Hey guys, new to the forum. Been scouring the internet lately for info on various machines. Im looking at pulling the trigger on a Cat 307. Its a mid-90s machine with 7600 hours. I am looking for a machine for personal use on my property only...pulling stumps, moving rocks, moving/stacking logs, clearing out some land for food plots/livestock etc. I was originally looking for something in the 5 ton range but recently found this Cat 307. Other than the weight and steel tracks probably doing damage to my lawn areas I can't see why a heavier machine wouldnt be better...so Im seriously considering it. Overall seems to be in good shape, bottom rollers and one final drive are recently replaced. I realize this a very subjective question...but is 7600 hours anything to be concerned about? Still a ton of life left in the motor and hydraulics? Are there any specific issues I should look for with mid-90s Cat 307s? What would you guys think is a fair price for a machine I described? Thanks! Looking forward to learning more on the forum. I'm hoping to find an excavator this year and next spring/summer look for a small dozer to use around the property as well...but one thing at a time.
Why are you dead set on an excavator I wouldn't use a 1 ton and trader to haul it around it's a little on the heavy side 307 is a nice size and at 7600 hours if it's been maintained I would expect that it will be ok for property work it's hard to say some machines wont make it to 7000 hours before they need a pump others might get to 12000 it's all variable It probably has a perkins motor in it and if it does most perkins I have been around are relatively trouble free I might suggest you bromden your horizons beyond an excavator and look at backhoes there are a lot of things a backhoe will do that an excavator wont there is only a few things the excavator can do that a backhoe can't and you generally find backhoes much cheaper and it's really the same size 307 size machines get spendy to buy a 90s model will be on the cheaper side tho
Well I don't plan on transporting it ever...once its on my property it will stay there unless I sell it. It has a 4 cylinder Mitsubishi for an engine. I guess I just figured an excavator would suit my purposes better than a loader/backhoe. My reasoning being a huge part of what I'll be doing is picking things up and moving them around...I feel with a backhoe I'll have to back up to it, lift it, then spin around and maneuver the machine to where I want to drop it, then spin the seat around and drop it....etc. With an excavator it seems much quicker to just pick up the rock/log and spin around to drop it. I also plan to use the machine largely in my wood lots and on a powerline ROW collecting logs for firewood and figured a tracked machine would be more up to the rough terrain than a wheeled machine. I do certainly see the advantage to having a large bucket though. I have a tractor with FEL now but its very small, would not be up to the task of moving large quantities of dirt like a loader might be...however I dont suspect I'll be doing much of that. I'm open to suggestions though...if you have reason to believe a loader/backhoe would be better than an excavator I'd love to hear them. I do agree they can be found cheaper...I've seen quite a few listed for sale for much lower prices than comparable year/hour excavators so thats definitely a selling point.
My CAT has been very good. I got it with 3200 hours about 4 years ago and haven't had any major problems. My bucket needs new pins and bushings and one of the Cat brand batteries went bad. A thumb would be a big help for what you want to do. I don't have one but have been looking. I think around $15,000 would be a fair price. I paid $21k for mine with a mangled door. ( Used door cost me $1500 ) My backhoe just wasn't doing well with the soggy land I have. I mostly use it for snow removal.
Thanks Pixie - appreciate the info. Yes it does have a thumb which would be very handy for me. And you're right there with what I was hoping to pay for it. My only real hold up is the 7600 hours...it seems high to me. But on the other hand where it will only be used by me on my land I can't imagine I would accrue more than a few hundred hours per year tops, so at that rate I would hope it would last for many many more years for me. Do you have steel or rubber tracks? I assume an 8 ton machine with steel tracks like this will destroy any lawn areas I cross? But is rubber on a machine of this weight really any better? I have seen rubber tracks are available for 307s...is it as easy as buying them and putting them on? Or do other U/C parts need to be swapped before using rubber tracks?
Rubber has some different parts typically You would eat rubber tracks on any type of rock and steel tracks float better with a little finesse you can do a lot and not destroy to much I see your point on why you are set on an ex I just find backhoes way more handy across the board once you get to an 8 ton machine And at that price ballpark i wouldn't have a lot of hesitation Pull some oil samples of the engine hydraulic oil Mitsubishi is pretty reliable
If you do not ever plan on transporting it, you may want to look at a much larger machine. They are cheap because of transporting costs associated with moving from job to job, normally have had profession maintenance, and will do a ton of work that your little one can't do. Just a thought. Beside an 80,000 to 100,000 lb. excavator will give your neighbors something to talk about.
You haven't told us about the size and slopes involved in your property, the size of logs, or whether snow is a problem. I have tractor loader backhoes and excavators. For all around general purpose usage the tlb is more useful. They both dig holes, the excavator just does it a lot faster. But the tlb can pick up a bucket full of rock from the pile beside the road and haul it around behind the garage to improve the road. The tlb can do a good job of pushing snow. The tlb moves around much faster than the excavator. Or buy one of each and then sell the one you don't use as much. What you will sell is your tractor with the front end loader. A tlb with its integrated front end loader is so much better than any tractor with a bolt on loader they shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence.
