Hi Can anyone advise me on how to configure this 1” air impact gun I bought from Harbor Freight? It comes with a 1/2” ID barbed hose fitting but I switched that out to match the hose fittings I use in the shop ( I think these are 1/4”). I’m not really sure how to configure using barbed fittings and clamped hoses and no instructions are included. it works on the standard quick connect fittings but even with 120 psi on a 60gal 12 cfm compressor I don’t think it is putting out anywhere near the rated 2000 ft/lbs of torque. How do I know the impact gun is under performing? We were trying to remove a 1.5” cylinder rod bolt and the impact couldn’t break it loose but a 5’ pipe on a big pipe wrench (gripping a impact socket) with about 100lbs of pressure , broke the bolt free. I calculated the torque used to finally break it free with (lbs x distance) that’s about 500 ft/lbs of torque. What am I missing with this HF impact gun that is preventing me from getting the rated torque out of it.....higher psi? Bigger hose? Etc The specs say 90psi 10 cfm.
Definitely need a bigger air line. Commercial fittings are easily available for up to 1 inch size hose.
You're choking the air supply to the tool... Quick connects are bad for restriction. A 1/4 QC is the worst. Look at the "glad hands" pneumatic breakers use. Very low flow restriction. If you must use 1/4 QC use 1/2 inch or bigger hose & barbed fittings to an air tank. No valves or QC. Then pipe the tank inlet to your 1/4 QC. You'll get a few good hits before the air in tank is exhausted. The bigger the tank the more hits before having to wait for the tank to refill. Fixed a production machine operation this way. Machine needed large volume of air intermittently but only a small air supply hose available. Installed an on board storage tank.
I just bought one of the smaller HF 1" drive guns. Several reviews said they used it to break loose piston bolts. At least one review I read said they tried the long nose gun you have and returned it for the short gun. That review said the long gun didn't loosen a bolt that the short gun removed without a problem. This is the one I bought but I haven't put it to the test yet. Download the 20% off coupon if you go to get anything there. I look it up on my phone and do a print screen every month so I have it saved in my photos. https://www.harborfreight.com/1-in-pistol-grip-air-impact-wrench-62355.html My gun came with a 3/8" NPT inlet and they supplied a fitting that had a 1/4" nipple. I bought their 3/8" high flow connectors which are 1/4" NPT pipe but have a 3/8" ID hole. I had to source a 3/8 NPT to 1/4 NPT adapter from Tractor Supply. My compressor is way too small but I'm going to try it before I go buy or borrow a bigger one. I installed the 3/8" connectors at both ends. The gun said to use a 1/2" hose but i don't see that as being a big advantage when everything else is 3/8". Not sure yet if I will have any better luck or if it's even up to the task. I already failed to get my bolt loose with a 3' pipe wrench and a 10' pipe. Waiting on the 1-15/16" socket I had to order to attempt with the air gun. I'm probably going to have to take the rose bud to the bolt before it's all said and done. I should probably go ahead and heat that sucker up and let it cool while I'm waiting on the socket.
Right there is your problem IMO. The hose should be of the same inside diameter as the female thread in the black fitting on the end of the gun. My rule of thumb for an impact gun is that the hose I/D should be the same as the size of the square drive on the business end of the gun. So by that rule a 1" square-drive gun should ideally be fitted with a 1" I/D hose, but certainly nothing smaller than 3/4". A 12cfm compressor is probably a bit borderline but if you can configure an additional air tank to act as a reservoir then it ought to work OK.
I guess what others above are saying is your choking your tool.
I saw a feller that had connected a 100 lb. propane tank up to his compressor to increase the stored volume. It seemed to work pretty good.
Okay got it, I need more flow , but not necessarily more psi. Do those barbed fittings just take a hose clamp to hold them on or is there some special crimp-on hose end collet that is supposed to be used?
I use a 3/4" factory made air hose with my large impacts. Those barbed fittings would work in a pinch, but probably not recommended and I suspect OSHA wouldn't care for it. If you care about that.
Think of psi as horsepower and flow as torque. Which one really does the work..? I would just throw them away and start with something far better.
Ok so bigger hose and change out that 1/4” fitting for a big barbed fitting or a QC. With that done and the bottleneck gone , is it your opinion that this impact would or could possibly deliver 2000 ft-lbs of torque.
