I had a membership here and somehow forgot my password then locked myself out. So this is a new account. I'm buying land for a new shop and eventually a new house and we have lots of skidsteers and material handling equipment, but don't do much on the excavation side. I'm going to need to get an excavator to park on there for use on whatever projects pop up, the first one being clearing several acres of young trees. Originally my plan was get just get the biggest old iron I could find, but then decided that was likely going to just end up costing me more money in the long run. So I've been looking at 12-15 ton machines that should be able to kind of do everything for me, and I can just rent a big one if needed or hire it out. I'm looking more for long term reliability and ease of repairs over production speed. Nearby I've found a Samsung SE130, Case 688 and Hitachi EX100-3. I'm going to keep looking for awhile, to make sure I get the right choice, but wanted some opinions on brands to look for or to avoid. The 688 intrigues me right now, it's at 5000 hours and looks to be decent condition, all the glass is still intact too. Seems like it's a fairly simple machine to work on. The Samsung is the best fit as it has a hydraulic thumb, but the internet searches have me a bit leery of it as far as getting parts goes. There's lots of older Deere, Link Belt and Cat machines with really high hours for cheap, but they are monsters, and I don't want to start the project off with 30 grand in repairs just to get up and running.
The hitachi -5 machines are very reliable and parts still available. I’d stay away from the -2 & -3 machines, they seem to have a lot of electrical problems
Case was a French Proclain design at that time, never saw one around me. Hitachi & Komatsu was one of best of the 90's . Korean machines disappeared like Daewoo & Samsung by the 2000's but Case had Samsung build later machines. Deere is Hitachi with JD engine all ways heard reliability wasn't there on 690 to a 200-
I'm seeing quite a few Komatsu machines, bigger than what I'm looking for, but not a deal breaker really as long as I can fix the thing.
Welcome back to the Forums! Out of the 3 you list I would leans towards the Hitachi and run away from the Samsung. No experience with either just what I've read on HEF. Cat will have the best parts availability FWIW.
Stay away from gray market or EL Cats they rebranded Mitsubishi/ Mitsubishi no parts
I'm gonna throw a curve ball into it I guess. What about a heavy backhoe, like JCB 214? I think I'm going to have a friend cut in the driveway for me when it's time with his big equipment, once I have good access I'll be able to get to most of the property with a wheeled machine. Anything I can't access I could get to with my C345 skidsteer. My plan is to first grub out the small trees on the bottom side, and then pull shale out of the pit that's there to get the roads roughed in. After that I need to clear about 5 acres to start (it was logged already so the trees are pretty young) then dig for the new shop and house as needed. I wanted a big excavator on site for digging shale when needed, but I think it's fairly soft shale, so maybe a backhoe would work to both dig it and move it around a bit.
^^^Yes^^^ Avoid -2, -3. We recently picked up a EX100-1 for this reason. Very simple, solid older machine. But…getting really old; hard to find a good example. We have also owned 2 Hitachi ZX series machines. They were excellent, pre-emissions units (Isuzu power) We also have a 2003 Hyundai 210-7. Cummins 5.9, Kawasaki pumps. This has been a very reliable machine over the past 10 years. Problem is (at least here in BC a lot of the dealers (Woodland) have closed up. Not hard to find most parts through other sources. Have not really needed any parts; other than Heater/ac control ‘box’. Found that on eBay.
If you gotta run junk, you gotta have a lot of it. If you don't have it, it needs to be available from other sources. I'd look on a site such as machinery trader to see how many of any machine you are interested in are available. Quite a few machines are really scarce on the ground. That leaves you in a predicament when you need a part from a salvage machine. I get the whole part about how orphans need love too. But you have work to do, and a busted machine is a double burden, as you have to take time to fix it, and you are busy working on equipment rather than doing the job. Your thought about a TLB is valid. I cleared a lot of trees with a 410 Deere. And the front end loader is quite handy, especially with pallet forks. In the range of smaller hoes you mention, a TLB may be a more universally useful choice.
I wouldn't run from a Samsung, yes they are a level below Hitachi in terms of performance and longevity but you can get just about every part for them at a good price from numerous companies out of Korea. You will need a parts manual however and require basic to reasonable experience working with machinery. If the price is right there's no reason to fear them.
