I've only had joystick control loaders, but was offered a deal on one with the the 3 finger tip controls. I've never even operated one like that. How do they worK. What are the advantages?
Hello MDD, To go back in history a little will help understand why there are two different control patterns. Back in the day there were two lever controls that had levers close to 2' long and were either connected directly to the control valve or were connected via a cable. Because the lever throws were so long is was nearly impossible to work both levers while in the pile, so the boom lever was often placed into a detented "up" position while the operator worked the bucket with the tilt function. This detent was also used when coming up to a truck or hopper to raise the booom while the operator used the tilt lever to dump the bucket at the same time. The single lever control was designed as an improved control pattern over the two lever pattern as it is decribed above. This allowed the operator to have full control over all functions while loading the bucket and dumping into a truck. Today the difference between the two patterns is not as aparent because the advent of pilot and EH controls. You will typically find the joystick or single lever controls on smaller, 4 cu yd) come standard with type of controls. Not that you can't get a joystick with these larger machines, but because of the high percentage of the time that these machines perform repetitive v-pattern loading it is thought that the short, two lever controls give the operator much better metering control over the bucket while coming up to and dumping in a truck or hopper. On a personal note, I grew up running single lever controls and now that two lever machines have such short levers and provide such a nice metering feel, I actually prefer these over the joysticks of today. With that being said I think that some manufactures have better two lever controls than others. I like the feel of the Deere and Cat EH two lever controls. Case/New Holland also have a decent feel. I don't care for the Volvo controls as they, in my opinion, don't have enough resistance. I also don't like the Komatsu pilot/EH controls nor do I like the Cat pilot controls. Both have levers that are too long for my tastes.
What make and model? Also, i take it the third finger tip control is for a third function similar to a loader I ran a few years ago. The third control on that loader controlled the top portion of the bucket. Its a hell of a set up. The only thing I liked more about a joystick was it seemed easier to use all three functions at once. The spacing on the finger tip controls is easy for two finger use, but if you have the third function it seemed hard to use all three at the same time. Problems, were not many. It is a good control system. Cat did have a few issues when they first came out. Mostly with dirt getting into the control electronics. Lets face it, ac in machines is not for operator comfort, rather its to save the electronics. I did have some issues with control when it was damp out. That problem was solved with a new set of controls per the Cat mechanics recomendation.
thanks for the great responses guys. It is an 06 or 07 Deere 544J. So I take it that the lever style control is better!?! Im just so used to the joysticks, I dont want to make a bad decision. The machine is far away and would have to be hauled in, so no test ride..
i much prefer finger tip controls in trackloaders...then again i also prefer 3 stick CASE controls on backhoes too...maybe i just like more levers to pull
i have the singel controls on all of our track loaders and our 928 we rented a 950 one time with the two levers i got used to it in no time but i still prefer the joystick i fell like i have more control of the tractor just my opinion
Most guys on here don't do this, but if you plan on using the loader with a pusher to plow snow the two sticks are nice too. When you use those you are supposed to set the bucket angle then just pick the arms to dump/clear snow so this way if you don't touch that bucket lever you don't have to worry about it. With a joystick it's easier to move your bucket curl. I've run them both in both v loading and jobsite support, I personally prefer the 2 stick.
I have a feeling I will be more partial to the joystick as well..
To me it comes down to what you are doing with it. If you are doing a wide variety of utility work, I would prefer the joystick, but if digging and loading is the main function, give me two sticks. If you spend all day digging and dumping, the ability to detent the boom raise is priceless. Also the control while dumping seems better, and it is easier to maintain a steady cycle. Going over rough ground can disrupt the cycle with a joystick, since you are holding it, not just letting it raise up while in detent. Gives you time to move your arm around, scratch your nose, trip a load counter, or salute the truck driver.
My main use would be for tramming gravel around for sewer/utility installs, and misc. job site stuff.
Hello again MDD, Of course it's a personal preference... but I favor the 4 function joy stick for loader and bucket myself. Our old Hough 80B has 2 levers... for lift and bucket... and the lever throw is too long to use both in unison with the same hand. The MDT loaders that I run have joysticks, so you don't have to move your hand from one control to the other. Our JD 750c dozer has one joystick for all 6 way blade functions... Back/forward for raise/lower...side/side for tilt... and twist, right/left for angle... I really like that control set up, because you can use 3 functions at the same time... that is... raise/lower, tilt, and angle... with out moving your hand off the lever. OCR PS. I also ran a Cat loader with joystick steering... not sure, but I think it was a 988 or the next size up, and I loved it too... no cranking that cussed steering wheel around and wearing out your arm... seemed very smooth too. Also ran a Cat with that "half thing of a joke" steering wheel... and you can probably gather... I didn't care for that control set up.
