I have noticed one thing in most TV shows and movies from the usa. Why is it that you never see an excavator equipped with rototilt. For where I'm from Sweden, so is it that the rototilt is as natural tools to the excavator as a bucket. Is it so that it is used but not seen on TV or is it that it's very rare to have it on his excavator?
Well we generally have more room to operate in so conventional tilt buckets usually work fine for weird angles etc. I have used a tilt-rotator but the extra cost of one usually is enough to scare most smaller companies off. The one I used was from Indexator and my boss it added an additional $20,000 CAD to the purchase cost of the Kobelco 5 tonner I was running. They are no doubt wonderful to have and when I do eventually buy a machine some day I'll strongly consider purchasing one. Here's some video of me digging cart paths at a golf course last year. I have pictures of some trenching work I did too, but resizing my photos is to much of a pain in the arse to bother. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_ytTOWid_g&feature=g-crec-u http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzFNtcQBW-4&feature=g-crec-u
I have been in Finland a fair amount on busines and you just don't see excavators without tiltrotators or at least just a rotator. And the work they do with them is impressive. I have been invovled in talking to some customers about a tiltrotator in the US, all is well until they see the price and the discussion ends. So, guess the US market is just not ready for a new way of doing things. But then overall, what US users do with an excavator compared to a European user is pretty amazing. The European users tend to use excavators in as many ways as possible, in the US, it is very limited in the roles it is used.
I think for the purposes of Underground Utility work a RotoTilt wouldn't hold up for very long. I could be mistaken but it doesn't appear they're robust enough to handle all the heavy lifting we do. Besides, doesn't a Gradall fill the bill for such a requirement? I have however, seen some European videos of RotoTilt equipped excavators -mostly wheeled variants with 2-piece booms- and the Operators were simply amazing making complex slopes look like childs play. For the purpose of discussion, a truly innovative attachment which allows an Ex Op to see below the surface and keep 'em from ripping outtaduhgroun things that shouldn't be, would be far more welcome. :yup
I'd have to disagree the unit I used was pretty robust and well built, it's a lot like using a tilt bucket you have to be a little more cautious for the hoses and exposed cylinder/s. In the work I usually we use a tilt bucket for all kinds of work so Gradalls here are very rare. A lot of basement outfits here don't take them off unless doing a demolition or once the ground freezes. But the biggest thing with tilt-rotators for Canadians and Americans alike is that they all come from Europe so the cost of importing one in is quite high. So really what we need is a more locally produced unit and then you would see more companies buying them.
I thnk that many people look at the rototilts as an addition to their investments and quickly decide it's too expensive. The truth is that in order to pay for itself, it has to be a replacement for personel and underutilized equipment.
245dlc, If you feel a RotoTilt can handle the rigors of lifting and setting 18,000lb concrete manhole structures on a daily basis then I stand corrected. The hydraulic hoses notwithstanding, in underground utility work an excavator spends vritually as much time as a crane lifting as it does an excavator digging. Just sayin'...
Perhaps it could be argued that worksites in Europe are generally more confined than they are in the US or Oz, so you have less room to move around and get the work done without the need for an expensive rotothingy. Then there is the problem of being more efficient, if you get paid by the hour to do a job and cause you have an fancy rototator, meaning you get the job done quicker, won't that mean you make less money? My prediction is that until operators get jobs because they have tiltogizmo versus those who do not, we won't be seeing too many of them.
Think of it this of my way, my clients know that my competitors work faster because they have rototilt why should they hire me? And perhaps with a rototilt i can use lift forks so i dont need to buy a compact loader and pay a operator for that machine. It is almost as if the only places where you see a compact loader is on the farms and the park management, you rarely se them att construction sites.
snubblaren, I don't think anyone doubts the advantages of a RotoTilt, clearly there are many but IMHO they wouldn't hold up well in Underground Utiity work done the way we do it but, that's only one type of work. It makes perfect sense to do as much as possible with as little as possible and I can't see how anyone could argue that point. In Europe they're super popular, gotta be a vaild reason for that 'cause they damn sure ain't cheap.
18,000lb... sounds like you have a machine that weighs over 30 tons? I dont think they make rototilts for machines over 30 tons. But if you dont want to wear on a rototilt when you dont need one you can always hook it off http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nphnAvwVHuc . "Europe they're super popular, gotta be a vaild reason for that 'cause they damn sure ain't cheap. " you mean that we are shopoholics for construction equipment?
