Hi guys:notworthy ,i have find this on a other forum: http://www.tnn.co.uk/BigLorryBlog/plonearticle.2007-04-10.0514696217 It`s probably the future dumper!Comments will be accepted. equipment fan
That's one big hauler!
Here's a couple more links describing the suspension and steering capabilities. Emirates Truck Factory (EFT) Emirates Truck Factory (ETF) 2 Check out the menu on the left side in the link below. Pretty cool stuff.....:cool2 Emirates Truck Factory Innovations It looks like a cool truck but it appears to be rather complex. I wonder how it would hold up in the long haul.......pun intended .
Cabin requirements ETF is designing a new cabin for its innovative new mining truck. We are looking for imput from operators regarding the layout of the cabin. We believe that the operator should have the maximum luxery/comfort possible in order to avoid fatigue. (After all it is an expensive piece of equipment.) Things as ventilated seats, adjustable pedals, super HVAC suitable for smokers, side and rear camera's, bottle cooler, fridge, sound system, glazing with sunshade band are foreseen. What did we forget? I appreciate your comments, Eddy de Jongh, CEO
Joystick controlls, mounted to the seat. By the way, your vehicle look's awesome. Nice design.:notworthy When can we se pictures of the prototype?
Welcome to HEF hdtruck! :drinkup Wow, the CEO himself. :thumbsup As I said in my above post, your suspension system looks rather complex. How do you forsee its longevity compared to a conventional rigid frame suspension?
I'm pretty sure we have you to thank for hdtruck joining us Countryboy. They have a tracking system on their website and I'll bet the hits from the link you posted got his attention. Welcome hdtruck, and thanks for joining us!!
You're a bright man Steve Indeed this is how I found out about this forum. I am glad to join you.
Our suspension is the key of he design, it protects the frame from road and loading impacts and not to forget, the operator from shocks. It has the same ride as an S-class Mercedes-Benz. It is more sophisticated than complex. The wearing items (cylinders & accumulators) last certainly longer than the struts of current Large Haul Trucks. At the end of this year it will be ready, make your holiday in Dubai and I pick you up for a test drive.
Welcome HDTruck I see a lot of potential in your truck, if you can get the reliability as good as you say. Only time will tell. The thought of using several smaller components instead of one large one may work, if they are all working together. Some potential problems I see are keeping all of the wheel groups in alignment. Any small misalignment will ruin the tire savings claimed. I see many of the large cranes and other carriers with multiple steering axles having tire wear problems due to poor alignment. I also see the bed design creating a lot of wear and damage at the back of the truck by not having a ducktail to deposit the load away from the truck and safely over the edge of the dump site. These comments aside, I would like to see it in action, and it may just set the establishment on its ear somewhat. A little competition is always a good thing.
One thing I would like to see as standard equipment would be a payload scale system. We had these installed on our Cat 775 Haul Trucks and noticed an availability increase on the trucks. This was due to the minimising of instances of overloading due to the loader operator trying to meet production demands. In a production based environment, sometimes rated capacities are overlooked for production demands. Some operators see overloading a truck as making more production while in reality you are causing excessive wear which will eventually lead to more downtime. The scales were mainly brought about due to the tire shortage. We were having tires fail prematurely due to excessive loads on the trucks. We installed the scales and gave the truck driver some authority on how heavy his truck was loaded. This caused maintenance costs to go down and equipment availability to go up which ultimately increased production.....the right way. I see a scale system as a benefit to the manufacturer as well as the customer. Just some thoughts..... By the way, will this truck be marketed in the US in the future?
