Knew was coming and now has started here. MO Brown Shirt DOT Enforcement Group is situating prowling check points across five counties out here, stopping Ton and 3/4T Trucks with ANY form of trailer where do not have F Tags. I fully expected being stopped when hauled the derelict crawler away. Local Contractor, newer Dodge Ton dually trucks with Cummins, thought was smart only 18k license tags, Two not only overweight(By close to a Ton) but drivers had NO CDL, 30,000GVWR on Cab Tags, no DOT Numbers and NO Company name signage on truck sides. Was written up in local rag we got this morning. Both were towed.
Sounds like hunting season out here for deer except over there it’s hunting by local brown shirts hunting for drivers to ticket. Damn I love where I live... There is a reason the state is named Misery
They are doing their job, at least for what they are getting payed to do. I wish DOT would go after more of them. If they met the requirements those vehicles would have been on there way. Trying to circumvent the rules by running peanut trucks.
Would rather see these twits removed from the road than kill someone and insurance say Not Our Problem then employer calls Bankrupt and the families get squat. ules written for EVERYONE, perform By the rules and all is good, pays your money takes your chances is your own fault. Need a Truck buy a 'Truck' not a glorified SUV, need truck drivers pay for the licenses and the qualifications.
I don't know. I see the same people in four different battered mini vans a year. A common theme, three donut spares, exhaust dragging, at least one window patched with plastic & duct tape. Six runny nosed kids wrestling in the back, "Dad" & mom smoking away. Some have home made license plates, others state supplied. NONE have valid inspection stickers. I've not once seen one of them pulled over by a DOT officer. I guess safety is not a concern with them, only trucks.
They get stopped here by state patrol, county sheriff, city police. And a DOT officer at least in this state is a commercial division with a main concern of commercial vehicles. As far as people driving unsafe personal vehicles that's a concern for city, county and state law enforcement. DOT has way fewer officers than standard law enforcement has so their primary concern is commercial vehicles. As far as what dad and mom are doing when children are present is a concern for child protective services. As far as the situation the family is in that's for them to straighten out-if they can. Or they can ask for help.
Around here, drive a truck, it costs $200 to talk to a DOT officer. Drive a pickup, it doesn't matter what you tow, or on what kind of trailer, you drive on by.
That's changed out here somewhat, DOT is starting to put more emphasis on pickups, one tons and ton and a half rigs pulling 35 and 40 foot goose necks. I know most are stopped for insecure loads and it goes from there.
I asked some DOT officers why they ignored pickups and single axle trucks. They said it was too hard to keep up with what laws applied to them.
That almost sounds like it's just a little work than I want to do response.
The sad part is they try to find fault even for minor things. Years ago I got pulled over by the truck unit. I was driving a 1 ton carrying a 40HP tractor on a trailer. One guy asks for my license and registration while the other one is going over my trailer and truck with a fine toothed comb. He said your chains are all tight, tires, lights, safety chains and everything else is good. Then the first guy gives me a $150 ticket because I didn't have GVW stickers on the side of the truck. I explained that the registry where I got the plates only told me I have to register the truck and trailer together when I asked what was required. The guy guessed I was over the weight that didn't require stickers(4500kg's, just under 10,000lbs.). A couple of people said I should have fought it if they didn't actually pull out a portable scale and weigh everything. About a month later a cop actually told me for something like that they can use a little discretion and often give you 24 hours to comply with the requirement if you're otherwise safe. It ticked me off because there are guys hauling stuff around on trailers that should never be on the road yet I get a ticket because of not having some stickers on the side of the truck. It was a technicality not a safety issue. Most guys hauling skid steers with pick ups don't have any stickers and are likely over 4500kg's.
I'd bet 90% of pickups pulling trailers grossing over 4500 kg's don't have weights on them, mine doesn't and never has. It's not something DOT here ever enforces.