I did give that some thought initially, but the vast majority of use will be in the woods around my property, I don't think something that large would be much use. And nevermind the neighbors...if my wife looked outside and saw a 100,000 lb excavator I'd be in big trouble! My property is pretty hilly, but no real steep dropoffs to speak of. Being in northern New England its VERY rocky. The low areas can be pretty wet certain times of year, but generally I stay off those spots in wet seasons so its not a big deal. Snow...well by New Years or so we usually have a lot on the ground. I have a 52" front mount snowblower for my tractor and a dedicated plow truck, so I dont need this machine for any snow clearing. I suspect from New Years-May neither an excavator nor TLB will be used too much. Once theres a few feet of snow on the ground there isnt much I can see or do, and late winter/early spring is VERY wet, so I'd have limited use then too. We have about 40-acres of woods, some of which was selectively cut many years ago and the old skidder trails are still somewhat distinguishable, so I was hoping to clear them out a little to better access my wood lot. I don't see needing the loader on a TLB much...which is why I was leaning towards an excavator. And if a project came up where it would be handy I do have a coworker/good friend that lives about a 2 miles down the road from me who has a Case 590, I'm sure I could get my hands on his easy enough if the need arises.
This brings a particular thread to mind lol Borrowing backhoes never ends well If you think an excavator is your best choice more power to you and dont let us steer you wrong we dont see your exact situation TH brought up some really good points about backhoes and on that subject as a guy who makes a living being a backhoe specialist there is not anything you have on your property a backhoe can't handle according to your description. Buy what you think will work and make it work just remember with equipment versatility is the key on a budget
If you haven't done it already, search for 307s and see if you can find many with similar hours or more for sale. The same engine was used in Mitsubishi trucks used in Australia and some other places. See if those have good longevity. I find the excavator much more useful in the woods and for trail repair than the backhoe. The biggest difference is being able to swing more than 180 degrees. You can grab a rock or wad or dirt from one place in the road and put it someplace else without having to situate the machine crosswise to the road or raise/lower the outriggers. With an excavator, you can raise the boom enough to swing 180 degrees without wrecking all the trees next to the road. Both machine will make a mess of your lawn. But if you don't try to turn, the Cat will just flatten it. I have steel tracks with not a lot of tread. I looked into rubber ones but I have a lot of very sharp rocks. I think the rubber would be harder on the lawn because it has a deeper tread and is less slippery. I don't think this machine needs any change in rollers to go to rubber. I am a thrifty person. I've owned the Case backhoe for 15+ years and tried to use it on my woodlot for a couple years before I gave up and bought the excavator. It got stuck a lot and just wasn't handy in the woods. If I want to move material, I have dump trailers and vehicles to tow them.
I really didnt see too many 307s for sale....theres a fair amount of 307B and 307Cs, but not all that many plain 307 that I could find. Yes I feel the excavator will suit me better than a TLB for the same reasons, I can see having to re-position the TLB frequently as being much more of a PITA. I really won't be doing much digging in one location...it'll be used a lot more for picking things up and moving them around. Being able to swing in a full circle without re-positioning will be handy. The areas I see myself using it most would not lend well to the space it takes to position a TLB. My biggest hold up on this particular machine is the hours. I realize it may very likely run without issue for another 3-5000 hours...but it could not too. I would hate to spend $15k and then lose the engine or hydraulic pump and be facing a huge repair bill. It's really just a question of whether or not to dig deeper in my wallet and try to find something with lower hours...or stick with my originally planned budget and get a higher hour machine.
Also, according to this website: http://www.topbid.com/resources/manufacturers/caterpillar-series-and-country-of-origin/ The serial on this machine starts with "2PM" which says Country of Origin is Japan - does that mean this is a grey market machine? Or could it just be that this was built in Japan but still destined for the US market? I didn't see any Japanese writing labels when I looked at it...but then it was dark and it was a quick look. I'm planning to go see it again Monday so I'll look better in the daylight then. If it is a grey market 307 will that make parts sourcing harder? Or are all 307s going to use the same parts?
My guess is that it is a Cat machine made in Japan. Before you put your money out, get the serial number and visit your friendly Cat dealer. They can tell you country of origin and what the machine was speced at. Do not expect all parts to fit if any from a grey market machine. There are often subtle differences. You only need to search thru these forum to see folks trying to source parts for them. They are after all an illegal copy and made to look like the machine they reverse engineered.
Yes, Im planning to contact our Cat dealer first thing tomorrow morning to get their input. Huh? Is that true? I was under the impression grey market machines are still CAT machines...they were just built for a different market, so different requirements/safety standards...and I understand there could be differences in parts, but its not an illegal reverse engineered copy...is it? Still a CAT machine as far as I know...not built by some knock off company.
