We recently bought a couple used 14 yrd pans. We’re finally getting around to using one of them. Question on the cutting edges that load the pan. Both of these pans have 3 bolt on blades and the one in the middle sticks down about 3” further than the 2 outside blades. They look original like they’ve not been replaced. Is that normal? I don’t see being able to get a smooth grade with it like that. I’m new to pans so I really don’t know lol. Thanks
Someone else will give you a more real answer than I. My baby scraper has a similar configuration. I think the extended blade in the middle is to pull the cutting edge into the dirt. Somewhere, someone referred to it as a frost blade. On my little 5 yd. scraper, I don’t think it will dig in frozen ground.
Having the centre section lower is normal and makes it easier to pull when loading. Some change the centre section to straight across for final trim but usually elevator scrapers loading windrows.
Ok it makes sense then. Like I said I didn’t think they had been changed. Thanks
Yes its normal. Think of it as a plow.....that one will penetrate and help spread dirt to the others on the outside to gather.
Didn't Cat or somebody refer to that as a 'stinger' configuration as opposed to flat for finish work?
If the center bit has 2 rows of bolt holes that usually means it can be used as a stinger bit or a straight bit. Bob
Never thought of that I’ll look when I get to the farm!!
Otherwise torch it level with the others if you deem it a problem.
this is the cutting-edge set-up on the old Issacson KS1200 i'm currently converting to hydraulic
Tenfo I see that one has double row of bolt holes so it can be mounted in a straight line.
Yup, the previous owner spared no expense when it came to the edges. Makes it a little more versatile when you need to use it in a variety of conditions but a bit of a pita to change back and forth
Tenfo I can imagine those plow bolts aren’t gonna come loose easily. I still haven’t looked at ours I bet it’s the same way.
1" drive air wrench and big air hose
How level should the pan be when connected tot he tractor.
Out middle cutting edge has provisions to move it as well
Kinda looks like your cutting bits are welded on inside out, Bob
I’ll have to clean the dirt of but I’m sure they’re not welded. I’ve let it down now but here’s a pic from the side they’re facing correctly
If they are not welded, why are there no bolts in the holes? If they are good through-hardened edges, most often they will break loose beside the weld bead area because of the heat treating especially if used in stones or other impact conditions. If they are cheaper carbon-steel, not so much. The correct bolts are called 'dome head scraper bolts' and are usually available in a couple of tensile ratings. Sometimes if the frog is worn out guys will try to weld them on but the correct way is to repair the frog first and then bolt them on
I guess they could be welded I haven’t looked I just took it for granted they would be bolted on but now I’m going to check for sure. I just figured they had more bolt holes in them and the one showing were so you could position in different places but you may be right
They definitely have bolts and not welded. Judging from wear parts and points and the fact that there’s still paint on many sections in the bowl I’d say this pan has had very little use.
They definitely have bolts and not welded. Judging from wear parts and points and the fact that there’s still paint on many sections in the bowl I’d say this pan has had very little use.
They definitely have bolts and not welded. Judging from wear parts and points and the fact that there’s still paint on many sections in the bowl I’d say this pan has had very little use. Won’t let me load a pic right now lol
learn something new some days, I'd never heard of dome head scraper bolts. Looks like they're stronger than grade 8 but only available in 5/8" and up. 1/2" and under you still use plow bolts I guess.
I haven’t changed any on a scraper. I’ve only replaced cutting edges on dozer blades. I’ve always called them plow bolts
IMHO 2 things I see that aren't right. Firstly the cutting edges are fitted upside down and secondly they look like cutting-edges for a dozer. The give away is the bevelled edge.
They look reversible to me. What makes them upside down? Like I said I’m sure they’re original to the pan so I’m not sure what they used
Actually it does look like it’s welded along the top of the blades. I didn’t look real close when I saw the bolts
If you wear the edge into the bolt holes you won’t be able to flip them.
Understand that but looks like they have a long ways to go
Yes they are reversible but the bevelled edge should be underneath facing to the rear. Same as a cutting edge on a dozer or grader. If they are left as is hitting anything solid the edges will snap
yes, they're reversible. Upside down in this case means the bevel has the wrong side facing forward, it should have the flat of the bevel riding on the ground so it maintains closer to the same angle as it wears. I don't think I'd bother since they're welded. But if you wanted to change them, then remove the bolts and back up slowly while dropping the pan, they'll break right off, assuming the bottom edge isn't welded also. Do you think they're really that low of use, or just had new edges and no use on the new edges?
Look at post#18 the beveled edge is facing the tractor your saying that wrong? The bolts wouldn’t fit in the blades if they were flipped over. They look like they have tapered holes. I’m really confused. I hate to sound ignorant lol.
The picture in post 26 is with the bowl in the dump position that’s why they’re standing up.