I don't have a problem if it's a legit ticket, but the looking for a reason for a ticket is just BS, I don't care how well the truck is looked after, if they want to give you a ticket they will find something. Every time they do a road stop blitz they come out to the news with a massive headline hundreds of unsafe trucks off the road and put out of service. What they don't say is why, a tire more then 10% under max inflation is out of service. I mean, if a tire is 89 psi instead of 90, imagine how unsafe that is? Obviously some are unsafe, I bet like 10% of the trucks they pull off the road are actually posing a safety risk. When they do them at least they catch the idiots pulling skidsteers in dump trailers not tied down, or other insane things that pickups generally get away with. Other then those times, they don't seem to bother them. Or in the winter when they sit outside the snow dump and hand out ticket for not tarping snow, even though it's basically known you don't have to tarp snow, I would get it if they just went after the really insane loads or one's they see it falling off, but when they do it, it's any load that isn't tarped gets a ticket. I wish they would go more after any unsafe load too, not just commercial. If you're pulling a rv they won't give you a second look no matter how unsafe. Driver my dad had (fired after this incident) got 3 tickets in one stop. She being the genius she was, figured the flashing lights at the scales didn't apply to her and figured she didn't need to stop in a loaded tandem dump truck. So of course they chased her down and brought her back to the scales where she got a $300ish ticket for failing to stop at scales, $500ish for having restricted plates (was just over the boundary, stupid ticket IMO should have just warned), and $300ish for unsecure load because of some dirt on side boards. Expensive day! Had 8 other trucks going that day, all of which were smart enough to stop and got waived through, a few had restricted plates also and would have been screwed, but a lot better off actually pulling into the scales......
The city truck inspectors stopped me on QE2 close to 23 ave. and that was back in the mid to late 90's. I've always heard the truck units were the worst. 10 minutes of one guy telling me I have everything safe and the other guy gives a $150 ticket because I don't have stickers on the side of the truck. Big power trip for some I suspect.
I do have 24000 lb license on my pickup GVW on it with the trailer that is doable So supposedly with any over 12000 license supposed to have name and weight on side Not done that since my Dodge in the 80s No one else here does and small business I know seldom marks any of their light trucks Been told that MO let that statute slide some years back so will eventually find out or the day will come the pickup will go away
One of the young guys we see a lot of called me one day. He was working on Martha's Vineyard MA but his boss sent him to Vermont for a load of something or other. He was driving a 3 year old truck in good condition, GVWR at 25000. No CDL required. State police stopped him, claimed that out of state trucks require CDL at lesser weight. They red flagged the truck. He had to have his mother drive 60 miles each way to transport him. His citation specified a class A CDL driver had to drive it to Mass state line. I sure doubt that sort of BS would hold up in court, or anybody could show in statute law such a law, but who can take the time for that?
The real problem is each state having/requiring a different set of rules/regulations. The lower 48 should be the same across the board. And some of those regulations when written 50 years ago need to be revised. And most DOT will cut some slack when they see a person is trying to do it right, but fresh DOT officers have a tendency of trying the new sheriff in town approach.
We have our share of Name Makers in the State Brown Shirts. They want to be something they are not or cannot achieve by applying the rules so rules get 'Adjusted'. My ex boss used the old Pete to deliver a sold trailer bobtail coming back a Washington MO Franklin COUNTY DOT pulled him over and does inspection, issues a warning for No Conspicuity tape on Rear Cab Corners as ONLY thing could respond to, I noted to that boss is NOT a requirement except for trailers and box trucks, he still put it on.
I also believe they have quotas to meet or get brownie points for more citations.
I know a area DOT officer-WSP-DOT has no quotas. There are so many violation rolling at any one time a DOT officer doesn't have to look hard to fill a ticket book. The OTR's don't normally get random pull overs unless something is obvious. OTR's cross so many port of entry scales that pull random inspections the roving DOT spend there time on the local's in their area. Now with that said some officers with the WSP will call in randomly on vehicle plate numbers. I remember years ago a impound we had to do the driver had three license's-home was S.D. That driver had 11 failures to appear. The biggest violations/most common are improper paper work, out of date or no vehicle inspection that's current on tractors/trailers. The other is the use of farm tabs hauling commercially. In my area the possibility of getting stopped just to check for off road fuel in pickups is about 8%. Dump trucks is another vehicle that DOT keeps a eye on, must have 9" free board from edge of load to top of box, and no there is no such thing as a dump truck not being responsible for broken windshields. If anything falls of a commercial vehicle it's deemed insecure load. Top rail/edge of box and tailgate must be free of loose material. Lowboys the deck must be swept clean, all load chains and hooks must be system 7.