You won't get 10 cfm through that fitting or the regulator. Put a tee after the valve on the tank ...then you will get 10 cfm to the tool using 3/4 hose and appropriate fittings. The tool is rated to deliver 2000 Ft# IF it's air supply requirements are met. You haven't met its required air supply.
Well remember you bought a tool from Harbor Freight. I doubt you will ever see 2000 ft-lbs from that no matter what. As has been said you will need a BIG compressor capable of some serious air. You will want a 3/4" - 1" ID hose. A friend who works at a heavy truck shop tried to help me get a bolt loose on a cylinder I was repacking. 1 1/2" air gun on shop air supply which use 1/2" hoses would not break it loose. He fired up a diesel trailer compressor they use for jack hammers and that air supply did the trick. If you are trying to use this to break big bolts free you might find a torque multiplier a better investment.
As Nige says, one inch drive = one inch hose. It usually takes at least 20 CFM to run a one inch impact.
The cheaper the gun the more air it will take to run rated I have a 22cfm compressor with 3/4 hose and half inch fittings and I have to wait on the compressor when we are getting after it
psi and flow is far to low plus its a cheap gun but I think it should do what your asking A 1/2 inch hose at 175 psi will do what you need occasionally have cheated and ran 2 or three 1/4 inch lines into a 1 inch gun
Like Hosspuller said in post #3, I use a freon tank, with a 1/2 fitting to a 4' piece of garden hose to the inlet of that same impact. The 1/4" connects to the side of the tank fitting. I don't know if it gets 2,000 ft lbs, but it gets way more than what you're going to get going through way to small hose, filter and quick connects. You get a second of power and it drops fast after that, the size of the compressor hooked to the other end of the 1/4" hose only determines how long you wait to have another second of power.
The hose and adapter size is your big loss, just like everyone else just pointed out. I'll also tell you that you will experience some loss of impacting power by adding adapters to fit different drive size sockets. Those adaptors and/ or extensions will soak up some of the hammer action.
That ball valve is you are using can be a serious choke in the air flow. They typically have very small bores in the ball. I always go at least one size larger than the line it controls.
PS ... I missed this nugget in your photo.. the rated power (2000 ft #) requires 10.3 CFM at (max) 135 psi. You don't have that air supply. So, you won't get 2000 ft#
Agreed. And furthermore don't go using non-impact (silver) sockets on an impact gun. One of these days one of them will split wide open while you are hammering and shrapnel will fly everywhere. If you're lucky they will all miss the guy holding the impact gun. To quote Clint Eastwood - "D'ya feel lucky, punk.?"
And while we're at it, a 1" to 3/4" adapter to a 3/4" non impact socket makes it even worse. Stick with the 1/4" air line though, and you'll be fine
Remember, it goes by area, not diameter, so it takes 4 1/4" lines to equal 1 1/2" hose.
Absolutely correct. Cross-sectional area of a hose is proportional to the square of the diameter. 1/4 squared = 1/16 1/2 squared = 1/4 1 squared = 1 Therefore as Mitch says it would require four 1/4" bore hoses to equal the cross-sectional area of a 1/2" hose or sixteen of them to equal the area of a 1" bore hose. Or four 1/2" bore hoses to equal one 1" bore.
And all of that will be strangled by One 1/4 quick connect.
Definitely aspire to be OSHA compliant! Speaking of osha, for the occasional use that I’m looking at, I really like the close-by auxiliary tank with a 1/4” QC feed and a 5/8” garden hose on barbed fittings direct to the gun....simple, effective, maybe even safe ! thanks
Keep in mind though, that an impact wrench builds up to max torque, so you need to be able to hammer it hard for about 60 seconds for max power. I have plenty of air to my big IR guns, but I never look to an impact wrench to break tough things loose. I weigh 250 pounds, so with a 10' pipe, I can develop 2500 lbs pulling down, more pushing up. I carry 2 9' pipes in my truck that telescope, so I can get about 16' of leverage.
As @mitch504 said, impacts are not the go to for breaking something free that is tight. You need leverage for that. Long pipe and/or torque multiplier. You can also get a short power boost with a bit of oil into the impact gun.
If you run across someone with a CP0611, give it a try. Much less work and safer than a cheater.
