I have been running a 3 (actually 4 lever with extendahoe) lever 580CASE SL for the last 6 years.I just upgraded to a newer SL equipted with a 2 lever and foot extendahoe controls.I can barely hit the ground with the different controls.I could swap out my CASE controls on the SL i have for sale but i would really like to learn the 2 lever.Any pointers to make it easier to learn on?
I don't know if there is any good advise to be offered except talk to yourself while you hoe (boom up, crowd in) and practise, practise, practise but never give up on the 2 sticks.
Work At It You Will Get It . If You Move Up To A Excavator You Will Be Ready To Go !
Something I have done in the past to assist people in this situation before is to swap the boom & dipper controls. It seems the biggest hurdle to overcome is having the boom in your left hand instead of your right. If you slide up your lower rear window & remove the rear plastic cover around the control levers, you will see the control linkages. You will need to fabricate 2 linkages that will cross over each other & to swap the boom & dipper levers. That will make it a standard excavator pattern, in instead of a hoe pattern.
Alrman i would love to do that i can't get used to locking overcenter boom with my left hand.Is it alot of trouble to fab something up?What is the reason they make the hoe pattern different than the excavator?
I think the original reason was for marketing. As you are currently experiencing frustration, trying to switch to another pattern, you can probably see that most would find it easier to just stick with the same pattern (ie. same brand) instead of switching. However, this may well just be a side benefit that evolved from so many different MFRs trying to invent the same product (speaking to the inherent loyalty that would come from a particular customer being skilled in one pattern, and not any other), or it is possilble that a patent infringment issue forced each MFR to have it's own pattern. There are still several patterns out there. However, it does seem that most MFRs are going to the pilot control wobble sticks (the 2-stk that you have on your Super L) because the consumer wants to have the ability to go between the (2) patterns available with the two lever control system. The (2) patterns are SAE large machine (or CAT controls), and SAE small machine (or Deere/ISO controls). With pilot controls you can go between the (2) patterns with the switch of a lever. This allows employers to hire anyone who can run either pattern without having to re-train. Unfortunately this does not really serve all users, in particularly those who run (4) lever systems (Case, Ford/Sherman, et.al.). I learned to operate backhoes on the Ford/Sherman controls and excavators on CAT controls. I have been able to switch over to the Deere exc. controls but it was difficult (more so than going from 4-lever to either 2-lever pattern) because every thing is so similar (only the boom and dipper are on opposite hands). In any case you will be better off, ultimately, to learn the 2-lever system (either one) because 2-lever wobble sticks will be the only system available from the MFRs soon. BTW, I'm sure Case offers parts to swap your machine to CAT controls, or back to Case, if you prefer. My only advice is the same as others have said...give it time and practice. It will come to you once you have muscle memory.
Funny you should mention that... It was about 25 years ago, but I'd learned to operate on the 3 lever pattern, and went out and bought a second machine, which was equipped with the joysticks. It didn't take that long to learn the second pattern. I don't remember just how long it took (plus, I had another operator on the second machine, so I didn't get to operate it all day long), but I got to be as comfortable on one machine as on the other. I could jump off the 3-lever 680, and onto the 2-lever 580, and never miss a beat. The only problem I did have, and I never quite got over it, was that being the hand throttle on the 680 was at the left side of the backhoe controls, and the hand throttle on the 580 was on the dashboard, I was frequently reaching for that one on the wrong machine, and coming up with a handful of air. I didn't really find that to be an issue, since essentially, once you added the swing control to your hands, it seemed like a whole different pattern. I'd never heard of that before. I have heard of swapping hoses around. I was well used to operating that joystick backhoe pattern when I got on my first excavator. I learned to run that one too, and was just as comfortable jumping from an excavator onto that backhoe. Now, if you switched me to an excavator with backhoe pattern controls, I'd be totally confounded. And since that hoe is long gone, these days I need to switch a hoe to excavator pattern to be able to use it. (Thank God for pattern switchers.)
