We just sold three FMC/KMC tracked skidders that we converted into forestry firefighting machines some time back. They're an interesting machine that might have had a future in logging if some of the early problems were fixed sooner. They were originally built by FMC, and based off of one of their military tracked carrier designs. FMC made about 1100 of these things before selling the rights to KMC, based in Nelson, BC in about 1988. KMC is still around today but I'm not sure just how many new machines are sold nowadays. They are basically a tracked carrier that can have pretty well anything you can imagine attached to it. diamond drills, augers, off-road manlifts (for power utilities), tracked dump trucks, welding machine carriers for pipeline work, and, in the case of forestry, log skidders. We bought three units in about 1988 and used them for 4 or 5 years as grapple skidders. I believe they cost too much to operate so they were put out to pasture. They were very utilitarian--probably a leftover from their military beginnings--take a look at the photo of the cab interior. They were differential steer, and these ones were Detriot powered. However, they were a decent carrier and our management at the time decided to convert the machines to fire fighting water tankers with pumps and related equipment. I don't think they saw a whole lot of service but they sure look like they are ready for a serious fire! I sure would like to hear some opinions and experiences from anyone who has used this equipment. Please correct me if I have any of the history wrong! Jon.
I ran a new one in 1978/1979, it was a 210 CA which I think stood for choker arch. It worked fairly well, we were in old growth, and it was impressive where they would go, I think the ground pressure was only 5 psi. The only major problems we had was the track pads bending. They had a hexagon pin running through a rubber & steel bushings with nuts on each end of the pin, the pin & pads would bend. We never broke a torsion bar, but I think others had lots of problems with them. They were expensive to buy too, $200,000 rings a bell & that was 30 some years ago.
I worked for the dealer in Washington State back in 79 through 81 and I know a bunch went through the doors. They would get logs like no tomorrow but they had huge problems in high production. Torsion bars were mentioned but road wheels and sprockets could also be a problem. The tracks originally were military but a civilian version was produced. At that time as I recall they ran in the $20,000 range for a set. We used to pull sections of several tracks and make one good track. The differential case was made out of some kind of exotic aluminum alloy. The decay juice from wood and rain would eat the case up and it would end up leaking all the oil out and ruin the box. To get the box out of the machine you had to pull the engine and transmission first. If you had trouble with the transmission and had to remove it, the engine would have to come out with it. I used to liken the whole process to gutting a bumble bee. I used to see the arches all busted up and wondered how that could happen. When I was out on a site one day I saw it. A machine had hooked onto a log that was too heavy and the arch wouldn't pick it up. The operator simply put the machine is reverse and backed into the log until the arch was forced up and the back of the machine pushed under the log. Once the log was on the back deck of the machine he sucked the winch in tight and drove away. The machines were pretty smooth for operators because of the torsion bar suspension. Still one could become a pin ball in what little cab there was. Hard hats were required or head aches would ensue. I have seen several of these machines built to different applications and think fire fighting was one of the best. The machines usually sit most of the year, they now carry a specified load when they do work and fire fighters are not loggers. They usually wouldn't put the machine in places it ought not go. I think it is great getting paid rent on a machine where if everything is right, it is never used. Thanks for the thread.
