So I was on some rough terrain yesterday and my battery cable popped loose. I looked down and smoke was coming out of the battery box. I think it was just where it rested on the post and made a bad connection that arced. Anyways now I try to start and everything seems fine but just a click up top in the panel but not a starter clunk or any turning over. I checked the fuses on the dash and everything is good. Where do you guys think I should look next? Relay under the hood? Hopefully the starter isn't blown but they're not as expensive as I thought if it is. Thanks in advance you guys have been awesome.
BATTERY DRAINED WHEN SHORTED OUT,,, HAVE YOU CHARGED IT? GOOD LUCK
Get out the voltage meter and start checking voltages. If you find nothing, check the voltages when trying to crank it, like the signal wire at the starter solenoid is a good place to start.
Check all your grounds and hot/red connections... a lot of times when your stuff shorts it gets pretty heated i/e smoke from the battery box........make sure to check power from key to solenoid power....usually smaller guage wire that may have been affected....and there may also be a starter relay aside from the main fuse panel.......
P.S.... Look for melted/burnt stuff and promptly replace..............
Thanks for all the responses. Was hoping to find a burn wire to replace or something glaring at me. Pulled the battery to charge it but didn't need it. Voltage getting to the starter Nothing burnt I'm going to test some more of the easy stuff like the relays. Trying to figure out which relays it would be. This thing is kind of a frankenstein at this point. I'll see if I can get this figured out and report back. Only 100F outside today and I've grown soft so trying not to sweat too much haha.
Ok, at a bit of a loss now. Waited for a starter relay to arrive. I replaced the starter relay in the dash. It didn't sound too clunky and I broke a wire off looking at it. It clunks a lot harder like it should now. I've got 12v at the starter. Nothing is burned. Now I'm trying to figure out where else I should look. Obviously there's a pos and neg on the starter with varies wires coming out. Check between those and somewhere else for continuity? I wish I could be more specific.
12 volts - where on the starter ? The small wire on the solenoid ? Continuous or only when turning the key to the start position ? I'm leaning towards a defective solenoid. Is the solenoid pulling the bendix into the ringgear? If so the starter should be turning.
I'm with Tinkerer on the solenoid theory,if you have power to the small wire on the solenoid when you turn the key switch to start i/e the forward spring loaded position ,then, I don't know how comfortable you are with live power....but you can jump power to the starter stud from battery stud to see if starter spins then you will have your answer on actual starter condition.....orrrrrr you could take starter out and bench test to avoid any further melt down...
My recently purchased 410C started OK in summer weather. First cold morning it wouldn't. There are a buttload of points where one conductor meets another. This tractor has batteries with screw on posts. The cable terminals connect to the batteries & to the cables. After dismantling & cleaning gunk & oxidation from dozens of connections it started. I used it an hour or so, it started fine. If you have resistance, it steals voltage from the starter. It also steals voltage produced by the alternator from reaching the batteries needed to charge. If you have two batteries the ties must be good, or one battery gets all the charge, the other gets little or none.
Ok big apology. I'm not sure how I missed this before. When I check between the relay wire going to the starter and negative I show 8v then crank it show 4v. Would it make sense that wire or connection is burned out somewhere between? I changed the relay above but didn't see anything. Hard to trace and haven't spotted anything.
As suggested earlier ,stuff shorting out makes heat and any weak point in the system is nuked..if you have to remove all connections,ohm and physically inspect.... bad or corroded conductors are not your friend.....
If it was a known to be good relay then ---- Classic example of a wire broken out of sight inside the insulation, or a loose connection and last but not least, a defective ign. switch.
Voltage drop the positive and the negative side of the circuit. Then you will know if it is the ground or power side. From there keep measuring at different points until you narrow down where it is. Voltage drop is measured in a live circuit and is the only way to find small resistance in high amperage circuits like starting or charging. It is not unusual for a starter to draw hundreds of amps. Less than a half of ohm resistance will cause a several volt drop. If you are not sure how to measure it or what you are doing just google Voltage drop. Lots of tutorials online.
Thanks for everything guys you were a big help. It was burned out near where the trigger wire (right term?) connected to the relay (one in cab). I cleaned it all up / replaced and it is running like a champ. Thanks again.
A good quick ending for that problem !
A welcome change!
That's awesome..as with any electrical issue it's nice to find that smoking gun problem instead of getting lucky when you wiggle the right wire...now you know it ain't coming back .....
I spoke too soon. Sort of. So its starting and running great but I hadn't tried forward or reverse yet. All the hydraulics are good but it just won't move forward or back. Was fine prior to the smoke. Neutral safety is fine it won't start F/R but works N. Now I'm lost. Hopefully didn't fry something in the computer but literally everything else works fine. Going to google around see if there's something obvious or easy to check. Was feeling as good as can be until F/R didn't move the tractor haha. Edit: has to almost certainly be electrical. It was great until the electrical problem so very unlikely something physically broke etc.
