Hello all and thanks for the place to be Just purchased a wheel loader off a fella, been sitting in his yard for 3 yrs. said he ran it last summer. Im pretty confident in going over the Detroit 4-71 to set the rack and make sure the shut offs are working. Ive drained the Oil(about 5 gal of water in there too) and ill top up all the drive line fluids. havent cranked it over yet but fairly confident it will start ... ha ha but what I have no idea or experience with is the air brakes. he said they work but not strong. I am planing to drive this home about 15miles all back roads , shouldnt really see more than one or two cars along the way, but id like to go over the brakes. its air over hydraulic? where is the air pressure created and how do I measure it? is there a regular brake fluid type master cylinder as well? If anyone can guide me from start to stop on how to follow them along and check Id be much obliged. i know these have a habit of overheating the driveline and tires when traveling so any other advice or comments are most welcome cheers T
also If anyone has a link or knowlege on where to find a service manual for this michigan Clark 175A loader pls let me know. seems to be none out there
Power assist booster and master cylinder are usually right under the floor. Its a very small master cylinder for all the brake lines and brakes that it supplies. If you need to bled the brakes for removing any air out, use a power bleeder or you will be filling that tiny master cylinder over and over.
Should be an air compressor mounted to the engine, might be belt driven or even gear driven. How about posting a few pictures of the engine to help get answers. As for measuring the air pressure there should be a gauge mounted in the cab area. Should read between 100 to 120 psi when pressure is up.
Did a search online for 175 Michigan images Firt off if yours is the same as the one I found the red arrow in picture below points to the air compressor, gear driven in this example: And I believe the red arrow in image below must be the air pressure gauge as all the others are marked, this one appears to have been replaced with an Euclid air gauge. See red arrow:
Before you go firing off that Detroit engine here is some advise. If it has sat as long as you say, with water in the engine, there is a possibility that the injector tube and injector rods are rusted, and possibly the governor links. You really need to remove the valve cover and make sure everything is moving like its supposed to. If they are stuck the engine will shoot to the moon and you will have a runaway on your hands that usually ends up in a explosion.
Thanks a Million Kevman, I will look for those under the floor.
Yes absolutely. I was out there today and I took off the valve cover and made sure, all the injectors go in and out. and the rail is free. I checked that the shut off works and I also checked that the emergency shut off is still closing. wether or not it has all the seals in there is another story, but I will be prepared with something to choke the air incase all else fails in a runaway. Thanks for the reminder.!!
This IS exactly the info I wanted. Thanks Kshansen I didnt see a pressure guage on the dash but will look more closely tmr. I assumed the compressor was belt driven as there is some sort of pump off the belt but maybe its a ? dunno? the power steering is hydraulic so im not sure what it is? maybe mind has a belt compressor ? Ill take a pic tmr and put it up here. thanks a million cheers T
heres some pics of engine from today.... see whats run off the belt
Clamp a good pair of vise grips on that fuel rack tube tight enough that it doesn't slip but also doesn't crush it. Its a good way to slow the engine enough to kill it if an injector hangs up. I also keep a BFH nearby to knock a fuel fitting off if all else fails. You cant have too many ways to shut down that engine if it decides it wants a moon trip.
good Idea, I will do that. once it starts and runs a few times and is started regularly the chances of a run away are pretty slim? its only after it sat and gets siezed up right? or is it a constant worry with the detroits?
Correct! Once everything is oiled up from a start or 2 you should be good to go with no worry. For the most part. Those engines sitting for long periods of time can sometimes rust up top and seize a fuel rack, injector, or a governor link. It only takes one injector to hang which will override the governor yield link which is what stops your engine at the set speed. Yours in the pic looks pretty good but if you have ever had one of those engines run away its something you never forget. Most of the time when it happens, people run for cover instead of trying to shut it down. An injector can hang up at any time which is why the emergency shut down flap is there. Its important that the engine oil is changed regularly and kept reasonable clean. Good clean fuel supply and clean oil helps prevent it.
Ok. I took off the valve cover And have been moving the rail back and forth Making sure the pins? (What ever they are that the rail pushes foreward and retracts) are moving in and out Checked that the shut of pops the rail back . The air flap is too hard to pull by cable but I can flip it pen and closed at the linkage for the cable by the flap. Will keep a piece of tin handy to smother air if needed and an extinguisher for worst case. I don’t want to have to runaway from a runaway! Lol Also the fella I bought it from is very particular about oil drips and tire tracks in his lawn. can’t imagine the hell od catch if I exploded a Detroit there ha ha ha
One strange head scratch I had was When I first checked the rail it was free. then I turned the engine over with a bar. And the rail was stuck! Turned it over some more and it was free again? Any thoughts on that?
