I haven't used the 310 since September (haven't started it either since then ) She's just been parked out back waiting for me to put the chains on and plow snow. I waddled through the snow behind the house to find weak batteries. Not surprised. Drag out couple hundred feet of extension cord and the battery charger. Let it charge for 6 hours. At this point it's dark and already -5F. I plug in the water heater and let it sit til morning. I get back down there about 11am, touch the starter button and get a single click. No crank. Go fetch multimeter and check batteries. Both showing 6.2 volts, 12.4 combined (they're in series). Touch starter button again and she rolls over. A quick shot of ether and she fires up quick and smooth. At this point, I let it idle at 1000rpm for about 75 minutes for everything to completely warm up while I finished my other project. Machine is up to temp, everything operates like it should and I drive it up to the garage so we can chain up the rear tires. Get done installing chains, I take a quick test plow and recheck my chains and then park it. I needed to plow out around my house, but had other work to finish first. Gonna plow the next day. Come back the next day, go to fire it up and I'm right back to the single click from starter. Batteries are still holding voltage. This starter has less than 500 hours on it, but that's in the last 20 years. After consulting with my grandpa, he says it's simple enough, 2 bolts, 2 wires, pull your starter and have it tested. So this afternoon I go to pull the starter to find the back nut is almost inaccessible and already partly rounded off. And it's set into a recessed area in the starter so you can't just out a socket on it. Plus it's behind the damn loader frame and the accumulater is bolted on right next to it as well. Well, after 2 hours of fighting with the cold, stuck bolts and numb fingers i said the hell with it for tonight. Just a giant pain in the ass. I've changed 3 or 4 similar starters on old Deere tractors with no hiccups whatsoever, but this one is a dang pain. I'll get it done tomorrow, just need to get that accumulater out of my way. Sorry it's long, but the wife couldn't give 2 craps about this. She just wants her driveway scraped back down to gravel again.
Unless you just want to vent, I'm adding my two cents. You have a volt meter, use it. There's no reason to take a starter off that spun over fine a day ago. You might want to take the solenoid off, but check it with the voltmeter under "load" first. Also, try rapping the starter with a stick? You can't charge a frozen battery, it's possible they were discharged enough to freeze. Ideally the batteries would have had a little heat all night with the charger on them, and the block would get an hour in the morning. The engine will get as warm as it's getting in an hour or less. The batteries will take all night to thaw if there's ice in them.
I did try tapping on the starter while my dad cranked. I also tried jumping it with a screwdriver (yea, I'm aware of the risk and took precautions), which had the same result, just a click. I did not test voltage at solenoid under load. I can certainly try that tomorrow as starter is easily hooked back up at this point. As for the batteries, I can remove them and bring them into garage to thaw and charge. My garage stays above freezing. This machine doesn't have a block heater, it's one of those inline water heaters tied into a coolant line. I typically don't use it because I haven't noticed any improvements on cold starts when plugged in. This engine has always needed a squirt of ether when below freezing. It has Deere's onboard ether assist system installed, though I don't know if that was from factory or not.
It very well could be a bad cable going to the solenoid or a dirty disc in the solenoid. A voltage test under load will tell the tale. My 310 has the same setup and I often have to click the starter several times to get the solenoid to make contact. When I replaced the starter several years ago, I used a 12 point bolt to make it easier to replace again. I use a small propane fired salamander put under the oil pan to heat mine up. A half hour or so and it will start right up. Remember to push the clutch pedal to the floor to release the drag from the transmission and the charge pump.
Is your heater working? those tank heaters are usually 1,000 or 1,500 watts, block heaters are usually 400, so they work if they haven't burned out, or been mounted wrong so they won't thermosiphon. If you get 12V at the starter terminal, meaning the solenoid or screwdriver is making contact, then the brushes could be tight from sitting and getting rusty. Sometimes fixable on the machine. If you were a little more careful and used the screwdriver to jump the small terminal on the solenoid, then the bendix could be hanging up on the starter shaft from too much or not enough grease. Or the contacts are burned out, those are sometimes replaceable leaving the starter in place and removing the solenoid. And sometimes taking the solenoid off helps to get at that bolt, I don't think so in this case, but you can look.
