school 1: I have to figure out what school im going to, one cost $11-15 000 and promises me training on backhoe/ loader, excavator, bulldozer , skid steer. 8 weeks training with dz. school 2: is 10K, gives me 2 weeks class training and 4 weeks training on one machine only-excavator, or 3 - tractor/loader/backhoe. This school is also tied in with the industry more. Money isn't a factor when it coms to tuition,....but as an entry level operator what will be better? I know the first couple years on the job ill be working a skid steer most likely or smaller machine. So is school #2 a waste ? by the time i actually step into an excavator i wil have to be retrained all over again.
Hi Rui ! Getting training on an excavator is hopefully more then just learning the controls. I hope they teach a lot more, like safety, proper trenching, benching, locating, etc... So when you finally get on a machine, you need to learn the feel of that machine, but you will know enough to be productive, and not a danger to those around you Personally, I would suggest a program on Dozer/Excavator/Grader. Bump the other stuff. If you can get those down, you can run most of the other stuff. Good luck, Keep us updated !
Do either of the courses teach you anything about reading plans, shooting grades, things of that nature?
So they are counting a TLB as 3 machines? It still only takes up one parking space... :bouncegri Just making sure that you understand that it's only 1 machine really... Best of luck and let us know how well you like whichever school you chose!
That's a good point that slipped right past me--it does read as if Rui is thinking that a TLB is three different machines. Rui, if that's true, someone would be happy to explain the differences to you. Like they say, the dumbest question is the one you failed to ask...
I understand it is one machine, just wasn't thinking clearly and typing too fast.
In my opinion you would be much better off to learn the TLB than the excavator if you have to choose between them.Once you learn the principles of the TLB and can actually do work with one the excavator will be a natural for you. I would much rather teach a backhoe operator to run an excavator than to teach an excavator operator to run a backhoe. The concept of getting the machine in position to do a job with the backhoe has much greater significance than it does with an excavator,even the finer points of setting your outriggers to your advantage to achieve particular results. Having tracks under you and a 360 degree swing can disguise a lot of incompetence in the art of excavating to those who do not know what to look for. Like Bob Horrell said in his post the other day,watch out for us old guys.:wink2
You have a good point, Ron. I spent the better part of twenty years on a backhoe before I ever sat in the seat of an excavator. It spoils you in a hurry, partly because there's so much less of the "how must I position myself to accomplish this?", type of thinking required. Combine that with the luxury of going almost anywhere on tracks, that you don't have on rubber, and the TLB shows itself to be that much more of a challenge. It probably is easier for a good TLB operator to quickly transition to being a good excavator operator, than vice versa. And when Rui goes out for his first job interview, the potential employer will be impressed when he explains that was why he took TLB in school. :wink2
Rui, I hope that I didn't offend with my post. Sometimes my attempts at humor miss the mark. Learning to be a good TLB operator really will be like learning 2 machines in one as there are special techniques for running both ends of the machine. I just didn't want anyone to try to charge you for 3 machine training and then only provide for 1.
I thought your sense of humour fitted in here rather well I agree and disagree. As a kid I learnt on tractors with FEL's which is what TLB's have been up until the last 4 or 5 years. The TLB's we have now are truly specialised machines in their own right with 4WS etc etc. Learning on older TLB's give you a lot of site organisation and excavation experience that His Diggerness talks about above. However, older TLB's do not encourage best "Loader" practice...in fact they are almost opposite in their operation ...especially when digging. You will see a TLB (when loadering??) lifting its front wheels off the ground. Thats why you see comments on this forum about the 4WD TLB's with same or similar size front/rear wheels being better than the older ones. To lift or take the load off the front wheels on a loader is of course a useless waste of time. Because of the articulations loaders track different from TLB's. I would think (putting graders aside as a true speciality), if I had to pick only two machines to learn on it would be a loader and an excavator. Loader experience and theory will benefit you in skids through to any other articulated machine you can think of. Tracked experience on an excavator helps with TLB's and combined with loader experience you are on the road to dozers and track loaders. The TLB would appear to be the obvious choice if you had to choose just one but again I think the excavator has the edge because you don't see too many sites without an excavator...but you do see plenty without TLB's. Just MHO.