You have a sticking injector. Bob
Injectors are ok, Ran the engine a dozen times after making sure they were free and moved the machine home. It stalls here and there when it comes down from a higher rpm, but I assume thats because I havent cleaned the Fuel Filters and or the Idle isnt set correctly.. Air compressor works and fills tank but brakes are almost non existent. I assume theres pads or bands in there that need replacing.... if anyone knows pls fill me in. also Theres alot of Transmission fluid dripping only when the unit is running and for a few minutes after then it stops... any Ideas? and Diesel fuel drips from under the blower for about a few minutes after the unit is turned off but now while its running or sitting..... thanks for all your knowlege Folks It sure is nice to have some light shed on all these issues. I really appreciate your time... Cheers T
OK, then yours has a belt driven compressor! Just keep in mind that on a machine of that age it has probably had many hands on it and what it came from the factory with has little bearing on what you might be seeing today. Might take some work but I would be trying to locate some manuals on this machine, operators and parts manuals would be my first choice and if possible a service manual. I would prefer an old dog-eared original to one of the new scanned copies as sometimes those are very hard to read and pictures almost worthless.
yes, It has been around the block for sure! I have an operators and parts manual but cant find a service manual there is one for a 125a avail but not sure the differences. gonna get to the brakes this week. somehow I think Ill want them and trying to figure why my trans fluid is pouring out when running. the manual calls for 7 gal of fluid I put in 5 and seemed to fill it up to the level plug but Im a bit confused because ... the manual says to fill till the fill plug which is up top on the torque converter. but then theres a level drain cock on the lower part of the transmission housing above the screen. and that seems way over full. any insight?
Any idea what model the transmission is in that? Michigans I was around all had Clark transmissions. Maybe post some pictures of the transmission from different angles someone might spot something.
Just an idea. There was a guy here a while back this spring that restored a 75A. Have not seen him here since then but might be worth trying the "Start a Conversation" thing with his name. he used Burnt.Fingers Or just read the thread he had on his machine, might be something in there that would help you. Does the operators manual say how to check oil level? Could you scan or post a picture of that page?
ok , here goes. and pls excuse my ignorance of some of these parts. I am really looking forward to learning as much as I can about this Loader and how it all works. first pic is of the trans, second pic there is a drain I am pointing to. the parts manual confuses me as it says this is the level plug but the operators manual calls for 7 gal of trans fluid and that would only take a a few gal to fill to where i am pointing in the above picture... . and the manual also says fill to flush with filler hole. which is ... as far as I know at the place im pointing to on the third image below. there are some gears in there ....but not sure what part of the machine that yellow round case is. ... What is that part of the system called ? (second image , yellow part where the fill plug is) it is above the trans. is it the gear box or a clutch? if so how does it regulate how much trans fluid goes to each place? I know I need a teacher more than a forum but ill take what I can get from you fine folks cheers T the image below is me pointing down to the trans from the filler plug yellow (gearbox? clutch?)
Hello, I'm more familiar with the smaller 75A but design is similar on some components. Brakes: If you're serious about getting 4 wheel power brakes working, you need to start at each wheel and completely strip and refurbish the foundation, then you can move to the master cylinder and power assist or hydrovac. It's the only way to get back to good on a 60 year old machine. You'll need new wheel cylinders and usually you can clean and restore everything else. Quick, cheap easy fix is to weld a brake rotor to a driveshaft and hang a single caliper. It wont be anything like 4 wheel power brakes but better than none at all. Transmission: Fluid is filled at the torque converter (yellow housing with plug) Fill it up until you see it at the level plug on the transmission.(the plug you're pointing to) There are brass tags on the torque converter and transmission that will tell you what models they are. Leaks are likely coming from a bad pressure hose to the control cover, charge pump, pan gasket, pressure regulating valve, internal converter issues will make them blow fluid. On top of the transmission is the control cover, there's a 1/4" test port where the pressure line comes from the regulator valve. Plumb a 300psi gauge there.(might already be a dash gauge on yours, not certain) Running in neutral is charge pump pressure. Shifting 1,2, H & L the reading will drop and bounce back, that reading is each clutch pack pressure.
Circled: Pressure regulating valve on torque converter, the hose running down off the valve should be the pressure supply to the transmission control cover. Fill plug at torque converter. You fill here, but check it down below on the transmission. Typically when they stop driving, you'll be 8 quarts low. Dextron.
Ok. thanks very much I’m sure I’m over full on trans fluid then. As I thought the full level was when flush with full plug. I can just crack the level valve until it stops coming out and that should get me straight.
Yes, need to bleed it down to the level plug at the transmission.
Been too long since I was around a Clark transmission or Michigan Loader. Just checking for tarmop, the oil level check is done with engine running at idle with warm oil? I know that is how most of the other loaders I worked on were checked unless they had a dipstick with markings for cold and warm or other things. Also know some like older Cats if filled to the full mark when cold they could read several inches high when warm.
Hey Kshansen, thanks for lookin our for me . Burnt Fingers sorted me out with the trans, fill through torque converter and check level at drain thats near the pan on the trans. now, got to figure out how the heck Im gonna get those wheels off to work on the brakes lol!!
anyone know where to plug in my serial number to check date of Manufacture?