So you're saying if a dump truck was rolling around with no tailgate, full of ledge stacking rocks in it, that would be a violation?
LOL!! Takes ALL Kinds!!!
Still has to have gate.
The load still has to be secured if there is no gate. I don't have a lot of problem with cops doing their job. The ones looking for something usually have a reason to do so. Worked for a fella years ago that ran older stuff that was immaculate in appearance and maintenance. His trucks never got pulled over unless the driver screwed up.
One item that most overlook is Keeping good records on maintenance and repairs, because DOT can show up and do a audit. Get generic work orders and a company stamp, write down all parts and labor plus keep all outside repair in same file. If for any reason the rig is involved in a accident and lawsuits start at least there are records {a paper trail of repairs this includes tires}. DOT likes to see a proper paper trail with inspection reports.
https://mobile.twitter.com/wspd3pio/status/1318567443392995339
MO Must be running a program currently. Buddy of mine has a Dodge RAM 3500 Cummins power he uses for pulling his fifth wheel trailer, Licensed RV. He lives in Holts Summit N of Jefferson City MO, took the truck and a borrowed 16' trailer to Lumber yard in Jeff City, coming home got stopped as First did not have but a single 2" strap holding his material and had shifted, then got a $85 ticket for using a RV for other than RV use(Has RV plates on Truck to escape Driver license requirements and Weight Tag expense) In MO RV is $32, 24K weight tag is $100, both plus issuing fee at offices. His truck and Trailer loaded weigh in over 25000 so would have to step UP to Commercial 26,000 plates($130) and Class A CDL which he does NOT have. IF they do not provision up prior to leaving and Drain all the tanks completely between destinations MAYBE could get under 24,000 License.
Man i would have thought the 59 would have fared better. ouch. One thing around here that drives me crazy is the HP never pulls over the guys with junk trucks, old tandems or semis with no taillights and week brakes. We try to keep our stuff up, get all the right permits, load with scales on the grain cart, than get a ticket for being over axle a few pounds while the guy with parts falling off drives by.
Well your equipment probably looks fairly nice-which to some means you got money to glean. The rag tag is more trouble than he is worth.
I am going to start hauling my scrap next week. i need to replace some marker lights on my trailer then every thing will be in good shape every thing but my nerves. The place i am going to had a place out side the gate were you could park i would get there early trying not to be seen and wait but it was beside a 2 lane highway with 80 mph traffic they thought somthing mite happen so they did away with it. Now if you get there before they open you have to drive 4 miles to turn around to come back.
Update on buddies 3500 issues. MO renews heavy truck and RV plates at end of year for the next year, the decision was made to stop using their RV tag when went to DMV as had a Note on their License by MoSHP as to improper RV license use. The GVWR on the truck is such they could get a 24000 Beyond Local license for it HOWEVER at 30K GVWR he would have to take lessons and get a Class A CDL for combination vehicle. The two of them are re-thinking the RV.
Basically quit skirting the law and just get the right paperwork and licenses. Not that hard to get CDL when you got the equipment to take it with "if" one were smart enough. Though in some states don't know if MO is one but you have to have course hours or be sponsored by a company. Supposedly they are making all states go this route by a certain date that keeps getting kicked down the road like kicking a can down the road. Covid-19 has made the waters murky on what one can do to acquire a license in some states.
At present Vermont does not require a training course to test for CDL. Here, it is written test, medical card & road test. They will throw some wrenches in the gears. I had to earn it! I believe I understand why people go crazy & shoot up DMV offices! From my perception it is like any driver's license test, except in a big truck & trailer. They DO NOT want people to think. They want people able to recite word for word what the manual says.
Ex Coworker needed a Class A for a side job(Fireworks Displays) as required HAZMAT for the Trailer(Explosives) and a larger trailer to haul a 20' Conex loaded. Eerily similar to Spuds issues. He had a neighbor willing to allow use of his equipment, took the written(TWICE) passed that took driving three times before chose to go thru a Training School outside of Rolla MO. Once thru the school and appropriate cert on paper driving test was waived. That is how MO is doing it currently and seems they are pushing for the Cert and Waiver method.
