This unit has a Isuzu 3LD1 engine and an overheating problem I've been trying to figure out for several years. It starts great and runs great but starts heating up past 190 while working it if the ambient air temp is over about 55-60F. I eventually have to run it with the hood open and if the temp is over 80 or so I can only work it a half day. It cools down to normal operating temp if I idle it with the hood open. Here's what I've thrown at it so far: 1) New radiator cap 2) New thermostat and I verified that it works. 3) New water pump 4) Rodded out radiator 5) New muffler 6) Tested for leaking head gasket 7) Added aftermarket temp gauge to verify the factory gauge is working properly 8) Cooling system flushed out several times over the last few years I'm out of ideas. it doesn't leak a drop of coolant, and it used to run on the cooler side even on a hot day until something unknown happened. Does anyone haven any ideas? Would an out of time injection pump cause overheating? The exhaust smells like burning oil, but the engine doesn't burn any oil. Don't know if that could be a clue. If anyone might have any suggestions on where to go from here I'm all ears and would very much appreciate any help.
Can you loosen the injector lines at the injector to disable one cylinder at a time? that might make the smell go away and tell you one of the injectors is bad. A drippy injector could possibly cause it to run hotter and smell like burning oil. Or pull the injectors and get them checked, or try a tank of biodiesel with some diesel injector cleaner and run it hard for a tank. don't let the biodiesel sit and turn to junk.
Thanks for the info. I'll look into the injectors when I get a chance. I appreciate just being pointed in a new direction. This overheating problem has been driving me nuts for too long.
I would check the injectors. I had a 35J that had that issue (overheating and injector failure). If I recall and if it is the same Isuzu engine, the engine has kind of complicated injection system. Once I had the injectors fixed it was good. I would also contact Compact Equipment Sales in Ky. Those guys are rock solid, if it deals with an IHI they can help.
I had an overheating issue that was related to two things that have nothing to do with coolant.. one the inside of the machine had so much dirt, grease, and mud that the hydraulic lines were heating up and causing the internal temperature within the engine bay to increase, also I had leaking hydraulic orings leaking internally making the hydraulic pump work harder therefore increasing heat in the compartment as well. I only mention these because you have no signs that point to coolant issues and opening the engine bay door appears to help. Just a thought.
Thanks for the replies. The engine and everything else under the hood is really clean. I just have a little oil leak coming from a bad oil pressure sensor that's making a little bit of a mess but i'll fix that when I get a new sensor. The hydraulics are strong and any leak down is very minimal so I don't think there would be any issue with that. I'll look into the injectors next.
Air filters
This overheating problem has been giving me a headache for several years. The air filters have been cleaned and replaced many times over those years.
try a new radiator cap with the proper pressure rating ?
yep, a new proper pressure radiator cap from the dealer was the very first part I threw at it.
Your description of your problem points to something in the engine bay heating the engine up externally, as to say its not a coolant issue.
What kind of fan do you have on machine ,direct drive,clutch drive ,thermostatically controlled?
Did you find out about the problem? Mine also goes to 100 degrees c
No I haven't gotten it fixed yet. I'm going to try replacing the fuel injectors and see if that helps. I just got the parts but don't have the time to do it at the moment.
I finally took my injectors out and found something that doesn't look good. This is my first time trying to upload pictures so this is a test.
Ok I think I got the pictures figured out. So these holes are supposed to be round, well one is anyway. So I have a couple questions. First, what causes this metal to be eaten away.....or burned away? Is this from bad spray patterns from the injectors? And my second question is can I put the new injectors in and run it without any problems or do I need a new cylinder head for it to work properly? It looks like all the sealing surfaces are in good shape.
I think those are replaceable injector seat seals, done with the head on. I know on Cummins B motors, they get replaced when changing injectors, and, on a Cummins B, they pull right out. #66, but I can't find part number or instructions, yet.
And, this...
Are you talking about the heat shield, which looks like part 66 on your diagram? The pictures I took are with the heat shields removed. I first thought I might have broken this metal while removing them because they were a pain in the ass to remove, especially the one that came out of the hole with the biggest section of metal missing, that one was an absolute BITCH to get out. After looking at it a little closer, that metal is thicker than I first thought so there is no way I could have broken it.
