Grading and the such What do people think of http://www.deere.com/en_US/cfd/cons...steer_attachments/skidsteer_rollerlevels.html I have a job comming up that is on about 1 acer of land, I need to move IE cut away about 200 yards of dirt and grade - move it over to another area on the property. I will be using a http://www.deere.com/en_US/cfd/construction/deere_const/compact_track_loaders/ct332_features.html I was originally thinking of renting a dozer http://www.deere.com/en_US/cfd/construction/deere_const/crawlers/450J_dozer_overview.html I will admit that I'm very new to grading, so any help would be nice. Im also looking to see what others charge for grading. Thanks
imjustave, Welcome to Heavy Equipment Forums...:waving :drinkup :usa Hopefully one of oure ever-helpful moderators can come along and move this to a new thread. If it were me, I would use a dozer to move that much material. Nothing beats a dozer when it comes to grading. That's the job they were designed to do. You can grade with a CTL, but the short undercarriage is going to follow every little dip and hump and require a bit more fussing about to get things really smooth. Around here you can rent a dozer for about $350/day (Deere 450) plus delivery. What's going to be done with the property once you grade it, and how precise do you need to be with your grade? Take care... Joe
well there is going to be a single story building ericted on the filled in area, the area that I'm gettign the dirt from will be a parking lot. I must admit im new to this and might not even want to get envolved lots of Q have come up in the past few hrs in my brain.. Grading wise The site plans have elevation to be so many feet here and so many feet there. IE lots of measuring involved... very new to this .. not totaly sure on how close it needs to be Whats "standard" but I assume 1/4 to maybe an inch at most I'm assuming I can just use a laser on a tripod at a known height and check- measure the differance in different location on the site getting the dirt to site plans level. Do I need to pack down the area that the building will be sitting on? The customer wants me to grade the whole lot, but he still needs all of the utilities to the build installed, parking lot drainage installed etc? To me it seems logical to move and ruff grade the parking lot area and move the needed dirt to the building area and level out. Building is 50K SQ. Moving the dirt seems to be the easy part, its making sure I don't F it up thats my worry. like someone 2 months from now saying hay this dirt is 6 inches to high..... I like the challange but I know im on a hudge learning curve on this. Oh and the guy wants a bid tomorrow on the leveling part at least. Not even sure where to start on price for that eithor......:Banghead but I want to at least try and put in a decent bid.
Joe, Your wish is my command... :notworthy
Dave,I'm far from an expert on these matters,but I have bitten off more than I can chew many times,myself. I'd recommend that you pass this project up for now.If you're uncomfortable about your knowledge on this type of work,I'd say that could be a sign that you're not quite ready yet,but someday down the line you may be. It's too much of a risk to your business to have something come up that you didn't even realize was an important consideration.The liability for having to go back,after the job is done,to redo something will far outweigh any amount of money you'de make off the job now. Wait until you're comfortable that you know exactly what needs to be done,before you take on a project of this size.You may be able to handle it now,but what if you're wrong? If you're going too be working for a seasoned contractor during this,and he's going to be calling the shots for you,that may change my opinion,but I got the feeling from your post you're the top dog on this job,so.... Good Luck on whatever you decide too do!!
I would bring in a dozer to do the grading. The part i would be worried about is the building sitting on fill. How deep are you going to be filling? You'll probably want to bring in a roller. How about a compaction test?
I also would use a dozer. It is very hard to beat a PAT blade for grading :wink2 Also, like mentioned above, if you will be filling in any areas, then you will need to compact the material. Also, you said that you have to move 200yds of dirt off the site to another area. That could take quite awhile with that skid steer. It may even pay to use a track loader. If you have no experience on one then it wouldn't be a good idea. If you own the skid steer, then I would use that, no sense renting something then.
Do I need to pack down the area that the building will be sitting on? i'm sure the engineer/architect will require compaction on the site if any type of structure, parking lot goes on it. personally, i refuse to hire a soils consultant to take density tests. i want the owner of the project to. that way they say where, when the tests are taken. and they say yes/no if it fails or passes. it just relieves some of the liability in my opinion.
