howcome i hear nothing about the kubota wheeled skid steers? why do they not make a regular door on the cab an option. seems like they are weeding out all the people like me who do not care for the roll up door. the old john deere roll up door was not exactly a hit. the only reason i would consider a kubota is because there is a small chance they will offer me pilot controls still. i still have major problems with electric controls and with people who claim they are anywhere close to manual controls as far as productivity. i been running them for 2500 hours now and they work fine in ideal conditions, and i say I operate in ideal conditions... pretty much never. if i was getting paid by the hour to drive a skid steer, i would love the electric controls. how come none of the case people seem to be outraged that their sweet servo controls do not exist anymore? it seems to me the case servo controls were the way to go, even though i never operated them much. im not impressed with the longevity of the 10 inch michelin radial skid steer tires. got 1000 hours on them and there is serious wear on the outside part of the tread. they might make it another 400 hours. i hear the 12 inch ones last longer. we bought the bobcat s570 standard machine to supplement the jcb. bobcat makes a bad a** ride that can get stuff done fast. when we look to trade the jcb i might consider another jcb depending on what their new design looks like; but unless i feel it is irresistible (and it very well might be) we will probably get another bobcat.
The CASE servo were good, you still can get manual controls in the wheeled machines. I am almost certain that they are servo. I have run them and thought they felt similar to the servo machines of the XT and 400 series. I think the 12" are superior in everyway to the 10"s. Only if you need the smaller tire to stay narrow, would that be an option.
i was just reading the case literature, and it does seem like they are offering servo controls as an option, in addition to mechanical controls or electric controls. i feel like this is a new development because only 1 place on the internet in a rogue piece of literature did i find the word servo mentioned. that puts case on my radar, but i don't know if i would be able to stand learning yet another skid steer pattern. if I'm not happy with electric, and I'm not happy with mechanical, would i be happy with servo? but i don't know if i would be able to stand driving around in a case machine, are they planning a redesign any time soon? are the new ones quiet? I'm also concerned they are not offering these controls on the s590 competitor. are there any other manufacturers offering servo controls? assuming the sweet t bar units are still servo, what about gehls H pattern?
The overall nicest controls I've used on a skid steer are the Cat hydraulic/hydraulic "pilot" controls. On the other extreme, the stick & pedal controls on my old Bobcat were pretty responsive too. Some other stuff in between that I've tried is a little squishy in my opinion. Kind of Poed at Cat right now though,(see "another Perkins Pukes" thread), although until it died it was one of the most reliable machines I have ever owned. I have a new Ditch Witch SK850 mini track loader getting delivered later this week. Was going to get something lighter for small yards anyway, the blown 226 motor made it so I could not wait until spring. One of its first jobs will be to pull the motor from the Cat.
i have only put 5 hours on a pilot controlled machine. I'm guessing i might be able to live with pilot controls, but i am still confident they wouldn't be as effective as the bobcat controls, but all the timing for everything is problematic for me. of all the times to switch to sweet case servo controls this seems to be the worst. here is my other question. why do they not put fore/aft/lateral isolators on the seat suspension in skid steers. the most perfect application i can think of for them. also, how come none of the new farm tractors come with lateral seat isolators (just fore aft). except for deere. all my tractors always had lateral isolators on the seats years ago and now the 2 new ones don't and i can't hardly stand to drive them. i am probably going to purchase lateral isolators and install them on the new tractors but i see the seat will dig a hole in the upholstery of the cab; a small price to pay i figure. my favorite is back in the 90s when they first were figuring out seat isolation they had fore aft only on 2wd tractors and lateral only on mfd, which i find to be funny.
Not all pilot controls are equal. The Cat ones are the same they use on larger machines. A salesman I spoke with recently claimed their brand of machine had pilot control, but it seemed like electrical servo to me. I like the Bobcats too, but a smashed toe, sore ankle, ice under the pedals can be a pain . Always two hands busy while driving, how are you going to drink your beer? (;
so disappointingly, i was just at the case dealer and realized case does not offer the old school sweet servo controls like i thought they did. of corse the salesman said they were servo controls just like the old ones, but I'm afraid they are exactly what the bobcat has... and that is definitely not what the old cases had. again, i do not understand how case people are not in an uproar because their sweet control system is gone. whatever they have now is clearly the same as what the classic 1845 had. i put 30 hours on the sv185 "servo" machine and it was not good. i drove around my buddies 200 "servo" machine and it felt exactly like the 185. maybe I'm missing something somewhere but i don't think so.