Your concern about wheel alignment make certainly sense in case of multiple steering axles in conventional designs. We solved this issue by using the steer-by-wire in combination with the hydraulic cylinders operating the steering of the axles. This assures the right alignment all the time. The bed design need some work, we don't have a large rear overhang because we need to have the centre of gravity right to utilize the front axles. Your comment will be taken into account when we work on the body design. Thanks a lot for your input, Eddy de Jongh
We fully agree with you Countryboy, that a scale is a must on Large Haul Trucks. If you see pictures of the ETF truck you'll notice that we have loading lights on both sides of the truck, so the shovel operator can see if he is overloading or not. It will be a small thing to direct the weighing data also to the cabin so that the truck operator also can see it. Consider it done! In the future we will market our trucks also in the USA although not in the first stage. We will first concentrate on areas where slippery circumstances are a big issue of lost production. (Tropic and arctic countries) We appreciate your input. Thanks very much.! Eddy de Jongh, ETF
And we appreciate you sharing this new technology with us. Change is risky. My hats off to you and your team for taking a huge risk in brining to life this new hauler. I hope everything goes as planned and welcome aboard. Pete.... :cool2
'Necessary' Inclusions. Hi, Hdtruck. Firstly, welcome to our little corner of the (heavy equipment) world. Thank you also for your input about your company's 'toy' Without wishing to be critical as everybody has to start somewhere - if they wish to get started - but at 170 ton capacity you are entering a section of the market that is VERY well populated with more or less proven makes and models of dump trucks. Yes, you do have a different slant on a well-worn theme but I suspect that you are going to have to build an EXTREMELY good product and market it VERY well to get a foot in the door beyond maybe your big toe, at least in the short term. You will need to at least match the existing contenders and even surpass them in things like reliability, serviceability, parts and service back-up on a WORLD-WIDE basis and dealer/distributor presence and presentation. You will also need to at least match and preferably beat the performance of the existing contenders in things like driveability, controllability, road handling, braking (including retarding on downgrades steeper that 10%, possibly as steep as 15%.), turning circle, all round vision, view when reversing, driver appointments, power-to-weight ratio, ease of loading (longer, narrower bodies are not as easy to load in most cases as shorter, wider ones) and many other considerations. One thing I would at least offer as an optional extra would be closed circuit TV, especially at the rear - camera situated under the body - but maybe also covering blind spots on the off-side of the unit too. Correctly placed under the rear of the dump body, a rear CCTV set-up is a GREAT aid to reversing under a loading appliance, especially an excavator. I believe it would also pay dividends to look very closely at mirror placement to help eliminate as many blind spots as possible. The load-weighing equipment is a good idea but it does need to be monitored in the truck cab, by the driver, with both visual and audible alarms. This puts the responsibility squarely back on the person who is actually IN CHARGE of the truck. I don't think a BIG, RED, FLASHING light and a good buzzer would be going too far as I have seen some rather lethargic, even sloth-like 'steering wheel attendants' and 'seat-warmers' in my travels. Computer monitoring of ALL functions is also pretty much a 'MUST' these days, both as an aid to servicing and repairs and also to help weed out lesser performing drivers to reduce machine damage due to poor driving practices. It would also be a good idea to have accomodation for at least one passenger in the driving compartment to faciltate training of new drivers. I wish you every success in your company's venture, not least from the point of view that extra competition helps to keep the existing stakeholders on their toes and doing their best.
ETF Haulage concept Hi, Deas Plant. Thanks for welcoming me at your forum. I am impressed by the level of comment we get from all of you. This is really helpful. Let me try to answer you and share our ideas about haulage of minerals. I firstly started to think of developing a new mining truck, when I lived in Indonesia and saw the problems with current large haul trucks. The biggest issue was in my eyes the fact that all the trucks were out of operation when it rained and some time after it, due to traction / safety problems. The next thing I realised was the technical availability, repair and maintenance jobs were taking too long in my view. The last major point was the environment for the operator and his/her skills. The mine I visited had to use local personell to operate their Lrge Haul Trucks, even if these people never had driven a normal car. Having this all in mind we started to develop our new concept. 1) Traction we solved by developing an all-wheel-drive truck with ABS brakes, all the design is done with a modular concept, this means that all the axles are the same and it also means that we can add axle lines or make trucks with less axle lines and still have the same components. 