I have been doing a bit of research on this, and what i have found so far is that there are 3 key areas which lead to accidents. 1)the stabilizing arms being left out when the machine is moving and 2)collisions with pedestrians and general operatives. 3) sliding into ditches and trenches was thinking a good feature to introduce would be a system where the backhoe cant be moved with the stabilizers out? and something like a radar collision system like the ones available on cars for when they are parking? was wondering if you could what would you change/ introduce on a backhoe to improve safety or what do you think is the most dangerous part of a backhoe? i know i cant change it myself, i just looking for peoples opinions and recommendations they would make.
I feel that if you just keep tossing more safty gear on these things, the people using it just stop thinking. Just like the drives on the roads these days.
Noted
I think someone should make a CD ( the manufacturers with dealer and operator input ) for training on basic everyday use with tips like stopping before changing direction , maintenance tips grease and lube changes. Some of this stuff is already in operator manuals. There is allot of info like what we see here in this forum that is good info for all operators. Or do we want to be licensed like crane operators.
the operator.........lol
Without laughing, you are right. The operators need better training. Who actually reads an op manual? The brain of the machine is still in the seat. In my opinion, trying to engineer safety via locking out functions is just avoiding the issue. Bypassing safeties will be done by operators, perhaps creating a bigger hazard than what was the original intention of the OEM. All of the functions should work from any position of the drivers seat, occupied or not. Similar to an excavator, a safety lever could be used, but don't use an operator presence switch in the seat. There are many times when standing up is needed to see what is being done with the hoe.
I think one item might be the education of everyone else on a construction site of the dangers of Backhoes or any machinery in general. I don't know how many times I have had to shut a machine down because some idiot was wagging his head over a hole or trench. I usually tell everyone to stay out of the reach of the machine until I say its safe. They'll see it just fine when a bucket swats them into a hole. O r people who come up next to a machine not realizing it can slide around.Just my thoughts on the subject. Steve
When ditching a lot of operators move the machine ahead by lifting the rear with the backhoe until the stabilizers clear the ground and pushing the machine forward sliding on the bucket, raising the stabilizers would just take too much time. It may not be the safest way but it's done all the time.
Not safety related but needed...Design a backhoe so when you bump a truck while loading it does not take out the front of the hood. I know poop happens, but it seems like a simple option to add to a machine that across the board owners would appreciate.
I agree with oldseabee, seen guys do this to. Machine moves much better if the operator takes the 5seconds to pick the stabs up. I think the operator is the biggest part in safety. Pay attention and know what your doing makes the biggest differance. Inexperiance is a scary thing. I think having a cut out switch were the machine couldnt move if the stabs were down is a really poor idea no offense. Not always the proper way of doing things but sometimes need to use stabilizers for unitended reasons and or those shady steep spots. Mirrors are a great safety feature. Case use to have the rear view mirror on the left, now the new hoes on the right. Makes sense, on average operator leans to the right were the loader lever is to look down at the bucket. But traveling over the road the boom is a huge blind spot so having that mirror on the left helps in seeing passing cars. I added an extra mirror on my hoe. I like how Deere puts a mirror in the back of the cab so you can always look up quick and see whats in front of you as well. As far as collisions, Im on the street 95% of the time. Having good detail cops really works well. Again all comes down to the operator and how much attention or how alert they come to work as. Theres always that chance of the idiot driving down the road not paying attention texting or w/e the case. Never completely have full protection no matter what you do, but setting up the job properly with cones and signs helps prevent accidents. My point is its not always the machine safety or operator but the whole crew that can play a big part in preventing accidents. Everyones responsible.
Very dangerous spot to add, trenching, having an over excited new laborer that doesnt understand how much of a blind spot the boom can be and jumping in the way. Had this happen to me pleny of times.
+ 1
Operator presence lockout. If your not in the seat in the proper position the controls will not operate. How many times have you seen somebody move the boom from the ground on the boom side of the hoe. This has crushed and killed many people in the construction industry. I know it will be somewhat of a hassle at times but jodsite safety is priceless.