I have the most experience with bobcat hand/foot controls. Ran these for years. The most responsive IMHO. Currently I have a Cat 242d (electric over hydraulic). The past couple days it's been around 5 degrees outside. When I start the machine in the shop it's fine. When it's been sitting outside for a few hours, the hydraulics are horrible. Slow response and then jerky. I recently bought a Bobcat T590 and went with the hand/foot controls. I am glad that I did. I had a demo on a JCB skid steer and was not impressed. Up until the cold weather I preferred the Cat over JCB for sure. Bobcat SJC controls were really decent as well. They are much improved from years ago if you haven't tried them lately. On another note regarding true pilot controls. One of my John Deere 27d mini excavators was returned on Monday after being left outside around 5 degrees. The pilot controls suck in the extreme cold also. Slow response and jerky.
what did you not like about the jcb? what model did you try? the jcb is not terrible in the cold on startup. generally i try to do my less precise work in the first 10 minutes while the machine is warming up then its normal after that. does the cat become normal after 10 minutes? yes i have not driven a bobcat with sjc lately, but its true they have been doing eh forever now. ic case has some kinda false detent they worked into their joysticks to mimic "feel" sounds like kinda a gimmick to me.
I'll take the controls of my Case 75xt over any other machine I've been in. My Volvo with the pilot controls is nice and smooth also but a little sluggish when cold. Steve
The JCB was a 175, I believe. I tried the machine in ISO and H patterns. I tried all three of the operator modes for response. It was slow to respond and jerky when it did. We run a small rental yard and I rented the machine a couple times. One was an experienced operator, he was used to running the H pattern. When he came back, he said he ran it in ISO (b/c their H pattern sucked) and had to stay a foot away from the walls while grading gravel b/c it was too jerky. He said he would not rent it again. The Cat 242d is a friend's lease machine that we are renting out for him, testing the waters with Cat machines. Today, I parked the Cat out front again 20 degrees. After fours hours, I went out to try the controls again in the cold. It was difficult to start, no glow plug indicator. It was the same slow response when driving. I did notice the bucket and boom were not really affected. I think the driving is different in the fact that the machine is trying to feather the pumps to make a gradual turn. I would lean the lever all the way to get the response and then it jerked that direction. Straight forward or reserve was not an issue. I ran it around the building a few times and it started to warm up and the steering response improved. I believe it would take 15-20 minutes or more to get the usual steering feel. The hydraulic fluid is no doubt very cold. It should warm up with the engine warming up. I have not driven the Bobcat SJC in the cold. I was very close to buying one with the SJC when I test drove them at the local dealer. The Bobcat T590 we just bought in December was the last one the dealer had with a Kubota diesel and enclosed cab, it had the hand/foot controls. I am really concerned about the new Doosan/Bobcat diesel engines. I have heard they are hard to start in the cold and very finicky with fuel. Couple other threads on this forum and others.
The control on my Volvo are silky smooth at any engine speed, smoother than my brothers 277 CAT which are too bad either just a little touchy side to side.
i know whats going on here they guy who likes the volvo has pilot, and the guy who doesn't has electric. I'm guessing the 175 had jcbs second attempt at eh programming. that attempt was laughable. not even worth having. they are on their 3rd attempt now and seem proud of it; I'm considering updating my machine but i am scared i will not like the update. and I'm sure it would not be easily reversed at this point. 1st attempt is what i have. it would be ok for a beginner running a tracked machine. but unsatisfactorily slow at maneuvering for a pro, like myself... but its true i don't think getting the H pattern perfected is too much of a priority for them.
When I bought my Volvo the first thing I did was drive it and check out the control, any jerkiness it would have stayed there. My Case I just got lucky as it was my first skid loader.
In very cold temps, my Cat takes 10 minuets or so to warm up the hydraulics. They even sent out a bulletin a few years after I bought the machine warning that steering would be sluggish until hydraulics warmed up. Cold starting the engine was never a problem, but I usually plug in the block heaters on my diesels if it gets too much below 20*F. My old Bobcats (732, 743) hydraulics were fully responsive in the cold. But it is better for the machine to warm up the pumps before they are put to hard work.