2) In order to reduce R&M time we designed all the major components in such a way that they can be exchanged in 15 minutes! Power module, axles, bodies etc. exchangeable. We designed the whole truck with the eyes of the mechanic who has to repair it. That also took a lot of extra engineering time but I am sure it will pay back by means of shorter repair times. (You may be not believe it, but also our truck will break down! ) 3) In order to prevent accidents etc. we designed a system which make live easier for the operator. Too much information is confusing, why we have all kind of gauages of which the low educated operators in developing countries don't understand. (Oil temp, water temp, rpm etc.etc.) We only have a speedometer and fuel meter, all other items only come up in the main screen when something is wrong together with a message (in their language) which tells them what to do. This accompanied with an audible signal and a big red lamp to get enough attention. The problem is also wireless send to the workshop, so they know in advance that truck number.. is coming in for a problem and they can prepare themselves. (F-1 pitstop system) The next thing that we have done is to give the operator all the luxery money can buys, a super HVAC system in which they can smoke, ventilated seats, watercooler, fridge, a good sound system with radio/cd/casette, no mirrors but cameras for rear and side view. A superb view with a lot of windows fitted with laminated glazing and sun visors. To prevent accidents we will fit a Sleep Deterrent system, A sleep preventing system and a collision avoidance system! We have aranged 3 seats, one for the operator, one for the trainer and one for a trainee. The trainer will have a detachable steering wheel with brake which he can use in case of emergency. The last issue is the competibility from a technical point of view, here we beat all the contenders, be sure of that. Furthermore we only want to sell our vehicles in combination with a full repair & maintenance contract. We will build a workshop and carry the necesarry parts on site. The customers only pays a fixed amount of money per hour and we do the rest. Wait till we are ready and I will show the truck in Oz. Thanks for your good wishes. Look forward to meet you then. Eddy de Jongh
What kind of exterior lighting will the truck be equipped with? Does your target group, that you are trying to market this to, have 24/7 operations? Working nights myself, I have come to appreciate equipment with a good lighting package. Our older equipment has been upgraded with extra lights because lighting technology has come a long ways from the original sealed beam lights that most had. Some of our newest equipment came with HID lighting which I find to be the best so far due to the high intensity of the lights. They show more definition in the viewing area compared to Halogen or Xenon lights. If you haven't already, take the truck out in the dead of night and you will quickly find out where you need the lights. More is always better. I have never found a piece of equipment that had too many lights. The quarry where I work purchased a couple of the newest Cat 775 E Haul Trucks and the lighting is terrible. The headlights are mounted in the bumper :beatsme instead of higher up, under the catwalks. This causes 2 problems. They are more prone to damage because a bumper is there to do exactly what its name implies. The other problem is that they are too low to be able to illuminate the road properly. You end up having alot of dark areas if the road is even slightly uneven. Its like they just forgot about the night shift crew. In 24/7 operations you will find that most of the time production is placed more on the night shift crew that the day crew. When you can see what you are doing, safety and production stand to benefit. I hope I am not coming off as trying to play CEO , but you did ask and I do have many ideas for improvement on whats currently being offered in the haulage market. From what you have said already it sound like a great improvement already. :drinkup
Lighting Countryboy, Indeed we equip our trucks for 24/7 operation. I do agree with you that lights are of utmost importance. We will use only Xenon lights for headlamps and reversing lights. Besides that we will have a set of extra Xenon lights which will turn and light up the curve you are going to approach. This is fully automatic. When approaching hairpin curves with low speeds it will pay of! All the lamps will be automatically cleaned with high pressure washers at the same interval as the wiper washers will be used. This assures that the light are alway clean! If you want to see the scientific details and can send it to you by email. Thanks for helping us, really appreciated. Best regards, Eddy
PM sent with email address. Both of those functions would be highly beneficial. I'm sure the competition will have some catching up to do once this thing rolls out.
Off-Higway Road Trains available Hi Guys, Emirates Truck Factory launched a new product: Off-Highway Road Trains with two locomotives on both end. A unique design only possible due to the all-wheel-steering-by-wire feature of ETF trucks. Check it out on the web site: http://www.etftrucks.nl/Products/Roadtrains/ Looking forward to your comments. Eddy
Have you actually produced any of these trucks yet?
By the way, I could do without all the pop-ups I get navigating your site. I'm not interested in ring tones or anything else unrelated to your truck.
The only problem I see is the cost of buying tires With them steering and driving a haul truck like that probably peals the rubber off. Probably the biggest benefit is the trucks don't need a perfectly graded haul road. Have to see if Alberta oil companies buy any for hauling the black mud.
nice product/innovation but would like to see a real one...