Sounds like no one was home in the improvement dept. John C. and imbzcul8r, You both put forth interesting comments. I noticed right away that these machines, although looking rough, tough and built for the job, two fit nicely on the step deck with load capacity left over. Yet I had two Cat 528 rubber tire grapple skidders in the yard and suggested to another trucker than he put both on his truck. He laid an egg on the spot. So these FMC's are built quite a bit lighter than comparable equipment. I have to assume that nobody very intelligent manned the product improvement department with FMC! It sounds like they had years to make improvements but milked the same old design year after year! The issue of an aluminium gearbox must have been a military holdover for sure! I would have hoped the newer machines were converted to good old cast iron gearboxes....probably less costly to produce, too. I've heard that the latest KMC machines can be had with hydrostatic track drives. This probably gets around some of the transmission access problems. Hopefully KMC would have put in a tilt cab or something similiar to get at the innards in a expedient manner. I don't really know. The tracks seem to be a bit of a puzzle to me--it is easy to make the track plates heavier, which KMC has done...each link has gained about 20 lbs, up to over 50 from 30. But the rubber bushing setup looks like the weak part big time--the idea is to keep from metal-to-metal contact--great in theory. But I can't believe that the rubber bushings do very well when the track is under heavy tension, like you would see when pulling a huge log loose, wide open in low gear, with the torque converter maxed out. I'll bet those tracks can see 50,000lbs pull. Its a wonder the rubber isn't just squirted out the sides of the bushings! Even nowadays KMC states that some of the rubber bushings have to be replaced every 1000 hours and the rest at 1800 hours. You must be right about the value of the tracks--we had a whole bunch of used track squirreled away inthe back of the yard like it was real valuable. I was told that the torsion bars were nice but tended to break, not when riding up over an obstruction, but when coming off an obstruction too fast and going hard into the stop or whatever they had for a return travel limiter. I heard they are still plenty spendy--someone told me $450,000 for one today. I'm not sure how that compares with something like a Cat D5 tracked skidder (I forget the model no.) but I'll be you would have change left over after buying the Cat...and relatively few track (or machine) problems. I've added a couple of photos of the one 1988 KMC serial no. 0001 (first they built!) and a photo of he upgraded track and wider track sprockets retrofitted to one of the FMC's. Thats a brand new track!-- it hardly has any sprocket marks on the pads yet. Jon.
I've always had an interest in these machines since they were built very close to where I grew up......only a short drive to the next town basically. Here's their website. www.kmc-kootrac.com
The one military vehicle I beleive these are based on is the M113 APC It used a special aluminum armor to help reduce its weight. It may be that FMC was making so much money on the military side (Where over 50 countries, including the US, are still using them - over 80,000 of them were made!) that they did not bother to focus on the forestry side of the market.
any left to sell do u have any more tracked skidders that were converted into forestry firefighting machines or fire fighting water tankers
Hi, Mabarkwire, We sold everything we considered surplus at the time. We kept one more firefighting machine for our own use, which is a Cat 528 rubber tired skidder set up with tanks, pumps and the related jewlery -- set up very much like the FMCs/KMCs that we dumped. Jon.
thanks for reply back if u come across anymore please let me khow
We have them Mark we have the 3 tembec FMC Firecats and are interested in selling Murray 250 368-7044
Looking for fire units I would be interested in seeing pics of these units. [email protected]
There was a Logger here in Texas that used the FMC cable skidder.Great in muddy ground.Finally parked them because of expenses.Mostly under carriage.
Great machines when they were going, wasnt many days youd make it through without having to spanner somthing!!
We run a 210 and a 220 as skidgines. Amazing machine in that application, fast and stable.
Prior to seeing the FMC Skidders, both line and grapple, I saw what I seem to remember as a Bombardier skidder, about ¾ the size of an FMC. It had a tilting arch that would pick up the butts and let them ride on the machine similar to the FMCs. They only had a 5/8 drum line with a hook, set up for cat chokers. They did not have sliders on the line. I only saw two of them and they were in a surplus yard here in Seattle. This was around the early ‘70s. Does anybody else remember them?
I worked for a gyppo logger summer of 1980, running FMC's on the mudflow picking up logs that had washed down the Cowlitz River. These machines were the only ones able to get out on the fresh ash/mudflow. Do that AND pull in old growth logs. I could take that little FMC places that were too soft to walk on. The machines we used were brand new, so we had no problems with them. Sure, the cab was small, but really liked operating them.
The Bombardier Muskeg Jimmy? Never heard of it.
I worked around a couple of FMCs back in the Seventies, 210s I believe, with inverted grapple bunks and swinging grapple booms to load the bunks. Nice machines from what I remember, except the hydraulics. I believe the hydraulics, and particularly the swing booms, were the reason they were eventually sold. Had 6V53 Detroits in 'em.
The 220 working on a fire The 220 and 664 clark
These dam things would go just about anywhere but they did not like snow building up in the tracks and rocks were real hard on them too, they could be a real bear to change out track pads unless you had hydraulics to push a stuck pin out, they also had a nasty habit of biting your hanging chokers off.