Missouri has a trucking guide which explains all this. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjABegQIARAF&usg=AOvVaw3Dt1mbD15nyvKs2IzqWJUY Where I am very unclear is where they say used in commerce. If im hauling my own stuff I dont think thats considered commerce. If im hauling for hire that certainly is. I think for commerce is wide ooen fof interpretation. If im hauling truck parts for my trucks is that in commerce? If im hauling a antique tractor and going to a farm show is that in commerce? If im hauling a 69 kenworth to build as a hobby is that in commerce? Even hauling a skid steer that i use to maintain my own properties is that in commerce? The 10,000 lbs threshold covers about all pu with a trailer!
Truck MUST be marked "NOT FOR HIRE", "PRIVATE CONVEYANCE" and be Address labeled accordingly, if hauling just for private shows and NOTHING is for resale then can use FARM Plates out to 50 miles(100 mile radius), if out beyond that then must have BL License and be carrying supporting documentation for use or machines in question. IF buying and selling machines that is considered Commerce, IF moving machines across state lines and sell any of them then are performing Interstate Commerce. IF just hauling your own machines and own materials then should not be a problem except Air Brakes and over 30,000lbs GVWR with a weight tag on machine you are now under CDL Rules.
The in commerce applies to or such as-hauling grain from field to elevator that's farm related but once the grain is mixed with other and hauled from elevator then that's commerce. If your hauling hobby stuff it's not but it still has to meet weight limits.
Well i dont buy and sell I only buy! Some how once I get it the only way it leaves is if its so worn out its just scrap! Now most of what im gona haul is gona be things like engines, trannys, cut off rears, material to build dump boxes. Again all for my own use. I guess its really open to interpitation as to what is and what is not! I hear even things like hauling horses to a show or race cars are considered in commerce as there is prize money expected! I guess also it depends on which officer you get and just how big of a dick he wants to be! I think my plan since I already have interstate authority is to just get some stick on magnets made up with all the required info. If im over the 10k theshold slap em on. Not sure how to stay where i can run a paper log since my truck us a 2005. I guess they have eld apps and may have to look into that.
It has to be permanent signage, magnetic signs are not allowed.
Interstate authority you are already registered as a Commerce Carrier.
Technically once the DOT number is on the side of any vehicle any and all rules can apply.
Really i have never heard that. I run a magnet sign on my dump truck all the time and no one says a thing.
Yes i have interstate authority as well as intrastate authority for missouri. Even if you have interstate authority and do point to point in missouri you also must have intrastate authority. I also carry the million dollar limit of liability to haul motorized equipment. Need that to haul heavy equipment!
Then you are a Commercial Commerce Registered Carrier. You have no alternative unless Relicense and drop all the authorities. AND Must label your vehicle as noted under a BL License plate. And this: https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/regulations/highlights-commercial-motor-vehicle-marking-final-rule
I have always heard you can run the nagnet sign cause when your not pulling a trailer and the vehicle is below the 10k you dont need sinage. I really dont want all that crap on my personal daily driver vehicle. I can understand if im pulling a load but thafs where magnet signs come in
Even if its my personal daily driver? Im not using my f350 for my business. Its a support vehicle for all my hobbies and properties!
And actually I am not registered as a common carrier. My business Bullfrog Site Work LLC is registered a s a common carrier. My pu truck is not registered or insured by the business so I think thats a totally different issue. Now as far as using it occasionally for the business I dont know hoe that applies. I guess if I do I wouldnt be insured correctly. Of course thats only if im pulling a motorized vehicle but hust parts and such shouldnt need such high limits of liability!
If it's used for business and above 10,000 permanent signs are required, that loop hole was closed back in the 70's. I know I worked in my dads sign shop. DOT 2.5" letters min City or Town 1.5" letters Company name 3" letters min Fire X 1" Vehicle number 3" min
Use it one day for Business and it is a Business related vehicle, there are NO temporary reliefs granted.
So basically anyone with a pu bigger than a half ton needs to have a dot number and comply with all dot comercial vehicle law? Man if thats the case there are a crap ton of illegal trucks out there!
