This is going to sound silly but I would love to hear from folks about how they got into rigging and crane work. We seem to be able to do just about anything else but no clue about the rigging and crane rules/regulations/laws and ever so important: how to find work. Any input is awesome...always been a dream of ours!
Don't know about others, but in my own area, back when I was still bending nails, I noticed getting a "crane" (a 15 ton Terex boom truck, that a local concrete products company owner, mostly used to set septic tanks) was difficult. And the people that had the 15 ton seemd to think their you know what didn't stink. The next step up was a 50 ton POS. The people with the 15 ton just rubbed me the wrong way, looking back, I think they had the market sewed up for so long, with no competition, they started getting too cocky. So I figured there was room for some competition, and within a couple years they went out of business, though I have no idea what if anything the work I was taking from them amounted to that or not. One habit I've been in for some time now, is when I go to another town or area, I look up the local crane services, it can be educational. I think I was in the right place at the right time, and seized the opportunity. If you have an area over served by crane service, it'd be tough to get established. I started rigging using common sense, and an abundance of caution, and also gradually got up to speed by reading up on the subject, all the info you need is out there. Luckily, I was lifting trusses mostly, so no big deal, the heavier stuff that came later happened after I had a good handle on what was required. Nowadays, the cost of good rigging is such a minor cost relative to the income the biz generates, that if anything I over do it, buying new way before I really need to. Having new looking rigging is a huge sales point also, as is your attitude in taking care of it. I jump on guys for laying a sling down in the dirt, and if they then walk on it (common problem) I yell louder! I also make a big deal about keeping everything out of the sun, not only because it should be, but also because again it lets the crew your working know you give a hoot.
Most of it is just just showing up to the task & taking care of the customer . Take care of the customer's needs and they will take care of you .
Become a student of your work, that should apply to any trade, but the difference with crane work is, instead of just leaving poor work and dis-satisfied customers you stand a really good chance of filling graves. Now on that cheery note I love running a crane. Unless your in a badly under serviced area make sure you don't need paying customers to finance it, because it takes a long time to show other people's customers that your the better choice. Good luck, I hope we see you on this sight and get to read about you growing a successful crane business.
Thanks guys! Nope don't need the crane business to survive but would love to provide the service and grow into it. So on a "small" starting scale would I be looking for 15 ton machines?
My first crane, well boom truck, was bought to assemble our big trailers. It worked out really well. Already being in heavy haul and having worked for a crane company I had a good working knowledge of rigging and safety practices. I think those are the most important things to educate yourself on. Once we had it we steadily got calls to make picks here and there. It was a 23-1/2 ton so we couldn't lift much but it still stayed somewhat busy. Even rented it out from time to time. If you've never been around them enough to feel comfortable understanding a load chart, various rigging scenarios, angles etc I suggest reading up on that and finding somebody to learn from. It won't take long with the right "teacher" to learn a lot. You don't have to be picking 150k with a 250 ton machine to have a big %#|€ up. Even the little machines end up in power lines, flopped on their sides and with folded booms. There are several guys on here considerably sharper than I am on this subject. Once they all chime in you'll have a great start! If you're wanting to work into selling the service I would make sure you are properly insured and certified to operate. Also will want a certified rigger at some point. Sure saves your tail liability wise in the event of an accident. What you're looking to work with pick wise will help determine your machine. Boom trucks sure have come a long way, not sure what your budget will be. I see them at auction all the time. I'm sure we can all help you get going! Junkyard
Having a certified rigger is not an option any more. It is a OSHA requirement in many states that the lift have at least one certified rigger on it. That being said it is not a big deal to get a riggers certificate. The community colleges around here host the rigging classes from time to time bringing in certified trainers. Classes are never over a couple days in length and I would advise anyone to take one. Some places do it in 8 hours. You can learn a lot there even if you have been rigging for years. Certs here are good for 2 years. A re-cert is 4 hours. A critical lift which is above 90% of crane capacity requires a written lift plan and a pre-lift meeting at the lift point attended by all lift crew members including the operator and the plan must be signed as approved by all crew members. Most inspectors never ask for the lift plan during a site visit but always ask for it after an accident.
Thanks for the information, gentlemen. Sounds like my first plan of attack will be to get myself certified as a rigger in the eyes of OSHA. I would be the operator of any crane and I would be operating in order to sell the service for others. Thanks for the input and I will just keep my progress in this one thread including the status of getting certified and of course deciding which crane to buy. Thank you and stay tuned!
I should add to my earlier post, that after educating myself over the first few years on rigging, I went to a OSHA rigging course and got the card. Didn't want to come off as a total cowboy!
