Hi Guys I am new here and I am looking for someone with grader expertise. I purchased a Champion 565T grader for a road builder, road maintenance rig. It is in great shape, new tires, new paint and really well cared for. We were looking at the blade today and found that the moldboard is made of 1/2" steel and in the center of the curve, about 2" above the cutting edge, the blade has worn to about 1/8" thick. This thinned area is probably 6-8" high the length of the blade. It must be from years of grading and has to be somewhat normal. What is the proper way to fix it? We probably won't run it more than 100 hours a year so it is pretty much in retirement here. I was thinking about having a piece of 1/4" x 12" flat rolled to fit the angle and then just weld it in, does this sound right? My mechanic says it looks like the same radius as a 36" pipe. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks
Thats just how we have done it have the shop roll to match as close as possible and weld it on
Hi Jonas. Did you hard surface over the welds that were on the bottom edge and sides? I am afraid of the weld wearing through and getting dirt and water under it. It was scary after we started looking at the moldboard, it is starting to bend and dimple since it is so thin. Thanks
If you're worried about rust getting behind the patch, weld a 1/8" pipe coupler every 3' along the back of the moldboard and then drill a hole through the center. Once you're done, add a zerk and grease it up with cheap grease. Don't worry about the weld, that will be a harder steel than the patch, you can always go over the welds down the line if they look a little thin. Put a little thought into the procedure for welding this to avoid warping it too much. Tack it from end to end and then weld a little section at a time, move to another spot, etc. DON'T start welding at one end and go right across as fast as you can.
Hi Delmer. I am not as worried about rust, just water getting in and freezing and heaving outward. That is a good idea on lots of tacks and welding in sections. I have gotten in a hurry and messed up a perfectly good welding job before.
We've worn a number of those through on newer 700 series machines. And those start out at 3/4 I think on older 720/ 730's and 1" on 740's and larger and all the newer graders. I wonder if the slides have changed much. If not you could look around for a newer moldboard off a "dead in the water" machine. We've done skins and once built it up with welding rod. None of it's much fun and if that one started out that thin to begin with it's going to be real tricky to get something on without warping it. If you're only putting 100 hours a year on that thing you may never wear through what's left. Could just be making problems for yourself welding on it.
No we didn't do any hardface shouldn't have much problems especially in your light use
I think we are going to try to have a fab shop roll the plate for us. It should be wide enough to span to the thick metal, making it easier to weld. I think we will be able to weld it. I am afraid to try a blade from another machine. I have tried swapping stuff and it always seems much more of a headache than it was supposed to be. I am afraid if we don't plate it, it could bend and deform on me. Then it would be a nightmare trying to get it true again. Thanks for all the help!
For sure. I'm not familiar with the machine you have, the slides may not even be remotely close. And it's probably better to get it before it's too thin.
View attachment 14792 Hey Guys I went out to make a template to take to the fab shop and I have another problem. The first pic is of the grader. I just threw that in. The 2nd is a pic of the template that fits the worn area of the blade, held against the outer shin guard (what I would call it on a plow) and just picture how far off that would be if extending up the blade. The 3rd pic shows the template held against the worn area, sowing it fits well there. It has worn heavily in the center 8" of the blade. If I make a template to cap the curve of the blade it will have a gap of a 3/8-1/2" down the center of it horizontally. I am afraid to stick a piece of filler inside the curve to weld the center to, since I think it will dent, being that I am only using 1/4" steel for the cap. The other option I have come up with is, not to cap the entire blade but instead use 1/4" x 6" piece of flat and have it bent to the angle in the worn spot and weld it in like I was thinking with the 12" one, but only in the inner worn spot. I have attached some pics, hopefully it will help this all make sense.
I would go with the full 1/4" overlay. Nearly all of the force is on the cutting edge and the cut material is not imposing a huge load in the center of the blade where the material is loose and sliding to the end. In essense the middle is only holding a ft or less of loose material if your blade is full running over the top. Friction causing wear is the enemy here. I do not see a strength issue.
EDIT: Reread post 10 and 3/8" is a lot of gap. Not sure what would make sense there.
If it's worn an 1/8th for the length of the blade, I think you will need more than a patch. I agree that the cutting edge to where the mold board attaches to your quadrants takes the blunt of the force. Facing the blade with 1/4 plate is only gonna stop the existing material from wearing more. There are machine shops that can roll 1/2 inch plate, I would cut out the worn section, and weld in new 1/2 inch material. It would be expensive, but if the MB breaks, it will probably cost more. I did a quick search, and those machines are out there, you might find one with a better MB, and have lots of spare parts.