How did I miss thread, very cool! I would love to see more pictures if anyone has them. It brings back some great memories. My Dad operated one of these for a while when I was a kid.
I think I can go one better: Youtube video of a 220ca That one is probably one of the best video examples of a FMC skidder I have seen!
Very cool, thanks for that! Here is part 2 of that video http://youtu.be/fzuXSymTtVA And part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqzhIRGAUw4
Interesting tread pretty cool machines, thanks for sharing the pics and videos.... Bill
I Worked with these machines in the late 70s to mid 80s. I started on a 200 series. At the time these were going for 200,000.00. The running gear was like you said about 20,000.00. That was a yearly cost. We were logging out of Port Townsend, WA. We checked out the wear patterns on the road wheels, tracks and sprockets. Went to a Seattle foundry and had them re casted to our specs. We were able to get 2 years on a new set. Had problems getting bushings to go in the pads. as I remember we could only get them at Howard Cooper. We were able to change motor, tranny. or final drives in a day and a half in the field. Loved the 6v 53s. We ran 1" main line and 6 chokers. 9 loads a day with 3 men. We did weekly maintaince.
KMC rebuild I visited with the guys at KMC a couple of years ago, and took a look at what they do. They have been buying up old units, then converting them to as new spec, with modern componentry and an upgraded undercarriage, then sending them out the door with a new serial number and warrranty. These guys do business worldwide, with units being bought in from as far away as South America, and sold as far as Ukraine. The rebuilds are more user friendly than the former detroit powered machines, running cummins engines. The 2500 in the 3rd photo has an extra roadwheel than the smaller units.
I built several fire fighting protypes using the m548 carrier which was the cargo version in the m113 family. They all worked pretty well and several goverment agencys show interest however we were never able to get past the "combat vehicle" statis the goverment placed (prime example of goverment agengy cooperation). I have heard some that made into civilian hands. |I still have roadwheels, diffs, finals and other pieces in my treasure pile.
Funny, you never see them working in the bush in BC anymore, where they're built, and yet they sell them all over the world.
I am pretty sure this is one we owned several years ago and since has been rebuilt, Scott S
I have seen these chassis with a high reach limb trimmer on them- contractors for powerline companies clearing powerline right of ways. Looks like the chassis is kinda similar to FMC's M113 APC. Durability issues as noted above would definitely make sense if the FMC skidders were developed from the M113. The M113 was designed to be lightweight for the purposes of airlift, not optimized for durability.
You'd think they'd be available with rubber track by now. The Canadian Army rebuilt and purchased some newer customized versions of the old M-113 with electronically turbocharged 6V53's and in some cases 'stretched' the chassis to make them longer and put rubber tracks made by a Canadian company called Camoplast to replace the old metal track that they normally used. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoE0ZHiTCyQ&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htdQVbmvLgQ&feature=related http://www.casr.ca/101-army-engineer-mtve.htm http://www.casr.ca/101-army-armour-tlav-m113a3.htm Apparently to run rubber tracks on the M-113's they only need a special drive sprocket to convert them over. Not bad for a vehicle type that's been around since the Vietnam war.
Honestly all you hear leave my mouth when I see the third one, "WOOOOW" They do amazing work!
