I recently got my 955K stuck. I drove it back to the house, about 150 yards, and everything was running fine. I have had it idling for a few minutes while I moved to loader around to get a linkage pin lined up so I could put it back in. 2 days ago, I started it up and it would not throttle up. I got off to check the throttle linkage and noticed a couple of fine streams of oil coming from what looked to be the oil pan and engine interface. I shut it down immediately as I also noticed some knocking coming from the engine. The oil was coming from the front right of the oil pan. Is it possible that something has clogged the oil lines and backed up enough to pressurize the oil pan? Any ideas? I am going to remove the filter this evening to check for debris and to check the bypass on top of the filter housing. I am not very familiar with these machines so any response will not insult my intelligence.
First thing - have you checked the engine oil level in the pan using the stick...? Is it at the between the MIN & MAX marks, too low or too high..?
I'd also be checking the breather pipe on the chance it is plugged or kinked from getting stuck.
I checked it cold with the engine off, and had a good level. I was going to idle the engine to warm the oil and read it on the other side of the dip stick. Thats when I noticed the issues.
The breather tube you are referring to, where is located?
Not knowing your s/n for exact parts break down I can not say for sure but most Cats will have a pipe coming off a breather on top of the valve cover and going down one side of the engine to about the oil pan area, maybe a 1 to 1 1/2 inch tube.
Yes, I know which one you are talking about. There doesn't seem to be anything wrong with it. The serial number on this machine is 85J3940
When it's running is there pressure coming out the filler cap when you remove it? A slight amount would be normal , but if you lay a shop towel over it and it flies 10 feet away then you have a problem. What does it sound like with the filler cap off and engine running? A link to a video of it running with sound might help. Upload to say Youtube and attach the link to here. If that is not possible how about a picture of where you are seeing this leak.
I can do the picture. I want to see what my oil level situation is tomorrow. I pulled the dip stick just before dark and didn't get a good level. The tube is so long and the oil runs on the dipstick so its hard to tell what the level actually is. I crawled underneath and looked at the oil lines going from the block to the cooler and to the filter and everything looked good. Lots of oil dripping from the edges of the oil pan.
Finally checked the oil in good daylight. Way more than it needed. It was about 4 inches up the dipstick from the safe to start range. It says not to overfill. Could that blow a seal somewhere? I checked the filter and filter housing and everything seemed ok. No sludge or junk in it. I think I will replace the filter anyway. Just doesn't look like its the problem.
If the oil was that much overfull did you by any chance take a sniff to see if you could smell fuel in it..? That would be my first thought, especially as it sounds as though something in the governor could be on the fritz.
Maybe crack the motor oil drain plug and see if you get water.
Doesn't sound good, Knocking and can't rev the engine up can be roughly translated into low or no oil pressure. The oil pump does send the oil up through the block at the front. Did you notice any pressure on the gauge? Cut a filter open next. Later Bob
Four inches over full? If that is from fuel in the oil it should run out like water!
Ok. I will drain all the oil and see how much and if it separates. I hope its diesel and not water. Is the governor internal to the injection pump?
By the way, my gauges don't work. I came to the conclusion of no pressure as well due to not throttling up and seeing the oil spraying from the front.
The throttle will not open up until oil pressure retracts the pin that holds it back. It's in the governor on the back of the injection pump. Later Bob
If diesel fuel was getting into to oil flow system, where would be the most likely places this could happen?
Someone with a little better memory want to chime in here to let me know if I am thinking that at least one source of fuel dilution could be a bad seal on the transfer pump?
That's about the only source of fuel dilution that I can think of.
To test for fuel (Diesel) in the E/O put an amount on a bit of Shop Towel paper and set alight the paper if it flairs up its diesel doped, the fuel transfer pump and the injector pump have waste pipes on them that should drip if the seals are failed, these pipes often get pegged up with dirt so check them out, the hour meter face is another fuel drama spot that people seal off fuel leaks only to knacker their engine, the longer you leave the fuel tank tap open the more fuel will drop into your sump?? I would turn the tap off under the tank to save some mess and cost. tctractors
Ok. I drained all crank case oil and got a whole lot of diesel smelling, thin oil. I would say there was about 12 gallons total when manual says 5 gallons is the capacity. Very thin. I took pictures of what I believe is the fuel pump. Lots of diesel around it.