Welcome HDTruck, awesome looking machine. Hopefully some of our input here will aid in the building of trucks and equipment in the future, if other CEO's are open and will to talk like yourself. Trbo
Off-Highway Road Trains To Steve Frazier: - You talk like my banker They're not produced yet but the design challenges were huge. We are ready for the first orders. - Turn on your pop-up blocker in Internet Explorer, that will solve this issue. Sorry for the inconvenience. To Ford LT-9000: - The investment in tyres is roughly the same as for Large Haul trucks to carry the same load, however we lift 50% of the tyres during the empty haul and that reduces the tyre costs significantly. - Steering axles prevent wringing from the tyres and they are not scrubbing the rubber off like with the front wheel tyres of Large Haul trucks. - The oscilating axle configuration ensures that the tyres are always loaded equally. Compare this with twinned rear tyres of Large Haul Trucks. If one of the tyres from a twinned pair goes over a stone the other tyre is also lifted and it means that one tyre gets 100% overloaded. This is happening many times per hour and causes heating up of the tyres. Our tyres run much cooler. - Our Road Trains are very suitable for Oilsand fields. Especially in summer time when the "black mud" gets softer and the trucks have to drive against a wave. Our all-wheel-drive and better load spreading will really pay off there. Talk to the guys over there, we would lover to supply them. To Equipment fan: - We keep you informed as soon as the first one is delivered. To EZ TRBO: - We want to make the best possible solution and therefore your input is very important to us. Please keep on feeding us and be critical. Thank you all and best regards, Eddy
Eddy - Your new truck design is rather interesting, but I think there are maybe three factors that will be difficult to overcome, to develop sales with this radical design of truck. 1. The open-pit mines in most parts of the world use a 1 in 7, or 1 in 8, ramp slope for efficiency. With your design, weight transfer to the rear, on a typical mining ramp slope, means that the rear two axles, end up carrying 80-90% of the gross weight. This surely must result in rear axle/tyre overload .. On a current standard design dump truck, the rear axle carries 4 of the vehicles 6 tyres, and thus the tyre loading is balanced, when climbing out of pits. Long distance, flat travelling, as encountered on the surface, tends to overload front tyres on current design trucks .. but mine dump trucks spend 80% of their time climbing out of pits, fully loaded .. so the loading is balanced out, overall. 2. I am having trouble trying to envisage an easy, and low cost way, to change those inside tyres! .. 3. Your truck sounds like an extremely complex nightmare of electronics, sensors, and wiring. These three items are the least durable part of any earthmoving equipment .. they cause the most downtime .. and they are generally overpriced about 500% in comparison to simple mechanical parts. I know that design costs and research costs have to be figured into electronic costs .. but some of the electronic parts costs I have seen, would make even a millionaire wince .. It's not only the cost of these complex items .. it's trying to get the people with the necessary electronic/electric troubleshooting and repair skills, onto remote minesites to keep this equipment running, that causes most headaches for CEO's/managers/foremen .. As a result .. simple is good .. minimum electronics is also good .. if electronics HAVE to be used .. they have to totally sealed, easy to repair, OVER-PROTECTED (not just well-protected) .. and high temperature, corrosion and vibration proof. As a matter of interest, my nephew has produced a design similar to yours .. a 4 axle, 8 wheel truck .. but with single wheels. The truck is diesel-electric, uses AC wheel motors .. follows the best LeTourneau design, in having all the wiring harness in identical section lengths, so inventory is reduced, and any damaged section can be unclipped and replaced in minutes .. and has all the electronic components mounted inside the cabin, as best protection from shock, damage, dust, corrosion and vibration .. He holds numerous patents on the design, and has been to all the major truck manufacturers including Cat and Komatsu, giving presentations on his design .. and they all flatly refused any interest in producing the truck .. due to them claiming the benefits were not substantial enough, to warrant major re-tooling, re-design, and replacement of current designs. Whether that was a ploy .. to allow them time to study ways around his patents, and produce their own designs, copied from his design .. only time will tell .. In the meantimes, he's gone to China with the design, and has agreements in place with Chinese manufacturers, to produce and market the truck. I told him my concerns about the design (the same three I listed above) .. and he reckons I'm exaggerating the potential problems, and it will sell like hot scones at a church fete .. He's always been an optimist .. but he knows earthmoving equipment and mining, as he was brought up in our earthmoving/mining family .. so he's well qualified to produce improved designs. He also has very good local design engineer, as a partner .. who has designed much new equipment, such as the Rhino blade for loaders (now combined with Tiger Engineering, and re-named the Tiger blade - and produced in conjunction with the original Tiger wheeldozer blade). Tiger blades .. http://www.specialisedmachine.com.au/index.html The nephew claims the big advantage of his truck design, is a longer, narrower truck, that can carry bigger payloads, on existing mine ramps .. without widening them. As it stands at present .. anytime any company wants to upgrade to bigger trucks .. all the mine roads and ramps have to be widened at huge cost. A truck that can carry a bigger payload on current roads and ramps does have a big selling advantage .. Watch this space ..