Good imformation guys, thanks!!!, i've been reading alot.. there is soo much i don't know .....
ok it's crunch time , im about to hand in my proposal ... besides this site- is there any other websites i can checkout to learn more about HEO? Anything else i can ad to my report will help me out. thanks,
I know this is an OLD OLD OLD post but I'm new and can't make a topic but I was wondering if anyone has heard of the program at Northwest Iowa Community College? I am still a highschool kid and I really want to get into the Heavy Equipment field. This course looks like it would provide me with all the skills that I need out in the workforce plus it has job placement, I will post the link: http://www.nwicc.edu/pages/programs/trade/heavy_equip.html Any input would be appriciated
You might also find out the phone number of Iowa Operating Engineers Local 234 out of Des Moines, and see if you can get into their Apprenticeship program. Assuming you are in Iowa, which I figured by your choice of schools. Get paid to learn.. If not, contact the union local in your state. Anyhow, good luck! alan627b
I'm actually located in Northwest Missouri but I have more than a few reasons for wanting to attend school in Iowa.
Northwest Missouri, huh? Then might I suggest contacting Local 101 Operating Engineers (KC-St Joseph area) Training Site 22770 SR273 Weston MO 64098 888-640-2336 You might get paid to learn that way.... I just found out I was selected for pipeline equipment training, starting Monday. Which is good because there is going to be a lot of pipeline work in Nebraska in the next 2 years.....ought to be interesting! good luck! alan627b
yeah im actually right by the Weston area, I might have to give them a call one of these days. Oh and thanks for the help I appriciate it!
hey I am in HS, I am very interested in Heavy equipment since im subcontracted with RYan homes if your familiar with them. There one of the local big housing developments. I found a school called ATS in columbus ohio, i dont know if anyone went to it herd of it whatever the case may be. Like the guy be4 me i want to get into it and want to know the correct direction to go. I talk to the guys on the sight and he said he would show me the rops some day, but that day has never come around. This is something i have wanted to do since i was a kid. I was one of those kids who used to play with tonka trucks in the back yard. well i guess i never really grew up lol. im only posting on here cuz i cant put up my own forum. Why is that?
As a new member I think you must have 5 posts in other threads before you can start your own thread. Welcome to HEF! :drinkup
anyone have any suggestions on how i should go about. i mean like should i just open up the yellow pages and start calling company's should i wait to go to that college? anybody ever herd of it? its called, Associated Training Services. Its located in Columbus ohio
i talked to the head of an excavating company around here but it wasnt really in depth but i would reccomend tryin to get around the machines before college so you know a little bit goin in. This summer i am goin to try and apprentice somewhere to get a little info on the machines first
cat300, I am a apprentice in ohio through local 18 operating engineers. if you can get into the apprenticeship is a good deal. its a 4 year apprenticeship and its no cost to you at all. they take apprentices once a year a you just missed the signup but its worth the wait. i make more then most college graduates as a third year apprentice. ted :usa
ted- thanks I know a guy that is a OE (operating Engineer) and i was telling him about me wanting to this stuff and he suggest i, Try and get in the Western PA Operater engineer joint apprientship program. Which is the union i think.? but i thought with union jobs your not always garenteed a job. is that true? (sorry for the spelling. english is not one of my best subjects!). or should i go 4 the college
cat300, being in the union or going to a 4 year college doesn't guarantee you a job. but being in the union you sign up for work at the union hall and the hall dispatches you to work. you also have to remember operating is a seasonal job, you might get lucky and work year round but you might not. the thing i don't like is if you go to a 4 year college, then at the end you owe money and usually its a big sum. with the unions 4 year apprenticeship it doesn't cost you anything and they have just about every type of machine you'll ever see on the job. you can go in anytime monday through saturday, pick a piece of equipment and operate it. with some of these heavy equipment schools out there you pick one piece and get to operate that for a couple of weeks and then your out 8000. if you want to be a good operator you need to learn how to run more than one piece of equipment. if your versatile then you valueable to a contractor and then your guaranteed to work. ted:usa
that school is 4months long and cost 15grand not including room which i think is like 2grand on top of that. but included in that 15K is a cdl license
cat300, in the apprenticeship, they help you get you cdl license for free. they have a freightliner dump truck with a tag trailer so you can get you class a cdl. all you have to do is put in the time and they help you with pre-trip and they take you on the road, as much as you need to get the hang of things. also as a apprentice you get a percent of scale, so contractors like you because your cheaper then a journymen. ted
i got a question. since im new i was wondering how many post do u have to have to be able to make your own topic? The second question is; What the heck is the use in those i call them(remote control) mini escavators? Like the really small, u dont sit in them u like stand behind and operate them or something along them lines.