You misinterpret to be argumentative. IF use a Personal Machine in a Business use it needs to be labeled for that business. If you use it once or everyday it was used for business and is supposed to by law be labeled. If you are using it in lieu of having a dedicated business vehicle to save an expense then again Yes it needs to be labeled. There are no rule side stepping clauses that state you can use it once and all is Okie Dokie just continue as usual. And if have not been keeping up YES there are a 'crap ton' of vehicles being used illegally and being caught out there. Do as you wish, just remember Paid Your Money Took Your Chances. Yesterday we rode bikes for a charity event, there were SEVEN pickups with gooseneck trailers had Cardboard signage taped to the trucks sides pulled over North of New Florence MO. Hot Shotters that were not labeled and thought by adding the carboard signs were adequate, they were being fined on a Sunday by Brownshirt MoDOT after being stopped and held for them by MoSHP. They were pulled over where we could here the argument as rode by directed by another MoSHP. Guy was from Linn MO and "I have never needed signs before, these are signs" pointing to the cardboard.
I have a friend and collegue set up a closed trailer a few years back to use as a mobile shop behind his service truck. It's a big service truck and the trailer is pretty heavy but I don't know the total weight. He drove it around Washington State for awhile and no one ever blinked about it. The weight stickers were on the truck, proper signage and all that. He had to travel to Oregon for a job where he promptly got pulled over and checked out. The only thing they got him for was that he had a Class B license. He called me up and told me the story and asked if I knew how all that worked. I told him this was the first I had heard about it. I asked him if he had asked the officers to provide the legal parameters in some type of official writing? He said they had it all on paper in a book with markers so they could pull it up nearly instantly, of which they proceeded to do. He had to turn around and take the trailer back home and go back to the job which cost him about a day in unpaid time. The moral of my story is that just because we didn't know about the laws and regulations, didn't mean they didn't exist. My friend having been using his trailer for some time in Washington State, and no one ever brought up the issue which just meant he was operating in a fools paradise.
They are no longer allowing ignorance of the law to limit controls.
Cross the scales at Cascade Locks or Woodburn and you will start a new life. Can't pull a 42' and 20' A Train in Oregon has to be a 40' and 20'. Tongue is to short on turntable/dolly to make bridge. 42' is legal in Washington. Rain skirt is required on three axle trailers in Oregon, two axle doesn't require it. Washington State is now cracking down on pickup-trailer combinations, anything under 32,000 is suspect.
I'm an electrician in VT. For a while, I worked in Mass. on occasion. The states have reciprocal licensing agreement, but don't imagine a VT electrician will be welcome in Mass. I endured several threats from inspectors, this after 9 months of effort trying to secure a license in Mass. They played every trick in the book to avoid issuing a license.
We do not have so much issue here, do have issues with IL idiots driving machines that should have been junked long ago still cruising down interstate. Get tickets like confetti. They have really poor truck inspection requirements that few observe on the lighter stuff. We see the garbage in the RV campground here at City Park. Somehow a moron got as far as the MO River Bridge before caught. HALF Ton pickup, 28' RV Trailer, 18' boat on trailer behind that. MoDOT abused him to no limits. Over Gross, Overweight for License, Multiple Trailers and IMPROPER drivers License(only thing registered RV, the camping trailer), Pickup had a weight tag and boat trailer just a Trailer Tag. Trailer is still at local body shop impound, Boat trailer left with the pickup. NONE of the tail or stop lamps worked on any of them until repaired to go home.
If you want to see scary spend sometime at the station i work by. If it moves its road worthy,if it has brakes it dosent need tied down, if it need tied down 1 small strap is almost over kill. I spotted a skidsteer that was chained down front and back i almost offered to buy the driver dinner. If i bought every one dimmer that had their loads secured i would be very lonely.
For years around here farmers would haul 300 gallon totes of chemicals without restraints, about ten years ago WSP cracked down on that, Now there all restrained.