Welcome back Eddy... The dumpers in the middle.... Are they side dumpers? FWIW, I really hope these plans become reality! People like you who are not afraid to try new ideas and concepts brings about much needed change in this stale world we live in. Like a kid dreaming about the day when he will finally get to operate that big yellow tractor, I am sure that one day your dreams/visions will come to life. Till then, I'm saving for a plane ticket. When this finally happens, I do wish I could be there...
You just have to send info to companies like Syncrude in Alberta who are in the tar sands. The oil business in Alberta is going great guns and if they can move the sands quicker and more efficiently they will look at it.
From your website: "In 2005 the engineering activities were moved to the Emirate Ras Al Khaimah in the United Arab Emirates where also the prototype is constructed." Do you have photos of this prototype? I'm sure our members would love to see them!
Yes Pete, All dumpers are side dumpers in order to unload quickly, in some cases it could even be two-way side tippers. This depends on the product, for sand it can be done, for rocks it cannot. We will keep this forum informed when the first ETF Road Train is ready. You're very welcome to see and drive it than. Cheers, Eddy
Technical answers Dear OzDozer, I am always pleased to have reactions from Down Under as the Road Trains are common equipment in your continent. Let me try to answer your questions and comments: 1. Overloading of tyres: To calculate the load transfer from the front axles to the rear on inclines there are three things we have to know; firstly the height of the Center Of Gravity, secondly the wheelbase and thirdly the incline itself. Well organised Open-pit mines are having inclines of between 10-12 % otherwise the speed of the vehicles are getting too low. Current Large Haul Trucks have a weight distribution of empty: 47% front and 53% on the rear axle. Laden this is: front 33% and rear 66%. This is a perfect distribution as the rear axles have 4 tyres and the front axle two tyres. The COG is approx. 5,5 m heigh, with ETF this is 3 metres. The wheelbase of a comparable Large Haul Truck is 5,7 m and with ETF 6 m. When we calculate the difference in weight distribution on a 10% incline we end up with 9% increase on the rear axle and 9% decrease on the front axle of a Large Haul Truck. In our case this is 5%. So you see that we are better in that respect. The configuration of twinned tyres on the rear is a considerable disadvantage compared to single wheels with oscilating axles as ETF has. If a twinned tyred wheel drives over a stone or hole in the road one of the two tyres is 100% overloaded! This happens many times per hour and result in heat build-up of these tyres. In our case the tyres are always equally loaded! See the attached pictures. 2. I appreciate your sharp mind. When an inside tyre is flat we change the complete axle.(15 min.) This have to be done in the workshop because we need special tooling for that. Before arriving in the workshop the axle with the flat tyre is lifted, so no damage to the tyre. Compare this with a flat tyre on current trucks, if it is a front tyre the customer is in trouble. It will take a long time to change a wheel! By the way we will only sell our trucks with a Repair & Maintenance contract. This means that the customer pays a fixed amount of money per working hour and everything is carried out by our own people in a workshop build on site. 3. Your worries are real, but unfortunatly we need the modern electronics to optimise the productivity. On sensors we use all wireless types, which don't need any wiring. All our wires are specially designed for the severe conditions the trucks are operating in. We use the same system for wiring as LeTourneau and the price is reasonable. We don't need to get rich overnight! What an interesting story about the design of your nephew. I would really like to come in contact with him. I understand the problems of re-tooling, re-design and replacement of current designs of the big five manufacturers. This is the very reason why we made a modular design for all our vehicles. And it is also the reason why they are not coming with better solutions. They will only do that when the market ask for it and that will happen when we are in full swing. This is the chance for outsiders in this market. The trend for heavier vehicles is solved with our modular design with adding axles and engines, all of the same type so no extra parts are needed. Please have a look at the page " modular design" under "Innovations" at our web site for more details. Thanks for your contribution, we really value it! Cheers, Eddy
Photo's prototype We will put them on this forum when they are ready.