True pilots are nicest IMO. If all you have us EH though, you kind of get used to it. I don't run our pilot machines much so when I do, they're actually too responsive since I'm used to the dead feeling of EH. I wouldn't trade the nice features of the EH machine though just for pilots. Some forms of electronic controls can be much nicer, like throttles. Love the electronic throttles, no more sticking pedals that won't go to full throttle or come back to idle. The 10" Bibsteels only made it 1200ish hrs on ours, I wasn't impressed and put 12" on that machine. Those have about 1200 on them now and plenty left.
You really need to check out the pilot controls on the Mustangs. Every Cat guy that I know that has tried them likes them better.
are you speaking of the takeuchi mustangs or the new mustangs. i test drove a bobcat s650 yesterday with sjc. it seemed they were better than jcb controls, but i still didn't feel they would be anywhere near as productive as manual. the not being able to get any gas in the cold would be a real inconvenience. i complained instantly at the slow speed in low range, and the salesman proceeded to show me the specs are the same on both machines, so i "clearly must be mistaken." I'm guessing the 650 would take at least double the fuel the jcb does mainly because you have to run it wide open to get anything done. i would consider a cat, but by the time i get to the local dealer it would be 1.5 hrs one way so. i just noticed cat released a s185 competitor, which seems quite a bit smaller than a s570 these days. i saw some rogue new style john deere skid steers on a truck yesterday, seems they finally got rid of the new holland boom design and installed a copy of bobcats design; which is superior anyways. i see the local dealer is trying to get 50k out of a new 65 wheeled kubota hand foot machine; i thought that was hilarious. how many dollars an hour do you try to trade the cats for on your 2 year trade plan. the dealer said $10 bucks an hour is good. so that means it woulda cost $110k to run my s185 11k hours back in the day. i think i got it done quite a bit cheaper than that. where do you get the retread done on the bib steels.
Usually when I start equipment when its cold out I let it sit and idle for 5 to 10 minutes so the machine can warm up, don't really have any issues with the controls then. I have yet to run a machine that had smooth controls right after being started in 15* weather. Oil is too cold yet.
I've ran some older Gehl/Mustang with pilots, I guess as haven't really found a true pilot machine that I don't like. EH on the other hand is a different story. Cat did bring back the 232D to compete with the S185/S570. Cost per hour on ours has been lower than 10, that's trading between 2-3k. Obviously running to 11k your depreciation cost/hr is much lower and maintenance/hr is higher. The G series Deere booms certainly are different looking. I have Bauer Built do the retreads.
Rogue John Deere Skid Steers
My First thought was "WOW" …. Copy Cat of Bcat !!! ….. But then me is thinking ??? …. LOL …. Why Not !!! …. Bobcat was the First and Everybody Follows ….. Look at Skidoo they were the First TOO …. right up to in recent years Skidoo came up with the Rider forward position and EVERYBODY Copied and followed Suit !!! The New JD Skids Copied a Great Idea !!! ….. "Why Not !!! " … if it works Great … Don't Fix What's Not Broke !!!…… JMHO ….
That 317G looks like a T-190
Yep, Bobcat was first by six months, Owatonna "Mustang" was next, to all the engineers out there, sometimes being first is better than being the best... Mustang WAS the FIRST Hydrostatic though...
Just found these videos on the new John Deere skid steers. I saw them earlier this week in person at the rental show in Atlanta. Hope to demo one soon. http://youtu.be/n7gOzXCU3ck http://youtu.be/bI0LpbiO6_g
Found another video. http://youtu.be/DwoRfG3Nh5Y
Finally found one of the Deere skid steers on a dealer's lot. It was the 318G. Vertical lift Bobcat S185 copy. Hand and foot controls. The Yamar diesel started and ran great, no DEF but does have DPF with regen. Easy to see out the rear window. Side visibility is similar to the Bobcat. Low entry and exit. Great visibility of bucket edge. Downfalls. The machine was very bouncy. Of course, I was driving on blacktop. The hydraulics shuddered when I was lowering the arms and driving around. This is the same problem that Kubota told me that they had to correct before they released their wheel skid steer. The main reason that I was looking at these machines was to add to the rental fleet. John Deere gave me very aggressive pricing at the American Rental Assoc. Show in Atlanta earlier this week. The dealer didn't act like he was willing to honor the pricing. Most likely I will be buying another Bobcat skid steer. Now I just have to figure out if I should pay extra for SJC (joystick controls).