Well, your Post Counter shows you now have 5 posts under your belt. You should now be able to start threads. :thumbsup The mini remote control equipment would be used in places that are too narrow or tight for regular equipment. They can also be easily rented and moved by homeowners for yard projects. They are very handy when doing work inside buildings and small spaces. Since they are lighter they could be used in places where damage to the terrain would need to be kept to a minimum. I'm sure there are hundreds of other benefits but the ones I listed should give you an idea of their possibilities.
hey kid... HEY, KID THERE IS A TECH. COLLEGE IN BELOIT KANSAS (HEAVY EQUIPMENT SCHOOL) I WENT TO, I TOO WAS ONE OF THOSE KIDS, I'M 41 AND PLAYING WITH THE BIG TOYS NOW MAKEING PRETTY GOOD MONEY DOING IT. GOOD LUCK.
Welcome to HEF backhoeman! :drinkup No need to shout. We're right here beside ya. :wink2
I think he has his ear plugs in.
:usa hey Rui if i were you man i wouldnt waste the money on thise schools man..i kno you say that money isnt an issue but theres not much that can replace good ol exp in the cab workin in a real life situation, i would say start at like alot of us did at the shovel aka D1 haha no but really if u start as a laborer you wil apreciate the guys on the groung a whole lot more and i think it will help you in the long run
Welcome to HEF d6catd! :drinkup
For sure make money while you are learning and get a better edge mucation doin it. Those unions sound great. As well even non union. There is a shortage of operators almost everywhere. It is way easyer then it used to be to find someone to train you. Lots of companies have almost no other choice but to train new guys because there are not enough experienced operators to go around. If you get on with someone as a labouer, work hard and show some potential you will get a shot at a machine. Get to know the operators and ask them lots of questions. Show em you want to learn and lots will be happy to teach you. Some operators will even spend their breaks teaching you if you show an intrest in what they are doing and like you. That's how I got on my first machine.
:usa thanx country boy!
:usa hey guys this is kinda toward cat300 and rui i think its awesome that you guys are trying to ge the most info you can we need more of the younger generation trying to get into the field. guys i looked into the schools also and was real close to goin to 1 and cat300 i have heard of ats and i almost went to it. man honestly that is alot of money for that limited amount of training. the best thing i can tell you guys is if you want to operate is get in with an excavation company and put your time in the trenches and you will move up the ladder and you will learn alot more and get paid to do it wel guys g2g
I'm looking at a couple of things myself. I was working for a vending machine company for 11 years running their computers (everything is getting a computer) and working on their handhelds. I worked myself up in that from a route driver to machine repair and finally into the office. But I hated it. I'm in my mid 30's now and I lost the job (I just couldn't take it so I don't know if you can call it a loss). Anyway I'm trying to get into a operators school while my seperation pay and unemployment last. I think its the right way to go because I have a lot of forklift experience and ran a light tractor at a nursery and helped out with my Uncles farm (International Harvester with a bailer that spit out the cubes). Anyway I always liked that. The computer stuff was nice but I only ever got into computers because of video games. Along the way I've picked up on some college, some accounting, some mechanical work, and had several years in the army running an M113. It's in the running the equipment I was always happiest in though. Anyway I've been looking at the schools and it looks like that most of them are tied in with each other and run similar programs. I was looking at Ohio but I'm opting out of that one because of the 4600 price tag on a CDL vs. 800 or so at my local community college. I was looking at the Georgia School of Construction and the content on blue prints, grading, and CPR certification caught my eye so I am looking at getting in on that. Also the aspects covering math caught my attention also. If I was a younger guy (and I wish I had done things different), I would start out as a laborer and learn equipment that way. But I'm not. I'm hoping that the combination of the GSC program and hard work and a little luck will see me into a good paying job. I've seen a lot of complaints about lack of work in some areas but Brunswick and New Hanover counties are two of the fastest growing areas in the USA (up there with Las Vegas) and with three military bases and 3 ports (a fourth coming on soon) and a lot of major highway projects that I can catch on to something. But who knows. I have been out of a job for less than a week. But everyone needs to be enthusiastic about what they do. I think computers/internet can help you learn and I read more stuff on a computer than a book, but I really don't want to go back inside. I could spend months and not see the sun sometimes (exageration). Anyway maybe taking a school is cheating...I just know that there are no Unions or Community Colleges around here that teach equipment operator. We've talked with a lot of the big companies (Martin Marietta, Port of Wilmington, etc.) and they said they usually hire through the temp agencies. I figure worse case scenario is that if I go through a temp agency that they are more likely to send me to a Martin Marietta if I can say I've got training on different equipment. I'm glad I found this forum though and I've enjoyed reading the threads.
