I've been pecking along on doing some badly needed work on the u/c that the previous owner had let slide because he was sick and off his game a bit.
Only the six bolts on top and the four at the final drive were still in it and the six were worn sloppy. TO BE CONTINUED.
I also need to check the final drive out and replace the duo-cone seals on this final drive while the track is off. Does anyone know an affordable way to get the sprocket off? I would like to inspect the gears and bearings my self and then take it to a shop with the new seals and any parts,if I need any, and get it reassembled and the sprocket pressed on to spec.
Best of Luck Charles. Thanks for the Excellent Pics! Nice to see your progress. Post some more when you open up that Finial Drive.
Will do,I'm hoping to get some tips on getting it apart without the proper puller.
I could maybe help when you start opening it up. Hopefully someone that's done it before pops up. Do you have access to the parts manual? Porta-power or large jack? Torch with large rose bud?
I have a parts book and a service manual,a 20 ton air over hydraulic jack. I don't have a portapower. I have done this before years ago but I had the correct tooling via a friend that worked for Cat back before they put GPS on the service trucks. I'm planning on blocking up high enough to roll the frame out this evening and then I will start opening it up.
I'm guessing, but a 20 ton should work. Well lets say it's worth a try, if it hooks up easy enough. With heat from a 3/4" or better rose bud I'd say it'll work if you pour on the heat fast enough. If the hubs real beefy it maybe on the light side. We once pulled a big hub 5" shaft 7" of engagement. 20 ton w/torch nothing, 35 ton maxed out before we started using 2 rose buds wide open. I made the adapters so nothing fell apart when that first Pop Hit! I warned them what going to happen, but I had to Yell Pump! Pump! get those Torches back on!... must of been fun to watch. The assembly was hooked to an overhead trolley 300lb hub 50lb pulling set up. It was a 2 speed porta power. The fit .003 interference/shrink. It went back on at .001. Anyhow, how tall is the pump? How heavy is it? Can you screw or bolt any adapters to it? Maybe just take a picture. Do you remember the rating of the Cat puller? If you look at a cutaway of the sprocket and shaft assembly in the parts book. Does the shaft have a taper where it connects with the sprocket?
Should be able to rent a porta-power relatively cheap.
The hub is splined and tapered and the sprocket is splined and is pressed on the hub. Must be pulled off and then pressed back on.
Taper is great once it moves just a little its free. Splines no surprise, hopefully they aren't rust welded together. Can you use heat when you pull?
Yes, I can heat it. There should be no rust. I just don't know how to pull it with a jack.
Hopefully someone familiar comes along. I'd wait and see.
Yes, I can heat it. There should be no rust. I just don't know how to pull it with a jack. Heat is really a friend when trying to get things apart. I have a friend that uses a very large propane tank to heat things up because its a lot cheaper. One of these days I want to see if I can use a tank the size for outdoor grills to heat with. Charles post a picture of the jack and lets see if it could be practical to use it.
A BBQ tank will work fine with a weed burner or when using an oxy/fuel set up on propane.
Seems big and awkward to use except when on the ground.
Looked at my 977K parts book. Seems to be one of those jobs that I would need to be there to judge what to do without breaking or melting something. Dave is right it would really be good for you to work with someone that's done it before. If you go ahead and have the equipment this is what I'd do. Heat will wreck the duo-cone seals, its probably going to get smokey. I hope you have a beam for lifting. Safety First! Once you get the FD off block it off the ground just like 4" +- resting on the sprocket take apart the side facing up including Bearing and Duo-cone seal. Also the nut that holds the sprocket to the hub. You might save the bearing but I doubt it. You must keep every thing as plum and level as you can so you get an even pull on the sprocket. I know a fancy choker hitch we'll get to that later. You choker a strap to each side of the jack rest it on top of the shaft. Make up a little puller to run through the holes of the sprocket. Make a cross out of box, I, U beam and drill holes on the ends for something like 3/4 threaded rod. Cut 4 pieces of the same or lighter beam to go across the holes in the sprocket. Drill in the center. You need to heat the sprocket hub up fast and evenly. If the heat just soaks into the shaft its not going to work.
