Hello all: Long time lurker and new poster. Ive been wanting a T loader for a while and think im finaly gonna enter the misery. I have my eye on a 250c dresser and wonder if any IH fans may have the track spec info on this machine. I know over at RP there was a post on it but has been since taken down. pin size, rail height etc.
Ill just rattle on a bit. I was intending to go with a 175C I found local. It had sat out for 8 years and was about a 1978. The story of why it got parked varied differently depending on who you talked to at the outfit that owned it. They want 10K firm. Good amount of leaks, hoses from the sun are shot, all 4 cylinders leak prettty bad, hrs are 3800 but not sure when the meter quit. It did have the SS track on it that was pretty good. So, to heck with it, Ill keep looking. I find a 250c with about 1600 hrs on it, good hoses, few leaks, its been ran every few months on various jobs, it has that 573 DVT fuel hound in it. Big machine, maybe too big for clearing work and putting in a road. 46K LBS about so no permits to move. One final drive does leak depending on how you park the machine shaft rotation wise. Maybe a bugger on the shaft? Bentshaft ? seal may be turning? Not sure. Owner says hes not worried about it and just adds gear oil and not spend the money to fix, re: oils cheap. So Im thinking about it and will go drive it next week. Im gonna measure up the track and keep hunting for the track service limit specs / sizes. Man I wish I would have saved them from RP when that guy posted them up. But hoping someone on here has them as well.
I found this at General Gears site: http://www.tractorparts.com/undercarriage.htm Is a repro of IH chart guides, the 250 had 7.50 pitch rails, good luck finding replacements/parts as I am in the same boat with a Allis with 7.00 pitch.
Thanks for the link. Page under construction sadly, they only had the 25 and 9 track info. No 250c track info. CB I think there was a serial number break where they went from 7.5 to 8" CC's They then called it a SS or severe service track and the rails were about 3/8 taller. Hopefully someone has a copy floatin around...CB
Go to the bottom of the page, there is "IH track school manual" lightly high lighted, click on that and you will find the 250.
Thanks DM. Yes I have that download, very good general infornation on IH. However does not give roller dia and flange heights etc. Hoping to find a repost from a reader on/from the IH track service manual. They listed all specs of every sort on the tracks. With some luck maybe the right "packrat" will catch this thread. Thnaks again CB.....
Your final is leaking on one of the dowels, it has any oring on the inside the owner was right on "its just easier to add oil." If you park it so the dowel is at 12 oclock it will be above the oil level--I know these things because thats what I do with mine lol.
Thanks for the info 250.
brownihc.com
IH 250C is basically the same machine as TD-20C dozer. The track pads will be narrower of course. The parts are going to be a lot harder to find for the 250C and for IH engine. The 175C was basically unchanged until it was stopped being produced in the 90's by Dressta. The only change was to a Cummins engine at some point in the late 80's. Make sure you find one with a 4 in 1 bucket. We did a conversion on a TD20C from the DVT to a 466 I believe and the engine mounts were the same. We have a brand new turbo for the DVT 573 that we never used that we have for sale.
Thanks for the info. I wound up going with a 175c, that 573 in the 250c was just too tough to find parts for. B The pic is just after 2nd pressure wash. The guy/seller had just used it the day before to fix a pig slop pool and never blew it off. Boy was it nasty, a combination of clay, roots, and pig flop. There was no way it was going in the shop with clumps off that stuff falling off! I scooped up about a full skidloader bucket of goo after I was done. I wonder what kind of poop bath Im gonna get when we drop the belly pan?
Did the 466 seem to have as much power as the dvt 573?
Well they both barked good when working a load. I couldn't tell alot because Im a rookie and the conditons were different and a weeks time between them. The 573 in a crawler app is suppose to have 57HP more. 466 = 133 573 = 190 I think they were both rated at 2400 rpm? Both units at about 3/4 throttle seemed to have more power then either had traction for. I bet in a dozer it would be Big difference.
Looks good Barky. Parts shouldn't be too painful to come by. You doing a full up service or gonna put it straight to work?
