many of you have posted accounts of the screammin 2 stroke diesel jimmys ,used at one time!ive been told ,they made big power, lasted well between overhauls! made tons of noise!! (cool to me) but no one here has told me why the end of this power-house 671! please enlighten me! dad ran cat stuff since i was a kid in the 60s , he never thought much of euclid stuff! but some of you guys think its great!!!!! i think thats real cooLLLLLLL i lived just miles from the euclid plant! and saw acres of there stuff outside waitin for the train!!!
Hmmm, are you asking what brought about the demise of the 2 stroke Detroit???
HuH? what did you say? I owe a lot of my hearing loss to sitting on top of those screamers in cab over Fords. All day long hitting gears picking up trash. they would always start and were always loud. Must be why I have one in my dump truck. HuH?
death of the detroit diesel 2 stroke In the lates 80`s the engine makers saw the writing on the wall about the coming snog and pollution rules for diesels. There is no way a 2 stroke diesel could ever meet these rules. So they phased out the 53 and 71 series engines. Also about the time GM sold off detroit diesel. Despite all the great lore about these engines. They had there faults. 1. not much torque as compared to a cat,mack or cummins engine 2. They would as my dad put it slober oil a low idle. 3. And yes they were loud but not in a good way if there is one. The sound they made would drive a man crazy after while. :Banghead It was so high pitched! But in there defense they were cheaper compared to other engines and they were simple to work on and the parts were cheap and easy to get.
any diesel shouldn't idle ,with the jimmy it was oil and fuel ..on the for stroke fuel loading into the exhaust ...any Diesel well get rotten if idling for extended periods The oil they let off at idle was due in part to poor scavenging in the cycle..they all load up ... they used more fuel ..twice as many power strokes over a four stroke..... Emissions ,fuel efficiency and in some small part the need for quieter running Diesel as noise pollution became a bit of an issue back in the 80's
Heres mine. http://www.vimeo.com/2987098
A place where the Detroit still lives on... I can't say all their trucks do, but all of the Fire Trucks I've heard from the Knoxville Fire Dept still use the Detroit 8V-92T. I was sittin' on the couch today viewing HEF when I heard the Federal siren coming down my street and stop 3 houses down. It seemed one of my neighbors caught his mattress on fire. He wasn't hurt, and the KFD quick response got it out. Company 11 engine showed up first, within minutes Company 15 engine and ladder showed up. You could here those 92's hummin' before they even turned on my street, music to my ears.
Here’s a little Detroit music. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1YXx4kytNU
We've got a 6V92TA in two of our trucks, I think they were bought in '96 and '97. The two newr trucks have the Series 60 in them. When I was a kid, the largest town in the area had a Seagrave ladder truck with an 8V71 in it. Their firehouse was 13 miles away, but if the wind was right I could hear them pull out responding to an alarm.
Part of that is actually false. A mechanical 2-stroke detroit can and has met tier II & III emissions. So if anybody has the smog police after them for their detroit let me point you in the right direction. The proof http://www.arb.ca.gov/eqpr/kits/ccts/ccts.htm The Place http://www.cctskit.com/ The real question is why the hell detroit dropped the 2-strokes in favor of 4-strokes just to have some private company show them up with technology. They spent millions on computer programs to clean them up and never could get it to work. This is the best example of KISS I have every seen. To my knowledge the only mechanical engine to meet emissions. The noise is just a matter of opinion. If you don't like it get a better muffler.
I'm still livin' your childhood, Steve. Fire company 11 is just about a mile and a half from my house, one of the reasons I bought this house. In Knoxville, the fire dept has the duty of being "first responders" on any 911 emergency call. Car wreck, heart attack at home, anything that's an emergency. I sit here many times and here that engine going in various directions around me, you can hear that 92T humming for miles with that siren wailing. The 92T is one sweet sounding engine when they're stepping on it to answer a call.