I've been down that road more than once. I dropped a valve in my old Takeuchi a few years ago and couldn't find any parts in the US. Ended up getting a new head and piston from a factory in China off of Alibaba. It took a few weeks, but everything showed up and I was back up and running for like $750 total. The Samsung looks like it checks most of the boxes. It was a single owner machine, pins are tight and cylinders are dry. Less than 4000 hours on it. I still may consider going big. I found a Deere 792 (Hitachi with a Deere engine) that had the undercarriage redone for a really good price, but it's so damn big it would just have to live at the property forever.
It looks like the Case 688 is a rare bird. The price on it is bargain basement, but if it can't be fixed then it seems like a silly thing to get into. I do like that it's basically all mechanical though.
At the current time, I'm not sure you can buy anything for a 688 unless it's for the engine, undercarriage, or hoses. Many a story on here about guys needing hydraulic components for 688, 888, 1088 and ending up at a dead end. They are probably about the worse orphans out there.
Case 688 & JCB past was metric & or British pipe thread mix of fittings. JCB parts use to be hard to find mostly waiting to get'em from the king himself in England
Case and Link Belt both had Sumitomo start building machines for them in the early 90s. 90xx Case were great machines.
Ya wrong machine Helicopter cab couldn't think Sumitomo partners in 92. First modern Case 210 saw at dealer was 2000
Link belt is another shared brand to look at all I was around was the big old FMC LB.
I'm gonna go check out the Samsung this week and take a guy who knows more about them than me. For the size of it the hours seem very reasonable. I'm seeing other similar units online for sale pushing 10,000 hours. Looks like it's powered by a 4BT, those things are hard to kill.
CB - What is your budget?
Samsung became Volvo. That doesn't mean that there are any parts for old Samsung machines. Sumitomo and Link-Belt were in bed together in 1979 when I worked for the dealer. Case came into the fold with Sumitomo in the late 80s and early 90s. Parts are the same for period comparable machines. Each dealer will tell you they are not. Poclain and Drott were owned by Tenico Corp. in the eighties. It all ended up as part of Case eventually. Poclain started the change to high pressure high flow hydraulics. Case took the Drott machine and put their name on the brand. Didn't want to do the redesign so had Poclain do it. Parts were always a problem even when they made them. the "88" orphans don't deserve any love from anyone. I haven't had anything to do with Hitachi machines in awhile. I do know that 20 year old Komatsu parts are very expensive and not guaranteed to be available for any of the line. Right now the auction market machines are likely going to be much older than we have seen in the past with a lot more hours on the clocks. New machine prices are still going up but sales at this time are pretty poor. Old machines make lousy trades so those end up in the auctions. If you are looking for used, you might just wait a couple of months as the markets are showing signs of strain. Get to know someone with a background in repairing these units.
40 grand or less ideally.
Machinery trader upstate NY is Hitachi 100 $29k high but like John said old honeys are in demand.
I found another potential machine real close by. A Kobelco SK135sr. 7300 hours with new final drives. Undercarriage looks good. The short swing gives me pause though, probably a lot harder to work on with it being more cramped in there.
Just a suggestion - LB for LB the class excavator you are looking at is very popular since it can be moved on a tag trailer and thus pricey compared to a 50K machine that has to be moved on a lowboy. Do just want a machine in the 30K lb range or can you go up a size? How often will you need to move it? FWIW we hire out all our moves to a local lowboy service. All 3 have Landoll's which are the sweetest trailers to load and unload from. Costs us anywhere from $300-500 to move a 60K 325 around town.
I'm hoping to keep it so I can move it behind a dump truck at some point. I don't intend to use it for business except when needed, but just want a versatile machine I can mostly keep on the property and around the new shop for odd jobs. Found a Cat 312 a bit farther away with 4000 hours. Very interested in going to look at that one. Looks pretty clean.
I had a 315CL and a 315DL. Both were fantastic machines, very dependable and we hauled them on a 54K lb tag trailer wherever they needed to go.
I just looked closer at the pictures of the 312. It has REGA printed on it. Looks like that's a grey market import?
It's been a while since I heard the term REGA. As memory serves, yes REGA machines were grey market here in the US. C model?
No letter, just the 312 decal.
Probably an A model machine. Lots of those were gray market as Cat was still selling 225 model machines. Analog electronics weren't to bad to troubleshoot. The build quality was pretty good as there were few structural failures that I saw. Parts are available but you will have to pirate a North American serial number when ordering them. The cabs are different an you won't be able to source parts for those. It will be very old though.