A guy I work with just bought a 3/4 drive earthquake impact from garbage freight with a super coupon for about $250.00 and in true g.f. fashion the first one worked for about 9 of 10 lugs on a big truck then just about seized...the replacement gun he got is a bad mother..that thing spins every thing off w/3/8 air...lugs ,pinion nuts off trannys and diffs I had to eat some crap after the giggle fest I had with the first one..I've been waitin' for that super coupon..gonna try my luck..
Re @mitch504’s point about using a cheater and not the impact to break free these super tight bolts....I’ve discovered that thru trial and error . It was only when my lousy air setup didn’t enable my “2000 ft-lb” impact to deliver more than 400 ft-lb. that I too used the cheater pipe. What I discovered is that for occasional use, the cheater works fine and gets it done, although a pita to be messing around with the long pipe and sometimes requires two people. I also saw that they use some sort of military grade thread locker on the cylinder rod bolts that truly need to be broken free, after said thread locker’s bond is broken the bolts come out without much effort. Also , on the tightening side , with a cheater I can calculate the torque setting like @mitch504 said, I can’t do that with the impact. So I’m wondering how useful this HF (or GF ) impact will be for my needs . Thread locker photo:
Depending on application, heat becomes your friend when thread locker is involved, especially if the threaded hole is in aluminum. If i suspect red loctite or equivalent was used, I reach for a torch and heat the area before attempting to break the bolt loose.
It helps to have a shop manual so you know what you're up against. If it's loctite and 600lbs of torque, you'll know what you have to do both directions.
There is a YouTube video of this fella who heats a rod end bolt for about 2 minutes using a cutting torch. He gets it HOT. I fear that amount of heat would damage the hardness of the bolt and the rod. But that bolt came right out. Seems easier to use a cheater to me.
People have been using heat on hydraulic cylinder rod nuts and bolts since long before I started in the industry. The only problems I've seen anyone have is when they didn't tighten it up to spec when they put them back together.
I looked at that, air consumption at full load is 68 cfm!
Looks like the new model uses an additional 20cfm. I own two old model 0611PASED-s and there's another one that's community property in the shop. An online reference says it uses 12cfm/15 sec., 48cfm/min. I never really thought about how much air it uses, as the shop compressor's tank is big enough to handle the flow. 15 sec-s is a long time. By then whatever you're wrenching on has broken loose and is spinning free or easy. It takes volume, not pressure, to run a 2 ton gun, as over 90psi is destructive. Our oldest gun is at least 20 years old and she's as good as the day she arrived. They're no beauty queens, just heavy and tough. I once read that CP built these specifically for the iron workers building the World Trade Center. Who knows.
It is actually the other way around. The air flow is the work, the PSI is the torque. Think like a hydraulic ram. The amount of force that can be applied is the psi, how quickly the ram moves is the flow. AFAIK all fluid devices work on the principle of pressure over an area. In the case of an air vane motor, pressure behind the vanes.
So how do you guys and the professional hydraulic shops get the bolt back in and tightened to spec , does anyone own/use a torque wrench capable of 1200 lbs or is it the common practice to coat the bolt with thread-locker and just make that darn bolt as tight as you can however you can ? Of course the factory has some very precise setup to torque these bolts to the exact requirement but I imagine that few others have this capability.
A cylinder bench is the correct answer. Any decent hydraulic shop will have one, the only differences will be in the maximum torque a particular bench can apply and that will depend very much on what the shop's local market (as regards cylinder size) is. The one in these photos goes up to 6,000 ft. lb. of torque.
Holy cow ! I’ll take two ! Those babies probably hold the entire rod length when torquing and not just at the end like I do. With these huge amounts of torque, during the 1000’s of cycles during operation there must be counterclockwise force that causes or caused that bolt to loosen. That would be annoying and potentially dangerous were that bolt and piston to loosen.
with piston nuts, correct torque and red loctite are your long-term friends. too much torque will stretch the threads and you don't want to be the next guy that has to take it apart. i have been that guy
Darn , I used blue Loctite! At what torque does red release it’s grip, does it always require heat to break red Loctite free?
Blue Loctite is OK, Birdseye. Red is to, but ya gotta heat it to at least 500 degrees. I rarely ever used the red stuff. On a big fine threaded bolt or nut hydraulic cylinders you won't pop red loctite loose without heat. Unless you have a big a## commercial cylinder bench.
