When I got my "new ride" I wasn't satisfied with the way the hoist line was spooled.I re-spooled as much as I could with a single part of line with-out much success.So today I rigged two parts and spooled all the line out and reset with a rubber mallet,lubricating as I went.My question is what are my chances of re-training the line, or will it revert to its old lay? Any advice would be appreciated. I also scarred myself, I gave the cable a real good oiling with chain and cable lube,when I finished that I hung my crosby quike reeve block down low enough too freshen up the paint job, a couple hours later when I put it in the shop for the day I saw a puddle of oil on the deck where the controls would have been while I was respooling, my first thought was **** whats leaking but as it turned out it was the cable lube dripping off the cable. Man these machines are like a sickness working on them or with them is just too much fun! regards Glen
could be that the cable wasn't spooled off of the original reel correctly on to the lifting drum. if thats the case it may never lay correctly. Did you have any overhaul weight on it when respooling? i have seen people pull the cable through a couple of 2"x4"s clamped together with C clamps to give some resistance when respooling the winches.
You need to put about ten percent of you total line pull on the hook and do it again. Get it to lay correctly then run it up and down slowly and keep an eye on it. After that it should be fine. If they put it on wrong it will alway be a problem but I wouldn't think that's it. Usually people just roll the wire on the drum and call it good, or use the 2x4 trick. (witch is really a no no because the load is only placed on the outside of the wire) it needs a real load to do it right. That being said this is something you will always have to deal with. Cable fouling has to be in the back of your mind all the time. Everyone has to deal with it and not just on new wire.
Something that I have to keep an eye on constantly . Seems half the time I had to take one of the straight trucks out the line was messed up . On all of the companies boom trucks the two speed switch is a button in the hoist lever . I finally saw what was happening , One guy was lowering an empty hook with the engine at max throttle and the hoist lever fully engaged then pushed the high side button . It was just enough of a burst of speed with the light ball that the winch was faster than the ball for a split second . 40 ton National had big time spooling trouble when it was bought new . After many warranty complaints a spring loaded roller was installed on both the winchs
Wind will also screw with the spooling of cable, It's almost a daily chore to keep the line reeving on the drum, correctly when the wind in blowing 20+ everyday. I had new line put on about 3 months ago. It must be one billionth on a inch bigger than the old cable. I won't lay on the drum properly, no matter what you do, I just make a nasty looking start to the right side of the drum on all the wraps. Even used an air compressor to weight the line, didn't help. Office/mechanics say it's good to go, I just keep an eye on it.
Thanks for the advice,its laying pretty good right now. My line block is 290 lbs. I will keep an eye on it and use more wieght next time, its always good to see we all have the same problems.I'm not saying I'm glad you have problems just glad I'm not alone out there in the big old cruel world.:drinkup Glen
Hi, I have a somewhat related problem. I have about a wrap and a half of hoist line on my dragline and just about every time it makes that second wrap instead of spooling next to it and back across the drum like it should it continues to wrap on top of its self and then bang slides over. How do I train the cable to go back across the drum? I have had this problem with several cables, so I don't think it is the cable?
IT might just be worth it to bite the bullet and get a new winch rope and see that its spooled on correctly.
I have done two jobs this week and it is spooling perfect. Thanks for the advice:notworthy
"VERY FEW" people in the industry apply a new rope to a hoist drum 'as it was on the spool when it was delivered.’ It requires completely removing the brand new rope from the new reel first and most won’t commit that extra step. The do this it takes an powered wire rope winder, an extra empty cable spool/reel and some time to do it right for the very start. Position a wire rope winder near the tip, or a least as far away as possible to reduce any fleet angles. Remove the old rope from the drum with the winder and then remove that loaded old rope spool from the winder shaft. Then securely position the brand new rope spool close to the boom foot pins, with the rope in a posture to come off the top as it goes OUT towards the tip of the boom. With the winder out there nearer the tip, wind up all the new rope from off of the factory spool onto the extra spool, off the top and back on the top. NOW the factory anchor point is on the top layer!!!!!!! That way the factory anchor point can go to the drum’s anchor point with the wedge. The reason is so that the rope can spool back up on the drum the way it was applied during manufacturing! Now spool it all onto the hoist drum, from top of winder spool to top of drum, applying a winder brake for some moderate tension, and then follow the rope break in and training procedures that some other members have already spelled out, to tension and wrap train the new cable. Think about it. The rope was originally put on so that it goes in a natural and relaxed layering and cross over pattern, that will likely be repeated if it goes on the drum the SAME WAY. A heavy enough over hall ball or heavy enough block is also very important along with an operator that is very in tune with how smoothly he starts and stops the drum when working. Lack of unloaded rope tension at the drum is a problem even if all else is perfect! That’s just my 2 cents worth.
