Need a tractor trailer set up to haul a cat D8T. Have no idea what size trailer I need and what type will work the best. I believe it weighs close to 90,000 lbs. Iowa is the only state it will travel in. Thanks
Are you talking about one specific D8T tractor here or D8T's in general..? If it's one specific tractor then you'd be better off posting the details of that tractor because attachments and optional extras could easily put 10-15 thousand pounds on the weight of the tractor and maybe leave you with a trailer that's undersized for the job of hauling that specific machine. If you have them, post photos of the tractor or let us know the Serial Niumber. The machine weight can be found from the factory system so long as it's still basically the same configuration as it was when it left Cat.
User123, we have a 50 ton Aspen lowboy (3 axle) and 4 axle tractor that works well for hauling a D8T. This is probably the minimum to handle the job. I believe that you can permit this in Iowa without any problem, other than you may be restricted from interstate travel. I am sure some of the Iowa members can add to the discussion!
Yair . . . (Big grin) Those tractors loaded *** backwards look strange to my eyes Oxbow. Nice rig BTW . . . all of it's nice. Cheers.
You and me both Scrub. We were always taught to reverse equipment on to the lowboy and drive it off.
Yair . . . Gotcha Nige . . . I think . . . which end are you coming from? (bemused grin) Cheers.
Quite often we had to load a certain way to make the correct axle weight work out.
I always drove them on so I could get a better idea of if it was lined up correctly, most of the time I was loading alone, then when it was time to unload, it was already straight and could be backed off. When I first started hauling dozers years ago, the old guy I worked with liked to have the blade at the back on an oversized load, and if someone side swiped you they hit the back of the track and push arms first doing less damage than hitting the blade corner first. Thankfully I never saw that happen in 45 years of trucking. George
While I'm Wisconsin based, we travel a few states. Here a 4 axle tractor and heavy enough 3 axle trailer can scale a stripped down D8t. To be safe, if go with a 4 axle trailer. Oddly, if you are adding a D8T, I'd think you or the dealer should know what's needed.
It's not *** backwards, I drove it straight on! Five reasons I prefer it this way Scrub, Trucker 1 touched on a couple: (1) Easier to get it on centered (2) By loading this way the dozer is higher and will go over some obstructions like guard rails (3) If a car does happen to clip you they don't get the pointed end of the corner bit in the windshield, but rather may get pushed away by the dozer frame (4) Might be a touch more aerodynamic not having the U-Blade facing the wind (5) It is a bit easier to see around the dozer having it further from the tractor Cheers.[/QUOTE] Why? To each his own, but I always think excavators loaded with the boom facing forward looks funny. Often times it is a weight factor with excavators though, but a blade (motor grader) loaded facing forward just does not work on my trailer.
Yair. . . Some confusion here I think . . . you blokes (I think) are talking detachable goosenecks and I have never even seen one. Cheers.
Shows how things differ. Here a 3 axle tractor (6 x 4) and a 3 axle trailer would be more than enough to handle a fully-equipped D8T with a U-blade and multi-shank ripper. We always reversed the tractor on to the lowboy, so if we were loading over the back of the trailer the tractor would have the blade facing to the rear like Oxbow's photo, or if we were loading over the front using a detachable gooseneck the tractor would have the blade facing forwards. The theory was basically to get centred when reversing on to the trailer all you have to do is look out the rear cab window of the tractor. When it comes to driving it off it's straight on the trailer so you just drive straight back off again, despite the lack of visibility due to the blade being in the way. I can see why hinky axle load limits might force anyone to do it the other way round though.
Yair . . . . It's strange how different methods evolve in different places . . . . In nearly sixty years of experience I have never seen a dozer being backed up the ramps of a rear loading trailer and (to me) there are probably several good reasons. Despite what Nige mentions I would have thought it quite difficult to get the darn thing centred. Loading front wards with a (lowtrack) is a piece of cake . . . you can mostly line up just by looking down on the inside of the idler. Once you know the trailer it is usually possible to align with the edge of a deck plank and we always used to take the machine right forward and rest the blade on the goose-neck to keep it clear of traffic and guide posts. I do understand the need to comply with regulations and, fortunately, we did not have to operate with such restraints. This pic. is already posted on here but here I am, good to go . . . . Cheers
Look at that old B-61,they are everywhere!!Man,those cabs were hot.Ron G
Indeed we are Scrub, and a marvelous invention in my mind; simple operation and no wet kit required because of Honda motor, although much nicer with a wet kit. We used to load everything over the back, but it is quite hazardous with snow and ice conditions, plus no need to build a ramp for scrapers and such.