Yep, When we do big projects like the one we're mobilizing now we use 30+ ton machines in this case two brandie new CAT's are comin' a 349E and 336E, scheduled to arrive by the end of the week. As for "unhooking" an attachment on an Ex, very uncommon for us to use quick couplers on Ex's, only our Loaders have 'em. Hey, nuttin' wrong with being a shopoholic so long as you don't end up broke in the process. I've been to Europe and it must be nice to have dump trucks (tippers) with a Mercedes Benz emblem on the grille. I think it would be great if someone assigned me a Mercedes Benz S500 as my work ride.
Yes we do love our mercs even my last "company car" had a merc engine http://************/crgetnk I think we are a little bit to eager to get new machines in sweden you rarely se a backhoe with more than 10 000 hours on it, i think its pretty stupid to buy a machine everey 3-4 years when you can have one at least the double time.....
10,000hrs? Tell 'ya what, with the outfit I'm working for now if a machine MAKES it to 10k it's a miracle. On my Pipe Crew we have a Deere 642J with 6896hrs on the clock and it's already long overdue for retirement. One of our Survey Parties came out today and told me the main office yard has 8 new CAT 938K's sittin' there gettin' "company-ized". For my project we should be assigned a new 962K but so far that's only rumor. But back to the Merc's, yeah I still want an S500 they can even apply all the reflective company graphics and I promise to keep it clean as a whistle...
Your machines perhaps get more beating than a excavator that for the most of thimes only digs holes for pipes and drainage for houses
Oh yeah, We ride 'em hard an put 'em up wet EVERYDAY! Standard Operating Procedure (SOP) for us is to run them until they break, completely bass-akwards I know. I just work here but so long as our Safety Man is pacified we stay focused on production. We recently have been slammed with more work than we've got machines or personnel and the "powers that be" don't want to hire anyone except dump truck drivers until the economy shows some long term viability and I understand that completely. It will mean 10 hours a day, 7 days a week with only Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Years off for the next few months. Uncle Sam is going to be REEEEAL happy with us come tax time for sure.
Guess it's a lot to do with "stick with what you know" in Oz it's usual to bring an excavator and a skid steer to the party. Sure I'd love to have just one machine do all the work but how are you going to get tonnes of material from out the back of a site, into a truck and then bring in tonnes of base material? I take it you're talking about road work? Where you can have a truck parked next to the job.
That's pretty cool, here is an even cooler one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fZl8bgHjTQ&feature=related I can see the benefits of the set up but how will it stand up in the real world of dirt and rough operators? I would think there are a lot of precision bits to make the auto hyd couplers work.
Hendrick, I hear you loud and clear! I was just turned on to the Oil Quick quick coupler by a fellow member. Our Fleet Manager is now looking into these, we need them for our loaders, we would like to purchase hydraulically adjustable forks and jib booms but not have to dismount everytime we hook 'em on, we swap attachments constantly throughout the day.
We usualla do this when we want material to the excavator: http://www.google.se/url?source=img...8wc4Eg&usg=AFQjCNFI5TwhlISxBDhpZ7B6j8KkjVhKRg
That's a cool idea but it would never work for most of the jobs that the company I work for does. Nor would the wheeled machine for that matter!
But the best thing with rototilts is this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-H7JAMopvU
Very cool but, not practical here. We do good keeping hoses on top of the boom let alone a very expensive and exposed attachment.
Huh? One slice of sausage and a poorly poured beer? Bugger that I'm going to IKEA for Köttbullas. Although using an excavator we could have a go at the worlds largest pancake, which is 15 meters in diameter and weighs 3 tonnes. What size machine will we need?
I don't think it would hold up in the American market. We are a big dealer for track loaders and because of that had the field follow units. ( 953 and 963D) We were having problems and found out the French built them to hold up to their operators, the French babied them and looked after them as though they had bought and paid for them themselves. American operators beat the crap out of them and found all the weak links. This is one difference between US and Europe. I have put some tilting buckets on the M318 wheel loaders and on a long reach 320.
It could do well for smaller specialized firms that have little or no turnover of operators, like these that build pools, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9NcaLi48Vg Or for working in cities with alot of underground piping, they are great for working around, under, besides, between piping and cables. Bad operators can kill everything, even a prybar can be broken.......