I bought my first FMC 210 when building power line near Castlegar in 1977. Worst thing I ever did. I fell in love with those contraptions and wasted years of my life making and paying for repairs while always looking for a more challenging job to see if I could stick 'em. Got stuck several times but needed another FMC or a Cat dozer to pull it out. Got stuck for 6 days one time on a mining job. Had 4 wolves for company. I always had my 45 Combat Commander in the shoulder holster just in case they wanted more than Spam sandwiches. I was lucky to get her out. Working alone miles from nowhere, water covered the seat but engine was just clear enough to start up due to up slope angle. Whew! Amazing machines. Too much fun. Could not afford to log with them but no other log skidder could come close to equalling their go anywhere ability and that arch was a gem of engineering if used properly. Too many never really understood how to use it. I did mostly powerline work or fighting forest fires, scarifying, tool carrier etc. or with the water tanks I built or digging with the 580 case extendahoe. My water tanks were square like yours, with pump all mounted on top. Held about 1000 gallons. Could be placed on back of machine loaded with water in a few minutes. Put out a fire on Blackcomb Mtn. at Whistler when the first ski runs were being built in 1978 or 79. Fire truck hoses were too short. Slapped on the loaded tank, chugged up the new ski run and no more fire. Dug a lot of the footings for the first lifts on Blackcomb with the 580 hoe. Later did a lot of work with BC Hydro. Built lite brush rakes for land clearing and dug structure sites for Hydro here and there. Did mining exploration with the hoe and had lots of adventures. Hauled water one spring for Blackcomb when the water system failed on the ski hill, Great job. Good people to work for. I could go on. The steering differential was made of magnesium. Lite material that sucked up gear noise which is why the military used it. But the diff. would evaporate if dirt got packed around it. The T-bars should have had twice the durometer and needed stops to prevent them from being pushed the wrong direction. The FMC dealer never quite believed me on this, but I bought very few T-bars after that modification. The splines would often wear out before the bar failed!!!! I bought 10 bars from Danzco Machine Shop in Oregon as they were stronger ( thicker ) and much cheaper. Could go faster as suspension sat higher and climb was improved, not that this was needed. Had 1" x 2 1/4" T-1 bands welded to the road wheels. Couldn't wear them out! Mechanically they were tough. The finals, never failed me. The Clark winch is a marvel of elegant, maintenance free engineering and the engine being a 6-53 series Jimmy was indestructible if oil and water were kept where they were supposed to be. Never overheated, esp. after I went to high volume fiberglass fans. The tranny was bullet proof. I ran 10W - 30 high detergent engine oil in the tranny. No converter or tranny problems. That ATF is crap oil for heavy duty applications. The tracks were the real weak point. The rubber bushings were not up to the job. I built my own bushing press and fitted it to the shop truck. Pull out a few pads, bush 'em up on site, ready for the morning and another fun day of lets see what this puppy can do! Damn they were addictive machines. The best way FMC could improve, a word they never understood, the bushing issue would have been to go to a double pin system like the Sherman and later tanks. I bet even A SALT track would have run circles around the rubber bushed units for availability. Well I should close. Getting too worked up!
Challenge for you photographers I have been tossing the idea around to build a scale model of a FMC 210, and I need some high-resolution reference photographs to get measurements from. The main shots I need are side and front/back views(As straight as you can get them) , and as many detail shots as I can get. I am willing to pay you a little bit of money for if you get a CD's worth of non-sized images
Hi Puffie40: I don't have many photos of the FMC skidder. I recommend you contact the dealer, if there is still one around. Last I heard, some years ago the dealer is now KMC, a subsidiary of sorts of Kootenay Tractor located in Nelson, BC. I would think that with a bit of luck they could put you onto drawings and measurements etc. I'm sure they will do their best to be helpful as they were great people to deal with in the past. One day, can't say when, I will get digging thru my photos and get a shot of the water tank and Case 580 hoe on the FMC 210 CA. Looking back I can only wonder why I didn't take more pics. Too busy working I guess. Good luck.
fitzpatrick; If you have pictures of your bushing press I would be greatly interested. Or even a detailed description of how it was constructed. Leonard
Maybe?? Hi. I'm in Victoria now, but I remember a few of these around Quesnel when I was growing up. I'll put out some feelers to see if there are any around. What scale models ddo you build? I'm doing 1/24-25 scale trucks. Check out my site. www.dougsscaletruckreplicas.com . Thanks Doug.
There is a 210 for sale at Oregon Tractor in PDX http://oregontractor.com/product.php?productid=12&categoryid=27 Maybe they can help. Scott S
Thanks. The KMC dealer is a few hours away from Yahk, but school (Electronics engineering in Kelowna) has bigger priorities than a road trip right now . I don't have much experience with scale models (Aside from a IH TD18 I built from Lego ), but I do have some experience with machining and fabrication. What I sort of have in mind is a 1:16 (Or larger - maybe 1:8?) model that can be remote controlled - similar to this project (As well as many others like it on that site). Right now, I'm thinking 1/16 mainly because I might be able to use tracks from an RC tank and be able to use smaller drive motors. I have a spec sheet for the 210, so I know some of the "Actual" measurements to use as reference points on the pictures. I'll sketch the parts in a CAD program before I go gung-ho and start cutting metal.
