I have been looking till my eyes blur and looking for the part number for the Bristol spline type drive cam advance screw tool. Anyone have an idea where to get one?
I don’t have the p# in front of me but if u google STANADYNE cam screw removal tool im pretty sure you’ll find it.. BE SURE TO GET THE BUSHING TOO.!!!
Btw.. they don’t sell the Bristol tool anymore.. it’s now a straight cut TORX BIT W BUSHING (T45?) but like I said, it’s a special cut torx bit..
The catalogue ........... https://autodocbox.com/Auto_Parts/70151671-Stanadyne-service-tools.html
A source for Bit (24992) and Bushing (21178) usdiesel.com Fort Worth,Texas Link to bristol screw bit and bushing (the correct tools to remove timing screw/less likely to break the screw off) https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rCp8BcpT-vAsizxeVIrQpN9BnXwgYwpY/view
I am gonna get back to this when i get back to my pc.
Crap, we put one together and runs about 30 seconds and sounds like it runs right out of fuel. The guy was dicking around and changed transfer pumps so I doubt it's that and it was reallypumping fuel. Thought maybe the busted flex ring had clogged the return but unhooked it, same thing.
U need to check to see if its seized. Take the INLET FITTING OFF, now pour diesel fuel and fill the inlet up to the top.. Now spin the engine.. If the fuel gets sucked down, that’s good.. IF it stays the same, u seized the head and rotor..$$$$ It’s very important to torque the key components .. DV and end plate screws..
These things are like a watch.. Each and every component has to work w the other.. & if 1 piece is outa whack, the whole thing comes tumbling down.. Stupid manual..
I will check. It runs dandy for about 30 seconds, then runs out. Waitn runs again. I went out and took it off. I marked it taking it apart but one part in the window has a line, other none. When I put it on started right up, I don't do this a lot and my helper is really the mechanic but we have done half a dozen and never a problem.
If u timed the engine and pump correctly, there’s 2 lines, 1 is stationary and 1 rotates.. U SHOULDA rotated the engine over BY HAND until the 2 lines met and STOPPED.. THEN U CAN TAKE OFF.. but seeing u didn’t do that.. Take the pump off.. u see the dot on the drive shaft.?? Now look INSIDE THE PUMP.. there’s a dot in there.. put the pump on DOT TO DOT.. THAT’LL GET U CLOSE ENOUGH TO FIRE.. THEN u can fine tune the timing.. Did u put in an EID weight retainer.? Did u transfer the timing line.?? Did u put the weight retainer on correctly.?? It’ll go on 2 different ways..& if it’s wrong, the line won’t show up in the window at tdc.. it’ll actually be outta time 180*. These r the things u won’t have to ask if u get your pumps done by someone who knows what they’re doing.!!
I believe we timed it dot to dot. There wasn't 2 lines on this unit. Now.... If we took it somewhere we would never learn. Maybe it's been apart before and would it run 180 out of time?
If they will even start and run at 180 out it will have zero power and smoke like a freight train
Did u take ALL THE FITTINGS OFF the top cover.?? All the way down to the aluminum cover.. If done correctly, there will be a hole in the top cover.. NOW START THE ENGINE.. Does it stay running.?? (probably)
There were not 2 lines to match. I turned engine till I set the flywheel pin. We turn and turn, wasn't there. Took it apart, flex ring busted in to chunks. No mystery. Repaired, started right up, ran 30 minutes shut it off and went to start it month later, doesnt run right.
It ain't out of time then. It runs perfect,,,, for 30 seconds.
So u didn’t JUST rebuild this pump.?? It’s been sitting for a month.?? And NOW it won’t run.?? Or it’ll start and shut off.??
No, didn't take all the fittings out of the top cover. I thought I took the return fitting out, maybe didn't although I unhook it. We had another problem in the middle threw us off a little as one of my guys had a stroke, ended up in icu. So,,,, i took it off before I post here and gonna take it apart again as soon as the help shows up.