so everyone on the forums may be impressed to learn that after 2500 hours we traded the jcb 205 on a new bobcat s595. im pretty much a bobcat guy now, bobcat makes a hell of a machine. although it may be interesting to see how the thing runs in the cold i hear. it turns out there is more to a skid steer than one might think. the jcb was actually a nice ride as long as you had plenty of room to maneuver, which is...never. it quickly would lose its composure in tight spaces. i figure this was from a combination of joystick programing, wheelbase, track width, weight distribution, (flat footedness), and the single arm. it had an uncanny ability to bounce when turning which really gets old. this was really my only problem with the machine. the new bobcat has joysticks, so i will know much more about weather we made the right move in a few weeks. also i will never own a skid steer again that does not have the hydraulic cushioning on the bucket tilt cylinder. as far as i know this has been a bobcat exclusive for 20 years or so. it really makes the whole machine operate much more smoothly. i do not know if cat has this rigged electrically but they might now. this is a huge deal that nobody seems to care about.
I have confirmed that Case does indeed offer the same M46 sunstrand with the same servo controls. It is a base model economy package, maybe your dealer didn't WANT to sell you one.
why would they offer their best control system in an economy machine? so after a few hours in the bobcat i have things to say. i am happy with the mechanical part of the machine, i was surprised the boom has mechanical "snubbing" on it. the software on the joysticks seems to be about as good as they might be able to get. what i am not happy about is joystick placement and joystick effort. it takes way too much effort to run the joysticks. the jcb joysticks were effortless, and that is the way it should be. i don't know what is worse running the high effort joystick or running mechanical controls. also, the joystick placement is bogus. sure they slide forward and backward; but all that really does is stop the lap bar from interfering with them. the relationship between my hand, the joystick, the base of the joystick, my elbow, and forearm is all off. jcb had the ergonomics figured out, that machine fit me like a glove. it was setup just like an excavator. in the bobcat i pretty much have to run the joystick without an armrest, and that is not the way it should be. i looked to see if there was anyway to adjust the joysticks further and everything pretty much seems to be all welded solid. if i slide the seat forward quite a bit things get only a little better, but i am not willing to give up the legroom. maybe i shoulda looked at a cat, but they do not have the v shaped belly pan, and they are harder to get in and out of.
Did you get any demos on any of the machines you were looking at? It seems like that would have brought up any issue with heavy/poorly placed controls, no?
it seems that all the local dealers are reluctant to give real demos. sure i drive them around the dealership lot but you really don't know anything about the machine until you get it in the barn on the farm. i have noticed many things you don't really notice in a small demo on the dealer lot. and at that time shortcomings are often easy to overlook. not to mention local dealers do not have joystick machines on the lot. i did notice the joysticks worked hard before purchasing, but i thought it would be something easily gotten used to. but after running for a few hours i quickly realized they work much harder than i thought. another thing i am annoyed by is the tendency for the seat and the controls to rock side to side constantly while driving. i thought i would like the joysticks mounted to the seat because it seems like a good idea, but i am unimpressed with the setup so far. if a guy could put the jcb cab on a bobcat they would have something.
Go demo a Cat, the joystick placement is nice unless you're very large. IIRC, bobcats lap bar doesn't move with the seat, which would get annoying. There's a number of dealers that will do on farm demos around here, just not the big BC one.
at first i was going to give bobcat the benefit of the doubt and assume maybe jcb had it wrong. but that is clearly not the case. the bobcat joystick setup is unacceptable. the arm rests are way out in lala land so all they do is dig into the side of your arm while your driving. if i had a grinder and a welder i could probably get it rigged up to an acceptable level. the first thing i would do is cut the lap bar out because it simply does not work out as it is. then i would move the arm rests to where that was located, which is where they should be. then i would raise up the arm rests a little if still needed; and cut off the joysticks from the arm rests and weld them where they should be, which is almost directly in front of the arm rests. currently, the joysticks are mounted inward an excessive amount so they don't even line up with the armrest. no wonder nobody buys bobcats with joysticks! I'm sure bobcat would tell me that i am the one who is screwed up, but i am afraid not. if i was 6'3" and 350 pounds the arm rests would probably be in the right spot, but then i wouldn't be able to get the lap bar around me, nor would my legs fit in the cab because they would hit those giant plastic pieces they put in the cab corners, which was also a bad idea. i also can't get over the excessive joystick effort, what is the purpose of that? maybe if i grabbed onto it like a man like i do my manual controls and moved them that way that is what they are thinking. but the key to a joystick is the arm rest. once your arm is planted, you feather the light joystick. i looked at a kubota and they have the convenient light feel on the joystick just like the jcb did. if i recall the cat seems to take too much effort too. so now i find myself grabbing the top of the joystick to try to get more leverage for moving it. so then my elbow digs into the hard plastic armrest. i am fairly impressed with everything about the new bobcat, but these ergonomics are really a big problem. I'm guessing i would like the cat ergonomics, but I'm guessing i wouldn't be overly impressed with the machine so...