Hi lg junior: I don't have a picture of the bushing press. However I will attempt to draw you a verbal picture. Get a coffee and turn off Led Zeppelin and no whisky. You gotta visualize big time. The unit was made of heavy 4" steel angle. Bits of this and that. It lay horizontal. It was about 3 feet long and a bit wider than a track pad about 26" or so. A separated and single track pad was put into the frame works with the center guide DOWN. There were small guide points welded on to position the pad. Two big 'C Clamps' held the pad in the unit. Lots of fun getting these things just right. You will probably come up with something better. A 10 ton hydraulic bottle jack did the pushing. It was a bit on the weak side but a tiger torch would get the dead bushing's attention. Remember, you will push only One bushing at a time. When the bushing exits the bushing bore, then use the longer 'track pin pusher' for the next bushing which will be in line with the bushing just pushed out. The two long bushings would be pushed out, as an example, the bores cleaned and GENUINE FMC magic fluid would be applied to the new bushing. Unless you know about a substitute, don't even think about using something else. I had an open can with this fluid in it. Roll the bushing in the fluid, insert pusher pin into the bushing. Get fingers moving, tongue sticking out of side of ur mouth, raise one eyebrow and start pumping the jack. The rubber will really stretch but a touch of pre heat BEFORE you put the pushing in the press, expands the bore but don't overdo the heat. You'll figure it out. You have to push the bushing in a tad further than needed. I made up a threaded puller to pull the bushing back a bit to get it positioned just right if I went to far. Eventually, with practice getting perfect, automatic pull back will be no problem and the bushing will be perfectly placed right away. A second jack on the opposite end of the press unit would be ideal for a quick shove on the bushing to get it positioned just right if you go too far. ALWAYS do the furthest bushing first. You may find otherwise. Keep shortening up the pusher pins as you work the bushings away from the jack. I connected two pieces of track pins for more length by cutting an old bushing center in half and slipping the two pusher pins into this as a coupler. Of course, the threaded ends of the old pusher track pin have to be cut off. More on this later. This must be confusing but I'm sure I'm putting some useful thoughts into your head somehow. The jack was put on its side with the pump on the bottom. Of course. Make sure jack is a tad overfilled with oil. Old track pins were cut up for different pushing lengths. The metal six sided part of an old bushing was used as a pusher against the dead bushing. This part was slipped over the track pin which was to be used as the pusher. Slip a another bushing steel centre on the pin to act as as a stopper between the jack and the new or old bushing when pushing. Otherwise the jack will simply push the pusher track pin thru the old or new bushing. I welded a washer on a few of the pusher pins to do this but slipping on an extra bushing centre or two worked well.You gotta experiment with the lengths. The side of the pad with the two Big Bushings used diff. lengths of pushers than the other side with the three bushings. Honestly, I shouldn't even attempt a verbal description since speech isn't my native tongue. We haven't even got to the tricky part and I'm sure my crude attempts are confusing you. Oh Kay! Now for the tricky part. I don't think I could even draw what I'm about to tell you next. As you know, the bushings have a 6 sided steel centre into which slides the six sided track pin. When the bushing is in the pad, the six sides of the centre are not at right angles to the pad. They are off square just a tad to facilitate the track strand's easy curving around the drive sprocket and rear idler. I think this was not needed but it is there anyway. That is why when a new strand of track is released from the shipping bands, the track will try to unroll. So, if you look at good bushings in a pad you will see this slight diff. You will notice this when pounding in track pins. The pads to be joined have to be NOT flat. Right? Too much fun. So eyeball this angle. Its not a large angle. Just get it real close. Even if you want to have the angles at right angles to the pad, you still have to have the bushings in agreement with each other or the pin wont go in. I figure you this. LOL Now the tricky part. When putting the new bushings into the pad, they have to have this angle to mate up with the other pads when pounding the pins in. So, on the head of the jack, the push part with the screw end, I welded a short, say 1/2" or so length of the 6 sided bushing centre onto the end of the jack. Then I welded a piece of 1" x 1/4" mild steel which would fit in a guide on the press, beneath the track pad. This guide ran the length of the press. You gotta exp. with the angle of the guide tab and the bit of bushing