If it is a grey market Cat, it will still be a Cat machine, but all the manuals will be in Japanese and parts will be hard to find in the US. Dead giveaways for grey maket machines of any make are parallel offset booms, weird paint colors, and any markings/stickers in Japanese.
What do you mean when you say parallel offset booms? Heres a picture of the 307 in question - any obvious giveaways as to whether its grey market?
If you go to Cat, get an SOS kit and test the hydraulic oil and engine oil if you're not comfortable with the engine. The engine is cast iron, inline injection pump and revs to 3,500 in little trucks, hopefully slower in an excavator? don't worry about the engine unless you have some reason to think otherwise. Wouln't hurt to check the oil level in the final drives, if one of those is dry it might make the engine seem cheap. The hydraulics are the main thing though, maybe take two samples from the hydraulics, if the hydraulic system goes bad in a bad way, it's game over.
This is a parallel offset boom: Nothing looks out of the ordinary on that machine, but check the serial anyway. Seems like most of the grey market imports were 7-8 ton machines so being cautious isn't bad. Everything delmer said is a good idea as well.
Oh ok, I see. Thanks. The Serial does start with 2PM...which I found means Country of Origin is Japan. What I don't know is does that automatically make it a grey market machine? Or is it just that it was built in Japan for the US market? There is a lot of conflicting info on the web about whether something is grey market or not. I did not notice any Japanese writing labels when I looked the other day...but it was dark and a quick look, so I may have missed it. I plan to call the CAT dealer in the morning, Im guessing they can answer that for me pretty easily.
Infact, heres another picture from the listing...that Warning label on the lower left looks English to me. I suspect a grey market machine would not have that?
Sorry, I forgot to address this. I'm 99% sure all of the 307's of this vintage were built in Japan. I think 2PM is the correct prefix for US bound machines, but I'm not sure.
That makes sense, when I was searching through the list of prefixes/country of origin I didnt see any 307s from the US...so it would stand to reason any 307s sold in the US back in 95 had originated from Japan. There was multiple prefixes for 307's originating in Japan though, so I guess the question is whether 2PM was the prefix bound for the US as you mentioned. Hopefuilly the CAT dealer can clarify that easily.
Caterpillar Mitsubishi has been building machines in Japan for eons. My 931B is made in Japan and not a grey market machine. I thought all the smaller dozers were built in Japan as well as a lot of other machines. The large excavators are based on Sumitomo's from Japan. That is a pretty clean looking machine for 7600 hours and I'd guess it's not a grey market machine but your Cat dealer or even someone on this forum can likely look it up.
Thanks, thats promising. I'm really thinking if I'm going to move forward I'll get the oil analysis done first...if that checks out I'll likely buy the machine. I assume it takes a few days to get results back from oil testing? Not sure how to handle the buyer...he'll want a deposit to hold it I'm sure but I dont want to really lose a deposit if I back out due to the results.
Get hydraulic samples done at the same time. Seems to me if it's a legit seller that isn't trying to hide something, they would be fine with a deal contingent on the oil test samples coming back OK with nothing major showing. Don't have to be perfect but not showing what would indicate a major failure just around the corner. Losing a deposit would suck but sometimes it's a lot better than buying a machine and having a major problem.
Yes I would agree with that. I'm thinking I'll ask him if he'll take a small (say $50) non-refundable deposit...if I lost that after seeing negative sample results its certainly much less out of my pocket than dealing with a major failure.
I got a Mitsubishi 4D31 or 4D32 in my Caterpillar E70, which was a rebadged Mitsubishi MS070. The hour meter says 5800 hours and she purrs like a kitten. You can get parts, but you have to look for them. Japan liked to use soy based insulation in their wiring. After a few years (mines's a late 80s model) it gets hard and crumbles and rats love it. Check the wiring over well. My wiring smoked this summer and I had to rewire the whole machine and change out 4 relays and switches. Around $900, doing it myself. Keep rat poison anywhere dogs and cats can't reach it on the machine. You can read about it here... HeavyEquipmentForums My E70 is the same size as the 307 and it is a digging beast. I also have a backhoe on my tractor/loader. Each has it pros and cons as noted above. TLBs suck in woods. No room to turn around. They get stuck easy. My foot sinks deeper in mud then my E70's 22 inch wide tracks does. That is where she shines, digging where TLBs get stuck. hugs, Brandi
I have a Komatsu PC75UU-2, with steel tracks, it weighs right at 18000lbs. I find it easier on the grass than my John Deere 60G was with rubber tracks. The lugs on the rubber tracks create big holes, the short grouser bars don’t. With either one you will tear up a lawn quick if you turn. So plan your entry to the lawn with either a straight line or big gradual arc. Woods work- that why I prefer the excavator, don’t have to tear up an acre to move a log, rock etc.