Why won't they let you demo the machines? I demo'd a bobcat and the Cat on the same day. Neither even really knew who i was, I never signed anything nor did they ask for ID. The Cat was brand new with less than 5 hours, the Bobcat dealer didn't have the machine i wanted to demo on the lot so they went and rented one from a rental yard and delivered it to me. How can they expect someone to by a 50K dollar peice of equipment without a good testdrive...
The Cat dealer sent me a credit app and had a machine dropped off at the shop. Bobcat guy met me at the dealership on a Sunday to test drive machines. But maybe it's a little different since they know I have a small rental store. Cat salesman didn't come out after they dropped it, he just tried to sell it over the phone. I really wanted to like the Cat 239 track loader. But in the end, I bought a Bobcat T590 with the last Kubota engine available. Bobcat track loader has hand/foot controls. I tried to wait until John Deere had a 316 GR they could demo, but I went ahead and bought another Bobcat. Bobcat S550 (hand/foot controls) should be delivered next week. Bobcat gave me a rental/demo until that one arrives. Putting free hours on their machine instead if mine. Still have the Cat 242d on lease. Run it around the lot a couple times a day. I really want to like the Joysticks, but think the hand/ foot controls are just fine for rental and my personal use if needed. I test drove Bobcats with joysticks and thought they were smooth and didn't notice the shortcomings, but that was a few minutes on the dealers lot. Maybe call the Bobcat dealer and see if you can get hand/foot controls machine. They cost less so maybe you won't take a beating on trade-in. Just a thought if you hate the joysticks.
I drove a almost new T190 for quite a while and I'll second it, I don't know what Bobcat is thinking on their hand controls, WAY to stiff and way too much travel. Getting back in my Case 75xt was like getting in a Cadillac compared to that 190T.
my biggest problem with cat is historically they have always been WAY longer than a bobcat. you could almost always jump a full frame size in a bobcat for length of a cat. i see the new 232d tries to compete with the s185, but the bobcat 500s are quite a bit longer than that now. so now i am looking for a cat to compete with a s595 and they don't have one. the 242d is what would compete, but that is 5 inches longer than the 595, so i could jump a full frame size to a 650 in a bobcat and still be shorter than a 242. the 232 is also only 59 inches wide. its really a small machine. maybe cat is figuring on picking up bobcats business where an s185 is the biggest size they can go.
so i tore apart the armrests in the bobcat to see if there was anything i could do to modify the setup more to my liking, but they have everything pretty much permanent. there is no way to force the setup to adjust in a different way short of a grinder and a welder. i might zip strip some thick pillows to the arm rests to get them to be more tolerable. if i tip up the cab and put some washers in various places i might be able to get the lap bar in a more desirable position so it doesn't interfere with my joysticks so much. dam JCB had the sweetest cab there is and i wasn't even aware of it. sitting in the comfort was almost worth putting up with the shortcomings of the machine.
I will try to get some side by side pics of the Cat 242D and the Bobcat S590 we have on demo. I agree with Dave that the Cat machines are way oversized. I also hate ISO controls after running them spreading gravel. It's funny b/c I tried to get the Bobcat T590 track loader and Bobcat S550 we just bought with Joysticks. The Bobcat salesman talked me into standard hand/foot Bobcat controls. I am going to buy him a case of beer or a bootle of Jack or something. Won't be buying another Cat anytime soon. Guess you can't teach an old dog new tricks.
Not the best picture, but I hope you can see the Mustang control towers adjust fore and aft, AS WELL - the armrests can be adjusted fore and aft independently of the control towers. VERY comfortable!
Here's some pics of the Cat 242D next to a Bobcat S550, same size, different arms than the S595 that you have Dave. They are really close in length. Pics are deceiving. The Bobcat 500 series is defintely longer than than 700 (S185 etc) that they replaced. Will post up some pics of the Deere 312GR when it comes in. I ordered one. Hate the Cat, so adding the Deere. Hopefully Deere has done their homework. Deere has a four models of skid steer in this frame size. 312GR is the lowest hp radial lift.