""Change"" ""Sorry ran out of Edit Time""! We want to weld up a cross first then put it between the 4 strap legs then pick up the jack.
Here is where I am now.
Here is step by step so far.
Looking good so far. My 977K book talks about a puller to remove the next cover, then a tool to remove the duo-cone seal. Also it looks like you can get behind the bearing cone to pull it or push it off with the sprocket retaining nut. Then remove the finial drive assembly. Keep posting those pictures!
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The final outcome was not what I wanted but it's what I expected..... now to decide if I want to buy a new hub and sprocket or just re-seal it and tighten it up the best I can. I know what it needs but I don't know if it's worth the money it will take to do it right and the only hub I've found is a used one and I don't know if it will be any better than the one I have.
Mighty fine work Charles! Did you use the adjusting nut to push the bearing off? What did you use to pull sprocket off? Do you have a tool for the duo-cone seals? Great pictures thanks!
It seems the sprocket is loose then? How loose is it? Is the gear damaged on the hub? How much use will the machine get? Have you punched the part numbers into machinery Trader? If I felt it wasn't that loose and for a farm machine I would Lock Tite it using primer. Use yellow or blue. Primer will harden it up in large gaps. 400F to brake it loose.
I did use the nut to push the bearing off and then the sprocket slid right off. I really don't want to buy a new hub and sprocket right now but I might if I can find the right deal i aftermarket parts. I'm not sure what kind of primer you are talking about. Do you have a picture or name? I have bought locktite in large bottle before.
Did some talking with my old Locktite rep. With the beating going to those splines go with High strength large gap 680 retainer compound would be best. Heating to 400F will break it apart latter. If I used a primer (I would in this case for sure) the only 2 in the toolbox. My chose for this. SF 7649 N, 30 min. assembly time, slower cure time. Tougher with the slower cure. (SF 7471 T 25 min A.T. faster cure time, can fill bigger gaps. "" Do Not Use on Warm Parts Sets Up Real Fast ""). It would be a good idea to do the job on a cool day it will give more assembly time. Check back for more if you want to do it. Best of Luck
Wire brush everything free of oil and dirt. Then go over it with contact cleaner and compressed air. Then just a very light coat of primer on both parts let it dry. Then put locktite on both parts. Don't wait the activator will harden things up in the open air! I'll look for a good place to buy primer later a 4.5 oz. can should be $40 to $50.
Blue loctite is removable with standard wrenches but I think it's worth fixing right after having everything apart.
I agree. Charles is checking out the new or good used parts. Also loose can be Too... Loose for a hack like this to work. I think wire brushing the splines putting it back on with a little light oil and hand tighten the nut. Put a dial indicator in a few places and rock it side to side, also try to rotate it will give a better idea what can be done. The 680 can fill .020 add the primer .035. New is way better that joint takes a hell of a pounding.
I have already ordered a 50 ml. bottle of Locktite 638,I picked it because of the tensile strengyh being the highest of 4500 psi. Is the primer compatible with it and is 50 ml. enough do you think?
I would like to put new parts in it but FINDING them is the key. My usual supplier can only locate a used hub and I think he quoted me $600 for it and I don't know if it will be any better than mine. I found a new one on e-bay that they claim will work for it. My part is #6k4618 and theirs is 4v3396,I was hoping someone could tell me if thats a match.
Loctite 660 is for worn splines and key ways. Best strength without primer. Used some on bushings for backhoe swing where bore was not perfectly round. Certainly not the cheapest but strongest for the application. I'd probably put some anti-seize on the splines. 660 fixed a common problem on Mazda Miata's with the cam or something. On my phone so can't post a link.
Some spots in-between the inside and outside splines probably have excessive clearance. The primer in theory will help make everything solid.