Definitely a better idea than the stabilizer lockout.
Here is a radical idea for you. remove the steering wheel. The machine would be controlled by pilot joysticks on the arm rests of the seat, much like an excavator. When the seat is facing front, the left stick controls steering, gears would be selected the same way a d5g does, maybe magnetic detents for foreward neutral and reverse. Right stick runs the loader. Turn the seat around and the sticks run the boom, and the magnetic detents go away. Have a button on the joysticks to run the loader and drive as well, but limit the hoe to first gear while the seat is to the rear. Next go to a euro style sideshift hoe, and vertical stabilizers. And add 5' of extendable boom to the loader for easier truck loading & material handeling, kinda like a twin boom telehandler. That enough of a concept machine for you? We could add 4 rubber tracks like the case 590m asian concept that was on the web site several years ago.
Minus using the left joystick for steering I'm pretty sure John Deere's new J-series already have that option of the controls built right into the seat. I'd love to try one out sometime, I think they have a mini stick just below the right one for steering when you are using the backhoe and need to move a little without turning your seat around. I've only seen photos from the brochures, but it looks pretty slick. Additionally, I think the only real way to make a safer backhoe is making sure the guys in and around it know and understand how the machine works and where the blind spots are.
You can have all the safty do-dads in a backhoe, but if there is common sense around you or in that hoe someone is going to get hurt...IMO
Jim, I had a chance to run a 310SJ and 410J with that tmc setup. Really cool machine as far as technology but wasnt the machine for me. To many buttons and absolutely no feel or feed back in the controls. If I recall if the door was opened on those machines all the controls would shut off until the door was closed and the unlock button was pushed.
I think the operator is the most important safety feature a machine could have. Additionally, people should stay away from a working machine.
If it were only so easy.
I sometimes get my butt off the seat to get a better visual of what is going on so that won't work. The best thing is a well trained crew that isn't afraid to tell you when a eff up is about to happen even if you are the boss. Transmission lock outs when the stabilizers are down might be helpful but I have been in situations where putting the machine in gear and poggo sticking out of a muddy field is required and having the stabilizers down some could be seen as being safer. It all comes down to experienced operators. I have never seen a operator that is experienced drive with the stabilizers down. My Dad has one of those mini 110 JD's and it has the sit in the seat to operate safety feature. I have to get off the seat to line up the forks at times and the damn thing stops. Guess I am to damn short! lol!
Not sure I am a fan of them yet either...newer operators might get on to them but old school guys prefer the stick controls. My 410J is due for a replacement in the in the fall and I will have some decisions to make then.
I don't think I would go that far. I don't think any features on the machine to stop it or not allow you to do some functions is practical. I do think that more training for new operators should happen. Training CD to be provided by Manufacturer, training to be done by owner of Company, owner should be responsible for training of new operators, nobody wants to take responsibility today, don't let the Goverment do it for you.
As for our new saftey laws go .The owner / contractor must set some saftey policies in place for his staff [operators labourers truck drivers etc ] Example watch that pedestrians and traffic do not enter the work area , labours foreman must keep out of the work area as writen in the policy unless instructed by the opperator . In the case of injury the fines are stagering . The machine does what it does , its the people around it that have to use there head
We don't need safer made backhoes,we need operators with more common sense.
Same goes for labourers. I try to keep a mix of old guys and youngs on a crew. The old guys know what to look for in potential problems and aren't afraid to tell the young bucks.
Revicm, My boss just bought me a brand new 580Super N fully loaded. Im 22, I refused pilots and the new machine has the "old" 4 stick with foot swing. The salesman was somewhat baffled that I didnt want pilots. They are delivering it monday I'll try to post some pics.
safety break... " nobody works, nobody gets hurt! "
Holy crap! Now that is old school. Got any pics yet?
Ya I got some pics but for some reason my computer is having probs uploading. So far I really like the new hoe. Extremely fast and smoother, much more pushing power as well.
Don't see a lot of new Case's around here. John Deere (surprisingly quite a few 710's) and lots of Cat's. I think pricing has a lot to do with that though.