92's The fire company here has an Oshkosh four wheel drive airport crash truck with a 8v92 in it.Rear mounted on basically a sraight pipe.It's cool to see/hear it on the road.They hook it up to hydrant when training and or testing the pumps and just hold it wide open throttle-for minutes at a time:drinkup Dominion
when my uncle taught me to drive a truck it was a 1974 freightliner with a 350 detroit the part of slobering out oil was true if under1000 rpm's i hauled lumber and wood chips in the mtn's of western n.c. with it and when you got with in seein distance of a good hill the engine could smell it and start lugging down lol. some yrs. later i drove a lnternational 4300 with a v12 it had enough power you could go through the bottom 4 of a 13 speed and get on it real good and break the yoke at the rear end the v 12 had some power but they did lose some oil i had a guy tell me 1 time that when they shiped them in a crate they showed up 1 gallon low.
You will still find a lot of 6-71s in older boats. I have a pair of 6-71 TIs making 410 horses each in my Gulfstar. I get many comments on how nice they sound as I am coming in or leaving my slip. (I know, it's not heavy equipment, but Detroit 2 strokes have a big marine following too!) Rick
How do you get 410hp out of a 6/71? That's almost double the factory rating. How long does the engine last at that rate?
If you will notice most marine applications can be rated near double what it would be for anything that is on the ground. Part of it is almost unlimited cooling that is available from the sea. Of course they don't last that long rated so high, but while they are running they really run.
Unlimited cooling and that they never lug or are shock loaded lets them live at high hp settings. Not only Detroits, but any diesel. I saw a pair of marine 3208's at the Cat house years ago that were 425 apiece, incredible as that may sound. For an example of a current engine, the QSC 8.3L Cummins is rated up to 600hp for recreational marine.
I think marinized 3208 cats can be rated over 500hp!! The highest rated detroit that I know of is a racing 8v96 (not a typo) 1775hp, in stock and ready to rock for $75k. This is the shop that it was built in http://www.jackbivens.com/ talk about a screamin' jimmy!!
My grandpa was a HUGE Detroit fan. I think he ought things just because that is what powered it. I can think of @ 7 238's that are still hanging around. Dad later bought a old state truck with a 6v ? in it. I was working for a guy that lived about 3 miles from dads house. Anyhow, I heard it screaming one day, I told the boss that dad would be by shortly. He asked how I knew? I can hear him, he just left the house. Bull---- wanna bet? $50 ok Here comes dad, pay up!!!!!!
a man in cleveland ,ga lawrence pilgrim his entire trucking fleet was dietroit's. i liked a dietroit i like the 60 series as well even though they don't sound the same i've seen the 60's eat a cat up on I-77 in w.v.
410 hp from a 6-71 with a turbo, intercooler and fuel cooler is near the top for long life marine aplication. Coddington built mine. Johnson & Tower ran them up higher but unless you were careful they tended to launch parts. Sport fishing boats had the high hp versions and ran them at max continuous or higher for the runs out to the tuna/shark grounds. Compaired to a dozer I guess there is little shock load, but if you get a lot of "air" with the boat and the props clear the water things can take quite a torque load. Lets not even think about contacting the bottom. Rick
Detriots From what I gathered when Roger Penske bought detriot diesel, they did not want to any effort into 2 cycle emmisions research. You probably have it right about the private company showing them up.
Detriot 2 cycle fleets Ronnie, I can well recall many fleets here in San Diego Ca with 2 cycle Detriots almost exclusively. Between R.E. Hazard Contracting, Sim J Harris Co, V.R. Dennis Const Co,H.G. Fenton, Daley Corp, C.W. McGrath Inc, Woodward Sand & Enniss Enterprises, there must have been 250-300. Mostly 318 H.P. 8V71's with the 4" dual exhaust. They died off slow slowy I did not notice untill there were none left
Dd The 92&60 series were they 2 stroke.i've read were the 92 make alot of power. My brother had a 350 Cummins in a Int coal truck he said he would kill a DD on the hills in Ohio . But he also said on the flats the DD would fly by. He also said you would here it screaming as she came on !!:usaJim
i just wanted to say thanks for all the replies about the "jimmys" out there!looks to me that there are more fans than not for those cool soudin jimmys! thanks for all the input! i learn a lot from you guys!!!!!!!