It looks like a less capable machine than the SK135, but it's half the hours. Here's the listing if you want to check it out. Facebook www.facebook.com
Providing you have part numbers, you can find just about any part for Korean made machines through Korean parts suppliers and there are numerous. I can get some parts through Volvo, if not I'll buy from Korea, air freight takes 8-9 days to Au, no doubt more to US. These suppliers offer, Genuine or Korean aftermarket, nothing Chinese. Here are some examples of enquiries Ive made. I only needed some seals but thought I'd see if they stock big ticket items like floating seals, slew bearings etc. They can supply anything for the Samsung down to small items like cab window rollers like in the pic, hinges for doors, window rubbers, decals etc... some items will come labelled Volvo. Very decent prices.
So I'm buying the SK135sr. I went and checked it out today. Fired right up, ran good. Everything was smooth and it dug well. Has a few wet fittings that I'm going to clean up and try tighten, no major leaks. The only real slop in it is the wishbone pin, which isn't that bad for the age. They just changed out both final drives. It's a retired guy selling his stuff, nice guy.
We need some pics..
This video just popped up on my feed. Posted two days ago. Seems relevant to this thread since the guy bought a Rega badged machine.
I'm not sure if I should start another thread specifically for this machine at some point, but once it comes home I'm going to hot water pressure wash everything, do a full service and try to address any repairs it may need. While doing that, does anyone know if it's fairly simple to plumb for auxiliary hydraulics on these units? I didn't run the serial number, but it looks like a first or second generation. If I could plumb it to run a breaker that would be handy.
We've come across this before on the forum, and most if not every the time there is a way round it. Cat have a bar code reader system that can interpret whether or not a machine PIN plate is genuine or not, even from a photo. Just by looking at the plate on his video, and based on a lot of others I've seen, I'm almost 99% sure it would flag up as non-kosher. To me it looks "wrong". If he had gone to Cat with a photo of the PIN plate instead of simply running a check on the Serial Number before bidding on it he might have avoided a world of pain. EDIT: A very small (30 seconds or less) dig into the interweb and the information popped up that there was NEVER a machine manufactured that originally bore the Serial Number GG803742. The last machine ever built with a GG8 S/N prefix was GG803340 on 20/NOV/2020. Also the GG8 machine is powered by a Cat C3.3B engine, not a Mitsubishi. Another red flag if more were needed. All the GG8 series of machines were manufactured in the Cat mini-ex manufacturing plant in Athens GA. A long way away from China........ So the plate isn't kosher and by implication that makes the machine non-kosher as well. It's not hard to do due diligence, and if you don't know how to do it the best thing to do is ask. TBH I think his video was done more for clicks than to make a point. I may be wrong.
Got it home.
Congrats! Good looking machine. How much did you end up giving for it?
$28k for it. I didn't look for long, but didn't see an operator's manual inside it. I have to spend some time giving it a full service. Fixing whatever leaks I can fix, and getting it all cleaned up. I'm gonna drain everything, all the filters, re-tension the tracks, whatever I can do to get it ready to rock. It's going to be out in the field for awhile once it leaves so the less I have to do while it's there, the better. Does anyone know where to find a digital operator's manual for it? Looks like there are a few paper copies available.
Is there a problem with the track adjusters? You could do some oil samples to see what shape they're in. It's not bad to change the fluids but fluids like hydraulic fluid could still be fine to run.
Looks in good shape, for a fair price. Well done! A nice sized machine. We had a Hitachi ZX120 & ZX135 with the Isuzu 4bgt. Quiet, smooth engines; excellent cold weather starters & amazing fuel economy. Good luck with it!
He's got the tracks pretty tight. I want to back them off a bit and adjust them to whatever spec is in the manual. Hydro fluid is clean and clear, but dark. Just to be safe I want to get it changed out.
You did very well IMO. Might have missed it but does it have an Isuzu engine? Great little diesels. You sound like me - I change all fluids and filters on a used machine regardless if the oil or filter is brand new. Figure the fluid and filter swap into the price of the machine.
Sounds like a good plan. I think draining as much hydraulic fluid as you can without trying to do a complete flush should be sufficient. That's why I thought testing a sample could give you a good idea how thorough you need to drain the old fluid. If there isn't anything that stands out in the sample, you could just drain the reservoir and replace 70-80% of the fluid instead of trying to get all of it. It is a nice looking excavator.