centre which is welded to the jack. The idea is, when the guide tab is in the guide, the bit of bushing center welded to the jack will put the bushing into the pad at the correct angle because the pusher pin is inserted into the new bushing so the angles are the same all around. See, the old six sided track pin will fit nicely into the six sided piece on the end of the jack. The old pusher pin will slip into the new six sided bushing and all will be well as far as getting the correct angle on the new bushing. When doing the side of the pad with the three bushings, there will be a different groove guide which the tab on the jack will drop into and the bushings on the opposite side will have the correct bushing angle. Now that you know this is what one needs to watch out for, you will figure out how to best go about it. I'm sure I got brain damage when I conjured the press up. I was logging in the Queen Charlottes and paying freight from there to Nelson was prohibitive. Not to mention the one month turnaround. I could change the side with 2 big bushings within an hour. The side with three bushings was always more challenging. You'll find out. I would usually change the side with two. The side with three bushings was usually okay. Hope this helps. It's really not that complicated once you get a start on fabbing up the press. There's lotsa ways to skin a cat so I'm sure you'll get something satisfactory with a bit of trial and error. It's worth it. To push the short bushings, lift the pad out of the press, turn it and clamp. More experimenting with the line up. You'll see.
I try to forget holding the drive pin while the boss swung the BFH at it, got a little better when we welded a long handle to the drive pin and I could hold my hands and head a little further away, I used to dream about a way to hydraulically push those stubborn pins out.
Fitzpatrick; Thanks for taking the time to explain how you changed bushings. There used to be quite a few Fmc's in the area, but they have slowly vanished as have the people who serviced them. For speech not being your native tongue I think you did an awesome job of answerjng questions that have been bothering me for sometime. Thanks again, I have an idea where to start now that's more than I had a while ago. Leonard
Glad to help. That part about the bushing angle is the critical thing. I made my press out of scrap thinking I'll perfect it later but as usual just made do with what I had. I may take a road trip this winter down your way. Change one swamp for another. If you could stand a brief visit let me know. Brian
Hi 69hayes: I guess you are trying to forget the heavy vibration holding the drive pin that would be created when the boss didn't get the hammer on perfectly. I had one helper who would start yelling before I finished the swing. I guess the suspense was too much. LOL I made up a thing for getting the pins started. 3' of 3/4" round stock with a piece about a foot long welded crossways at one end. I called it 'the putter.' I'm sure you did the same. A soft sledge of about 5 pounds for a starter, then put the long end in and so on. If you can get a Railroad Hammer that has a mushroom head and a narrow opposite end, I found this to be great for starting. Could hold the railroad hammer easily on the end of the pin while the fat end was easy to hit. Could start most pins without a helper who had to hold the putter while I carefully aimed the sledge at the narrow 3/4" starter. Was digging footings for Hydro over your way on the Cheekeye-Dunsmuir Loop with the 580 Case mounted on the FMC way back when the ice really got melting. I was hurriedly changing a track pin just before pickup with the chopper. Working alone. Holding a short piece of 3/4" round stock for a simple starter and swinging the hammer was working out okay until I turned my head when I heard my ride coming. Broke my hand. Had a few shots at the Wakefield. I learned to use the left one a lot more. No time off. No big deal. AAAAArrrrggghh! LOL
Hi again: Just thought of this. If the bushing bore is even a bit, a tiny bit elongated, the bushing life will be shortened, sometimes real short. Discouraging but in a pinch you will get a few more hours out of the pad. If Danzco Machine, somewhere in Oregon is still making T-bars, don't hesitate to buy their bars. I bought 12 at once for a complete change over of one machine, giving me two spares. I never regretted it. Way cheaper and superior to the FMC bar. I'm going back 30 years but try your luck. B
Fitzpatrick; I would enjoy a visit if you get down this way. Sure do appreciate all the advice, I can always learn something new. When I quit learning should be about the time they are throwing dirt in my face.
Hi lg junior: That sounds good to me. My email is fitz.nv@shaw. Get back to me with yours and we can get organized but wont be right away. I'm already looking forward to the drive. Brian
Hey Fitz, I think I have dozens of slides of your FMC when you were working for M&B. Not sure though if it was yours or Froese's FMC....
