Hi. First time posting. I have been using this site for information for a while now and find it very handy. I have a customer that has a 980G 2SR00296. He has had issues with the main implement pump wearing out in less then 3000hrs. We replace the orings and hose on the suction pipe every time we install a new pump. He was running 15w40 in the hydraulics and for the last pump we tried castrol Hyspin 46. These vein pump are about $10k here in Aus and are getting hard to get from Cat we have to wait to get one from the us this time. My question is has anyone changed from the vein pump to the later G and H style gear pump and what did they have to change? I can see I need to change a couple of pipes but is the pump outputs roughly the same? Flow and pressure wise? Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks Hilton
If memory serves me right, we always ran 10w with API CK-4, TO-4 in the G’s. A lot of oil doesn’t have the additives that a vane pump requires. We never had trouble with the implement pumps, some of the machines had 30k+ hours on them. Now the fan pump that is attached to the back of the implement pump we converted those all to gear pumps & had great success with that setup. You should get way more hours out of your pump than what you have been getting. After your pump failures are you making sure that you are getting all the contamination out of the system? I know that is time consuming & a pain for some people but I can’t preach it enough. Usually big problems can be fixed with simple changes.
Also take your case drain hose off both ends & make sure debris from previous failures isn’t causing any blockage in your hose. I have found that more with piston pumps but it’s always a good practice when you are cleaning out the system.
Has the customer ever done any oil analysis.? If not it's about time he started. The results of even one sample can tell a great deal, especially ISO4406 Cleanliness Codes. Are we talking at cross-purposes here.? The main implement pump on a 980G is a piston pump, not a vane pump. My experience of piston-type implement pumps is that they do not like contamination in the system (hence the need for the oil analysis) and they certainly don't like being overheated. Contamination would be my first suspect if pumps are failing at 3k hours, followed closely by overheating. Was anything ever done in regard to cleaning lines and the cooler after any previous pump failure.? Any cleanout fitlers used in the hydraulic system.? Cat hydraulic systems call for an oil with a zinc-based anti-wear additive package. Which one of the multiple Hyspin hydraulic oil varieties were you using.? I see 6 different oil types, at least a couple of which were zinc-free. Oil-wise this system should really be running an SAE10W hydraulic oil in your climate. You could also use SAW10W TO-4 which would work fine. While on the subject of oil, what filters are they using.? Cat or aftermarket.? Do they ever get filter plugged events for the implement hydraulic filters or do they run with the plugged filter switch disconnected.?
Talk to your local Cat dealer. There is a kit to change out the vane pump to a gear pump. Change the pump, suction tube, couple discharge hoses and away you go (plus any system cleaning from previous failures) - having said that 3000 hrs is low hours even for a vane pump to fail. And also you can just buy 2 reman vane cartridges for the vane pump as opposed to a new pump when they fail or are worn.
I can't say for failures previously but the last pump that I installed the whole system was cleaned and flushed out except for the valve body. It was flushed but not disassembled and stripped. The tank was split and cleaned and lines cleaned. SOS has not been done but the machine is regularly serviced and hydraulic filters done at 500hr intervals with either cat or Donaldson filters. I adjusted the relief valve back to 2900psi when the last pump was installed. Im not sure about the filter switch I'll check that out. It is a Hyspin aws 46. This pump has failed and spilt the housing so we are up for a complete pump but on the previous failure I just installed two new cartridges which were installed into an aftermarket ITR housing from the previous failure. Not ideal I know and probably the result of where we are now and why we are tying to install a gear pump because it is half the price. I had been onto Cat and they weren't aware of a kit but I thought I had read it on here somewhere that there was but had not been able to find the thread for it. I will get onto cat again and chase them up. I will recommend that we go to that 10W TO-4 oil. I have been recommending SOS's for all of his equipment for a while. I think it is cheap maintenance. I'll let you know the outcome. Thanks.
I get the idea of why the customer wants to go to a gear pump if one is available for perceived better reliability, but as Ben says 3k hours is no life for a pump, even a vane pump. IMHO changing the type of pump without getting to the bottom of what's going on is like putting a Band-Aid over a cut that has an infection in it. The plaster will stop it bleeding by it won't fix the underlying illness. Vane pumps are even more sensitive to contamination than piston pumps in my experience. I recall a fleet of D10s on a job site one time that were eating implement pumps for breakfast. Physically inspect any tractor and look at its oil analysis; the hydraulic cylinders were dripping oil and they were sucking dirt in though the wiper seals. The Cleanliness Code confirmed that, it was almost off the charts. The definitive fix was doing cylinder work when it was needed to prevent dirt ingress and what was at the time an Arctic option for a gear-type implement pump. How do the cylinders on the 980G look.? Any leakers.? Does the customer go through a significant quantity of hydraulic oil for top-ups.?
I had a customer a few years back had two main hydraulic pump failures on a 980g sn 9cm. We talked to cat tech services and they said that there was an upgrade to a gear pump which required a line change . We updated it and had no more problems. Tech services said that the size and design of that vane pump made it run above its comfortable limit of 2500 psi. The pump would probably live at 2900 but people were cranking it up to 3100 psi which hastened it’s demise.
HeavyEquipmentForums Found this.
@Wqds2024 - check your messages.
Thank you Moniletech that was the thread I thought I had read on the last pump. I have not been able to get onto our Cat dealer over the last couple of days due to easter but I will get onto them in the morning and let you know. The relief was at 3300psi when I adjusted it last time and thought that the pumps would have been able to handle that. I'll get a price for the kit and see what it adds up to and let them know. If the vane pumps are generally pretty good we might just put a genuine one on it. He has another two of these old G's and they are all getting up to that 15-20,000hrs so he thought if we put it on one we will change them all over as they fail. Thanks for the help.