I have a IH 3400A with all levers. I don't know how to operate a backhoe anyway so I guess it doesn't matter. LOL I'm working on it and getting it in shape. I'll learn what it does later. Ha ha. I thought of installing the 2 joy stick controls. If I could find some parts cheap....errr. free, I might consider it. Good Luck, Gene
I always made 2 x new links so that the originals could be refitted in the future (resale or different operator). All you need is about 1 metre of 3/8" round bar & 3/8" UNF die set to cut new threads. Measure how long they need to be & cut to length, Bend to the nessesary shape to connect lever to spool & cut threads. Fit the original rod ends & adjust so levers are even. The end that fitted the spool - heat with oxy & flatten it out a little & drill the hole for the clevis pin. I usually allow 1 - 1 1/2 hrs for the whole process. If you wanted to sacrifice the original linkages, they just need to be lengthened a little. So, you could cut them in half & weld in an extention & bend to shape. I have done this conversion many times in the past as die hard case owners (three stick foot swing) had alot of trouble converting to wobble sticks when they had too. With the conversion, they picked it up in no time at all. I haven't done one for a long time as wobble sticks have been std since the 580SL & most of the old timers have converted or retired. Swapping the hoses on a mechanical lever set up is not recommended as the boom & dipper valve sections have different secondary relief pressure settings.That will really upset your digging & can damage cylinder rods. Swapping the pilot hoses on pilot controls is OK.
You're thinking about it to much. Find a place with some soft digging so you don't bang the machine, wrap the engine up full and start digging and spoiling. A soft hole and a soft spoil pile will help cushion the machine. Keep the bucket in the dirt all the time. You'll have it down in 30 minutes.
Every once in a while a john deere 310 gets sent to us with a hammer, i loose my mind making a poor excuse trying to operate it. I wont even sit in an excavator with deere controls, i find it almost impossible and dangerous. 4stick case and cat controls only for this kid
There's a guy out on our site, working for a different builder, that brought a 580E. I'm dying to ask him for 15 minutes of seat time just to see if I can still run one...
You can run mine but it is a long drive.:notworthy
Digger come up my way have a go at my machine, plenty of trenchin to do
Thanks, guys, but I think I'll just ask the guy on our site. And as much as I loved the 20 some years I ran rubber tired hoes before I ever set foot in an excavator, I've kinda come to like spinning the machine around as opposed to standing up and spinning the seat around.
I learned how to run a backhoe 40 years ago, Case foot swing . The outfit I have worked for the last 15 years will keep them if that is what you are productive on .Right now we have 4 590 M's . We have one with the 2 stick and I hate it . I absolutely slow down 50% running that thing . I can jump off a 4 stick and into the excavators , JD controls , no problem . The case 2 sticker levers are not long enough for me and I am not comfortable at all . I have also seen the guys that say they can run an excavator either pattern . I for one cannot without 3-4 days of mistakes . And I noticed they could not either . It's 4 levers and JD pattern for this kid , 56 years later . My only concern is that 4 stick is probably on it's way out for us old guys .
I can run the case controls ok but I prefer the SAE excavator style. I bought a new JD 310SG in 2002 and I ordered the machine with factory SAE style controls to match my excavators. With the Deere pattern wobble sticks I can't hit the ground. To me the Case 3 lever is different enough that I don't get confused But, If I rent something with Deere style controls you can forget it.
It hasn't been mentioned here, but given the choice between the joysticks and the Case foot swing style, on a backhoe , I prefer the foot swing. Here's why--with the foot swing style, when it comes time to use the hoe to push the machine forward, you can reach around and use the steering wheel if you need to, while still having full control of the hoe. Try that with joysticks...
Im 24, i think 4stick is the way to go. All my work is in the street mostly trenching. I do like pilot controls but not for what I do.
10-4 Digger , that is where I really need foot swing . Trying to jockey around in the mud , coming up a grade , may have to throw it in gear ? I need two hands and my feet .