I didn't even notice but over the coarse of the summer I fixed the spooling on my hoist I spent a couple mounths re-spooling it every time I noticed it wrong and today i realized I havn't re-spooled it for a mounth and it is perfect. I guess I retrained it
I am from a different industry, logging. We have problems with spooling lines on our yarders. Have any of you used the Lebus grooved sleeves on your winch drums? If so how well do they work? http://www.lebus-intl.com II am considering them and am looking for information on if and how well they work. I found this thread interesting and helpful thano you. By the way our drum speeds are 2000 feet per minute when we are inhauling, so the comment about the operator being smooth has perked my interest.
I get a small pop when it does this too. I'm curious if that's normal or not.
There are lots of people on this forum with way more experience than me but I will deposit my two cents. No it should not pop that it is likely the hoist line falling of the improperly spooled line under it and every time it does that it shock loads your crane. When I was having trouble with mine, as often as I could I hung a heavy load on the hook , had a buddy hoist in and set the cable in place with a rubber mallet . Over the coarse of a couple months and respooling it maybe ten times, shasam!! I had it retrained.
Cool, Thanks. I'll get someone to line up and down while I watch to see what is going on.
Over time a cable will flatten from rolling onto itself over time. I've only seen this on older cranes. I have seen them roll up on themselves four or five wraps and when the slide over they shock load the crane like crazy. Most of the time when a cable is rolling up on itself it's time for a new cable. If it just spools weird you can sometimes get it to lay right. Also seems to happen more with non rotational cable then just standard rot cable.
There is a AutoAdvance Line Spooler it is an innovative system that simulates fleet angle for effortless and perfect line spooling onto a drum.
Does anybody else still unspool there cable, cut 6 ft off and reattach it to the drum so it wears on a new spot when it reaches the side of the drum. We do it as a normal maintenance item.
Old Iron, Yep,used to do that. Even went as far as to take cable off and endo it when it starts getting mashed on bottom layer, wouldn't want to do it if you didnt have a spooler or were workin in mud or dirt. I had the luxury of a blacktop dock. The old cranes(3900,4000) with there small smooth drums would eat cable big time. Lebus lagging on the drum helped alot. Repetitive duty cycle work pulling max line pull is hard on cable. the good thing is the newer larger cranes(2250) were purchased with the optional full width front drum and it was grooved with a larger diameter. Actually the whole cable would be trashed about the same time. 800'X1 1/4" BA Dyform reeved in a either a 3 or 4 part. We would go through usually 2 a season (8 mos.) per machine. 4100's were easy on cable, reeved in a 3 part, large diameter grooved lagging, little shorter boom,sometimes you stayed on the bottom layer and it didn't break over. They didn't have the capacity to go to a 4 part. We used same cable.
lebus lagging will absolutely cure you spooling problems. lebus guarantees it. the lagging is custom made with a double crossover design that eliminates all multilayer and high speed spooling problems. we have retrofitted many hoists with their product and the problem is gone. its pricey and it takes a little lead time but i highly recommend it.
the longer your boom is, the more of a problem it is to get a clean crossover without stacking because the fleet angle diminishes. grove had a prob with this for years until they tarted installing kickers on their model 30 winches. (they quietly offered retro kits if you screamed loud enough to the dealer) factory claimed they never had a problem but they offered kits a magically the prob disappeared. they also installed fleeting guides on the tip of the base section on boom trucks with over 90' of stick to keep the fleet angle constant. the europeans discovered this about 2000 and the american companies stole the idea cause it worked.
Niagara Falls
Just a drive by. The crane is at the edge of the cataract not from the brink of the falls
The Hills Hoist is also commonly used in Australian drinking culture with the smashing game "Goon of Fortune". Goon of Fortune combines two of Australia's most revered creations, the Hills Hoist and cask wine. Four sacks of cask wine, more commonly referred to as "goon," are attached to the end of each cross beam. The contestants then rotate the clothes line while chanting their favorite goon song. When the clothes line stops the closest contestant takes a long drink of the wine, 10 seconds is the norm. For the "Goon of Fortune" to be authentic there must be a combination of 3 types of cask wine: Fruity Lexia, White and Red. The fourth sack is can be either of the three however contestants prefer the saying, "Fruity Lexia makes you sexier!" and thus Fruity Lexia is the goon of choice. The winner of the game is the last one standing or the last not to vomit. A beer bong may be used in place of the usual 10 second drink if the other contestants feel that participant is failing to drink enough and therefore cheat the game (usually foreigners unaccustomed to Australian amounts of alcohol).