The backhoe service manual doesn’t go into the details of rebuilding the cylinders so I don’t know what the torque specs are on the rod bolts. Is it possible that the tightening torque doesn’t have to be more than say 700-800 lbs (150 lbs x 5’ cheater) and let the blue Loctite do the rest. Would you trust that for backhoe type loads and cylinders?
That’s good to hear about blue Loctite. The backhoe service manual doesn’t go into the details of repacking cylinders so I don’t actually know what the rod end bolt tightening torque specs are. Is it possible that a moderate amount of torque say 750lbs ( 5’ cheater x 150 lbs) with blue Loctite would be sufficient for backhoe type loads and cylinders?
I would think so
I don't own a tube of red locktite. I always use blue. Here is a tightening torque chart that might help.
Not in my opinion, find the torque figure and get as close as you can, and use red locktite. Do you WANT to take it apart again? No fun if the nut comes loose, it will make lots of sharp little metal pieces that will travel throughout the hydraulic system, more fun than covid at a hockey game.
Inside a component that is generally run to failure Red Loctite is your friend, it does NOT come loose easily. If you want it back apart on a site, BLUE Loctite ONLY.
A phone call to a dealer should get you the torque procedure. Post what machine and which cylinder it is and someone here will likely be able to tell you what you are looking at. In my early years there weren't no cylinder benches or multipliers. It was red Loctite and a big pipe wrench or a slab of plate with a hex hole cut in the center, as that is all there was. You used a pipe on the wrench and a happy tapper on the plate. When the Japanese excavators showed up on our shores, the benches became a necessity. It needs to be done right. I have personal experience of trying to get an excavator back on a barge with the arm cylinder pulling in all the time and the swing wouldn't quit turning because someone thought a cheater on a big wrench would tighten the arm cylinder rod nut tight enough.
This may or may not apply. When trying to bust a cylinder loose, if the rod is not completely secured the impact will just transfer the enegy down the rod making it rattle around. When using a pull it will take all the slack out and deliver the enegy to the nut/bolt.
Birdseye, The torque values are in the service manual. I'm posting the page for the dipper cylinder. Notice it says to use blue Loctite ! Also notice what it says about lining up the set screw.
It's definitely all about the air. I have been wrestling with the piston bolt on my crowd cylinder. The bolt is about 1-1/4" with an 1-15/16" head. I began with a 3' pipe wrench and a 10' pipe and it wouldn't budge. I bought the 1" pistol grip impact from HF. $128 with a coupon. I ordered a 1" drive impact socket to fit. I installed the "high volume" air fittings sold at HF which have a 1/4" NPT thread and a 5/16" hole. I put those at every connection on my compressor and have the air running through 100' of 3/8" hose. I knew my compressor was too small but thought I would give it a try first. Nothing doing! I had to go to the welding supply store to get my oxy acetylene tanks replaced so I took all the stuff with me. He had what looked to be a 5 to 7 HP two stage compressor but it was connected to the standard 3/8" hose with 1/4" fittings. I installed the fitting that came with the gun and hammered on it a while with his air supply and it didn't budge. I started out towards a hydraulic cylinder repair shop I had never used that didn't answer the phone. Along the way I saw the industrial John Deere dealer so I pulled in and asked if they could get the bolt loose. The guy set my rod in a vise and used my pipe to hold the eye end and my socket on the bolt. He pulled out the EXACT SAME Harbor Freight 1" impact gun I have. He put some oil in it and connected it to what looked to be a 3/4" hose. His fitting must have been a full 3/8" ID because that is the thread in the gun inlet. He spun it free to let the oil circulate then put the socket on. It didn't even hammer! It just spun the bolt out as soon as he pulled the trigger. I wish I would have asked about their air supply other than the large hose and fittings. This has me wondering if you can get by with 100 PSI as long as you have the first blow volume. My little compressor has a 2" pipe plug in the tank. I wonder if I bushed it down to 3/4" and got the full 3/8" high flow fittings on a 3/4" hose if it would work? The bolt just had a small spot of BLUE locktite on it. When you think about it these bolts have zero rotational stress. All they have to do is keep the piston stationery while it gets forced back and forth. Yes it has a LOT of force applied but it never turns.