I used to load over the side using the snowbanks for "ramps".It can be a hoot no matter how you handle it with the snowballs clinging to your track pads etc.Just be sure that you are tied down good with chains and binders plus binders from the track pads to the lowbed.Ron G
We hauled a d8t u blade no ripper with a 50 ton 3 axel trailer and tandem axel tractor. Not for sure it was legal but we were able to get a permit with 50,000 on the drives alt how I don't thing we had that much.
Exactly!!
Oxbow can I ask what weights you have on the tractor. Problem with our truck is the neck is to short to put enough weight on the steer axel.
Ion 8 axles here in ontario we can get 178,238lbs on are float with the 6 down and 2 up we can haul 140,000lbs gross weights so 133,000lbs machine with permits or 84,000lbs machine with out special permits
We did the same with the 3T D7s and the 2U D8s. Couple of 4' blocks with one end on a 12 X 12 block at each track to make a ramp and up you went turning it 90 degrees once it flopped down on the lowboy to go down the road. The old lowbow did not have ramps on either end. Can't remember ever tieing them down in them days either when moving locally.
The picture is a little deceiving from the angle that it was taken at, but we have two holes in the neck of the lowboy for the kingpin and use the front one. The center of the fifth wheel is directly over the front drive axle, and with the tag down (depending on how much air is in the tag air bags, I can adjust as needed) we can get 12,300 lbs. or so on the steer axle. I have about another 6" or so of fifth wheel slide going forward, but the clearance between the back of the tractor and the lowboy gets a bit close, and the steer gets too heavy for my liking. This outfit weighs about 41,000 lbs. empty, and with the D8T we were 137,000 lbs. +/- gross if I remember correctly. I didn't scale this load particular load out, but from experience I should have been about 12,300 on steering, 11,000 on tag, 49,000 on drives, and about 65,000 on the trailer. I did have to get a special permit for Montana (where the photo was taken) but I can haul this under my annual permit in Idaho on the majority of highways and the interstate. The old tractor is pretty well set up for this with an 18 speed, 46K 2 speed rear ends (4.11/5.29) and Hendrickson pad suspension, and handles the load pretty well.
State law here in Alabama requires the blade to be facing the rear. It's a nice DOT fine if you put the blade forward.
Yair , , , Gotcha CM1995 . . . different stroke for different folks. (grins) Cheers.
Interesting CM, for the safety reason I assume?
I would imagine so, maybe the same "safety" reasons as applied to the lame brain who managed to bring a mill chimney down on his head. That was in AL too ........ HeavyEquipmentForums
After posting I thought to myself that this was a dumb question; why else would the DOT require this. One would think that that would be a national law though, and up until CM mentioned this I had not heard of it.
Yair . . . "Safety" is a relative concept . . . is it any safer to hit the back of the blade or the front of it? As mentioned up thread I always thought it best to get the blade up nice and high on the goose neck. One of the issues we always had when roading scrapers in traffic was folks becoming mesmerised and driving into the side of the machine . . . quite apart from the fact the driver was on the wrong side. I always suggested to our police escorts the machines should run in the closest to the centre lane when on a divided highway but I never could convince them. Cheers.
It all depends which direction you're coming from at the time Scrub ......
In the U.K. it is legal to put 2 D8's -D9's what ever on a trailer with the blades facing any direction as long as both the tractors go from point A to point B, the axle loading limits would need to be correct also the road speed might be set low on the permit, its also not un-common for tractor scraper outfits to be moved in 1 hit like a D8K and 463. tctractors
Scrub I think the powers that be think it's safer to slide down the push arm instead of being snagged by an end bit.:beatsme In reality, no matter how the dozer is positioned, a passenger car colliding with a rig transporting an 8 isn't going to fair well..
This of course assumes that the impact is coming from the opposing direction of traffic. I someone hits you from the rear.... well hopefully they aren't going quite as fast as oncoming traffic would be.
That's what I was thinking.
Wow. Wish I'd have read more before posting. Law requiring you to put it on a trailer a certain way???? Legislature was WAY over the top on that one!
We generally haul with blade forward on fix neck single drop . Not always but most of the time . Blade forward in my case puts more weight on the truck drives and just seems to work better . Not to mention my neighbors appreciate not having there mail box knocked over . HeavyEquipmentForums Agree with Scrub , that is a nice rig Oxbow , I like it !:thumbsup Most contractors in my area load the same way with a drop deck detachable trailer . With the blade to the rear of the trailer you get some use out of the rear view mirrors .
Oxbow I think it's the gov't assuming they know more than the people that do it everyday.
