I've had an old David White for a long time, but mainly used it back when I had a concrete company. It's history now for reasons I'd like to avoid lest my blood pressure rise. With this new business I do a lot of gravel roads and seat-of-the-pants rural grading jobs. I'm also starting to get a lot more long drainage swales. I'd like to get a receiver mast setup on my tractor's box blade for swales and possibly a removable mast for my ctl's bucket so I can check grade as I go. I don't know whether I'll need dual slope at this time, but for sure I need to be able to set up a single slope. I don't want to break the bank either. I've been looking at a Spectra LL300 package that comes with their CR600 magnetic and rod mounts. The other one is the Topcon RL H4C. The Topcon setup doesn't include a magnetic receiver, so that would have to be purchased as well. The Topcon does look more rugged and has a better warranty. Any experience with either setup, or is there another brand that I should be looking at?
Maybe I'm just cheap but I like my home depot laser kit, made by cst / berger. Its the non self leveler, but that's a plus cause I can run infinite slopes with it, even dual slope if necessary. It comes with no equipment mounts and the detector only has a limited range, but its accurate. They are abound $400, and I get 2 years or so out of them, and if you say back over one with a d-6 your out a lot less than if you bought a 2500 dollar self leveler.
And that's one of the issues I'm having. I'm pretty cheap myself...at least my wife thinks so! I also thought about going that route and spending more on a nicer machine mount receiver like Apache. I work by myself about 99% of the time. Having a rod mount and a machine mount would sure make my day easier.
I dunno, I think the better recievers are still compatable with the low end base units. At least when there were several lasers spinning you had to be sure you had the right beam whenever ive been around multiple units.
I used a laser for swales for 10 yrs. Not sure how long of ditches you're cutting but it gets old moving the laser 30 times a day. I used to use a LL500, then upgraded to a LL600. I have a GL722 now for the excavator and wish it would go longer. I would go with at least a GL422. I'm not completely familiar with the 300 but I don't think you have a digital display for your slope? Those cheaper Spectra's are great for small site flatwork, footings, septics, etc. The CR600 should be OK for on your skid but you will have a very difficult time seeing it on your box blade when it's sunny out. The H4 will have better range than the 300 Spectra but I have run Topcon and I feel it is at best average quality.
No digital display on the slope. It's a point to point deal. My swales aren't usually longer than 400 ft, but the one I did last week was 850 ft with not a lot of fall. I had to bring out a helper with my old builder's level and relocate a few times to get it right. I am also a bit leery on being able to see the 600 display. The Topcon specs about twice as far as the Spectra. Not sure if they're figuring one direction distance or centered swinging both ways. Pretty hard to compare specs.
The lasers almost always give their distance as a diameter. So half is your one direction. I tried out a H4 last summer, distance was ok, maybe 800' one way with accuracy. The thing is with lasers is you might think you know where you're at, but turn the laser 180° on the tripod and check again. It can be a sobering experience. I know you said you're trying to be conservative on purchase price, but I've been down that road and in my opinion when it comes to your laser, your job depends on it and you get what you pay for.
Purchased a Topcon RL-H4C a couple of years ago and it's been a great laser, the best I've owned. Good range, easy set up. It has a "slope match" function that I've never used. Currently looking at adding a slope laser and looking at the Topcon RL-SV2S or the RL -200. The RL-SV2S is a dual slope laser but limited to 5% grade in either direction. The RL-200 is a single slope laser that can go 25%. I can get a RL-SV2S for $2500 and the RL-200 for $2900. The RL-H4C was $600 and one of the best purchases I have made. I want a slope laser for laying storm pipe, I don't use a standard pipe laser. I've been using the RL-H4C to lay storm and calculating the rise for each joint as we lay it. It works fine but it would be nice to dial in a grade and not have to move the receiver. I would recommend a Topcon product.
Thanks for the input on the RL. This is the package I'm looking at. http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Topcon-RL-H4C-DB-Rotary-Laser-Level-PLUS-16-FT-Fiberglass-10ths-Rod-Tripod/300854598287?_trksid=p2054897.c100204.m3164&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140407115239%26meid%3Dd98aab9cc0434f088c9fe628acc82336%26pid%3D100204%26prg%3D20140407115239%26rk%3D8%26rkt%3D20%26sd%3D191145492501 Just want to be sure, but are the machine receivers compatible with most lasers? I was looking at CST's site and noticed that their machine receiver is actually an Apache. I'm pretty sure I'd be going with the Apache Bullseye +3 or +5. I haven't yet been able to locate how the Apache units mount...:beatsme
cm, that very reason that you stated is why I love my manual leveling cheapo, I can set any slope I want in it. Can even get it to shoot a straight, aimed beam if that is what I need.
I bought a UL633 last year, haven't been disappointed in the slightest. I do a variety of work, most isn't related to dirt, but it's very nice having a verstile laser.
Apache units mount to either a 1.75"-2" round tube or 1.5" square tube. Here is the user's guide for a Spectra LR60 (same as a Bullseye +6). Only difference between the 60 (+6) and the 50 (+5) is angle compensation besides plumb indication.
Lumberjack - Love the 633, but its a lot more than what I'll ever need. Great info Shimmy. Thank you.
Great thing about having more than you need.... you aren't left wanting more! But... I understand!