I think I better go over it first. I gave the motor and trans area a degrease and steam wash the other day. Prior I couldnt see or tell much as it was so crud covered. I did take it out in the brush and black locust to see how it would do for maybe 45 minutes. The ripper is gonna be great for the locust roots except I didn't want to use it much as its missing one tooth. The guys at romac are trying to figure out as to what teeth are on this thing. They think someone put cat shanks on the IH ripper boom. Hope to get fresh FD, engine, and roller oil in this weekend. I don't know yet if I should change trans and hyd oil or just the filters and run the exisiting oil? Speaking of oil: I know many say you should run the factory specd 30W diesel oil in the 466 engine. Now all my other turbo diesel motors large and small spec 15w40 oil. Given the advances since 1982 wouldn't it be fine to run 15w40 in this motor as well. ??? OK what else, so Hytran in the trans and is it 30W in the hubs and also the lift hydraulic system? Just got a copy of the shop srvc manual but it didn't cover lubes oddly? The opening on the ripper tooth (ID) is 2.5 wide and about 3.1 tall, I think it could go as tall as 2.5 x 3.4 if it rides further towards the shank shoulder
Don't blame you on freshening it up a bit. I'd recommend changing out the trans oil if you don't know when it was changed last - at least you'd know. Here's the oil run-down Engine - 15w40 (we used CaseIH oil and filters) Trans - 10W Hytran (we used TSC Traveller brand which is Hytran compliant and complied with several other specs. We've had good luck with it.) Hydraulic - 10W Hytran Hubs - 80-90W Gear Oil Idlers - 30W On Edit: Regarding hubs, the manual recommends draining, filling with 5 gallons of diesel in each hub and running a few yards, drain and fill with oil. Put your nose plug on when you drain, then again it's probably no worse than the pig flop you've already experienced. Did you find anything of interest in the belly - was Jimmy Hoffa in there? Can't help on the ripper tooth. I'm sure Romac can match it to something they have.
I switched over everything I own to Rotella 15W40 around 10 years ago, not dissatisfied with the results, actually saw a decrease in oil consumption on one farm machine as well easer to cold start.
Thanks for the info, you guys are great! Had a bit of a start today. No oil on trans dipstick, YIKES, I took it out for a little test the other day and forgot to check it as I needed a wrench to get the cap off and kept forgetting it. Had good clutch pressure and TC temp so I guess there was enough oil not to kill anything? Anyway threw 2 gallons of 10WT non-det in it to move it back to the shop. It just touched the bottom of the stick. Arggggh.
Yeah, the rear has an appetite - 35 gallons if I remember. You might still be a few gallons shy.
I called the guys down at romac in AL about my ripper tooth search. Took them a couple days but they found the right ones. Gregg down there figured it out. I called 2 other places, one in Wi. and Il. and got the "well I dont see anything in the book" line. Nice job romac guys! Bucket teeth are almost shot, guess Ill get them there as well.
Barky, how are things going with the 175? I couldn't respond to this thread for awhile, kept getting a database error message. Looks like it's fixed. Glad you got the right teeth from Romac. We had good luck with them as well. Very fast service. I'm pretty sure the teeth on the 4-n-1 are different from the ones on the GP bucket.
Well I just got her to fit in the shop with only a 1/16th cut in the weather stripping. Hehe.. Good thing the grousers are worn out ! I got some ripper teeth from romac and they were close, but a bit off. I had to cut a inch off the ends of the shanks to get them on. Ive been wanting to service it out all around but cant seem to get the time except for a little here and there.. Its annoying seeing it in the shop but not being able to tinker. I gotta do the dang paying work first! Hopefully this weekend? I started rigging up this tank for the skid loader. I will definietly have to get it going to feed the 175. My plan was to mount it permanently on a skid and just fork it in and out of the pickup when needed. I got the 12V pump kit off ebay for 149.00. I wonder if it will hold up? B.
Nice pics and shop. Looks like you have a great place to work on it with the right tools. I guess those bolt heads won't wear any sooner than the tooth? Wondering since those don't have pins if welding a wear strip out in front of that bolt head might help slow the wearing or potential breaking. I hear you on the lack of time. We've not accomplished as much as we'd like this year. We've only burned and buried about 2 old piles still have about 8 to go. We also have a ditch project that we may get to work on in a couple of weeks. It's probably a two day job, but between bush-hogging we may only get one day on it for now. You'll enjoy the pump on your tank. Compared to our old manual pump, we've really enjoyed the electric one.