Better pics of the length. Buckets are even.
I would call that 6's.
so i test drove a 242d today. the final analysis is i wish i woulda kept the jcb 205 for 2-3 more years, and then reevaluated my options. the cab on the jcb is sweet. the cat cab is better than bobcat, but not quite as sweet as the jcb; although the seat was better. i would call the 242 half way between a 595 and a 650. it is physically a bigger machine than our bobcat; not much, but an extra inch or 2 in length would make it too long for us. i measure from the front of the front tire to the back of the machine. we used to run a 642 bobcat back in the day which was probably the ideal size for our setup, but we have gradually been getting an inch or 2 longer here and there somewhere you reach a length that is too long. the cat has a sweet seat, pretty sweet cab, good visibility to the front and sides. i didn't notice where the joysticks bounced side to side like they do on the bobcat. i didn't like the narrowness to the cab for legs and feet, intrusive foot throttle, poor rear visibility. i would prefer the joysticks closer to me than adjustment would allow. the joysticks were pretty low effort, but throw i thought was a bit too much. i prefer the joysticks in the kubota and the jcb as far as throw and effort. the cat eh software is better than jcb, but not as good as the latest bobcat software in my opinion. i didn't like the lack of bucket cylinder cushioning. i thought the ride control setup was acceptable, although i would still prefer a button on the joystick for that. i tell you if kubota makes their cab quiet when they offer joysticks, they might have quite a machine. i found the cat to be an acceptable machine overall. check out the design of this armrest, seat, joystick configuration in the jcb. this is the way it should be, it was perfect. http://static1.squarespace.com/stat...steer_interior_09_01_10_96924_hero_no_cup.jpg
John Deere 312GR Some pics of the new Deere 312GR delivered today. Will post some thoughts and observations later.
And here I thought Cat's machines had a longer frame....
i always measure from the front of the front tire to the back of the machine when i measure a machine with a tape. that gives me the most useful information i find for frame size. if you look at that in the photo, the deere is significantly shorter. i have never understood specs including a bucket because there are so many unknowns in that measurement. but deere has never had an exceptionally short machine either. if you look at published specs on machines, cat is always way longer; can someone explain to me why that is? says here bobcat s650 is 108.4 inches, and cat 262d is 117.9. that is a massive difference. i see the case 445 is 104 inches, the new cases are outrageously long. kubota claims 106 on ssv75.
Posted the pics but didn't have time to post any observations. So the ground clearance is about the same around 8 in. The Cat is 61 inches at the engine door. The Deere is 48 inches. Measured the distance at which you can see and object on the ground. Cat is 26 ft. Deere is 8 ft. Visibility is much better out the front and sides on the Deere. I realize that these are definitely different class machines. The bucket is much longer on the Deere which makes it the same length bucket to rear. I will try it with different buckets and it should be a few inches shorter. This is the new small frame Deere skid steer series. Designed for the rental and farm markets. The 312GR (50hp) and the 316GR (61hp) are radial lift machines. The 314G (50hp) and the 318G (61hp) are vertical lift machines. They are all on the same basic platform. They went away from the new holland style loader arms and more towards bobcat. They are basic machines. The 312 & 314 are available as h/f and h pattern mechanical controls. The 316 & 318 have the available E-H with a switch from ISO to h pattern. Again these are basic machines, not Cadillacs. The 312 GR we have is similar to a new holland lx565 I had years ago (except for the arms). Pumps whine at low rpms. Auxiliary hydraulics are mechanical, leaning the right lever. Engine is a turbo charged Yanmar Diesel. DPF but no DEF. starts much easier than the Bobcat/Doosan engine. Engine oil filter is relocated to the back. Fuel filter and water separator are at the back. Hydro filter is accessible easily with the cab up. Cab flips up like bobcat. Foot well clean outs removable like bobcat. Overall it's $5k less than the Bobcat S550 (61hp) we bought a few weeks ago. We will rent it for the same amount and see how it goes.
Looks like the JD has a longer bucket by about 6" in that lineup.
More pics of the Deere 312GR. Looks like it should be easy to work on. Oil filter, fuel filter and water separator at the back. Oil cooler swings out to clean radiator.