Have an idiot down around Jackson that I’ve seen a few times that runs around with a mini ex just sitting on the trailer no chains one of these days I’ll get a picture if I’m ever not driving and see it
Weigh Stations (Enforcement Facilities) Weigh Stations (Enforcement Facilities) Weigh Station Location List (PDF) Weigh Station Location Map (PDF) Mini-Site Weigh Station Location List (PDF) Who Must Stop at Scales? California's "Commercial Vehicle Enforcement Facilities" are commonly called weigh stations or truck scales. These facilities are operated by the California Highway Patrol (CHP), not by Caltrans. However, Caltrans receives many inquiries about weigh stations. This page is designed to answer some of those questions. The links provide access to the on-line California Vehicle Code (CVC). CVC Section 2813 outlines who must stop at weigh stations and inspection stations: 2813. Every driver of a commercial vehicle shall stop and submit the vehicle to an inspection of the size, weight, equipment, and smoke emissions of the vehicle at any location where members of the California Highway Patrol are conducting tests and inspections of commercial vehicles and when signs are displayed requiring the stop. Every driver who fails or refuses to stop and submit the vehicle to an inspection when signs are displayed requiring that stop is guilty of a misdemeanor. CVC Section 260 defines "commercial vehicle" (bolding added): 260. (a) A "commercial vehicle" is a motor vehicle of a type required to be registered under this code used or maintained for the transportation of persons for hire, compensation, or profit or designed, used, or maintained primarily for the transportation of property. (b) Passenger vehicles which are not used for the transportation of persons for hire, compensation, or profit and housecars are not commercial vehicles. ... (c) Any vanpool vehicle is not a commercial vehicle. (d) ... CVC Section 410 defines a "motor truck" (bolding added): 410. A "motor truck" or "motortruck" is a motor vehicle designed, used, or maintained primarily for the transportation of property. CVC Section 471 defines "pickup truck" (bolding added): 471. A "pickup truck" is a motor truck with a manufacturer's gross vehicle weight rating of less than 11,500 pounds, an unladen weight of less than 8,001 pounds, and which is equipped with an open box-type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length. "Pickup truck" does not include a motor vehicle otherwise meeting the above definition, that is equipped with a bed-mounted storage compartment unit commonly called a "utility body." Do these vehicles have to stop at the scales? PICKUP -- It depends on the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), unladen weight, and bed of the truck. GVWR under 11,500 pounds, unladen weight of less than 8,001 pounds, and open box-type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length -- NO. GVWR 11,500 pounds or more, unladen weight 8,001 pounds or more, or not equipped with an open box-type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length -- YES. California rules for pickups.
So Super Duties and Dodge RAM 3500s are required as are 14000+ GVWR, Ton and half service trucks are a mandatory. So any light truck over half ton with a weight tag is required to stop at scales in Peoples Republic of California.
Correct, I think all 48 should be the same. I just had to post that Cal Trans info-it will cause some step'in and fetch'in.
Washington rules page 4-30. https://www.wsdot.wa.gov/publications/manuals/fulltext/M30-39/CVG.pdf
Oversize, overweight, and most of the bales just riding along. No troubles here, we're farming.......
Yes indeedy Do. Over width what's that? I can almost see that traffic behind me. Good catch C.O.
The guy ahead of him had a oversize sign on the front bumper- that's enough, then everyone knows they are coming I mean, who can afford two signs and flags?
At least the lead truck has a strap on each row of bales......
Not overweight, heavy bales go 1000 lbs, most are actually 7-800 if you weigh them. So, 35000 on the 5-axle, 15000 on 4-axle. I put 46 bales on my flatbed, legal with my single axle tractor.
I was guessing on weight as I drove past, it looked heavy on the single axle drive of the tractor, but it may just have been how it was loaded.
While y'all are writing those tickets on the security of the load and over sized without signs might add in improper lighting on the rear of the lead truck. Wonder if the following vehicle has trailer brakes...
Actually-really who give's a **** it's do what you want anytime anywhere isn't it?
Big rounds in MO 5x6 go close to a ton EACH 34 ton front trailer minimum 14-15t rear unit
Hay that green is still high moisture My Allis is rated to lift a ton with the old loader Lifted trans for Fat Allis grudgingly but struggles to fails many times lifting a tight 5x6 where have to use three point spear
Not sure about your hay weights. We make hay around 20% moisture, 4x5 net wrapped. We consistently run 1000 pound average, and if we bale it tougher, they just get heavier. All of our hay gets plastic wrapped so moisture content doesn't matter as much. They just ferment once the oxygen gets consumed from inside the tube.