Yeah Parts , also check out Crane & Rigging books to get ideas & solutions for different applications . https://www.iptbooks.com/crane-a-rigging Keep in mind what the book answer is compared to real life job site . Both are good learning experiences . Read though the book but also observe human nature and all the adverse conditions on a job . Some times the book works fine and other times toss it out the window to get it done . Never boring .
I'm not sure your location (DMV area?) I guess starting out insurance, would to me, be the biggest issue. They're going to want to know how much experience/training you have, and if its 0, you're going to have a tough time getting insured. If you're a big enough construction outfit, you might get it to slide by as your own equipment, but if you just wanted to start tomorrow as a one man crane rental outfit, I don't think your going to find someone to insure you. That said, my experience started at 15-16 years old, building grain bins and grain handling facilities. Company had a small boom truck, and we rented bigger cranes, with operator. I don't think someone who doesn't have a construction background, makes a very good operator. It helps so much if you understand what the ground guys are trying to do. I went from small boom truck to my own 25 ton crane. After that I worked for a large crane rental firm (cranes 8-360 ton), with a great employer, and a knowledgeable group of guys. That was my best education in the crane rental business. Worked a 3 year powerhouse project also (concrete to steel to pipefitters). Have a small crane business now. 5 cranes, 25-70 ton. Me and 2-3 guys. I'm always still learning, and figuring out how to do the impossible. We're kind of everyone's method of last resort, if they can't figure out some way to do it, they call me. If insurance isn't a problem, the next most important thing, is being able to sit in the cab, and see problems before they happen. You have to be the expert. The number of jobs that I can just show up to and obey hand signals are few and far between. In a ideal world that's what would happen, but it never works out that way. The operator has to be able to step out of the cab and say "guys, if you rig it that way, and I pick it, its going to roll right out, and be on someones toe". "You can't cut off that much tree or I'm going to be laying on that house", "I can't set up in that mudhole", "nope, powerlines", "it's too windy (that was me today )". All that takes experience. You have to be able to look at something, and when they tell you it weighs 12,000lbs, not bust out laughing right away, and tactfully tell them its probably more like 12 tons. Yes it's common sense, but I sometimes find that sense isn't all that common.
Crane op. As my dad would say your like horse **** you've been on the road a while ( that's a great compliment ) what you so eloquently put in words is what we do every day, a lot of it we see as we're coming in the drive way. I set trusses today for a guy that worked for me for 10 years right out of school.it was kinda nice he was ready for me , had nice sized truss packages put together, had the walls all string lined and well braced ,used proper hand signals and the kid on the ground was a polite keen young man. He did everything the way I taught him when he worked for me. And better yet before I had the bill made out he was at my door with his check book
Thanks tradesman, I've got a couple good framers that are like that, they make for a good easy day.
I grew up on apartment projects. We had cranes when the bottom fell out and had to do something with them. So we hired them out. And that's how we got started in the crane business. I'm not huge on boom trucks. I can get a 30t truck crane in most any place you put a boom truck. Especially when you consider you can run a crane on half outrigger spread. It's also pretty nice to be able actually reach something. And/or lift something. If I'm in your shoes and looking to get into the crane business I'm gonna be looking at an older truck crane. I'd bet you can pick one up in good working order for 50-60k. You can't really buy much boom truck for that. That way you don't have a ton of money wrapped up in something your not sure is gonna get a lot of use. If you drop 150k-200k you gotta be sure the calls are gonna be coming in. And if the calls do come rolling in, you can always upgrade. I'd be looking for something like this. http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...ment/for-sale/11984499/1997-link-belt-htc-830 Or this http://www.machinerytrader.com/listings/construction-equipment/for-sale/12099863/1987-grove-tms145a That tms145 is actually a tms250c. It's just been derated.
On that subject, of US being the experts on the job, it takes some getting used to and is all part of the package of a good crane service. The thing of being able to yell at someone (can't hear you if you don't, so you have to work at yelling while not sounding pissed off), get their attention, and have them do what YOU want, without coming off like a jerk, is a delicate balance. And one I still work at daily! Just went through that today, and during our break, I made a point of going over and making real sure the tag line dummy (nice kid, but a kid, the contractors son) knew he was doing a good job, AFTER following my directions, and why I said why I did, and I was a good guy, and sometimes just needed to make my point loudly to make the job go quicker. It might seem like a minor thing, but it could make the difference in getting called back again, coming off like a jerk without a good reason, one clearly explained, can be bad for business. People skills I guess, who would have thought it would matter?!
I can't count the number of times I have stopped a critical pick and relocated the tag line people to a safer spot. For some reason they want to be on the far side of the load. (Maybe they want to pull it into place.) Guess where it is going to drift to if something fails and the rig starts tipping.