To the original guy that started this. If I was going to spend all those thousands, I would just buy a machine and learn it. You can always find some one that knows how to operate to give you some pointers. I would not waste the $ on a school. Either make a friend of an excavating company owner, or do the union appretice thing, buy your own machine, go to work at an equipment dealer, and wash and move the machines. Just some ideas. In the end you can either sell or put that machine to work.
Wow Take it from someone who went to a HEO Training School. I attended Linn State Technical College in Linn, Missouri. I thought I made the best decision Of my career But after spending alot of time Chasing down Dead end jobs I found out that the companies I Applied for would rather take you as a potential operator then one who come in with all these certificates saying that you can run equipment. Every job I have worked for Does things Little differently, everything I got taught in school was basic operating skills ( for people who have never ran a tractor) There was no Tips/Tricks and running equipment takes some years to get experience for the different situations. My advice for you is SAVE your money get with a company willing to work with you as an apprentice you might start out pushing waste areas or running a haul truck or doing some labor work but get your foot in the door with a company willing to give you a shot. If they are worth there salt (as I found out the hard way and spent my 11k) They can tell if you have the potential to being a good operator within the first few days And as far as my school went I haven't landed any job with my credentials from the school. My opinion is Just go to the field and get a job they can train you and you get paid for the training. One good thing I got my CDL class A from school but it cost me 11 thousand dollars I hope this helps some PM me if you'd like to talk more about it.:my2c
I worked with a guy a while back that said he wished he never spent the money on the school. He spent something like 12k for a 9 week coarse. The class was over crowded, not enough machines for everyone so you ended up waiting a couple of days before operating the machine you just had class on . Then when it came time to gradutate and get a job , the school just sent them on their way anyway with no placement or even help. They just gave him a list of contractors in the area and told him he was on his own. Not worth the money , like someone else said earlier, start in the trenches and work your way up, you'll respect the guys in the ditch and in the machines a lot better. Plus you learn a lot more about the business,cause as we all know there is a lot more to it than just moving dirt with a machine.
When it came time to find a Apprentice job they gave me a 3 inch thick book from the 80's and said this has every job in the country in it find the one you want. when I thought they were going to have kinda like a job fair or something or they would help you get a job that never happened I was all on my own the school wasn't what I thought it would be. Some of the other class mates I had, have told me the same thing it didn't help them very much either. save your money get paid to train what I should have done.
I used to take training in California for tool vending machines operation and all about it but I don't know this will be useful for you all or not that's why I will not mention the name of that institute. But yes I have learnt everything about tool crib and vending machines and now I am an expert in handling these tools.
For some guys the best place to learn may be in the military.
really! I think Military uses the heaviest equipment and tools and they have the best technology for vending these machines and equipment. One of my friend who is retired military man knows almost everything about machines just because of his job profile. I truly agree with you , pal !!
I really liked the variety of running equipment in the military. Rather than run a front end loader 40 hours a week for years, you may be on a dozer this week and a front end loader next week or digging a trench with a backhoe the week after that. The drawback of course is proficiency but that too can come with time. I think it's a lot like working for a city or county, patch a pothole today, replace a stop sign tomorrow, make a new parking lot....lots of variety. If I remember right, the school was about 8 weeks long and then you go to your duty station and continue training there.