The Detroit 92 series is 2 cycle and the Detroit 60 series is 4 cycle. The biggest farm tractor ever made has a 16V92 with 760HP and 2372ft/lbs of TQ. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjDshU8pDxI&feature=related
Our Mine has a few Screamin Jimmys lurking around. Does that ever make for a pleasant shift! The tractor that pulls our Portable Gen-Set to move the Shovels is an '81 Western Star day cab with one. I had never seen one before and was sure I had blown something the first times running it. Still seems odd cruising at over 2 grand all the time.
Here's a screaming Jimmy This belongs to a friend of mine just East of Flagstaff. One of the nicest guys you would ever want to run into but boy he builds some crazy cars. I believe this one has an 8V71. Its still in the building process but you can be sure it will scream when it's all done.
that truck is way cool!!!!!!!! thanks for the photo! can you tell us more about whats, gone into the build!!!!!!
When I was in high school, one of my friends was the son of John Haddock (J. E. Haddock, Ltd.) who was a major contractor in the L.A. area. He built much of the southern part of the Harbor Freeway, and did 101 on Conejo Grade. He ran GMCs exclusively for years, until at least 1958. DW-970's with 6-71s and maybe 6-110s for long haul equipment moving, DW-660s with 4-71s for dump trucks, and had a DW-450 with a 3-71 for a lube turck. He also ran a lot of Allis Chalmers bulldozers and tractor shovels, HD-5G with a 2-71, to HD-20 with a 6-110. Sweet!! I especially liked the 900 cfm air compressors running with 6-110s after GM started putting Roots on them instead of centrifugal blowers.
were the jimmys concidered 2- stroke because of the air that was pushed down them with the turbo and blower?
No, it is a 2 stroke engine because it uses 2 stroke to complete the running cycle. First stroke - compression stroke. Second stroke - power stoke. Then the process repeats. The blower is just how they accomplished eliminating the intake and exhaust strokes that are used on a 4 stroke engine.
Yeah but they cheated and used exhaust valves. We fired up an old 300 KW generator last week with a 6V-92, funnest thing I've done in awhile. It ran absolutely wonderful for about 10 minutes, then the poor generator exploded. I wish I had enough sense to videotape some things!
Hi I to love the sound of a jimmy I used to drive a heavy recovery tow truck fitted with an 8v92t and wood just love to load her up and pull up a hill to here it scream, Here are some video's of a hot up jimmy in the worlds fastest truck http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iRPjtLrsU8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFJYqILwa1U http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krAYoUSgkeU This is best one to here it scream
Dangit now I want one. One of those bad boys would be awesome in my truck with a couple of stacks. I'm tempted, but I bet it would be a nightmare to get a trans/t-case to work out.
Counter, I am going to try to go and meet him one of these weekend so I can get the low down. May take a bit but I'll get back to you. JD.
I bought my 4-53 with the intentions of putting it in my CUCV, plan on using a divorced transfer case but still want to keep it part time. Although a NP203with the hubs unlocked probably wouldn't be that bad. Is yours a shortbed? From this truck To this one
Nah it's a long bed. It's already got way to much money invested so I probably won't be changing this build. I put a 76' Chevy body on it but it's an 85' Dodge with a 67' 440. Not a good way to build a truck I can tell you that. Wish I would've started with a CUCV or something like you did.
OK ill bite whats a CUCV???
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commercial_Utility_Cargo_Vehicle
Thanks when i was there all we had were 3/4 tons.:usa:usa
Mines a '86, the trucks are 1 & 1/4 ton capacity and the blazer version are all 3/4ton.