I am aware of the dry clutch release on this machine. I do have the service manual and have studied it fairly well (except for the electrical section...) I've put about 200 hours on it in the last 18 months and have had no starting issues at all with this machine. Had other issues, but its never had issues cranking over. The inline heater gets hot as all hell and the hoses are warm from the lowest point I could reach to the highest point so I assume its doing its job, but the block itself certainly does not feel warm at all. As for testing the starter, I'll pull my service manual out and read through it. I've never done much starter testing. We have a a local farm repair shop that will fix a starter while you wait as long as he has the parts on hand. We've always just pulled them and taken them in. The farm tractors don't have this other stuff in the way like the backhoe does so it's only a 5 minute job to pull them.
Do you have a way to heat the batteries? Also, I wouldn’t be without a proper block heater, my Case 580K didn’t have one when I got it, put one in before my first winter with it. Only need to plug in for 45min and she starts right up.
I'll have to go to Deere and find out if that was an option. I know our 4020s, 4040 and 4440 all have block heaters, so I wouldn't see why this engine would be left out
You're not getting good circulation. If they're set up right the heater will take a minute to melt the frost on it when it's 20 because the coolant circulates with a low temperature difference. Of course all of my tank heaters are old junk that has the thermostat burned and bypassed long ago. If you have a working thermostat in it, then it's not going to boil, it will just shut off when hot, whether the engine is warm or cold. The hoses are probably warm from conduction, but that's not enough to get the engine warm. You need circulation and that will keep the heater from getting "hot as hell" and also keep the heater working instead of shutting off. You either have an obstruction somewhere in the loop, air blocking the circulation at the high spot, or not enough elevation change to get the hot water moving. You want the heater lower than the water jacket if possible. The starter guy sounds like the way to go once you get it off. You never know what people are thinking, I'd hate to see you send a good OEM starter in as a core on a new chinese starter.
on several john deere have had bad ground issues jump a good battery directly to starter ground on casing and possitive on the terminal that goes to the inside the starter it should turn with the starter drive not engaging that will tell if the brushes are good then put jumper wire to the solenoid terminal then booster cable to the that terminal that feeds the brushes this way you are manualy buypassing the solenoid to turn starter so engage solenoid then make starter turn with booster cable to the motor
I got the starter off. I stopped at NAPA and bought a 9/16" wobble socket that I was able to fish behind the solenoid and get on the nut with. Took starter to the farm repair shop, they bench tested it and about 50% of the time, the motor wouldn't engage. They'll tear it down this evening and get it sorted out for me. I did remove the batteries and put them in my garage to make sure they were thawed and charged them both up. Both batteries show 6.3 V which from my book says they're good to go. Quick question about these 3EH batteries: Aside from keeping them charged and the terminals clean, is there any other maintenance I should be performing? I tried google to find out if they require additional water to be added, but couldn't find anything more than a bunch of folks selling them.
If they have removable caps, check to see that the water level is between the top of the plates and the bottom of the filler neck, preferably closer to the filler neck. 3EH is just a common 6V size apparently.
Final update: starter solenoid was corroded and deteriorated badly. Starter motor was good. Starter had been date stamped 10/02 for last service and only has 415 hours on it. Just goes to show, sitting around in high humidity takes its toll on stuff. I was told the water just poured out of the solenoid when he took it off. He showed me the old one, contacts were degraded/severely corroded. Got it back on, put warm and fully charged batteries back in and she cranked over nice n quick again. Wouldn't start. Snort of ether, still no start. It was sunny, but only about 8 degrees out. Got my extension cord, hooked up inline water heater, came back 90 minutes later and she fired right up. I felt block before I started it. It was noticeably warmer around the water passages than the rest of the machine. I'll admit, that water heater works a lot better than I believed it too. After a 30 minute warm up, I got my drive all plowed back and scraped down. I also made sure to park within 50 ft of my garage so I can easily access machine and plug it in before I need it next time. Live n learn.
But the most important question--is your wife happy now?
Yes. No comment other than a quick thank you
when water is heated it moves around on its own, so the heater in the radiator hose can actually create a current or flow of water/antifreeze that circulates around the engine block, decades ago thats how houses were warmed before they had circulators on hydronic heating systems, as the water was heated in the basement it flowed up and around, just like in an engine block..
Yeah, but those old heating systems were designed by guys a lot smarter than most of the current generation. Same with a "circulating" tank heater, it has to be designed right to circulate right. I still say if the heater tank is hot when the temp is near zero, then it's not circulating enough and losing too much heat from the tank, or shutting off the heat thermostatically.
LOL..so true, but in theory it sounds good...