Got to the computer. You can use activator but I read it lowers the strength. Fills gaps up to .5mm (.020"). LOCTITE 660 - Retaining Compound - Henkel Adhesives (henkel-adhesives.com)
Thanks Cat977 and Welder Dave for the info. I might still have to use it but I went ahead and ordered a new aftermarket hub,hoping that will tighten it up,we'll see.
Well, I'm ready to start building up the roller frame and rebuild the track adjuster cylinder and I have a new hub on the way but I don't know if that will tighten up the sprocket enough. It looks to be like the splined center of the sprocket is changeable if it's available and I could find one.
Good to see the project keep going! I'm surprised to see an insert and the fact it looks pretty good. Do you see it listed in parts book? Those screws don't hold it in. I'm guessing more splines inside and a shrink/press fit. Is the whole taper inside look good? Can you measure the taper on each end with a telescoping gage and a mic.? Then compare the amount of taper over the same distance on the hub?
I could not find anything except a complete sprocket group in the parts book. I don't have anything to measure the taper. I guess when my new hub gets here I can see how far it will slide into those splines before it starts to get tight,I might still have to glue it.
You can check on the fit with just the 2 pieces before the installation. You also find the distance where the engagement stops. The really special fits I use Prussian Blue and Red Lead. Thin stuff it would show you just how good the fit is. Mostly I put a really light coat of layout dye on one piece slide to together wack it with a dead blow. Pull it apart and see what the engagement looks like. Lay the sprocket down on some blocking to get rid of the effects of gravity. Hang the hub off a hoist for the best work. 16 oz. on Amazon for $17.
16 oz. is a lot. You can also get the contrasting red. Plasta gage might be of use if you think the taper is off a lot. Best of Luck
thanks,I'm hoping for the best but planning for the worst.
You know, I've been wondering if there might be a way to convert over to a segmented sprocket somehow, maybe from a D4E or something.
Well I finally got it all apart, the gears and bearings look good.
Can anyone tell me what this part number is, the seal that I am pointing to? I can't find it in my parts book.
Is it for this.? Looks like you need ref #9 - 2S-5867 Seal. I may have mentioned this before but I'm not sure the Parts Manual you have is the correct one for your machine.
I have the 2s5867 and it doesn't look like the one I am pointing at. Maybe it has been changed?
The torn up seal doesn't look anything like what you need. Can you measure the places they fit together. The seal in your hand is the right type of seal. Only problem that could be is wrong size. It has the right shape. It should have the feel of hard rubber or soft plastic. The cup faces the grease.
Have you ever used the green without a primer? No. 638 it fills up to .015 and is 4500 psi and starts to set in 4minutes. The splined show a little wear but look to be good enough for this. I bought a new hub but I'm going to save it and if this doesn't work for long I will replace the sprocket too when I go back in there.
This won't be the proper way to do it. There is no guarantee you will have a good outcome. If I was there I would have a better feel for what to do. 638 will definitely work without a primer. It is a fast setup product, so primer would make it setup even faster, so I wouldn't use it. I think you should press them together with your jack to help tighten things up along with the 638. I think the press on would help send you towards the hub and sprocket running truer and with smaller gaps. You should check the run out before you mount the assembly. Also it may setup fast but doesn't get up to full strength for a couple days or more. Once you press it on remove the jack and don't even touch it for a good while. From the company. LOCTITE® 638 is designed for the bonding of cylindrical fitting parts, particularly with narrow bond gaps approaching .00984” The product cures when confined in the absence of air between close-fitting metal surfaces and prevents loosening and leakage due to shock and vibration.
I have an idea that I am going to try for getting it tightened up some and I will not mount the unit for a couple of days. If it works I will post my method......if it doesn't I will regroup and try something else.
