Have you ever seen an excavator operator plant the bucket on the ground, lift up the machine and then use the turntable to redirect the machine? That crrap makes my blood boil.
I do it whenever I operate my tracked hoe. It is a must when operating the Menzi Muck or you won't access rough terrain. My blood must have a high boiling point. And I like to minimize the wear on the undercarriage.
How else do you turn an excavator in the mud, or soft ground, or when the tracks are worn out?
What you are seeing is in fact called a jump-turn. If done correctly, there is nothing wrong with it. The goal is to take pressure off the tracks, then operate the tracks however necessary to complete the maneuver, while the turntable movement is just following along. Now, if you're twisting the tracks using ONLY the turntable, that probably is detrimental, but if you are not an experienced operator, you probably might not be able to tell.
Need better blood I guess. I and all of my cohorts have been doing that for decades now. It is easier on the equipment, not the other way around. I get into places that would be impossible otherwise.
That’s the way I was taught. Less wear on the undercarriage and can maneuver better. Also easier on the operator.
Hell, that's standard operating procedure around here.
When you're walking through a low spot and have turn, the ends of the tracks are carrying the weight and it gets tough to turn without lifting one end.
Jumping a trench without throwing loose dirt back in
yes that is the suckiest worst when you are in a trough. The opposite is a high dry knob turn on a dime, give 5 cents change. Love it when you can look ahead and do a quick pedal turn with perfect timing.
For me, "Shimmy1" post is the best answer.
Also helps with keeping the dirt berms from the turning tracks down.
Yeah I do all the time with our mini's and larger excavators.
A variation on the technique is crabbing across pipes . . .
Not to mention, in the right material, it keeps dirt out of the tracks. Sometimes, when she’s loud, she can use a mud bath. lol
Well, OP hasn't got the support he was looking for. Don't worry OP, we still love you!
Actually the OP is located in Kona Hawaii. I lived in Kona for 10 years. I would think operating on a lot of lava rock would be hard on the machine. The smooth kind of lava (Pahoehoe), you can twist the tracks on a bit. The chunky jagged lava (A'a), you have to lift and turn or damage the tracks or get stuff in the undercarriage like going over broken concrete.
What reeeealy gets in me crawww, is when an operator back drags with the back of my bucket and doesn’t understand, that’s what a cutting edge is for. I am driving into Mass on Monday to pick up a bunch of used cutting edges, so I can weld them on the back and bottom of my buckets, to lower my blood pressure. lol
Negative my friend, that's commonly called a jump turn and it's the preferred way to turn. It helps keep debris out of the tracks, and helps keep your tracks centered on your bottom rollers. On a worn out undercarriage it's the only way you can turn unless you like putting tracks back on. Think you ought to find an actual bad practice to make your blood boil
On our conventional hoes we do the same, but we don't typically lift the machine much off the ground. On our long reach you can still do this, but you need to be careful and gentle. They are pretty fragile in regard to lateral movement.
We use that move all the time, it's easier on all undercarriage parts. You don't lift the track off the ground at all, just find the right spot, put a little pressure down on the bucket, and spin the undercarriage under you, keeping the tracks flat on the ground. Easier on the machine, tears up the ground less, and lets everybody know who's got some time in the seat.
I'm guessing the majority of your operating experience is smaller machines, because that is not how it works with 35 ton and up machines.
Never ran an excavator bigger than 20 tons, how do the big boys do the spin move? Do you actually have tracks in the air?
To do it smoothly, you need to lift just enough to get them to clear the ground slightly, then you need to alternate stick in or out, depending on which track you're moving. If you don't, you dig the ass end into the ground and do almost as much damage to the ground as you would without lifting. Moving those big girls around on softer ground can be a bit of a challenge to not tear everything completely to hell.
Hey everybody, thanks for the replies. Even though it seems like every body disagrees with me. At some point in the near future I am going to write up exactly why I don't feel the same. I don't have much time today. I will say that I know there are occasions when it is a necessary move. I have had to use the boom as a crutch many times when I need to get a machine with a broken chain or a blown track tension cylinder out of a boulder patch to somewhere that I can actually fix it. I also know that the truck driver sometimes has to do it when loading or unloading a machine on the lowboy.
I appreciate the love Vetech.
No problem my friend. Let’s keep herding the cats
My favorite move in the snow (slippery) one track forward one reverse, and swing without the bucket touching the ground, but keeping the cab facing the way you want to go. I do see some guys lift the tracks high, and swing fast, and to the point that one side slams down on the ground hard. Not a fan of that.. when done right it's a great way to turn on asphalt without doing damage to the the asphalt.
I can guess what MW will say about why he doesn't like the maneuver, and I'm pretty certain he's not wrong. But, while there definitely is abnormal stress placed on the boom and stick during a jump-turn, if he's seeing broken parts, I would guess the jump-turning is a minimal part of it, the more likely cause is inexperienced operators whipping the bucket around, moving dirt with the side of the bucket.
Do yall remember in the infamous 'homeowner buys two giant excavators' thread where they guy was moving huge boulders by raring back and whacking them with the side of the bucket, like swinging a golf club LOL. Inexperienced and careless operators can tear stuff up in some amazing ways...
Yep and he was whining some didn’t have enough weight. Lol Almost cried.
I was clearing the right-of-way for highway 3 widening many years ago. My job was to burn the piles with a worn out 225, the guy on the D8 with brush rake was running ahead and making piles. There was one swampy area I grubbed out. You'd sink to your knees off the machine, but the excavator was floating nicely on the roots and stuff. Grab a fist full of stuff and swing it along, go back and get the rest, move on as I backed out of there. Each time I'd swing and then stop swinging, and the machine continued around on the grease for another 15 degrees with each maneuver. Simple minds, simple pleasures
Beat me to it ox, I’m currently running a long reach on my 210 but resisting the urge to jump-turn, that stick just looks too skinny. I have to tuck the stick right in to the tracks when turning to stop the inertia thrashing it all over the place as it dangles.
I can't quite make it out; what are the yellow lines going to the bucket? Do you have a roto-tilt bucket on that?
Just tilting mud/batter bucket
What about moving the mini excavator machine forwards or backwards with only one track on the ground, and the other track lifted and the movement controlled by swaying the stick off to the side. I've done this when a track has come off and I need to move the machine either onto a trailer, or to stable ground, or if I'm trying to get in or out of an area without one track running over something or damaging some infrastructure. Anyone else do this?
Yep.
Yes, Sir . . .
This is how I used a jump turn today...working with mud mats on a pond dam. Tight quarter turn to head 90 degrees from where I was picking up the mats from down in the pond. I also use the jump turn when making angle adjustments while on mud mats. No mentor teaching me, just videos seen on youtube...suggest away if there is a better way to do it.
I do very careful assisted turns with long sticks. heck, all of my assisted turns are careful LOL.
Back when we had a local Cat dealer, they had a customer service advisor there, old mechanic type of guy. He told me jump turns put too much stress on the slew bearings, and just tracking around on the ground is best. Working in tree stumps and slash I find it essential to do jump turns. Gently does it though.
If it mattered that much then the 330b and c we have with 15k + hrs all would've had problems by now. If the boss ever saw u spot turning and not picking up and turning he'd go nuts.