We didn't rebuild, we replaced the flex ring. Ran perfect for 30 minutes. Went to use it a month later runs perfect for 30 seconds. Starts, runs, quits just like it runs out of fuel.
Take the return fitting off, look into the pump, do you see fuel though the hole in the cover? look at the fitting, do you see crud? a ball? clean it. Listen to thepumpguy, you'll learn. Don't know why you'd take a pump off that starts fine and runs fine for 30 seconds, especially if it ran for 30 minutes last time.
If the flex ring had broken up.. the symptoms would be.. run for 5-10-20 SECONDS and shut down..(original problem) U replaced the flex ring & it ran great for 30 MINUTES.. u let it sit for a month & now your back to the original problem.. ok, I got it now. Yeah, first thing to check in my opinion is a dirt/stuck return connector.. hence the post about taking ALL the fittings off the top cover.. Chances r that the connector DIDNT get replaced at the time of original repair.. So let’s say ALL the fittings are removed and the engine starts but still shuts off.. THEN I would move to the fuel inlet side of the pump.. The 580c/k are GRAVITY FED.. meaning the fuel gets to the pump with no pump in between to PUSH the fuel to the injection pump.. (Supply Pump) So seeing the original problem was the flex ring.. assume that most of the flex ring broke up and was pushed back to the fuel tank.. It’s NOW TIME to take the line from the tank to the filter off and check the flow..just incase the flex ring bits aren’t blocking the fuel tank OUTLET.. Get yourself a 5 gallon bucket, TAKE THE LINE OFF AT THE FILTER & stick it in the bucket & WATCH THE FLOW.. it SHOULD BE GUSHING fuel...IF it’s not, u have a blockage.. There’s only 1 FIX.. take the fitting out of the tank and flush the debris out.. Or.. do like millions of people and “back-blow” the line to the tank..w compressed air..it’ll clear the blockage to allow the fuel to GUSH out of the line.. UNTIL the debis covers the outlet again.. If u look closely at the bottom of the tank, you’ll see a petcock.. THATS THE FUEL TANK DRAIN.. Open it up and water & garbage should drain out.. 9x outta 10.. it’s clogged & you’ll need a wire coat hanger jammed up inside’r to get it freed up.. Once u get the drain cleaned out & the tank back-blown, hook all the lines back up & CHANGE THE FILTERS.!!! Loosen the line going into the pump & wait until fuel starts to pour out & tighten.. Push the stop cable to the RUN POSITION.. Move the THROTTLE TO WIDE OPEN.. and try to start it.. if it doesn’t start after multiple times, loosen ALL THE LINES AT THE INJECTORS..& try to start again.. crank until fuel starts to spit out of the loosened lines and NO AIR.. THEN TIGHTEN up the lines. It’ll start now.. Once u get it running, start putting the fittings back on the top cover.. COUNT TO 5 between adding another fitting.. this will tell u what is clogged up..but experience tells me it’ll b either the 1st fitting or the last line going to the tank.. Good luck.
That is pretty good. So, I eluded to the fact that this engine has a transfer pump, sounds like maybe that was missed in this conversation. We did run a test and got fuel gushing. I even Declan the inlet fitting but I will go back and insure a supply. That was really the first thing we checked, sounded just like a failed pump. For sport the helper even changed it out as we had one. At one point had a pretty healthy stream by gravity. This has been good help, as soon as I can am going to start right over. Was kind of a surprise, we done this half a dozen times.
First time I put it together didn't even bleed inj lines, brought fuel up to it, started right up and cleared smooth in 15 seconds or so. BTW, this is on JD 310. I forget what model, MD something. Old enough it had the Bristol screw. Had relatively new filter on it with clear bowl.