I've mentioned it before but Loctite 660 is the strongest Loctite and fills gaps up .020" (.5mm). 638 lists gaps up to .25mm. It is strongest when used without a primer. Either 638 or 660 could work for the application though. I put a link for the different Loctite retaining compounds below. LOCTITE 660 - Retaining Compound - Henkel Adhesives (henkel-adhesives.com) Retaining Compounds (vehicle-repair-solutions.com)
Any particular reason your idea is top secret? There is an incredible wealth of knowledge on this forum so I would suggest telling us what your idea for the repair is. Chances are very good that it's been tried before and someone can say if it works or not. Don't worry if it seems odd. People are trying to help you fix your machine the best and most cost effective way.
I will take some pics as I do it and describe what I'm doing and then if it works,good and if it don't,bad. I'm not trying to be secret it's just that it takes longer to try to explain it without pictures.
I looked at that link a couple weeks ago when one of ya'll posted it. The reason I went with 638 is because I got it for a good deal on E-bay delivered to my door and it was the strongest one on there, I actually liked the sound of the 660 better but I couldn't find a deal on e-bay for it.
If your idea doesn't work, will it make it harder to fix with another option? Never thought that what you could find on e-bay for a deal is a criteria for what you buy. I don't mind going to an industrial supply to get what I need. I guess I prefer to not to buy online unless I have to.
I appreciate the help that I get on these pages but I'm not looking for critics of my choices to try and make me second guess everything,that's why I'm not going to post my method until I am through assembiing it and then time will tell. There is no doubt that it would last longer if I used a new hub and sprocket. I already have the hub but I want to try this idea that I have and see if it will hold together for about 200 hours and then I will put new parts in it and also salt tracks on it. The machine has been sitting for 20 years so I want to spend sparingly right now until I see if the trans and engine are going to hold up. P.S. there are no industrial supply places nearby enough for me to go by when I have to work 7am to 6 pm with 30 minutes for lunch.
It doesn't hurt to mention your proposed repair. There is centuries of experience on this forum and there's a real good chance someone has encountered a similar problem to yours. There may not be a need for new parts if a good repair is done. Only you can second guess yourself but sounds like you aren't confident enough to want to post what you plan on doing. That could be a mistake. If people need the right parts for a repair, they make arrangements to get the right parts instead of making excuses. Seen it too many times where someone posts and then doesn't want to listen to experience on how to fix the problem. Then they get upset and say no one tried to help them.
You're probably right, except I'm not going to blame anyone if my hardheaded mistakes are to blame. Here's a question I have came up with while not sleeping last night....why would JB weld not be the best for this application?
well,I cleaned up the sprocket and hub then sat the sprocket on the hub dry,to see how it looked and it slid down freely until the hub splines were sticking through about 1/8". I'm not going to try to use it,I'm going to shop for a new sprocket ,and bearing ro the new hub that I already have.
Splines are worn in the sprocket, hub or both? Loctite 660 is for repairing splines if required. Would have to follow directions very carefully. Did you take any pics.? JB weld is low on the totem pole as far as epoxies go. There are much better products for specific applications. JB weld works great for some applications but is more a general purpose epoxy. Belzona is hard to find but is apparently the best of the best as far as epoxies go.
They are both worn,I'm just going to get a new sprocket...that seems to be the best option for a lasting repairalthough I thought about using the epoxy and then running a bead with a 7018 where the hub splines and sprocket splines are easily accessible,but I'll save that for a last ditch effort sometime maybe on a tractor that is in worse shape overall than this one.
Here's the new hub slid into the old sprocket. It looks better than the old hub but I am going to try and find a new sprocket. Does anyone know if a reconditioned sprocket would have new splines or just a new rim?