"Take a look at this: http://www.etf.ae/products/trucks These vehicles can do both jobs." - hdtruck Yeah, I thought a little bit about replying to a thread that hasn't been replied to in more then 9 months now. But noticing that no one actually made any comment to hdtruck's picture, I myself couldn't help wondering about the image. Hmmmm....the Emirates Truck Factory.:beatsme Do they actually built those things? I guess so, having seen the pict of one of them rolling along a site-road. But I wonder, is THAT design really worth something? Those trucks -in my view- seem a little of a old sci-fi era, don't you think? Quadruple wheel-mountings per what it hardly can be conceived as an axle???? The wheels arrangement might be OK (with lots and lots of reservations) but that mono-rail frame...hmmm...doesn't look too rigid to me. Also it was funny to see some of the drawings showing the "innovative" solutions such a ETF truck presents vs. current large haul-trucks. Perhaps the Arabs do have a way with their things and money, but for one, I just can't imagine those things hauling extensively in mines like Morenci (US) or Kalgoorlie (Australia):nono
We attempted to get some proof of a prototype...or any production...but none was forthcoming. Nothing on that sites appears to be a real photograph.:beatsme I'm not sure about websites that have a lot of pop-ups too:cool2
Hi Cat4Ever, The main difference with ETF trucks and the conventional Large Haul Trucks is the fact that the whole weight is euqually spread over eight points. Normally 4 and not equally!! The suspension has a wheel travel of 1000 mm which absorbs the loading and road stresses and so the chassis is not effected. You have to wait till we have a demonstration vehicle ready and than you are more than welcome to make a test drive in the mountains and in the desert. We have both here. Beginning of next year it will be ready. Best regards from the Desert, Eddy de Jongh ETF
I do understand the wheel configuration's purpose hdtruck. My point concerning the frame though is that -although per your say- those wheel travels are meant to absorb the greater deal of road stresses, there's a totally different case with the loading stresses. Those are passing through the frame before reaching the suspensions (or your wheel travel). To me, your truck's frame seems just weak enough in dealing with the punching given by a 30-50 m3 capacity shovel loads on a extended period of time. Plus, from the drawings, I can see that there are multiple steering groups of wheels (again, I can't refer to them as axles...) so my next question would be: what's the traction like, on your trucks. Don't tell me 16x16.:eek2 Another problem with that design would be the expenditures. 16 wheels? That's a lot of them. And tyres too. All in all it's a pretty costly affair in my opinion. If it wasn't, the established manufacturers would've built it long ago.
If you want a real laugh, click the ETF link above in post #20, and whern you get rid of the annoying pop ups, look to the top left, and click on "scrapers" Be sure to have a firm seating position first so you do not fall out of your chair!
"If you want a real laugh, click the ETF link above in post #20, and whern you get rid of the annoying pop ups, look to the top left, and click on "scrapers" Be sure to have a firm seating position first so you do not fall out of your chair!" - JDOFMEMI :lmao Is that a garbage truck? :lmao
The load impacts are handled by 8 points on the chassis and then go to the suspension. Compare that with a conventional Large Haul truck with practically no wheel travel in the back. This means that the load impacts have to be handled by the chassis. I don't understand why you cannot see the axles. One axles line consists of two individual axles which can oscillate 10 degrees left and right. Each axle has an independent suspension. Each wheel has its own wheel motor, so 16 wheels is 16x16!! Regarding expenditure 16 wheels with 24.00R35 tyres weigh 16 ton. Compared to 6 wheels with 37.00R57 weigh 26 ton. Also the price is lower for 16 of our sizes compared to 6x 37.00R57. The running costs of the tyres is even more attractive as during empty haul 8 tyres are lifted. (50 % of the working hours) Talking about costly affair: In the tropics the conventional trucks are down to weather conditions (rain makes the haul roads too slippery for them) 8 % of the working hours. Try to imagine what it means if you can increase your productivity with 8% with the same capital costs. By the way this advantage goes also for arctic countries where snow and ice is the problem. Keep on asking my friend!