I worked the excavator today after installing the new injectors and there is no change. it's heating up like usual. At this point of my frustration I might just work it until it blows up and find another excavator. That would be a shame though because everything else works great other than the overheating issue.
this hasn't been addressed at all that I can see. Even a new belt can slip on a worn out pulley. Also, what kind of temps are we talking about? an infra red thermometer will give tell you the temp of the thermostat going to the radiator, the inlet coming back from the radiator, the air in front of the radiator and the air behind the radiator. Those numbers will make it a lot easier to guess what's going on. Take all of those temps at the hottest you get it, and as quickly as you can.
Could the fan be on backward? Installing it backward would NOT reverse the airflow, but would diminish the volume of being moved. How about some pictures, the fan, the shroud, etc?
Have you checked the head gasket, it might leaking a small amount of compression into the cooling system
The fan is a direct drive on a one piece pulley. I've tried getting some temps with a heat gun. I just shot the upper rad hose and the lower rad hose to get an idea if the radiator was doing its job, and it appeared that it was. I don't remember what readings I got......I'll have to do it again. If I remember correctly the fan can only be installed one way but I'd have to double check that. The shroud is in tact...….I'll try to upload some pics when I get a chance.
Yes I checked the head gasket. I did a block test that tested good as far as I could tell. There are no other obvious signs that there is a head gasket leak, and I put Blue Devil head gasket sealer in it just to make sure.
so with the head gasket sealer, did you drain the coolant, flush with water, and run it with straight water? did it still overheat with water? What is it exactly doing when it overheats? You mentioned "gets over 190" if that's F, and it's not losing coolant, or pressure, and you are running 50/50 antifreeze, then you can run it to 220 easy without worrying about a thing. What condition is the fan belt in? Look at the pulleys too, how worn? Those temps are still the best place to start.
I would also suggest contacting CES (Compact Excavator Sales) in Elizabethtown, Ky. They are the importer for IHI/Kato excavators. When I had an IHI they were very knowledgeable about the machines and very helpful.
you doit all of the cooling system good ¡¡¡ if you engine overheating only when when is working you need review the hidraulic system for correct relief pressure
I fought a machine a while back that overheated under load...turns out that someone had turned the throttle stop in, adding 500 more rpm.
Sergiosmi.…….thank you, I'm thinking the hydraulics should be the next thing to look at, but I don't know the first thing about testing hydraulics. I talked to one of the techs at the IHI/KATO place in Kentucky a while back and one of the first things he asked me was if it has a hydraulic thumb on it, which it does. He said if it doesn't have a hydraulic thumb there's a solenoid (if I remember right) that can stick and cause it to overheat. But since it does have a hydraulic thumb he didn't think that would be a problem.
Have a look at this. Hope this will assist you, Ken
Kenskip1, thanks for the video. The mini in the video has a 2 piece pulley that wore out. Mine is a one piece pulley so I wouldn't have this problem.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You Know hows the hydraulic siystem works or have the hydraulic diagram ? if su have the hydraulic diagram I can help
Hi Kirk, I've been working on a similar problem that you listed. That is how I found you and your problem. I watched the video from Kinskip1 and saw that he had the same Isuzu 3LB1 motor that is in my IHI 28N. So I went and looked at my pulley again and it looks like a one piece pulley, but when I took the fan belt loose and grabbed a hold of it with my hand I could rotate the outer part with belt groove in it with out turning engine crankshaft. Now it didn't spin like Kenskip1 did, but it was slipping. I've been working on diesel engines for 45 years and you don't see this problem very often. This pulley assembly is a damper for the crank shaft to absorb shock loads every time a cylinder is fired. The part that is secured to crankshaft has an elestromatic ( rubber) compound between it and the outer pulley part to make it one part that rotates together. If you saw in the video those small raised lines on timing cover, behind where Kenskip1took the pulley assy off, those are timing marks for setting valves and injector pump timing. Without that outer pulley ring secured to the center, it would be impossible to set up the fuel injection timing and make it more difficult to adjust valve lash. Kenskip1 should have replaced the seal for that pulley assy while the pulley was off, you could see where oil has been leaking and that rubber retaining compound doesn't like oil either, oil makes it soft. We use to have this problem with old 327, 283 chevy eng while setting timing by turning the distributor and line on pulley kept moving. Hope this will help somebody else.
First off, I did not do this project. I simply attempted to assist a member with a problem.
Sorry Kenskip1, I ass u me d you did the work shown in the video, I really appreciated the video, without that insightful info that was revealed i n the video a lot of people would still be chasing over heating problems. You were correct in trying to help out by sharing this vtdeo. Thank You Kenskip1 and whoever did make the video.