Airplane Steering wheel ? Here's the airplane steering wheel ,as I call it. Cat 980G.
Airplane Steering wheel ? Yup, that's what it was... didn't make much sense to me, you still had to have your arm extended out to use it. Just didn't have to crank on it as much. That set up seemed some what awkward to me... where as the joystick steering felt intuitive and smooth... of course I'm used to joysticks... and I like them as a control device. Thanks Northart, OCR PS. Looking at your picture again... I remember the two yellow buttons for forward and reverse... and also used for gear selection??? I can't remember exactly what you used to change speed ranges. But, if you held the wheel any where other than top left... you had to move your hand back to push the buttons... just seemed... well... irritating.
Gear Shifting ? The left yellow button upshifts, and the right yellow button downshifts . Got to look at the screen, to see what gear you are in.
Gear Shifting ? What about forward and reverse??? Same buttons??? OCR
Forward / Reverse ? Forward / Reverse is the rocker switch underneath your left hand. Not visible in the picture. Where your fingers are. Wish I had another picture. Gear shifting is done with the thumb. F/R is done with the index finger.
Forward / Reverse ? Yup... yup... I remember now... can't see it because it's under the wheel. But, I do recall the rocker switch that you used your finger to operate. There... I think we have that straightened out and under control ... Thanks Northart, OCR PS. Actually, Northart... If you look real hard... I think you can just glimpse the rocker switch in your picture... just slightly to the inside of wheel isn't it? And... we kinda steered this thread off track a little... didn't we?...
Forward/reverse is a rocker switch under the steering wheel, under the buttons. You use your thumb for the up/down buttons, fingers for fwd/rev.
I learned on a joy stick highlift. But now I run a 2 lever machine and I lke it 100 times better. It seems to have a better feel to what the machine is doing. It's purely personal preferance
I ran a Bell L2306C, not related to JD, and it had a joystick. It was a big machine, and it had all of the shifting and gear selection on the joystick. It was a nightmare. I would love to run a 2 lever combo, seeing as it is getting a lot of praise. I would hate to run a LongGong machine, it has 2 long levers, that are mounted next to the seat and go all the way to the floor of the cab!!
I see that's a 980G series I. That's called "command control" steering, it comes with "electro-hydraulic" controls (i.e has finger touch controls which are electrically operated and the electric controls the hydraulics) Standard steering wheel machines have pilot controls (hydraulic controlled levers)
For me, I would take the joystick every time. It gives you constant control over the bucket which in turn speeds up your operation. I haven't operated the newer machines with the pilot controls to compare, but we have had both twin stick machines and joystick machines over the years. The first joy stick ( perhaps I should say, single lever control) machines we had, were two Ford A64 loaders and although they were never a real popular loader, they were easy to operate and did well by us. Our Liebherr 541 loader has a joy stick with all the controls on it and it is absolutely brilliant to operate. Rn'R.
My 930G is single joystick with detent for raise, float, dump, and self level. It also has the third valve on the top right side and a shifter on the top left side. The machine also has a column shifter. I go back and forth using both, use the joystick shifter for loading, makes loading quick and efficient. Takes me less than two minutes to load a triaxle fully heaped, I love it.
i ran the Cat's with the joystick for a while and then moved into a Volvo with the 2-lever controls. The Lever controls are much easier because instead of moving your whole arm to move the joysticks you can just move your fingertips.
I guess if all else fails you could always use the shovel. Ther is no JOY in that STICK!! Sorry guys I couldnt resist!
gotta have two levers. i feel they grade and load better and they seem to be less rough on the wrist. i feel the 953 b had the best feel for grading.
It's all a matter of personal preference. I have run them all, from the 2ft. long levers, the pilot valve, eh, and single lever. I could make any of them do what I needed to. However I do prefer the 2 stick controls, maybe because that's what I started on.
The best loader i ever ran was a two stick komatsu WA500 and WA 600. The worst was a ford A 64. With a single 3 foot lever that you have to move two feet in any direction to get the bucket or booms to move.
I prefer the newer JD controls, with the shifting buttons and the single handle control.