Anytime I buy a new to me anything, I change all the fluids, sometimes I will skip the anti freeze if it looks good and runs cool enough. What I do also, is all the baby jars that I get, I will from a perfectly clean drain pan, always pour a sample into the baby jars and label them all. That gives me the opportunity to look at it, as it separates, in sunlight and most do to a degree. I have never sent any out for analysis, as that is not the correct way to take the sample. To me it’s just interesting to see what they look like after 6 months, then I generally pour them all into a jug and look at the beautiful colors left over. Just gives me peace of mind. Found a bad transfer case on a Chevy Silverado, that didn’t even know was bad, for 3 months. Jar was full of shavings and noticed it in the drain pan barely as well. Thankfully, found it before winter.
I agree. Just draining the tank and getting a new filter will make me feel better. If it isnt clear after like 20 hours I'll run it out about 100 hours and do it again.
Looks pretty clean. I would have wanted to aux flow to the stick and quick coupler, even manual. At that price those things can be added if you want them. I think Kobelco has always built a good machine and you see a ton of those 135's around.
It took two guys, two tanks of gas in the hot water pressure washer, and about 6 hours, but I got most of the sludge blasted out of it. I may have damaged a small hose in the process, so we'll see how that one holds up. All the engine filters will be in tomorrow so I'm going to do the oil and change all those. I'm gonna drain the hydraulic tank and fill it up with fresh fluid. Probably just generic store brand. I typically use NAPA brand, but they're closed tomorrow. Should have the hydraulic filters in by the end of the week. I'm going to do the slew reducer tomorrow too, the oil looks okay, but might as well get everything on the same start to a new schedule. It's calling for GL4 on the sticker, but is it okay to GL5 in that thing? Once I can get it working a bit I'm just going to do my best to look for leaks and change hoses if I can. I don't mind tiny leaks, but seepers annoy me.
How many gallons of hydro oil does it hold? Might be cheaper to by a drum and have some left over.
It's saying about 35 total, 25ish in the tank.
the Cat 312 stick is too short.
I don't think this thing has been pampered like that in awhile. Nothing was overly concerning, but I did a full service on it to restart the clock. It looks like the oil pressure sensor is working fine, it gave me a warning after starting it up with a fresh change and new filters like normal. So that's good to know There was a little bit of rust in the coolant, so I'll probably flush that again in like 40-50 hours. Just waiting on the hydraulic filters to come in, should be here this week. An empty hydraulic tank to the center of the site glass is exactly 25 gallons. I think I'm going to ask my neighbor if he wants any holes dug so I can run it through a good heat cycle working before it goes off the property. All I lack is changing the oil in the final drives and rollers and tensioning the track. The track is too tight, that's all I know. How much sag should I put in it when I back it off and go again?
Do you have an O&M manual? It should show how much slack to have on the tracks. All of my Cat manuals have that procedure in them.
I downloaded the manuals for it, they're huge. I'll have to sift through them.
Just so it sags, it's definitely not rocket science. I'd guess the spec to be around 1.25" to 1.5" between the roller and the idler.
I found it. It wants 10-11" from inside of the shoe to the frame.
Is that with the track frame picked off the ground and measured from the bottom of the track frame to the pad?
I forgot that they quit measuring on top.
Yeah, measurement at the center roller from inside of the pad to the bottom of the frame.
Maybe it's a little bit of rocket science after all or maybe it's just in the O&M manual.
deere 690 elc...had 3 of them at different times. great machines, and parts were always there. many of the filters, engine parts you could buy from local ag dealer and buy quite a bit cheaper than buying them from heavy equipment dealer.
of course, the very first generation of the "e" series....were hitachi's with a deere engine/paint/decals. then they kept boom/stick design, and bought their pumps from a German manufacturer. i had a early 90s hitachi 200 also...GREAT machine. biggest piece of crap i owned was a fe20 fiat allis...and i LOVED their front end loaders. for underground contractor, the 545 or 645 couldn't be beat....full bucket rollover going forward to clean up work, and 10 degrees more articulation than any other manufacturer to get into those tight spaces.
I'm nearly there. Still waiting on hydraulic filters to come in. I fixed the track tension today and put new oil in the finals. New hydro tank breather came in, so that's going on this week. The manual is listing an oil type for the top and bottom rollers, but only for a "refill". Is that just for after a rebuild? Looking at them they don't look very serviceable while in the machine.
Bottom and top rollers are life time fill. You don't change the oil in them at all. If there is a leak, you generally replace the roller. There are special fittings used to put oil in bottom and top rollers which allow filling to the proper level.