The thing the hour meter mounted to it is the fuel transfer pump, a small gear pump that move fuel to the injection pump. I see someone has been using silicone to replace or patch up old gaskets so I'd be a little leery of those points. I forget if there are passages in those places where fuel and oil could be swapping places. The transfer pump looks like it has been changed recently as there is no paint on it, but that's not a guarantee it's not bad. I believe the 1/4 inch line in this picture below is the "Vent Line" that should be open at the lower end to let any fuel that leaks past the seal in the transfer pump drain off before getting forced in to the engine oil past the oil seal. I know if it was my engine I'd be pulling the complete fuel system off it and replace at least all those siliconed up gaskets and any other gaskets and orings I could change. One more thing. When was this strainer removed and cleaned, and new gasket installed? See arrow in picture below: If you need a list of gaskets and seals I might be able to come up with one for you.
I have never cleaned that strainer, but I will now. I have only owned the machine for a few weeks, so I am not familiar with the history. I will take your advice replace all silicone sealed interfaces with the proper gaskets. A list of all those would be great, but don't go to huge amount of trouble to get them. One problem I have is that the loader is down all the way and I would like to raise it. I am thinking I will put some oil back in engine and run it just long enough to get the loader arms out of the way. Do you think that is safe to do? Also, do you think that this fuel overfilling the crank case caused the leaking that I saw when the engine was running the other day? Is the fact that it's so thin the reason that the governor won't release to let the injector pump throttle up? Or is the leaking oil/fuel seal causing a drop in oil pressure and not allowing the governor to release? In other words, do you think that if all seals are fixed and fuel stays where it needs to stay and oil stays where it needs to stay, that everything will work fine?
Check the engine oil filter for metal chips before spending another penny on parts. I suspect trouble from the conversations here. Later Bob
To properly inspect, do you mean to cut this filter? I have looked at and did not see any metal parts. I also emptied the oil I drained last night, and didn't see anything major in the bottom. There were some very small metal shavings but nothing major. What are you suspecting Bob?
Lubrication for the governor and fuel injection pump camshaft is supplied from the engine oil system. Flow is to these items then returns to the main engine sump. With those goober gaskets I suspect sealing is not correct and your leaking fuel into the system at a flange location.
I was thinking about that same thing this morning. Cut open the oil filter and see what if anything is in there. If it only ran a short time with the fuel diluted that much might not be any real damage but if it has been run hard for hours or days diluted then there could be a problem! One problem could be that silicone, some of that stuff will swell up when exposed to fuel oil and if there are gobs sticking on the inside like those on the outside and a piece comes loose it could plug an oil galley somewhere. It could be part of the problem with it not "ramping up" if the piston on the fuel injection pump has it's port restricted by the silicone. If the filter looks good I'd hook up at the least a temporary oil pressure gauge then refill with oil and start it and see what you have for pressure. Would not hurt to also have a working fuel gauge, think you should see around 30 psi fuel pressure when running. And if you do lift up those arms make sure you have them well supported, do not depend on the hydraulics! Something could leak, a hose fail or even someone bump a control while working on it.
I can tell you it has not run long since I have had it. Maybe thirty minutes total? most of that at a low idle. I will cut open the filter.
Is the oil filter a spin on item or a canister held by a bolt at the top? I would be thinking the lifting of the arms might be handy and lock them up might be a good idea in case the engine is full of Sparkles, the glop that is being used for a gasket and looks new fitted might have knackered the engine, this could well be why you have not had it for long. tctractors
it is a cannister held on by a bolt. i have looked at it and did not see any metal pieces in it. It looks to me like the oil flow comes from the block to the injection and transfer pump and I guess it goes back in to the block. Old Magnet says it goes into the sump next. If I look in the oil pan and this goop has actually broken off the I should see some in there I guess. Unless the galley from the injector and transfer pump down to the sump is clogged. I am still confused as to how the oil could spray from the oil pan seal. When I drained to oil pan the other day, the diesel/oil mixture was dripping from the pan gasket seal. I will for sure need to replace this.
Pan gasket was probably leaking to begin with. Now with the high level in the pan the crankshaft is slinging the mix as though it was pumping. Results are what your seeing. With luck the fuel source is at the injection pump/transfer pump location. If that silicone migrated in to the oil distribution system more serious events are likely.
Ok, that makes sense then. I will start the process of putting gaskets where the silicone seals are. When removing the injection pump or transfer pump, is there any thing I should be careful with? Like springs or snaps rings that may get lost?
Hay you must check the fuell transfer pump this is located near to inyection pump when the transfer pump seal is damage the fuel come dawn in the oil pan and increase the volume of the oil
Hi you must check the fuell transfer pump this is located near to inyection pump when the transfer pump seal is damage the fuel come dawn in the oil pan and increase the volume of the oil