It's amazing how different things can be state to state. In PA we can haul our D8's in one piece, but if we ship them to Maryland, Delaware, or Virginia, the blade has to come off. When the blade stays on, they are usually rear facing and we have blade guards on them as well, ya know, just in case.
Hmmm, blade guards, I have never heard nor seen such a thing until now. Nice outfit JimBruce!
Yair . . . You gotta protect 'em Oxbow , you don't want that blade getting dinged up. (wry grin) Are you serious JimBruce42?. . . I would love to see a close up picture. Cheers.
Yair . . . . Well there you go, Google truly is your friend. Cheers.
***..? Blade guards..? They look suspiciously like 10ft of Armco barrier to me....... :beatsme
We always loaded our d9n with wide u blade and rippers facing forward with the blade on the gooseneck. Just the way I was taught.
If I were to load the dozer facing forwards I would need to put the dozer right on the deck; if I were to put it up on the gooseneck I would be way heavy on the drivers given our laws and configuration. I could see loading one facing forward if putting the dozer on the gooseneck as then it would be higher than most auto windshields, and most guardrails and bridge abutments. I am not familiar with California's weight laws, but they must differ a fair amount from many other states as the Murray/Cozad expandable width trailers with two short axles and eight tires across are not too common here. http://www.murraytrailer.com/images/new/Professional/DSCF0016 med.jpg Also, I have always been a bit leery of placing weight directly on the neck for fear of interfering with the flex characteristics, and potentially causing stress cracks. It's probably not something to worry about, but I avoid it nonetheless.
Your loading it correct Oxbow . Like you mentioned when I load with blade up on gooseneck the weight is heavy on the drive axils and blade up high to clear obstacles . This works good for moving on narrow hilly washboard gravel cow path roads as the tractor wont spin out halfway up the hill .
I should throw in it was a baby 9 axle that we used and I think we could haul an 8n on a 16 tire spread axle cozad. It's been a while tho so I can't remember for sure.
Do they use escorts any more?It seems like an escort if it were required could take the edge off of some other safety measures in place now.Ron G
And now I've had chance to think about it all that they achieve is to make an already wide load maybe 18-24" wider IMHO. I personally don't see the sense in that TBH. I'm sure that between all who post on HEF, let alone those who've just posted on this thread, must have moved hundreds of dozers over the years. Let me ask the collective a question. Have anyone here actually experience of another vehicle colliding with a tractor blade while hauling it on the highway..? I know I haven't.
Yair . . . Nige . Never a problem with dozers on floats, a couple of incidents of drivers drifting over into the side of scraper-bowls when roading in traffic. Cheers.
I recall a 657 rear wheel going over the bonnet of a Mini that decided to poke it's nose too far past a stop sign just as the scraper was blatting past, but that's simply collateral damage ....... get over it - move on.
I used to volunteer my services as an escort if someone else was moving my machines but you can only be on one end at a time.I used to try to clear the road in the front on a two lane road if we were over width and found that to be most helpful if I was driving the wide load myself.I had a car hit my left front corner of my deck once but I was empty at the time.Ron G
Our annual oversize/weight permit includes provisions requiring pilot cars either in front, back, or both depending on the width of load and highway traveled.
Sorry for the delay guys. I don't get on as much as I'd like lately. Yes, they aren't much more than custom bent guard rails, but they act as a buffer just in case someone bumps into it while heading down the road. The D8's and D6 LGP both get them because of the width, which is probably also why they have to come off when heading to other states. I think most contractors in this area have similar blade guards, but I haven't ever heard of them being hit.
I don't know how effective those bumpers are but the fact that they are there tends to put the blame in the other guys corner from a referees point of view I would think.I have never seen them before.It seems like a lot of work to install them.Ron G
I still think it makes an already wide load 2ft wider ......... go figure.
JimBruce42, that is a very nice looking lowboy, but different than I am used to seeing the way the trailer axles are enclosed; what brand is it?
I honestly can't remember the brand. Most of our trailers are Talberts, but I don't think it is. I don't think there is much point to the axle shrouds. I do know it is probably the heaviest trailer in our fleet because of it though.
Thank you Jim; the trailer almost looks like a hybrid between conventional US/Canadian RGNs and the European styles of "floats" where the axles can steer and each side tandem moves independently.
Come to the U.K. as here we can haul 2 X D8's with all the trimmings hanging off them (no bits of Armco) on 1 trailer as a legal load. tctractors
Yeah, it's just a cover over the wheels, they don't actually steer like a European unit.
That trailer is a liddel
Its just called logic and the always missing element of common sense. A forward facing blade could hook many things on a narrow road, trees, bridges, cars, big trucks and even rip the machine off the trailer, it is by definition an OVERSIZE LOAD. In this state we always loaded big dozers facing to the rear, it maybe a law here as well.