If the splines have never gotten loose, or been subjected to corrosion they should be fine. If you plan on putting it together yourself be sure everything is very clean. Including deburring all edges and flat filing all dings. Don't use anything more than a very lite oil to assemble. You want a metal to metal fit without any galling from pressing to far. I would use layout dye to check the fit before finale assembly.
my sprocket was loose when I disassembled it. Not floppy but I didn't have to use a puller. I would buy a new aftermarket one but the chinese parts have suddenly disappeared. I found one new one in miami for $571 on e-bay,said there were three available and it had the "make offer" option so I decided to make an offer for two of them and I offered $950 for two,they answered back by upping the listing price to $5000 and countering my offer to the tune of $1500 per unit.My other option is a used,reconditioned for $800. My question is whether they can actually build up the splines and machine back down or are they just welding on a new rim and calling that reconditioned?
You need a very specialized machine to cut the tapered splines. It could be they put in inserts like you have on your sprocket. $800 sounds like a fairly good price for a sprocket with newly installed outer teeth. I don't believe they would install new outer teeth if the splines were bad. That fellow in Miami probably bought those sprockets cheap at an auction. Not a lot of market out there for them, unless they use them on a few other machines. You might want to send him a last and final offer. Have you tried Cat? I kind of get a base price of cost from what their charging.
The place in Miami is an aftermarket dealer. They have a bunch of parts on ebay. I wonder where you can buy the inserts? My sprocket will tighten up some before it presses past the range it should be but I don't think it will be to spec so I'm thinking about using the retainer and knocking it on to the right place and run it. I am going to put new ring on it first and I'm going to call about the used one and see what's been done to it.
Went back to looking at your sprocket, it has quite a bit of wear. I bet the chains/rails probably do also. I wouldn't put a new sprocket on. It would probably run rough because the spacing on the chain wouldn't match the spacing on the sprocket. Call some track shops to see if they've heard about that insert for the sprocket before. The old sprocket to new hub is sounding better. Be careful of welding the sprocket to the hub it could shrink the bore inside the hub.
Thanks, I was only going to weld it if I used both of the old parts. I will just use the retaining compound with the new hub.
I just can't bring myself to pay $800 for a used sprocket. I know of a couple of parts tractors with complete finals for not a whole lot, $3000.
Can you take a close up picture of the splines on the hub and the drivers/backside of the sprocket. What I'm looking for is where the damage stops and you see undamaged right next to it.
Things don't Look too bad. The hub looks like it has the most wear. It would help to have more pictures with different types of lighting and angles. Try setting up a trouble light and turning off the flash. Take some pictures of the other side of the sprocket splines. Take some pictures of the rails and bushings. You might have to use multiple posts to fit the pictures in. The undercarriage parts wear into each other. Changing one piece and not all could upset the apple cart.
Right, I just showed the hub so you can see the wear, it won't be used. Nothing will change on the track system at this time. I have 200-300 hours left before the bushings wear through I think so I am going to run it and then scrap them and get a new set of SALT. I hate dry tracks.
Both hub and shaft show wear from running loose only cure is unworn parts. The hub needs to be pressed on shaft when put together. Good luck Bob
Wanted to make sure I am comprehending this correctly. Is this saying that the sprocket should go past flush of the hub splines by .06-.18 or am I backwards.
This is a place to have a good picture of what they want. It could could be pushed past or sticking out. It has a range of .12 or like say 1/8". If you assemble the 2 pieces together by hand with a gentle wack with a deadblow is the shoulder in or out? The splines on the sprocket are distorted by running loose and may cause the hub not to go in as far as it should or it may go in too far. Using the layout dye can tell you where the 2 pieces are hitting each other. Using new pieces against worn pieces is a tricky business. But sometimes you just have to do the best you can under mitigating circumstances. Let me remind you this is not doing things "By the Book" and a good outcome is not promised. Best of Luck
I understand, I coated the sprocket with dycum and slid them together,didnot hit it because getting them apart is a problem with my wife helping me lift the sprocket, it looked like its matching ok. I posted a pic last week trying to show that the sprocket does not slide all the way down before it gets tight. It has about a 1/4-1/2" before flush. I intend to put a good coat of retainer on both parts and slide it together and then smack it down to as close to flush as I can get. I will post some picks later of how I am blocking up the hub,gear and case and how I will protect the cther end of the hub while I hit it.