Yea the romac guys didn't have pins long enough to fit. They thought it would be fine to use a gr 8 bolt and weld the nut to the bolt and then weld the back sides to the tooth. I guess they would know?? Not in the pic but I did weld them up, Ill have to keep an eye on them. I got to thinking though, I have seen many bucket teeth bolted on so maybe itll work OK.? BTW any guys that like the wix brand of filters. I ordered a filter set(8) for this machine for about 100 bucks with UPS from a place called disountfleetsupply. The hyd filter was like 70 bucks alone from the local jobbers and they had it for 30 bucks. I checked the other numbers and all were pretty good price wise.. 20 years ago I used to sell wix filters and they were on the better end back then. B Hey Boone, have you ever dropped the starter? I noticed I have a fair leak at the mounting point between the starter and the bellhousing. Im wondering if theres a funny square Oring in there or maybe just a gasket. Im thinking when I change out the trans oil it would be a good time to fix it. B
Hi Barky, congrats on your new2u loader. I like wix filters, from what I can find out they are one of the better manf. I was looking at your pump setup. I used to do the same thing, except using a hand pump in a barrel and had the setup in the box of my p/u truck. All was good until I found out that using that barrel will get water into the barrel guaranteed. What happens is that during hot temperatures the air pressure inside the barrel forces air out of the bung. If there is rain water on top of the barrel, when it cools the pressure inside the barrel drops and sucks water in. You need to keep the water off the top of that barrel or you will end up with water in your fuel. I have since switched to horizontal, cylindrical fuel tanks for outside storage and have installed an L shaped transfer tank in the p/u along with an across the bed tool box that fits the notch in the tank. Looks and works good.
Hey thanks that's good to know. I think Ill put a little raised nip above the head so if it breaths it can draw clear air. I have a sort of raw deal here on fuel. The fuel guy wont deliver less than 150 gallons, even at that it runs about 5-7 cents more than street fuel from the local station. We have a BP here in town and to the best of my knowledge its the only chain that still gives retail discounts on diesel. The other stations in town only give discounts on gasoline. So, the master plan is to fork it into the PU, fill it up, and run over to wherever the crawler is at. It didn't occur to me until I had to do it how much time and fuel you can waste running back to the shop to fuel up. Not so bad with a tractor or skidloader, but man its slow going with a crawler. Im learnin !!
I can only buy diesel from a supplier that delivers here for more than 100 gallons, many of the fuel stations have signage up now that will not allow the pumping of fuel into a 55 gallon drum or will not allow the placement of more than 100 gallons in a truck bed tank without placarding, they do have control over the pumps from inside. I get mine delivered from a MFA dealer, have a 250 gallon tank on a stand that meets EPA and local Environmental agencies standards. Yes it costs a few cents more per gallon but I don't like having set plans and they not being able to be used.
Yup, filling up is a bit of time of a time killer especially tracking to the tank on the loader. We usually do it first thing in the morning while it's still cool. Fortunately the co-op brings fuel to our tank and it's a bit cheaper than the off-road at the service stations. The starter just has a gasket. If I remember right, the gasket kit that came with our reman engine had the starter gasket in it, which leads me to believe you could get one at the CaseIH place. Definitely Komatsu or you could make your own. We pulled the starter from the top but our loader was scotched. You might get away without dropping a pan to get one of the bolts on the bottom out, but it's sure easier to get to the bottom bolt from the bottom of the tractor.
The 466 was comparable to the DVT after you "opened it up" to get more HP which we did. The weak point of the crawler loaders was wet or soft conditions for the 17" pads. The 466 had move room to work in the engine compartments as the IH V's "were a bitch" to work on in the 20C's, E's, 250C, etc...
Yea there sure are a lot of guys that mod out the 466 for tractor pulls. I think even IH had a 280 hp version. It would seem very safe to bump up the HP on the 466 50 HP or so. The thing I wonder on that is "can you use it?" Given the trans, FD, cooling system and the lighter weight of the 175 VS the 250. Maybe it would just spin more. It seems to spin pretty easy now, granted my grouser are pretty shot. Im going to weld on some 3/4 x 3/4 bar stock on the leading tread of each pad in a few weeks. Then well see if it runs out of snot. B
We have some 175C 17" grouser bars that we were always going to weld on our 175C pads that we never got around to using that we would sell. Still new from Grace Track I believe.
Interesting, can you send me some specs on the bar ? I think our pads are 16" and we planned to cut at 15.1. Dimensions ? Send a PM if you like, It may take me a bit to get back to you Im going outa town for a week or so. B