Hi trakloader; Very kind of you. There was another guy at Juskatla that winter, from Hope I believe. If you do have a few pics of my FMC I would be pleased to see them. A blast from the past. 1977. I would certainly pay you for developing costs or what ever to make me a copy. Here is my email: [email protected] . The moderator may require approvals from me and if so no problem.
I will have to dig them up, there were probably at least 100 slides of the FMC, in the Canoe/Florence Creek area. Looked to be not going too well in that country. I have Super8 footage of it too.
Hi Trakloader: I actually remember being filmed. Guess that must of been you! Oh what I would give to get some of that steam back in my cylinders today. Oh well, I'd probably be in jail within a week. Thanks for your consideration. Brian
wasn't me, I was not born yet, lol! I salvaged the film etc. when WFP scrapped 60 years of archives at Juskatla a few years ago.
Sheesh! Time flies when having fun. If you wish, you could mail them to me, I'll sort through, get copies made of what interests me and then mail it all back to you. Naturally I will cover all postage and a bonus. Thanks
Here you go, I put this one on Youtube. http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlANei_7mMQ
Hi: Yeah, that's me alright. I remember that day. I was getting a bit of a trail established to get better production in that mess. After the camera guy left I got things flowing. In fact M&B figured I was making too much money and wanted to cut back my rate which was based on production. I was averaging about 4 to 5 highway loads per day working alone. They told me I had to stay and work for less. I told them all I had to do was die. I got the machine on the next barge which was in our agreement. The barge was due in camp in just a few days and I was at home at Whistler within 3 days and skiing. I should have never left. If you have anymore send them on youtube but I would like to see the slides to pick a few I like. You know blow them up. Buy some beer. The older I get, the better I was. LOL
I will see what I can do, things are total chaos after having moved twice in three years! But I know they are in a box, somewhere safe...
My father eyeballing an early FMC clambunk in Prince George circa 1976.
Oh wow! That is actually really cool! Neat to see they actually used the rubber-lined roadwheels and spoked idlers from the military crawler when they first started. I managed to get my hands on a operators manual for the BG. Looks like it used a "Omark-Prentice" loader, and with no mention of a turntable on the operator's seat, the controls look really awkward to use. My spine cramps up just thinking about it! Apparently, the UNBC has a small collection of forestry shots starring an FMC skidder: http://search.nbca.unbc.ca/;search?query=FMC
Finished building it today. main thread here
nice model what is it built from
i work for soft track attack in yaak montana. i operate these fmc's and the two 560 skidgines we have. like us on facebook https://www.facebook.com/SoftTrackAttack
Acquired this old Dinosaur a few months ago. Sure is neat to run. Gotta figure out what to do for tracks and track tensioners. Also when I pull the lever to right it feels weak compared to the left. Very neat machine though. I knew what I was getting into when I bought it.
Nice Leebox! I wonder if M113 undercarriage will work for ya
End of an FMC
Been operating an FMC 220 Soft Track T1 Skidgen and a M548 Soft Track T1 Skidgen for about the past 25 years. Great equipment, but like you said, super expensive to own. Here's a couple of pics of my equipment. Known far and wide as 'Montana Mountainmen With Heavy Metal'. Yaak MT is the current FMC capital of the world. Soft Track Attack owns and operates several. You can find us online at Wildfirefighters.com. Currently redoing our website for more info on this type of firefighting equipment.
Cool! Welcome to the HEF.
My kinda Tribe, thanks!
I guess everyone saw the interview with the guys who had purchased the rights to make new KMC's in Uruguay.
I had no idea. Interesting.
Fished another set of investors into that mess of a design.