I'm re-visiting this thread because summer is back and I'm trying to fight this overheating problem again. What year is your 28N? I thought the N models have the 3ld1, but I'm not sure. I will check the crank pulley again. I tried rotating mine but it wouldn't budge, and I verified with the dealer that I have a one piece pulley per my serial #, but I will triple check it. It seems like the temperature stays in check for maybe a half hour to forty five minutes, then it goes up. Maybe the pulley stays solid until it heats up enough then starts spinning?
Hi Kirk, If you loosen the fan belt and maybe even remove from the pulley on crankshaft. Then get you a really bright Led flashlite and a mirror so you can get the mirror down next to the front of pulley at about a 45 angle, then shine your flashlite into the mirror, you will see a line around the front of pulley about 3/4 -1,1/4inch in from the outer edge of pulley. that line is where the outer ring of pulley is bonded to the hub/center of pulley/hub. that bonding material is about 1/8 inch wide. Yes the dealer will tell you that you have a one piece pulley because those 2 parts are not made to be serviced seperately. If and when you have to service that hub/pulley assy ,because, (ex:chunk broke out of V groove, bolt came loose in centerof pulley/hub allowed center hub to wobble on crank, bonding material protuding out, etc), you will recieve a complete pulley/center hub assembly ready to slip onto crankshaft. You will also note a notch in outer edge of pulley, that notch is for those timing marks I related to in earlier post. You may have to remove/pull that pulley assy off the crankshaft and mount it in a vise with protective material covering pulley where seal runs, then take a strap wrench around outside of pulley to see it turn/rotate seperately from center hub. Put a white paint mark across front of assy to see if it does turn seperately. One other thing that may possibly cause an overheat problem is if there isn't a thermostat in the coolant system. On the old smallblock Chevys, 283,327, if you took the thermostat out , the coolant would get to circulating to fast thru the radiator for it to cool down the coolant.. Also if you look in the thermostat housing on your 28N, you will see that the thermostat does 2 things, it opens to allow coolant to radiator , but it also closes off the bypass port that sends coolant back into block coolant passages. If it has wrong thermostat in it that doesn't do both of these functions. The coolant will go to the path of least resistance, and that may be just around and around the block. I know this is long , but if your like me , I'm open to any help when it comes to difficult problems to solve. Hope you solve yours.
Thanks for the reply. I'll look at it closer when I get a chance. The excavator is on a jobsite and the highs will be about 105 degrees for the next couple days so I won't be going out there until next week. The dealer told me the earlier 3ld1 engines had the problematic 2 piece crank pulley, and mine had one solid piece, but I won't know for sure until I check it out more closely. My hydraulic oil is too hot too, so this could explain both problems, or the hot oil cooler being in front of the engine radiator might be the problem meaning I have something wrong in the hydraulic system causing it to overheat. I took the machine to a hydraulic shop but they didn't seem too interested in putting in some time to diagnose it.
Yes, definitely over heating of the hydraulic oil going thru the cooler will transfer the heat from Hydra cooler to the radiator. Any hydraulic system will generate heat when the oil is forced thru a retriction, whether it is into a cylinder under pressure to move the cylinder or thru a relief valve , whether or not the function has reach the end of its stroke or not. usually you can find a leaking cylinder by it drifting in or out with the machine shut off and letting it set with clylinder particial extended or retracted. Or by holding your hand against side of cylinder where the piston is at, retracted or extended, while that function is held over relief for a while. If there is an internal leak on the piston seals it will heat up that area of cylinder where oil is being forced thru the restrictive leak. Another place to check that is over looked sometimes, because it ain't in use, is relief valves for aux functions. Those controls may have been moved accidently and gotten stuck ,( because they aren't used very often), and making that function go over the relief for that function, which will generate heat very quickly. But this problem usually shows up as a hard starting problem or slow cranking speed. but it can still exist if you have a pilot system that is shut off for starting, but turns on hydraulic control circuts when pilot system is turned on to operate machine. I hope you are able to find your problem. I had a neighbor I looked at his semi this morning that the dump trailer was taking forever to come back down and it wasn't to fast going up either, I showed him where he had forgot to screw the big hose connector completely together. This was creating a restriction for the oil flow both directions. Finished threading connector together and it worked just fine.
I had a similar issue on a kobelco blade runner. Shop had it for two months and didn’t figure it out. Brought it home and started looking at the basics. I found the fan belt was glazed over and slipping. You should not be able to rotate the fan by hand and mine, even with a tight belt, felt like it had a clutch on it and it was direct drive. Scuffed up the pulleys, installed a new belt, no more overheating issues. Sometimes we overthink things.