Why not both? the small patch for the worst area, and the big patch the full width. Cut a hole every foot or so to plug weld them all together.
Are you sure that moldboard isn't thicker than 1/2 inch? If that's a 5/8 plow bolt holding on the "shin guard" something seems out of proportion. Nice looking machine nonetheless. Around here we would call a shin guard a moldboard end bit
Hi DB2 Yes you are right it is thicker than 1/2". I think it is closer to what was stated earlier, 3/4". I was looking at the top of the moldboard and it was worn there, but I found some other areas that were not. Thanks for the help on the proper name Also as far as names go, trying to make a tag for the different lever functions for the dummies like myself who don't run this every day. What is the name of the function that moves the entire turntable (blade and all) side to side? Not the blade extend, the whole assembly.
Sideshift?
Yeah. That is what I would have called it on a forklift. Just thought there would have been some kind of cool grader name for it!
That function would be circle shift. The moldboard only is side shift.
I hope there's no written exam. It's the first one to the right of the steering wheel is all I know.... Earlier it was suggested to put one smaller patch on the worn area and then skin the rest with the plate you made. That might be the way to go. We built one up with filler rod about 5? years ago. Basically sucked smoke for 2 days and very pains-taking trying to do it without warping things. STILL had to die grind one bolthole to change blades. The other thing I learned is once you weld on them, the area right close to the weld erodes quick. Anywhere's on the edges where we stopped the beads didn't wear, but the 1/4" or so around washed out. The beads lasted a long time, and made it hard pushing. So I'm not sure how well a small patch on it's own would work out. A full skin over might work pretty good though. A full skin without anything in behind will stretch so that it's pretty much against the moldboard if ir doesn't get gravel in behind. My concern up here (we see this a bit) is if water can get in behind, it will, and it will freeze in behind, and then a guy will be fixing that. So maybe a patch to fill the erosion, whatever to get it trued up and then stitch the skin?
What if I bump the thickness up to 3/8 or 1/2" on the full plate and just put some kind of filler in the worn to weld to in the center of the plate? I keep putting this job off because I really don't like my options. I am afraid that the 1/4" full plate cap will have to much gap in the center worn area, and even if I weld in some 1/2 square solid in the worn area to weld to it will bend just before or after the filler. The 6" plate just in the worn area I am afraid is going to become a ugly project that won't work out like I am hoping. It will just look cobbled together. The idea of putting the 6" plate on the worn area and then putting the full skin on after, I think would make the most sense structurally. I just think that since this is a blade that has been worn by years of use and not machined out this will become a huge nightmare getting the inner plate to lay in smooth, for the outer plate to be welded over the top. Seems like it will be hours of grinding and welding trying to account for the variances of thickness from one end to the other. How critical would it be if the blade angle was changed or moved ahead? I mean if I find someone able to roll 1/2" and cap the entire blade, if the angle is the same as the existing and I can get it up to the cutting edges without being taller will it still work? Once again having at least 3-4 hours of grader experience under my belt, I don't know that much.
I have done my 14G when it was worn worse than that. Get the skin rolled to the tightest radius. Weld the bottom end, near the cutting edge, first. Make sure you install new edges prior to the skin, so that you know new ones will fit. Use small bolts or something to shim the liner up away from the top of the edges about 1/4 to 3/8" To get the top tight, cut some "C" shaped hoops and weld them to the moldboard and drive wedges in to force the top of the plate down to match the original. You can do this even with pretty hard steel. It will seem hard at first, but the result will be worth it. I would recommend a 3/8" liner plate. This method, securing the bottom and forcing the top, only works if the plate is rolled slightly more than needed. If done right, there will not be any space for anything behind the skin. IMHO, trying to patch the thin spots first will lead to trouble putting the skin on and worsen the gap problem, not help it.
The key to making this work is your template. You need to cut out your inner patch so that it fits the worn area under the template, if you make your patch a little big it's not that big a deal as long as you find the problem before you weld the whole thing in. Grinding a little off the back side of the patch around the corners is far easier than grinding a little off the whole face, right? If you want that patch, or the full skin to be supported, run beads on a 6"-12" grid to the height of the back of the patch, then use your template to get them close. If you have the manpower/equipment to lift the patch and/or skin, you could paint the welds and rub your plate in place to knock the paint off the high spots to grind for a better fit. Might want to cut a better template than cardboard.