Hello everyone. I came across this forum and thought I should jump in. My name is Alex, and I am the guy in the video shared by the user “Plebeian”. I just wanted to comment that we are aware of the historical challenges with the old versions and manufacturers, and we are spending a ton of time working on them. For a heads-up, we are bringing a new wildfire machine lineup with built-ins and standard safety features that no other machine on the market offers. They will be in 3 sizes, namely KMC MAX 100, 200, and 300. All of them are hydrostatic, and we are updating everything from the ground up, including the parts suppliers, which you were right about; they were not up to the standards. I can go into detail on what we are working on, but it would be too long and likely boring; just a heads-up: the torsion bars are now from a European steel manufacturer with much better quality, to the point that we don’t have to “break” the steel right and left. All machines will come with Volvo Penta 5L and 8L engines, new, more modern, and comfortable cabins from GSGR in Wisconsin, and, as I said in the video, MULTI-task platforms you can run year-round. By the way, cabins will be a lot quieter, so no more earplugs will be necessary! The KMC MAX 300 Wildfire MULTI-platform is, and here is a quote from one of your colleagues in the industry, “the dream machine”. It uses the Fawvett Cannon water tank system with 2,640 gallons of water, auxiliary hoses for ground troops, and front hydraulic pumps to convert the machine into a masticator after fire season. If this is not good enough, the whole tank rolls off, and a new platform can roll on to change the back from a water tank to a dumpster or a personnel carrier, just to mention a few ideas. The powerplant is an 8L Volvo Penta with 340HP, powerful, fuel efficient, and quiet. It is an outstanding machine that you have never seen before! There is still a lot to be unveiled... Machine manufacturing is always improving, so there's no news here; machines are an important and significant investment. To help you offset the upfront costs, our goal is to give you machines that operate year-round, giving you continuous work to pay it back. It will not sit and only cost you money; instead, it can be a consistent source for fulfilling whatever need, such as firefighting, masticating, or plowing, just to mention a few uses. Please respond to this post with any questions, and I will do what I can to answer them! Have a productive and safe day out there! Alex
Wow. What an introduction. Welcome to the HEF. Good to have you. You might want to chat up our moderators to discuss how to manage this discussion within the framework of HEF. I look forward to hearing about your adventures. I can’t recall in HEF history, an actual, legitimate OEM, stopping by to chat us up. Besides the Chinese BOTS. lol. We are a welcoming, but cynical & critical bunch, because we are the slobs tasked with fixing this stuff. So, please don’t get offended. There are plenty of outstanding SME’s on the HEF. If you are seriously interested in building a top class product, you could probably farm a bunch of ideas from them.
I saw a video of you and your machine on youtube. Looks like a great idea. Hope it is a success. As a young man I faught fires in the interior, mostly following a skidder with a tank attached, work well but it seemed the tank was never big enough. Spent a lot of time waiting while operator went to water source to refill. You obviously put alot of knowledge and experience into your design. I also saw a story online about a lowbed driver being caught in Richmond with an over size load, your machine. Free advertising sorta!
Hi all, Coaldust and Doug1966, thank you for the positive feedback and for holding your rocks for later on! LOL. It is tough to get exposed, but forums like this one are the best way to learn and try to do better. As a background, I am very involved with forestry operations; I spend a lot of time in the woods from Fort McKay/Canada, all the way down to Argentina- yes, many happy days for my wife not having to deal with me! But wildfire is new, and I am trying to learn from you guys and build from it. I think there are too many people behind desks building machine solutions, and a gap to reality. Honestly, our biggest challenge was/is what to do with manufacturing costs. We have great engineers working on technical stuff, but we have to decide whether to lower parts quality to make it cheaper or go for high quality/performance. Nobody buys one of our products for a run in the park, meaning quality and being tough were a must. So, after many discussions, with a reasonable amount of beers and bourbons involved, we came up with the current mantra: instead of cutting costs, we need to improve earnings. It is like in a home: bills are higher than your income, so you either cut bacon or find more work. I like bacon!! So, all our new machines will be multitaskers. It is like buying a masticator that also has a water tank for fire season, but also can pull a plow, also works as a feller buncher, and also have an auger; you get the concept. You work year-round with the new KMC MAX, so, yes, grocery costs are higher, but income is much higher. Fire season may offset the yearly cost of the machine, and the rest of the year will be to buy bacon and beer. By the end of the week, we should have our new website uploaded. There you will find new information about what we are working on. I am sure you will like it! Have a productive and safe day out there! Alex
If you have a superior machine, especially for wildfire work it should sell. Wildfires are major news topics nowadays.