I'm done asking. When your design actually becomes a well fortuned truck, with thousands of overseas orders, then I'll be glad to ask more questions. Until then, I'll keep to what's real.:cool2
Well i see that someone has finally taken a page from the platform style trailers that are popular in Europe. Not being a mining man I can't comment on the applicability of the trucks in a mine, having said that I do have considerable experience with the Goldhoffer and Schrilee style platform trailers and can say that the self propelled versions have unbelievable suspension travel and the steering systems are fantastic, however the wireless scares me (hope they are not using an MS based system). Traction is very good due to the suspension travel and the ability to maintain a load on every set of boogies. They are very durable and will handle very rough terrain. The tire wear should be significantly lower than the conventional setup as there is virtually no scuffing in corners and the ability to raise a line of tires when empty is great. I am curious about the frame work on the truck, the trailer system uses a lot of steel (read weight) at the connection point between the frame and each boogie system because it supports a great deal of weight on such a small area , it needs to be hell for stout, I realize that the hydraulic suspension absorbs a lot of the shock, but it is still a small footprint. I think that HDTRUCK may very well have a winner on his hands, I could see these on smaller on-hiway trucks as well, especially in the cities as the maneuverability is unbelievable.
Well here goes. Trucks keep getting bigger and bigger, the biggest hitch we have is tires. Our mine is only alloted X amount of tires for the year, when they're gone,they're gone... truck out of production. So we have been hard blading our haul roads and only graveling roads during bad weather. Also just for refrence our haul roads are between 10 an 14%. Tires are the biggest challange in mining today. We are now averaging close to 62,000 miles out of our 789 trucks. We have gotten over 68,000 on one set. This tire set up you have may work to your advantage simply because of supply and demand. Also here's something to consider from a differant perspective... the dozer operator building the stockpile. Our leach stockpiles are normally 40 feet deep. So a side dumping truck will not dump the load over the saftey berm, meaning that the dozer has to push every load. That's not a huge problem on a shallow dump, but on a waste stockpile that can be anywhere from 100' to 800' deep, at least in our mine, that would be a HUGE saftey issue. A stockpile is built from the bottom up. Meaning every load that is dumped over the edge builds from the bottom up leaving a natural angle of repose. On deep stockpile, if you have to push every load over, your stockpile will get "bellies" and that is very dangerous. That is when stockpiles fail and trucks go tumbling. I cringe at the drawing of the trucks backed OVER the berm. Yes it happens, not often, but sometimes. I personally favor a rear dumping truck over a side dumper for mining. Interesting design, I still see one thing more. A long narrow truck dosn't seem as stable dumping on slopes as a conventional design, once the bed is in the air. I will stay tuned. Best of luck to you , I'm still blown away by this internet contrapyion that lets us have a global conversation, that is really cool. This forum and othes like it are basically a free focus group for any Ceo who is willing to pay attention. Thanks for your time, Eric.
Eric, I fully understand the problems you see with side dumpers. I have to remind you that our standard trucks are equipped with rear dump bodies, only the road trains are having side dumps. From a stability point of view, our trucks are 6,7 metres wide, so not really narrow. As a matter of fact comparable types from Cat or Komatsu are even more narrow. Cat 785: 5,5 metres Komatsu HD 1500: 6 metres. But more important than the actual width is the mounting point of the suspension. Compare than again and you see enormous stability advantages. Thanks for all your input, I really appreciate it. Eddy de Jongh (hdtruck)
Mr. de Jongh, here at Heavy Equipment Forums we strive to ensure the information our members receive is accurate and I'd like to clear up something. On your website it is mentioned that a prototype exists, and that these trucks are working in two Middle Eastern countries. What is troubling me is there are no actual photographs of your trucks or even their parts, only illustrations. The same goes for your factory, only an artist's rendering of what the factory could look like. My question is this: Have any of these trucks actually been built? Are they simply a concept at this point? I will agree that what you have come up with is innovative, but if it is indeed a concept at this point we'd prefer that it be represented as such instead of as a working product as has been eluded to here. I find it pretty ironic that I get a pop-up requesting me to take a "Dumb Test" when visiting your site. I don't think any of our members here, including myself care to be misled, can you clear this up for us? Thank you.