Your backwards the The sprocket should be proud after pressing it and unless you press it it won't stay tight. Bob
I don't believe it will get tight and still be proud, I realize that it needs to be pressed on but there's nowhere around here that I know of that does it except the dealership and I don't want to spend the money that they would have to have because they want to sell all new parts to put it together. I gave $9500 for the tractor and it would probably cost half that amount for them to assemble the FD.
On June 12 I think I thought there was supposed to be a picture of the 2 together but I never saw a picture. Bob's right about the need to press them together. The Loctite can help to hold them together and fill up any gaps. On straight splines the Locktite probably would hold fine, depending.... On a taper it wants to come apart. In a way you are expanding the sprocket and shrinking the hub. Think of it like wood and glue the glue won't work without a tight joint. If you put Locktite on the pieces, the pieces might not even touch each other. You "Need" to press them together to squeeze out the excess Locktite, almost like gluing 2 boards together using clamps. But you need to go even further. You need the hub and the sprocket to always clamp each other together. Wood has pores/grain/imperfections/growth rings for the glue to mate them together. When the glue drys you can take the clamps off, jobs done. Steel has micro pores, ect.....,but not enough. You have to leave the clamps on, or the Locktite won't help you. Changes of temperature, fibration, running back and forth will cause the tapered splines to loosen up. Once they loosen even a little the whole thing is loose. That is not true for a straight shaft. I have to go right now but I thought I was thinking before about using your jack to put it back together.
Yes,I thought about doing it with the jack and I might try it but the only thing I have to press against is the bottom of my bucket on the loader and the VERY MOST I could hope for there would be 10-12 tons of resistence. I was thinking of driving it on with a big hammer and a tube that fits over the hub and will contact the sprocket. I know neither one is ideal but I'm going to try one or the other tommorow. The picture I thought I sent is not on here now,I will check my camera and see if I still have it.
I used taper pins a lot when positioning big machines at the Power Plant. I would use totally clean nickel based Never Seize on them. Most people put them in dry. Dry is fast and solid. After a while.... though rusted in solid. Sooooooooo.... When installing the pins the Never Seize would be thinned with medium weight oil. You could hit them all day and they would just bounce back at you, hit 'em hard enough and they’ll bounce right out of the hole. Turn and push them to get the excess out of this really thin paste and then easy hits like a heavy dead hit that just drops on the pin. Quick raps won't work at least not as quickly. You will probably have to press your pieces together I think. Also you must fully press them before the Locktite starts hardening. You need a good setup or some extra hands. I have never seen the progress pictures. It would be best to set it up as to get a full press.
The best that I can do with the jack is setting it up and pressing against the bottom of the bucket on my loader until it starts lifting the front of the tractor but I don't know if that would be enough to do it. I have some plans going on in my head for building a press for the next time but it will take a while to get the material together.
I should look back at some of the pictures...... What about using the nut......... Can you set the unit on an I beam, then the FD. then jack, then chain the beam to the bucket. Trouble would be the bore of the hub may shrink too much.
I think I will build a cage to work as a press with my jack,I have it pictured in mt head now. It will take another week or so to get the materials to build it and assemle it but I am confident that it will work.
How far do you think the sprocket will travel inward from the point where it begins to tighten and stops moving by hand once I start to press it on with the setup I'm planning to build next week? I only have about 1/4-3/8" before the splines are flush. I wish I had a new sprocket but I can't get one.
I'm going to order some 660, I found it on e-bay. How much do you think I should order for this fit? Thanks for the advice,I was in a hurry before and I'm hard headed and just didn't read everything correctly about the properties of these compounds. Now I'm slowing down and rethinking everything before I try to assemble the parts.