I had the fuel tank out of a dresser the other day, different job. No transfer pump on that one. I was thinking it might be a problem due to the head difference but it zipped right up. Fixed the tank, super cleaned it before putting top on.
if it's a JD with a transfer pump, that changes things a little. JD likes to put a big plastic suction screen around the intake inside the tank, that works great until it plugs up and gets sucked flat and blocks off the intake. There's probably enough fuel inside the plastic screen to run for oh, maybe like 30 seconds? The transfer pumps with a priming lever have a built in digital self diagnostic feature , you take your digits and pump that thing and you can tell if it's sucking against a vacuum, or pumping fuel, or pumped up the fuel and the diaphragm is not pushing back against the lever. If you know that the spring loaded diaphragm produces the fuel pressure, and the cam and/or lever retract that diaphragm, then you can figure out what it's doing. But check the outlet fitting first...
We had a mixed up day due to medical and it didn't help the trouble shooting. I took it off the other day, any problem with me taking the timing peg out of the flywheel and whizzing it around to double check the primary flow? Seems it was good, we had a little too much help at the time. Just one of those things. Never really occurred to me suction screen might be a thang. It was pouring fuel thru easy with about a foot in the tank, prolly just above the pump maybe and how much it need at idle?
I couldn't tell you if the timing gears will stay in place without the injection pump. You can check the valves to get it back to the right stroke. I'd see what you find in the outlet fittings before doing anything else.
I've had my share of pumps of that series of john deere engines and never had one go out of time there. There is not enough room for the gear to come out of mesh with the other gears
Seemsthere was a step by step manual on line for assembly of this.
Ok, we got side tracked but it runs. It's quite responsive. What adjusts the idle?
Depending on the pump #, the low idle could have 1 or 2 adjustments. If it has a screw on the lever AND 1 on the top cover. U back the one OUT on the top cover & run the one on the throttle shaft down until low idle rpm is reached.. THEN BACK IT OUT 1 full turn.. THEN run the screw on the top cover DOWN until the correct rpm is reached.. If it only has 1 screw on the throttle, run it up or down to achieve the correct rpm..
Got it, thanks. That saves me a lot of grief. Yes it has 2 screws, one on the cover. I will snap a pic today and I have one other thing to fix yet. Stuck hand throttle. This is a neighbor machine. It wasn't busy, if it was booked we would have got on this earlier but it's now starting spring thaw and I got a job come up I need it. It's not much of a loader but it digs well, needs a few minor hoses yet but it's decent tight, not all busted welded up.
Here is a pic. Seems it needs another screw on the throttle arm? To set the low?
It’s supposed to have 1.. I’ll bet I’ve seen thousands without one tho..IDK why.??
Ok, I am a little slow this morning. It seems the one on the arm limits hi speed if I am looking at it correct but that's not always for sure. Seems the little hole on the left needs a screw to set the low stop but maybe I look at this wrong.
All u gotta do is move the throttle to figure that out.. Right side is HI IDLE. Left side is LOW IDLE. (Needs screw) That’s what we’ve been talking about for these past 5 posts..
That's what I thought, I was just being clear, it needs a screw.
I wasn't the primary mechanic, this was kind of s rescue job. I thought I looked at a drawing and saw 1 screw on the linkage similar to this one, had me shop for a bit. I don't see it in the book, I will add one. I have another one identical I should have looked at but it wasn't home. As for pouring it over and pontificating here, we'll it's kind of the point isn't it? Wouldn't have much use for all this if it wasn't. Unit is running great, we need new throttle cable yet.
I had to finally put it all together as we had some incentive. I will get a couple better action shots Not much of a loader but good little digger. Dug thru a foot of frozen road no problem. We have a pretty fair operator which helps.
Thanks for the help. found a screw this morning and tuned it runs great.
Good job..
I could feel it all at idle, the adjustments worked well. Thanks for the explanation.
Is it going to hurt to bump this again? There is so much so simple and useful in here and I might wan this week and I want to order the bushing. I had one and ruined it on a stuck rescue but got so much better idear now about how to do this job. Itys not something I flag down roadside to do but it does come up on occasion and nice to be aboe to fix these for the price of the kit. First one we used the new and improved and even fixed one with the left over ring from a kit and stock a kit or 2. Even old worn out stuff works again with new ring in it.