Steve, I am not aware that it is mentioned on our website that our trucks are working in Middle Eastern countries. This is not the fact, you are right in assuming from the pictures and not photo's that nothing is running yet. We are working on the prototype which will be ready in some months from now. Also the preparations for the factory are on the way but not ready yet. We will show photo's as soon as it is possible. I don't know where the pop-ups are coming from. Our IT specialist is clearing this and hopefully we can get this of our web site soon. Sorry for the trouble. Thanks for your interest in our designs, I am sure that it will make some waves when we roll out our first vehicle. We have an enormous interest from all over the world and 15 trucks are already sold. Best regards, Eddy de Jongh
If the prototype is going to be ready in "some months" from now, I'd think you must have some of the components assembled and on site, and perhaps a scale mock-up of one or several of your trucks. I think photos of even some of those items would go a long way towards allaying some of the skepticism that's being expressed here on the forum. (Not to mention the educational value to our members.)
Digger, You are right, we have some components on site but for obvious reasons we don't want to show anything before the complete vehicle is ready. Eddy
Well then, I guess the skepticism will continue for a bit longer. :beatsme Be sure to share something as soon as you're comfortable doing so...
hi hdtruck : it is very exciting to see such a truck, this should be a revolution of heavy truck!! but I still have some questions: 1 the net-to-tare ratio is not very good, particularly the smaller models, ex: payload 75 ton with GVW 150 ton, the net-to-tare ratio is 1. Generally the net-to-tare ratio of a 80-ton rigid truck will be around 1.4-1.5. payload 275ton with CVW 450 ton, the net-to-tare ratio is 1.57, this is very good. Well, Ti272 of libehher, net-to-tare ratio is nearly 2.0. and the Ti272’s rear suspension system looks like ETF’s to some degree. So maybe the future models of ETF truck can decrease EVW 2 Are there some planetary in the drive wheel, just like the rigid AC-drive truck? 3 How to cool the drive motor, liquid or wind?i if use wind, the mud will be dangerous to motor.
Dear MT driver, You rightfully mentioned the weights of our trucks. We are working on that and I am sure we can reduce it somehow. You cannot compare our suspension with the Ti272. Our suspension looks more like the multi-axle, self propelled trailers used to transport very heavy cargo. 1) Yes in future the EVW will be reduced 2) We have no final drive in the wheels, all the wheels are direct-driven (No gears) 3) The wheel motors are oil cooled. Thanks for your input MTdriver
i'm glad im not the only one thinking that's alot of tires to buy
cat 385 16 tyres is indeed more than 6 tyres you buy now for an existing Large Haul Truck. However the total amount is approx. the same because we have smaller tire size: 2400R35. However the running cost are considerably lower because we lift 8 tires during empty haul. Cheers
hdtruck, first of all I'd like to wish you success with your venture. I'm wondering if your company is publicly traded or if you have strong private funding in place to bring this to production. Given the condition of world financial markets, this is a tough time to try and raise money from investors.
having a 16 tire murray lowbed I can tell you the setup they have WILL without a doubt wear the tires much better than current haul trucks. Everything else is up for debate.
Eddy, One of the things I noticed about the road train concept is it will require the driver to get out of the vehicle and walk to the other end after the vehicle is loaded. I would think that due to safety concerns mine operators would shy away from this. Also, the shortest train you have on your site is 5 units long which would result in a train about 250ft or 76m. From my limited experience with truck drivers this distance would take them a considerable amount of time to walk.
So we should have that prototype up and running now...??
That would be an excellent grocery getter
The ETF sounds very interesting. How do we find out more? The website doesn't contain that much information.
Mr. Eddy de Jongh, I am currently a college student studying construction management. One of my papers has to do with your type of equipment. Is there anyway I can get your email so I can ask you a few questions? Thank you for your time. -Travis
In the mid to late eighties I worked as a welder millwright at W.O.T.C.O. (western oil tool company ) Anyone else familiar with them? I visited them recently by satellite seems that facility is closed. When looking at the rear of a 777* you see the ends (bottom corners) of the "Pentagon beams". When building the beds the parts would go to a fit up saddle......the bed tacked together upside down. Then to the first position errands that would turn it (barrel roll) so you were always welding flat. The second position errands would endo' it so you were always welding flat. The welds on these were not automated. The large welds were One pass only! as the beds were just tacked together. What an army of cowboy welders it took to mass produce these. ... The beds were shipped all over the world The beds were a wide load on a train car being "married " left and right" One third and two thirds then welded together on site.
Typo errands* position er