may melted and drained down on the fuel return line from injector pump to fuel tank blocking off the return [ I'm thinking plastic return line] GL
Good thought, but the bottle was unhurt. I put it back on for the return trip. (Wonder what's in Mountain Dew to make them need such tough bottles? )
As soon as I read "I left it at the dock", makes me suspect fuel quality.. If your buddy put fuel in it from the dock, you better change the fuel filter pronto.. That's where I'd start..
I think your on the right track with the air system Mitch. With the broken exhaust your filter maybe full of black soot.
If all else fails remove both the inner and outer air filter and see if it runs any better. The hose on the air cleaner could be collapsing or separated inside.
I cant see how the restricted exhaust with "port under the hood" did much other than maybe the air filter picked up some soot; perhaps the turbo was slowed due to the backpressure so it made for reduced air flow to the engine ... thus the soot production. FYI Certain State's agencies feel awful about that.
Fuel quality was my first thought, but I was thinking black smoke pointed more toward low air or too much fuel. They mostly run salvaged fuel that has been through a homemade fuel polisher without problems. They sometimes get thousands of gallons from ships and boats they clean out before sinking them on reefs. They run it in their cranes and the tugs (though I'm guessing a 1940's EMD 2-stroke sucking 75 gph would be pretty tolerant) without any problems, but it was my first thought. But, it'll be high tide soon, so I'll find out more.
Well, I'm very happy tonight, even though y'all can all guess how bad I hate to say this: Granpa was right I appreciate tinkerer backing up my thinking on this, but not that old guy. The outer air filter was black, but didn't seem too bad. The inner filter however, was so full of fine soot it had sucked flat! Pulled both filters and started engine, smoked for 30 seconds, then cleared right up. Put in two new filters, it ran fine.
Good to hear. Send your partner the bill for the new filters.........because he sure as heck didn't just run it "for a few minutes"
:falldownlaugh
That is good news Mitch. I ran a grease (lube) truck for a contractor for several years. I found that the inner air filters are routinely ignored by people servicing machines. I guess a lot of people think if the outer isn't too bad the inner is OK.
Call me weird, but I woke up in the middle of the night thinking again about this one ........ a bit of a Eureka moment ...... Does anyone else have an opinion as to why the inner (secondary) filter had sucked flat and the outer one was still in shape (at least Mitch doesn't say it wasn't)..? Now IMHO the idea of that secondary filter is simply for insurance if the primary filter fails catastrophically for some reason. Usually even if the primary filter is absolutely clogged up with cack ythe secondary one is generally as clean as a whistle. So how in this case did the soot manage to get past the primary filter and then get trapped in the secondary one..? That's not logical. Mitch, if it was me I'd be looking very closely at the filtration efficiency of your primary filter if you are using a "will fit" element.
I would think it is the amount of cubic feet of air over the amount of square inches of filter area. The inner one has to be almost spotless to keep the air flow up. I diligently serviced a lot air cleaners and no matter what I did eventually the inner one had to be replaced. Some seemed to last a lot longer than others. I was never in favor of blowing an inner air filter with compressed air. I don't know what happened in Mitch's tractor, maybe the primary wasn't seated or sealed properly when it was installed. The inner is a backup filter but it still stops a lot of fine particles that the primary ones let thru. To bad precleaners are not practical on small machines. Nige and anyone who works around Caterpillar equipment knows what a difference they make, especially in the air cleaners service intervals time wise.
Particle size distribution: reference dieselnet https://www.dieselnet.com/tech/dpm_size.php (cant get the graph to show up here) Notice the peak where most particles occur, could this be small enough to pass the outer yet large enough to be caught on the inner? jj
As a matter of practice we replace the secondary element whether it needs it or not (they're like your car insurance - you have it hoping you never need it but it's good to have if anything goes t1ts up) every 4th time we change a primary element. We don't even blow primary elements out. They run until they plug and then get horsed out and a new one fitted. That said I don't think I can ever recall seeing a secondary filter in anything other than perfect condition UNLESS their had been some type of major failure in the primary element. More than once I've looked at a secondary and thought to myself "now why the ***k am I changing that?" ....... it makes no sense to me that soot (or dust for that matter) could get through the primary element only to get caught in the secondary. Usually the primary is a much "tighter weave" than the secondary because it has much more surface area. Tinkerer, up to a point you're right about turbine precleaners. However when you have a climate like here that is alternately dusty then rains (a LOT) even in the space of a single day they are a positive PITA. The turbine assembly clogs up with what started as dust that then gets wet and hardens like concrete. Then the turbine goes out of balance and the whole shooting match falls apart.
I guess I owe you fellows a little more info. The primary filter was dirty enough to be due for a change. I change the inner filter every other time I change the outer one. There was a spot in the outer filter I can best describe as a "weak spot", for lack of a better term. Some manufacturer's service manual that I own says the primary purpose of the inner filter is to be a safety while you change the outer one, or if it is damaged. When I first started the machine that morning, it seemed fine, but that was just high idle, no load. When we reached the site that evening I operated it under load for about 5-7 minutes with the top of the muffler sealed tightly. This appears to have caused a rusty spot on the top of the muffler to blow out. This caused all the exhaust to go straight into the precleaner. (I had EGR ) This may or may not have contributed to the "weak spot". Even after taking the bottle off, since the stack was gone, a lot of the exhaust was probably still sucked in. I'm sure this was the source of the soot. After I took the bottle off, the machine's performance declined quickly. This machine does have a precleaner. My experience in this nearly sub-tropical coastal plain climate nearly mirrors Nige's, but I find them worth it, even when I am chipping the hardened dust out with a chisel.
Nige: You're weird. Well, you asked for it, lol. And by the way, lots of the people on this forum are weird in the same way, so you are indeed in good company! LOL I've read a couple articles that stated and showed the curves, modern air filters actually get more efficient at removing particles as they get more plugged up. Changing filters too often actually allows more dirt into the engine as new filters are less efficient than filters with some dirt in them. Supposedly the best practice is to change filters only when the restriction indicator (which you have religously checked to insure it's working, right?) says to and never blow out or otherwise clean an air filter. I agree, change the safety filter at any sign of dust or dirt, and regularly anyway, at least once a year. Cheap insurance.