If you use Loctite 660 it will only dry if the parts are .5mm max. gap. In air it won't dry. I'd guess 2 tubes would be enough and I'd put it on both pieces after making sure they are spotlessly clean. I wouldn't use primer because it lesions the strength. You could use some heat to help it cure faster though. Even a little heater with a tarp to contain the heat would work for a couple hours. A little warm to the touch is all you need and then let it sit another 24 hours to fully cure and have the most strength.
I ordered 2x50ml. tubes.
Got the material together for my final drive press. in
Can't open the pictures. Try the upload a file on the bottom right.
They are posted when I open the thread.
Yea they open up fine today.
You got me Charles. I'd say you bought the threaded rod say 3/4". 4" H-beam x 10' long x 1/4" top and bottom. Now if it was me I'd cut that frame in two and put the block side down to either side and set a big I-bream down the middle, that makes your base. You can set what ever you like on top of it. If you had a few hands or hoist, bolt your jack to another piece of that I-beam you used on the bottom. Figure out your spacing and pin or bolt that to your uprights with the jack pointing down. Best of Luck What ever Way you Go!
that's a little different than what i have planned. I got it cut out today. I will start welding tomorrow, it will only be 4' long,only big enough for a D-4 size sprocket,maybe a D-5. But I'M sure it's going to work. I'll take a bunch of pictures when I start welding.
Well I got the bottom section tacked together.
Well, I couldn't do much last weekend because I threw my back out but I got back on it today and I'm ready to stack it on here and press it. It's not pretty but I believe it will work.
Way to get busy Charles! Pink's not my favorite color, but pink steel is probably Cheaper! The design holds good promise. I like the extra wide spacing between the beams, you can always use cross beams, if you need to. You won't be bending the I beams. Even 3/4" rods have plenty of strength. If the rods start stretching, it will get easier to pump until they break. Best To stop first because you don't want to have the sprocket bounce back and loosen. Before the Lock Tight dries it will behave like a lubricant. At first the steel to steel press fit is what holds it together, but use the lock nut before you release the jack. The Lock Tit will fill in the voids and add grip when it dries. After you give it 20 tons back off on the jack. Because of the wear on the bore of the sprocket and the possible off center push of the jack. It may be a bit tilted. Then let it sit for a week. Don't use a primer unless you you can get it together in 20-25 min. or less.
Well it's done!
It's on there tight and the sprocket splines are a little bit proud of the hub splines. Pink is not my favorite color either LOL put for 25 cents per pound I'll take it,I might paint it a better color one day if I ever get caught up, it worked great.
Yea 25 Cents! Pink's looking Good! That nice little ring of Lock Tite on the top means it filled in Good. On the bottom there will be a lot more. If you used primer there will be hardened drips after some time. Looks Good! That cage could come in mighty handy. It'd be nice if you can hang the jack from the top on a side to side slide. Use it to flatten, bend, some V blocks to straiten shafts. The only Thing the old Press at work had on Yours was it was Tan! LOL... Good Job
Thanks, the press will definitly be used again.
congratulations good job
I'm trying to put my final drive back on and it feels really tight, hard to pull it up and I was wondering if there is some good tricks to make sure the pinion race is going into the bearing.
Cat977, do you know of any good tricks for this problem?
With assemblies in general things should go together fairly easy. When it doesn't most of the time you will need to pull it apart to find out why. You may have damaged the shaft and bore if you pulled too hard on a dry assembly that wasn't going in straight. Did you lubricate the cross shaft? I would use super lube grease on the shaft and bore on the finale. In the picture it looks like there's a good ways to go yet. I would try backing the bolts up till you can rotate the sprocket. I bet you need to release the clutch. "REMEMBER I HAVEN'T DONE THIS JOB BEFORE." I would think it could be wiggled because of the clearance between the gears. Measure the gap between the finial drive casing and the main frame all the way around. Then tighten the bolts by the biggest gap while wiggling. Give a holler on how its going.
I pulled it back apart and found that one of the rollers on the pinion bearing inside the case had dropped down and hung up on the race on the end of the pinion shaft and it damaged it oh so slightly!!! I'm going to have to completly disassemble everything to replace the bearing now. All of this happened with grease packed into the bearing so maybe there was more wear than I thought to allow the roller to drop down.