How do you set it to a specific slope, for example - 3.25%?
get out a long tape measure 100 feet off, set the laser flat, note that mark, come down 3.25', adjust the manual level on that axis till the detector is right and your done. Whats a lot harder is matching pipe ends with a self leveler. Say you have 120 feet between two existing storm boxes and you have to connect them, what do you all do? Me I can just set the laser on top of the one, the detector on top of the other, adjust the level till we are on and I'm golden.
OK thanks, I'll be looking for a unit I can put the slope in or just do it the way we have. I just shoot one invert and then the other. Figure the fall from one the next, distance of pipe and calculate the slope. Divide the rise of the line by the length of pipe and it gives you the rise per joint of pipe. This is the reason I would like to have a bona fide slope laser, no moving the target on the stick every joint.
I would suggest a Spectra GL622 and a Spectra LR60W. The GL622 is a great dual slope laser that does slope matching and the LR60W comes with a remote display so you wouldn't have to break your neck trying to see the receiver no matter what you are using it on
I bought a Spectra UL633 and so far it is excellent in every way, every time we use it we learn something new that it will do. Easily allows a dial grade in for any pipe application, any building project and slopes for area grading. I really like that it is a pipe laser and a construction laser in one package that does everything from 1 carrying case. The cost was plenty but it paid for itself on the first storm sewer job we did.
Thanks for all of the suggestions guys. I ordered a Topcon RL H4C package today from I3SYS today. We'll see how it works out.
CM You may already know this, but with a slope laser, what I would do is dial the slope in that is indicated on the plans, with the laser in line with the survey stakes. Set up on a hub, and set the tape to the cut indicated to FL. Then you should shoot "0" at FL. You can then check in at each survey hub, and you should read the same as the cut indicated. If not, there is a problem. I once caught the surveyor with the slope staked to fall the wrong direction on a 42" concrete encased storm drain. It was to run under a mall, and they sure were glad I found it before the pipe went in. It sure makes it easy to grade the trench bottom when everywhere you go "0" is grade for FL, and zero minus pipe thickness and bedding combined is subgrade, anywhere in the ditch.
I agree that's why I'm looking at getting a slope laser. All I have now is a RL-H4C, which is a good laser but each joint has to be calculated.
I've been eyeing this pup on fleabay, if I hadn't already bought a similar laser earlier this year... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Leica-RUGBY-270-SG-/271693712035?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f42350aa3
I would not buy a used laser. Not sure how much that particular one is new, but a laser is pretty important tool. Spend the extra to get a new one, if you have any trouble with it, somebody else has to pay for it.
I agree. You can get a new RL-H4C package with cheap grade rod and tripod for less money.
Ya... $715 for the package with free shipping was a no-brainer for me.
Hey John, hope you will post your impressions of the RL H4C unit when you get it. Does Topcon offer a remote read out for this system? I have looked at some the remote (in cab) read outs available and they seem pretty pricey. I have a Dewalt DW073 that I bought from Lowes several years ago. It works pretty well but is a very poor cousin to the RL H4C. Range is only about 600' dia. and they claim an accuracy of only 1/4"-100'. Still I was able to use it when I cut the ditches for my septic drain field a few years ago. No problems to date with the drain field so I guess it did ok. My use would be mostly on the skid steer so I think the in cab read out would be very handy. Looking for an inexpensive solution in case you happen to run across one Tim
You need a machine receiver to get remote read out I think
I've had the RL-H4C for about a month now. I've used it on a few jobs, but I haven't had a chance to mess with the single slope setup yet. I'll be getting a machine receiver and fabbing removable masts for my ctl bucket and for the tractor's box blade. An easily readable receiver costs more than the laser itself, but I'm sure it will pay for itself pretty quickly. Shimmy is correct on the remote. If you get a Topcon machine receiver like this http://www.tigersupplies.com/Products/Topcon-LS-B110W-Wireless-Remote-Display-Machine-Control-Laser-Receiver__TOP57137.aspx it is compatible with a remote display.
JNB, I bought a Laser Horn a long time ago. Works well. http://www.lascolaser.com/magento/i...netic-mount-pole-for-receivers-laserhorn.html I am going to replace my LL400 Spectre this Winter. I really have not been that pleased with its durability. I have a dual slope Topcon that is outstanding, but I don't like to bring it along if I don't need that capability. The 400 has slope matching but it is not that easy to use. I am trying to decide what to go with next time. I have had better luck with Topcon than Spectre but I have had three different Topcon's and only one Spectre, maybe the 400 is not that rugged.
KSSS - Thank you for the link. The only thing I'd worry about with that mounting system is the stickiness of our clay. I respect your opinion so maybe you could give me your thoughts on it. I've been thinking about fabbing one up like this http://www.laser-grade.com/bucketmount.htm but I'd have to weld a mount on each bucket. BTW- I emailed you the pdf files on the hyd. hose.
I got a Lieca rugby 410, 5 years ago invisible beam duel grade its a great laser that does long distance I use it on a regarler basices and it was a country mile cheaper than most other quality lasers out there. A good quality laser will last for years and avoid green beam lasers.
Sorry about not seeing this. That system works well enough in loose granular material like 3/4 roadbase. Heavy clay may break the magnet bond on the bottom of stick.