Not me but my good friend saw a D8 do flips on I-5 many years ago by Mccord, he never saw what caused it. I guess it landed right side up and had a track off.
50 or 60 years ago near here a lowboy was hauling a TD24 or 25 with the blade forward. His pilot car couldn't stop another vehicle at a bridge so he hugged the steel superstructure to make room. Yep, the dozer ended up sitting in the other lane pointed the other direction. The other vehicle made it through before it happened so he was fine, but the bridge ended up getting replaced with a nice wide concrete one. I've seen pictures of the dozer sitting on the torn up bridge. I never load them blade forward. Keeps the bugs off the front glass and I don't have to stuff a rag in the exhaust, too.
similar deal on Highway 410 at Little Naches River bridge, a different outcome. The lowboy and dozer and bridge all ended up in the river as the dozer yanked the bridge off the footing.
I hauled em blade to the front for 30+ years, but we always loaded over the back. And, the blade sitting on the neck kept it above the cars which was great buzzing thru the freeways in LA. And, the pilot car was your eyes in the rear.
the knucklehead who blew by the pilot was in a pickup camper, if I recall properly. It was 1979 and the lowboy should have steered INTO them but that is not hard wired into us, we steer away. The one who caused it made it across the bridge and got away. I have looked high and low for a picture I remembered from the day. If I pay for a Yakima Herald subscription I could get it, I suppose. It was August 20, 1979. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Washington_state_bridge_failures It was a photo of the bridge and dozer and lowboy in the river bed. That little river is a trickle in August and not much more most of the year. Until the bailey bridge was put up, we went around on the Old River road. Across the river at the bridge just west of Cliffdell, the one that goes to Boulder Cave. Then back across the Bumping River only about a half mile from the downed bridge. The river did some shifting over the years and closed Old River Road permanently. That was a bummer.
Here in the UK,we tend to leave the blades over the rear.
I liked doing lead pilot car stuff. No one could get past me, when a bridge was involved, yeah fun times then.
I remember when that happened--I know someone who worked for Leland Hyatt at that time. He might have photos of it, but for some reason bridges along the Naches seem to be plagued with trouble. The one below was 2005 from a crane on a low boy on Naches bridge on I-82, which I think is the last bridge over that stream. *
that was indeed the last bridge and they fixed it. There is a trail that runs under those bridges. You can walk or cycle between Yakima and Selah. That raised concrete monster in the middle is the hyperspace bypass they put in to solve those massive rush hour backups on the mainline. . It did help.
And as is that bridge would be safe for normal small vehicles. But I bet it was closed for a long time?
Not really, repairs were made with a lane open.
If I can, I always face the exhaust to the back, because I'm too lazy to put a bag on. Grader and excavator unfortunately always face front.
Leave it idle.
I do sometimes, bit it's illegal. Only issue I have ever had is with a loader. It was a NewHolland with touchy steering. I could see it jerk side to side as the bumps snapped the wheel. It had a starting issue, so I just stopped looking in the mirrors. I don't know how picky they would be. Steering bar is supposed to be locked as well, but I never use it either. A lot of times if I am not going far, and the machine is not an overhang, I won't even chain up. I chanced a 350 Linkbelt one Saturday at the C+D site. It's a back road, only a short drive. Never again. It moved on me. Not much, but you could see it. There is a 90 degree turn just before our shop, I took it pretty slow.
Van Dyke moved the 400 Komatsu a few miles for us on the Puyallup river job and did not put a chain on it. Not my circus, not my monkeys. The tracks were in bad shape too. They did grip that lowboy nicely, but there were several cracked links at the time.
I would never do that on a heavy traffic road, or on a wet deck, and after that 350 moving, never a machine that size. I mean common sense should tell me that the chains themselves are hardly on the deck as we never use the side extenders on the trailer. But like they say. F around and find out.
If-I say if a accident occurs, whether load is or isn't secured DOT will check.
exactly that. It was his call and his excavator once it was on the deck.
Always the driver's responsibility. Even if someone else put it on and chained it down. You need to check and make changed if need be, or refuse to drive. I delivered s load of roofing. The driver picked it up on Montreal. Brought it to the yard in New Brunswick. Had a wedding to go to, so I pulled it the rest of the way. It was a tapped load. So I thought nothing of it. When I untarped, not one single strap. I mentioned it to him. Said he did it all the time with roofing. If I had been checked, or anything happened, it would have been my problem
And then added to Overload of the Day thread.
A little further west and.....