I was working a job today in the back yard of a house on a back road. The road had a long incline at this point with the place I was working at about half way to the top. While I was working, I heard the distinctive sound of a Detroit going through the gears. I hadn't heard it in so long I had to stop what I was doing and walk out front to see what was coming. It was an old IH Fleetstar 6 wheel dump with a 6V53 in it downshifting like nobody's business. It had a equipment trailer on back with a 3" caliper maple tied down. It was sweet to hear that sound again!
LoL, the drilling company I used to work for had a Fleetstar with a 6V-53. Had a 2,000 gal water tank on it. When loaded it couldn't get out of it's own way...but it made a lot of noise going nowhere fast.
I am so thankful for youtube.I get my fix of whatever I need to hear at the moment.There are Detroits of all configurations there and I have good sound systems on the two computers that I use the most. There are some videos of a Mack Superliner with the 500hp V8 on there that sound so sweet...........I have to hear them again every few weeks.One is pulling a long hill,it is about seven minutes long,right hand drive but who cares,it is music I tell ya'.The title is Tawoomba Range or something like that..........it is in Australia.I mean it,every week or two I search it out,that engine has a bark like no other. There are plenty more but that one stands out to me,those aussies know how to dress up a truck.That youtube keeps me off the street and out of trouble.LOL.Ron G
:drinkup
screamin jimmy's thanks for all the replys! i never knew what the scream was all about till i came to this forum. im the son of an operator, not a operator! a few years ago,the rural city i live in chose to dig a flood control pond very close to where i live.the winning contractor dug out a pond at least 3 acres! they used an old d-6, and a green machine with a chrome stack! the green machine looked to be the size as the d6 i wathched them on a few occaisions, they worked like a real team! i would get home and would hear a motor screamin for a half hour or so! now you guys have taught me about the jimmys! i loveeeeeee the screammmmmmm!
You realize that is a mack v8? Not a detroit. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C80JnUaJPQs Here is a detroit. Sounds just a little different. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krAYoUSgkeU
Yes,thanks for the heads up though.That engine is legendary.I should have made it clear in my post.Ron G
This has to be the coolest ride ever!!!!!!
that roadster is wayyyyyyyyy cool!, id love to hear it bark!!!!!!
Pissed of Pete is actually not nearly as cool as it looks from a hot rodders point of view. Those drag headers are cool but are completely lacking in the performance stand point. The stock headers hold a lot more heat resulting in close to a third more power. The air intake is another point to pick at. When did diesels need restriction of any kind at small throttle openings. My personal opinion is all go and no show. Lime green 12v71tti@950hp in anything that will hold up would be wayyyy cooler IMO. Have you guys seen the 12v92 in a super duty ford at Bonneville? Now that is cool. This builder leans way farther towards the artistic part than the mechanical part. If you haven't gathered I'm the exact opposite.
still wayyyy cool! ive never,seen, nor heard of anyone using a diesel in a street rod! its really a cool idea, because street rods are an extension of the builders dreams! they generally dont get raced,so build ur dream! different is good! if every street rod had a hemi or big block chevy, wheres the fun part of originality? it would be cool to see some guys stuffing rolls royce or allison aircraft motors in the rides! im not suggesting using "cat" motors in a street rod. but if it works for you, do it!!!!!
sweet ride there, man. you built that from a kit, i would imagine, no?
I wish i could claim that. But I can't.. It may not be a practical ride,but it is awful cool,that is why I posted it:cool2
You're right from a technical point of view, but that still is a very impressive work of art, even if it's not very practical. Reminds me of Jay Leno's tank engine- powered rod, or this GMC Twin Six V12- powered jalopy.
Many years ago when one of my first jobs out of the union hall was running a LeTourneau Model C Pull. If I remember correctly it had a V-8 GMC in it . It really sounded sweet. Hearing protection was almost unheard of. We used small balls of cotton dampened with saliva. My most used word now is --- HUH ? We shifted the gear box with our right foot. You weren't considered a scraper operator until you had broken the gear shift off with your foot.