Big air tools require a lot of volume and pressure. Big tank and big hoses. 100 feet of 3/8 hose will never deliver the volume you need. IMHO ! I am aware you already know that but it bears repeating. 150 to 175 psi would be ideal for those big impact wrenches. You may have a defective HF impact wrench.
I started doing a bit of searching after reading this thread looking for large air hoses and fittings. For around $100, you can get a 50ft 3/4" jackhammer air hose with universal (Chicago) style fittings crimped on, 2 more Chicago style fittings for gun and air compressor, and the plumbing pieces to mate up to your tank. A bit of threading parts together and you'll never short your 1" impact gun for air because of the hose.
Perfect choice ! Safety wire in the Chicago fittings is mandatory.
This is what me employer uses on pneumatic tools used in pipeline installation https://www.whitecap.com/apt-safety...y7e5DyXQpahoCVhQQAvD_BwE#WTC2001875-20018754/
The size of the compressor tank determines how fast the pressure drops off only. The pressure determines how much force the impact has. The restriction in the hose determines how little pressure the impact actually gets, doesn't matter if you have 175 in the tank, a hose with 3/8 fittings won't have 100 at the gun. The flow is irrelevant, the gun will flow what it will based on the pressure supplied to the gun, if you don't supply the pressure to the gun, you don't get flow or power. Make sure the threads are perfectly clean before using locktite, it won't do anything with oil.
I wanted to try MY wrench but the fitting I had wouldn't fit their hose. I bet if I would have asked he would have let me switch fittings to test my gun. Either way I've been getting by with what I have for 30+ years so I will probably take this gun back to HF and forget about it until the next time. I know a place that can loosen bolts for me when I need them. His supervisor no charged it so I slipped the mechanic a $20 bill.
Tinkerer, shame on me, I should have looked more carefully at the service manual because you’re absolutely correct, the case 580e service manual has exactly what I am looking for. As you say it has all the details about the replacement of seals in the backhoe cylinders: - torque settings for each cylinder - weight of each cylinder - recommended thread locker - dis-assembly and re-assembling steps Thanks for pointing out what was right in front of me ! The manual does however make the repacking process more difficult by removing the entire cylinder from the machine, to me it’s easier to just remove the cylinder rod.
Comparison of hose diameters and connection location worth the watch.
Good Video. I would have loved to see them take it further and show how the flow is related to max torque, in all 3 scenarios. When I purchased my compressor, I purchased a 2-stage that would achieve 175PSI, and is rated at 15.4 CFM @ 90PSI. I plumbed in a 3/4" regulator that was rated at 140CFM, and used 3/4" copper tubing to plumb in (I have heard this is not good, but have worked at multiple places that had this setup for many years). When I decided to purchase a 1" drive impact, I added another outlet (tee in the copper pipe, with drip leg). This tee is fitted with 1/2" female pipe thread opening that has a Milton G-style high flow coupler rated a 99 SCFM. The hose is a 1/2" Good Year rubber hose that is 50 feet long. This is probably the only bottleneck in my setup. I also purchased an Ingersoll Rand 1" gun that is rated at 2100 Ft # of torque. At this point it has successfully removed the piston rod bolts on the stabilizer, lift cylinder, crowd cylinder, and front bucket cylinders of my New Holland 675E, all of which were factory tight, and had blue Loctite. One of the things that is worth mentioning about breaking a piston rod bolt is how it is secured. I like to reinstall the rod back in its normal position with the original pin in place. This seems to absorb the least impact (power) from the gun. Years ago, when I used to rebuild cylinders all the time (mostly bucket trucks for a electric utility), we had a jig on the bench that was bolted fast and contained 2 ears with different inserts. You pick the one that matches the size of the rod eye. It was also adjustable for width, and was just at working height. We never had an issue breaking the nuts (most bucket trucks had the rod threaded) from the rod with an impact gun. I think this device was in-house manufactured as we had a machine shop, but I wish I had this setup today. Oh, and buy the way, it had a gantry crane over it to move the rods into place...a long way from working off a ladder on the side of a backhoe! We also had a hydraulic cylinder bench for the really big cylinders from cranes and such. It was sweet to watch a cylinder bolt or nut just unthread as the hydraulic cylinder moved...no struggle at all.