Renters run a 5x6 Baler, bales come out tighter than Dick's hatband, they stated closer to 1800 lbs. when fresh rolled than not Do not like to waste Wrap making more bales that do not weather well.
We run our baler the same way; as tightly packed as we can get it. Dense bales means less bales to handle, truck, wrap, etc. Just more weight on a truck when hauling them in.
Most of my experience weighing bales is Coastal Bermuda and Bahia grass. My biggest customer and best friend owns a feed store and mill and farms about 350 acres of horse quality hay. In addition to what he grows, he usually buys about 10-12,000 bales a year. A lot of bales (not all, just a sample) get put on his scales in the course of a year. You will note though, you and I both said 1000 lbs, and that is what I used for my calculations. I wonder how much less a bale weighs after being in the barn for 6 months?
Considerable less, it is sitting outdoors, fully wrapped drawing moisture and fermenting they gain weight. Uglier part of bigger rounds is the mold, many will be black at center where the cows eat around it, horses will sicken from it.
When I was in my teens I had a friend much older than me, left US Forest Service career to dairy farm in Wisconsin. He was obsessed with protein levels of hay. Found that best availability, and price of top quality hay was in Canada. By 1976 he had bought three cab over IH road tractors & trailers, hired two drivers, and a herdsman. He turned his focus to importing hay. Offered me a job, but at the time CDL required you to be over 21. He talked at length about how much protein was lost if hay gets rained on before it is baled. These were dry, rectangular bales, hauled under tarp, and kept under roof. As round bales took over, I wondered what the different handling practices did to the quality of the hay.
There is top notch hay made in all shapes and sizes these days all over the country, and mediocre/junk hay made right beside it. Biggest factor is cutting at the right stage of growth, and getting it put up and stored properly as soon as possible.
Most of whats baled here is hard to get a stabber in to and they unroll it so the cows can eat it other wise its hard to pull any off the bale.
Watched a Great Brome patch get left get seedy and was pollenating as they cut it, looked like a dust bowl or forest fire, was more stem than grass with much of the nutrient lost. Our brome field gets cut Just Once a season, resumes growth at a nominal rate where they allow the critters to munch upon it as a graze fodder the second go round, then it winters pretty well.
That's one thing about the hobby horse market, everything is baled only in dry weather and put under a shed the same day. The customers would be in hysterics at one handful of mold. Anything not perfect is sold to the cow hobbyists. My sister owns an 85 stall, high-end show horse operation. All the hay she uses is premium alfalfa, trucked in from a producer in the midwest.
Horse folks here pay premium dollar for Brome square bales
The bale shape wasn't a concern. I see hay being baled 4 hours after being cut, then laying on the ground days until they find time to wrap it. The majority lays in the field until it is needed for feed. Here, I suspect the change in what animal eats it explains. This state was once a dairy farm state. The Federal "Whole Herd Buyout" in 1985 signaled the beginning of the end of Vermont dairy farms. These days it's beef or horses eating hay. Dairy cattle need protein for milk production. Beef, you want them to eat more hay to grow faster.
Icicle River. https://komonews.com/news/local/semi-crashes-into-river-along-us-2-near-leavenworth
Always some jamoke trying to be Speedy Gonzales at the wrong time.
I gotta disagree with that. The biggest factor in making good hay is the weather. What are you going to do when the alfalfa will be ready to cut in two days, and the weatherman says we have 5 days of rain coming? Can't put it up until you get it knocked down. The best alfalfa is grown in the desert under irrigation. As for losses, again depends on the weather (location). Low rainfall, you can store twine big rounds outside for a year and only lose 5-10% dry matter. East of the Mississippi river, same bale may lose over 30% dry matter. Weight depends on the type of hay, baler, operator, and weather. Alfalfa big rounds with a newer baler can top 2500#, while the same baler may only make 900# wheat straw bales. Brome or prairie hay would be in the 1400# range with the same baler.
I agree, weather is the key to all successful crop production. I don't think my statement is wrong. If you dont harvest at the appropriate stage of growth, you'll never make quality hay, whether it be grass or alfalfa variety. Sometimes it doesn't get cut at the right stage due to weather, other times it's negligence on the farmer. If the farmer doesn't cut when they need to, weather permitting or not, they'll never make quality hay.