I guess it all depends on what you're used to, I can't remember all the times I've driven my boom truck through town to set a single HVAC, charging my 2.5 hr. minimum for what amounts to a 15 minute job, while stopping on the way back to the crane yard at the grocery store and other places. I look at a truck crane like that and think, what a pain to drive, slow, and wonder what the mileage is. But for sure, once onsite, it would rock. My National has charts for mid and in outriggers, and easily makes 70 mph down the road. It's a chicken or the egg kind of thing, mine works great for the work I do, if I had started with a crane truck I'd probably be doing a bit different type of crane work. I sure as heck wouldn't have gotten a crane truck up the driveway where I worked yesterday and again today. One of both would be best, this thing of what kind of rig reminds me of what kind of airplane decision, it comes down to "one of each." Lots of compromises either way. I have considered getting something like a 50 or 60 ton truck crane, but am too busy on the 30 ton boom truck to mess with it.
Since the above post I made this morning, I had something happen that perfectly illustrates the conundrum that involves what size crane to buy. While I was on my second full day on a project that involved chaining up to access the steep driveway, then once up the hill it was super tight getting set up, once set up the biggest load i had was a bundle of big truss, 5000 lbs, I had to pick up 40' away and put 40' away 180 degrees opposite. The job site so tight we had to shuttle things around as we worked, the 30 ton National was perfect for this job, plenty of reach and capacity and it made it in the tight spot. I simply could not have made it up there with a bigger crane. But then I got a call to set a 6,000 lb HVAC unit for a new hotel, that I had off loaded from a trailer a few days before. They finally were ready to set it on the roof, 60' away. I had to pass, can't do that....made me wish for a bigger crane, but then I wouldn't have been doing the 2 day job I was on. I want to drive a 10 ton boom truck through town, but have a 60 ton truck crane once on site, it's all a compromise.
If you had a 30t truck crane you could have set that unit. A t230 Truck CRANE will do 6800# at 60'. I don't think a lot of people realize the difference in load chart from crane to boom truck. All the while having a smaller footprint onsite. Not to get into a boom truck vs crane deal but my main point was that you can buy way more crane with an older truck crane. No they're not gonna be as comfortable on the road but when you're just starting out I'd think you want more bang for your buck. A boom truck will do better if your running all over settting light things. However if I'm just starting out I can live without some comfort features. If it's my money I'm buying the most crane I can get my hands on. Once I had the work I'd look at the best machine to fit my needs.
Yes, I sure could have, AND I had lots of room to set it up, and pretty level ground even, a clear case for the truck crane in this case! I'm spoiled with the boom truck National though, (for as you said, light work that involves a lot of running around) power windows (handy for letting the dog stick his head out the passenger side when he needs to bark at something) cruise, SAT radio etc. In my country, I sometimes drive 2 hrs for a job, real rural, of course I get travel time though. That truck crane you linked to is a lot of machine for the price, for sure. One thing about running errands in town while driving back to the yard from a job: when I walk out the door of the huge grocery store I go to, unlike when I am driving the car, I don't have to remember where I parked, it's hard to miss, and has my name in foot high letters on the boom. I've run into people I know while doing this, and they'll ask "what are you picking?" I just look at them and tell them I'm just buying some groceries.....all the rigging boxes I have, more then I need, make great storage for whatever I'm buying also! I do get a little self conscious when loading beer into the rigging boxes, that just doesn't look good, but I sneak it in anyway.
The most important thing I learned as a certified rigger is : You Are Liable. I got certified as a rigger and sent out to the oilfields, yeah......Don't recommend that one. Most half assed needlessly dangerous display of crane operations in a developed country your likely to witness. https://www.amazon.com/Bobs-Rigging-Crane-Handbook-Pocket/dp/B00JQNXZEU Haven't looked at one of these for awhile but I think this little guy covered a lot of good basic info. Many guys I worked with swore by it
Yes you are correct that you are liable as a certified rigger, but no more liable than a non-certified rigger. And just hopefully the rigging class and knowing you are liable, even experianced students learned enough to take the steps needed to look for the right way to make the lift safely. Bottom line , Its a great day when the job gets done and everybody goes home to their families. Edit, I never worked in the oil fields but know lots of folks that did. I think most survivors are lucky. I'm amazed that there is not even more injuries than there is. My BIL is messed up for life 8 years ago from a fracking hose that blew apart because the crew never put the safety ties on the high pressure hose connections. He was the truck driver and got hit nearly sixty feet away. Nearly ripped his clutch foot completly off.
Good points old iron . Hate to hear about your brother in laws accident & injury . Sometimes bad stuff happens for no apparent reason & impacts some good people . My take on the whole subject is trust your own judgment and don't depend on any one to warrant success or safety on a given job . If the job environment don't feel rite get out of it . Sometimes I hop out of the rig before a lift and do a " walk around " . Rigger yells " what's going on " ? Reply " just looking things over " .