Good to hear your back on Track! The Super Lube grease is a very light weight synthetic grease. If its used, just a light coat is plenty. Too much could interfere with getting things metal to metal tight. I like it because it stays put and easy to clean up. Oil maybe better.
Just a bit more on this subject. I use homemade guide pins a lot. Cut the heads off a couple bolts. Sometimes long, sometimes so short you need to grind a couple flats on the tip and use a needle nose pliers to get them out. I make them different lengths so you can get one started and then try for the other. Point them on the lathe or grind them. Then have the top tipped back to help cancel out the work of gravity. Have a Nice cold Beer when Done !!! Best of Luck
I got the assembly apart and replaced the bearing with a new aftermarket bearing. I was expecting a Chinese knock off but it turned out to be a Bower USA bearing which is exactly what the OEM part is. Got it all back together and installed, now I'm working on the roller frame.
Its good to see things coming together for you!
Been a busy fall and winter but now with bear,hog and deer season over I can get back to posting about my progress on the loader. I got the left side all back together and used it for a few minutes to take out three big oaks that were in the way of my kennel expansion.Now I have the right side torn down and working on it. No duo-cone leaks on this side so I'm not going as deep on this final. View attachment 251643 View attachment 251643 View attachment 251643
What’s the latest on the crawler?
Well, I decided to take a look and it seems I will have to replace the hub and possibly bearings on this side too.
I wish I had your patience and skill to do that kind of work. Nice job. I can’t wait to see it when your done. Keep us posted with pictures and descriptions. Please and thank you.
Here's the results of when I looked inside
Doesn't look too bad to me Charles, you aren't going to the races. Take a small stone or burr on a Dremel tool and grind out any sharp edges in the pits. They can start cracks to get more flaking or even chipping stay off the tooth face. If there's rough spots on the face of the tooth buy a new very hard and smooth honing stone and smooth them up. You did the other side this should be a brezzzzz.
Thanks for the encouragement,I was thinking about honing the rough spots but I just wasn't sure. I did not want to tackle the job of changing the pinion.
Keep all of the correct contour of the tooth you can. Don't dip the honing stone into the pits. You want to keep as much of the tooth contact area as possible. Always ride the contour of the tooth you are feeling just for high spots. Use cutting oil or a most any that keeps you from scratching the shine. The hard smooth stone just touch's on the little bits that stick up. Don't go wild with it. It should not scratch a smooth highly polished tooth at all. Use a high quality oil of the proper spec. oil check Cats price 1st then Mobile I'd stick with them but shell and Conoco Phillips some others are ok, no universal, F&F, Farm store.... TDTO Best or TO-4 power (skip the TO-2 too) transmission/drive oil probably 30W(sae) maybe 50W(sae), check. If its always hot when you work I would mix 2 bucks of 30w with 1 50W. That's just what I would do. My 977's use 50W in the finals, winter its way thick, summer not near that.
A couple of thoughts. Unless the Cat dealer has an oil promotion running you will likely find that Cat-branded oil (is it still manufactured by Mobil.?) is more expensive. From experience I'd happily use either Mobiltrans HD or Conoco Powerdrive in that compartment. SAE50 viscosity over SAE30 any day of the week, especially based on the user's location. As @Cat977 pointed out - use nothing where the words "farm, tractor, or unviersal" occur anywhere either in the name of the product or of the store selling it.
New bearings and seals and pressed back together.
Bolted back on
Charles- This is amazing work documenting your steps here for the rest of us to learn from! How's everything holding up? Side question: I noticed during your disassembly there was a fair amount of grease in the front parts of your hubs. Is that normal? I thought all the parts were lubed by the final gear oil.
If you are refering to post #21 that grease is under the cap over the axle nut and that area is outside of the oil and uses grease.
I have her up and running pretty good now.