I'll never knock somebody for "having a go" and asking questions here is good thinking but; I'll be blunt: Then Jeff D has nailed it in one.
Truer words have never been spoken. I know plenty of guys who can run circles around me when it comes to sitting in the seat, but show them a set of plans, and...:dizzy I don't know about your area, but around here, that size job would require a complete set of engineered site plans that would have been approved by the local municipality. The plans tell you EXACTLY what to do. Personally, I love these types of jobs, because there's no quibbling about how something should be done, or what materials should be used. It's all right there on the plans. Compaction? Absolutely. Material will have to be added in "lifts", 4-6" at a time, and compacted with a roller between each lift. I also agree with dayexco's idea of haveing the GC hire his own soils engineer. Takes a bunch of the liabiity off of you. I'm a little confused...is the customer just asking you to just level the lot, or do all the site work? Usually one contractor would get all the site work. Everything from clearing the lot, rough grading, storm water management, parking lot sub-base, footings and foundation excavation, utility trenching, backfilling, and final grading. At least, that's the way it usually goes around here. Don't know your relationship with the GC, but some others have given you some good advise. This is a big job. Know your limitations, and then push yourself to just beyond them. Once you have that mastered, then puh yourself again, and so on, and so on. Don't push too far beyond your limitations too fast. Your business and your reputation will suffer. My advise is figure out where you would fit in on this job and bid that part. Then, try and be on-site as much as possible when the other stuff is going. Sit back, and soak it all on, and ask some questions of the guys doing the work. It will be a great learning experience. Take care and good luck. Let us know how it turns out... Joe
I would agree with the others: First you need a dozer to level and strip top soil. Then sub soil should be rolled. Then gravel over top of sub soil and rolled. Dozer work and at least 15k roller. The level of grade should 6" to 12" below finish and then driveway mix "crusher run" over that to finish and rolled. You could be required to put fabric down over gravel before crusher run. The job should have a GEO TECH book with it to spec what is needed. The footings dug before finish grade and material hauled away. Can not backfill with dirt will have to use crusher run for back fill around foundation wall and compacted in lifts. Everything has to be compacted and checked by GC for compaction before black top. If you have any movement down the road you will be responsible. Utilities dug before crusher run. This sounds like a impossible task with just a skid steer. You can rent the other stuff but very hard to competitive with 3000 to $4000 a month rental fees for dozer and roller. Don't forget excavator for digging footers and trenches.
I would not be afraid of grading with skidsteer its only moving 200 yards. I would stay away from rubber track skidsteer and rent a 90-xt case with steel tracks. I have graded up to 6-acre subdivion with my skidsteer. The last 1-acre site I done another excavator left black dirt and filled broken concrete mixed fill over it on most sites. I use my xt cut off concrete sticking out of ground cutting grades. I ended up moving 600 plus yards on that site by the time I spread black dirt. I changed the grade as much as 18" in some spots. When your grading have engineer stake it or cut lowest grade and highest and grade between. Most of time I don't need grade stakes I shoot lowest grade and grade up to foundation. You can grade plus or minis 3 " grade with skidsteer.Also that 1 acre site took 2 days.
I would agree that you can grade with a skid steer but grades on most of jobs of mine have had to be with in 1" and sloped in some cases for proper drainage and that is a problem with skid steer even with dozer blade just alot harder. You still have the problem of compaction and would need a roller for that. The job he is talking about is parking lot prep work not yard prep. So sub grade and finish grade and then crusher run. Much more demanding on elevations. After I am done with grades the foreman checks entire site with grade stick to make sure it is in 1" of elevation and has compaction tested to make sure you have 95% compaction or better. GC's do not want to use any extra concrete or asphalt than they have to. I have done this with my skid steer before I owned a dozer but the dozer is days if not weeks faster. Also the GC's that I have worked for would have told me to go home if I tried to do site work with skid steer only just for the time factor along. I would be holding up other subs waiting for me to finish my part. If this was not the case why spend 50k to 100k on dozer? I didn't want to but had to, and renting made it impossible to be competitive.