Probably a good time to post the serial number. I can't help, but the people with that info will often need the serial number to know what you have. If you don't get a response in a couple days, post a new thread with the new problem, you'll get the attention then. Just don't post a new one with this still active every few hours.
Thanks will do. I'm going to do the obvious in the mean time. Fuses / fluid levels etc
mg2361 will need a serial number before he can provide his expertise ! Until then look to see if the shift linkage is intact.
I don't know if I can post this but..........Dude that bl#ws.....
I believe your FNR may not be getting power. Could be a fuse but I couldn't tell you which one to check. All FNR neutral circuits I have seen are "pass thru" for the start signal when in neutral and don't require power. If it worked before the other issue, it either burned a fuse or something was knocked lose or disconnected during the other repair would be my guess. All of this is me assuming you have the electric FNR of course.
And completely off the subject...............we are NEVER going to get one of those 65+ page repair threads on ANYTHING Deere with MG around . So far I haven't got to use any of my stocked popcorn and alcohol that I SPECIFICALLY bought for such thread enjoyment in the evenings when I get home from a hard days work . Its just NOT FAIR that I cant enjoy someone else's misery like I have sometimes when dealing with equipment repairs . I'll see some Deere thread which starts to show promise.......I get all excited.......then "BOOM"........MG shows up and fixes the dam thing in 1 page. THAT guy needs a month off............from the internet. Im gonna bitch to his wife! She can get'er done!
I have been in a truck dash before chasing down a rubbing/broken wire before and had that aha moment,found and repaired the problem only to have a new issue where I knocked something loose....check every little thing where you were digging..most newer systems have 40 pounds of crap jammed in a 20 pound bag in a confined space...
I don't know. My JD trans teardown thread had to of provided some entertainment!
Thanks again everyone. I was sitting in bed thinking "why the hell did this happen" and going through everything I had done. I checked the starter and there was a disconnected cable. Now the reason I hadn't checked that cable is because it shouldn't start without it connected. So.. I've got a short somewhere that's letting it start when it shouldn't but for some reason that was stopping the transmission. I tested the FNR and the NSS was working fine. I was quite shocked when it moved F/R but obviously pleased haha. And now it's in it's normal state of "not sure why, but it runs great" and I'm not going to lie I'm ok with that. I'd love to rip it apart and turn the Frankenstein back to stock but not going to happen anytime soon. Thanks again guys!
Don't feel bad, you aren't the only one that leaves cables off. I put a new battery in my wife's car and it wouldn't start. I called the dealership and they sent a tow truck to haul it in. About an hour after they got it I get a phone call to come n pick it up. I left one of the battery cables unhooked. Fricken GM vehicles with their stupid battery covers that have about six wires in them.
LOL! I did that same thing not 2 months ago. Spent an entire day scratching my head only to find out I was a dumbass.
Haha thanks for making me feel better about this mistake guys. It doesn't top when we spent an afternoon trying to take a nut off. 6 ft bar, hammers, WD 40, tried using a torch. The thing wouldn't budge. Long while and a few beers later my friend said "Maybe it's reverse threaded?"
Thanks for the laugh Vetech !! Good grief ! I cut the head off of bolt that holds the blade on my 12" DeWalt miter saw. Only to find out it has left hand treads. I used a Sharpie and labeled the saw with an arrow and wrote, left hand thread stupid.
I guess since the backhoe is fixed we can go crazy. I put $100 worth of hydraulic seals in a cup of water and into the microwave. Then watched them morph into useless gobs in about 45 seconds. NOW I can tell you that seals absorb microwave energy at a much higher rate than water.......
LOL !!! Who would of thought that would happen. Certainly not me.
Check this out for a stupid move. I just finished a small engine changeout today, so I start putting engine oil in this engine and it only holds 2 quarts according to the specs. So I get through dumping 2 quarts and there isn't a dam thing on the stick. Another quart.....still nothing on the stick. So I back away from the engine and notice I have fresh oil all over my left shoe, from the high ankle down. Yeah.....my dumbass didn't put the remote drain plug back on the hose. LOL.....been a long week!
Similar story. I just completed a 1000 hr service on a 20 metric ton excavator. Started it up and Hmmm, why isn't the oil light going out? What is that sound of a water fall I'm hearing? I quickly shut down the engine, then climbed down to an oil lake the size of Lake Superior. This dumbass forgot to install the engine oil filter .
I helped a buddy replace his girlfriends front brake pads. While we finished up working, she was in another room apparently looking around on his notebook computer. She finds some semi nude photos in his email inbox from another girl and starts screaming. Things get out of whack real quick and she storms out and jumps in her car to get away. With some real accelerator force backs it right into his new pickup. See, in all the craziness, we hadn't pumped the brakes yet from that brake work. She had no way to stop that car....... Those ended up being some expensive photos for my buddy.