Yea very little wear or missing paint on these pans. I bought two. They were hooked together. The man bought them new and leveled a 9 acre lot with them. That’s all they’ve ever been used for. He passed away and they’ve been sitting for a bit
If that's the case then they have been manufactured wrong. Those edges are going to wear quite fast until they get to the proper meat. It something to look for when you replace them.
U have any pics or reference to the correct mounting and what they should look like. This is the first pan we’ve had. Thanks
https://www.bluediamondattachments.com/product/bolt-on-edge-36-wnuts-bolts/ Here you can see that the bolt holes are square and this is the same way up as your cutting-edges. The counter sunk round holes will be on the other side. Hope this clears things up for you. I've used this as an example only and not necessarily for your pan.
Is this any help.? Looking from the side along the cutting edges. #4 shows the centre edge in the lower position, #5 in the higher position, by virtue of the second set of bolt holes. See how the bevel on the bottom of the edge is the same orientation at the ground. Yours are the other way round to what's shown.
Also, just look at my previous post of the picture of the edges on my old Issacson. Edges have the most strength when the bottom row of holes is used. In the stinger configuration, the centre edge sacrifices strength because it will most likely break through the holes. In impact conditions( stones and rocky), the centre edge should be moved up to the lower set of holes for maximum strength and will also help to prevent bending the frog underneath. I agree that your edges seem to be made differently than most conventional edges
Yea that’s a clear picture and according to that mine are upside down
I think there made the same they’re just upside down. Well maybe lol. But as I said before I don’t think the bolts will go in from the other side. I’ll definitely check it out shortly thanks to all for the info
As strange as it may seem that’s just the way mine is made. It looks like the classic case of tomato tomaatto to me. This is a pic of the other one. Same way and I can’t see much if any difference if it was flipped around. The way mine sits to the ground looks more natural to me idk. Plus like I said. The bolts will only go in from one side. It has a countersunk hole and definitely cannot be installed upside down. Also after closer inspection mine isn’t welded along the top it was just dirt I was seeing. Both pans are the same and neither one has a broken cutting edge it must be working. I’m not touching it till one breaks lol. Thanks again for looking.
Question though this pan isn’t as wide as tires on tractor. I can’t see the bottom when using it. Any tips on knowing when it starts to make contact with the ground other than seeing dirt in the bowl? Even then u wouldn’t know right away. I guess eventually get the feel of it but I was just wanting to know for being smooth and not gouging the ground. It’s a 9180 400hp Steiger it don’t feel like much behind it.
I don’t have a clue when it comes to posting these pics lol
A bit further investigation would suggest your cutting-edges are for a wheel loader which bolt on underneath the bucket.
Well that’s good to know if I need to replace any of them. Thanks
Well, i thought of that too but the ones i changed on wheel loaders and excavators had the edges bolted to the bottom of the buckets with the bevel to the top and the bolt heads on the top of the bucket with the countersunk holes on the bottom of the edge otherwise you would wear off the bolt heads if they were underneath
Yeah that makes sense. I’m gonna clean them up and see maybe of there’s a part number stamped in them anywhere. If there is or was it’s probably worn or on the underside lol
The underside of those holes is flush? not the same countersunk hole as the top?
Yep here’s the backside
That pic shows they can’t take a plow bolt the other way. What make are the pans. Maybe the mfr just built them like that. I don’t think I’d worry about orientation they’re on and tight just use em. Nothing moves dirt like a scraper in the right conditions
Exactly what I said they been working all along. No issues whatsoever that I know about. I’ll use em till I can’t lol. They’re Prime Manufacturing pans. They’re no longer in business
And I got a chance to play with it a little bit. I can see how to line up the top of the bowl with the wheel bracket and other places I can kinda tell where I’m at with the blades. Plus u can tell when they start digging even a little bit really. I’ve got a good bit of dirt to move it’ll be a fun experience
Referring to my last post about the loader buckets, i should have said bolt heads on the bottom and the nuts on top of the bucket. oops i guess i'm losing it, just like my wife always reminds me
I’ve never seen cutting edges like yours on any towed scraper or motor scraper.They appear to have been fitted wrong.Perhaps that’s how things are done.I don’t like them. Over the years,I’ve bought various cutting edges for my towed and motorised scrapers,and I do like having the center edges dropped.They are considerably more profitable to me that way. On another note,I’ve tried various brands of edges too.Some are really quite thick,yet I prefere the slimmer genuine Cat edges on my bowels.They seem to stay sharper and load easier.It could be my imagination,but it puts beer in my glass. These days,I only buy Cat edges for scraper bowls.
Sorry you don’t like them I’m just gonna run them they seem to have been working properly as they are. I don’t think the blades realize they’re on upside down lol
Yikes As sharp as those edges are, I doubt you'll know the difference for a while. If you ever turn them around, put the flat edge forward and see how they act half worn, if you ever get there.
I’m hoping I’ve turned my last scraper edges to be honest. Never say never though
At least when they get worn and its time to turn them, they weigh less