I always like to see projects like that have as few technical flaws as artistic. No matter how its dressed its still a detroit. Why not make it a happy detroit? Drag headers and butterfly valve intakes do not make a happy detroit! I will guarantee it! If he wanted a gas motor why didn't he use one? Instead he dressed it up to look like one and made it run really poor in the process. Some chrome turbos hung on stock chrome headers would look just as good if not better and performance would go from 250hp to a possible of 950. Those are some facts mixed with my opinion. What would you guys choose if you were building?
Quantum, I was trying to be agreeable and not start an argument in my earlier post when I said that you were "technically correct", but in truth the "facts" in your initial post simply aren't valid. How do you figure that the "stock headers hold a lot more heat resulting in close to a third more power"? That's true in a turbocharged engine where the heat energy is used to spin the tubine, but in a naturally aspirated or roots-blown engine- gas or diesel- you want to get that exhaust heat and backpressure out of the engine as quickly as possible. If what you were saying was true Pro Stock drag cars as well as NASCAR would be running iron manifolds. It's true that many racers wrap or coat their headers to hold in heat, but this is more a function of keeping the heat out of the engine compartment with a tiny hp gain as a bonus. In fact, the biggest gain I've ever seen claimed for header coatings or wraps is 3%. The loop-scavenged two stroke Detroit is particularly sensitive to exhaust backpressure and opening up the exhaust on a non-turbo model will make it run better, but at the cost of an increase of the infamous Detroit Howl. As for the intake butterflys, they're wide open in the picture with the car (truck?) apparently shut down, which indicates to me that they're fixed in the open position. If they are they wouldn't pose an intake restriction to the big Detroit. The way I see it he hasn't hurt the output of the engine, which if otherwise stock should be 400+ hp, but he hasn't helped it, either. A pulling 12v71 with four turbos and 240mm injectors would have been a better choice.:drinkup
I'm not trying to be disagreeable. Sorry I came across that way. The only reason that I know a detroit does not take kindly to header modifications is reading about one of the original detroit drag trucks. The name escapes me at the moment but it was Toyota with a 471 that was cranking out some serious HP. You may be correct about the turbo comment because I can't remember but I would assume that it had one. So any how the guy spent a lot of time making a better flowing exhaust only to be a complete failure in performance. It did look cool though. The butter fly valves are indeed open but those little holes are still little. A detroit sucks a huge amount of air. Think about it a 12v71 will use around a 1000 cfm at 2000rpm. A big cam cummins will use half that. In no way am I trying to start an argument. I just hate to see someone spend that much time on something that in my mind is a flop and the sheeple think its great. I think its great, but it could of been "holy ****" great. Ya know what I mean?
I didn't at all mean that you were being ornery- what I meant was that I was trying not to come across as a smug, know it all jacka$$ (which I am, but I want to keep it a secret ) so I agreed with you even though I wasn't completely convinced of what you were saying. I do get your drift,though- the guy uses a diesel and dresses it up with hi performance gas engine parts rather than building a true high performance diesel. But, wrong or right I still dig it!:drinkup
Hey Dave, I've already had to concede to ya' once that you was right...am I going to have to do it again? (please don't make me do it) :lmao :drinkup
I operated Champion graders and TS 18 and TS 24's with Screamin' Jimmies. They were a dependable old engine and pretty much bullet proof. They did have their faults, particularly in a grader. They took a long time to get their revs up and have no torque at low revs and cannot lug, something you needed in a grader when finishing in the days before power shifts. The noise issue was pretty much a self inflicted thing as when they were well muffled in a grader they weren't bad. Owners of Euclid/Terex scrapers often took the rear muffler off the back engine so the operator could hear it and not incorrectly shift the rear transmission when the engine was running wide open. The trannies in those old machines were a touch fragile and it didn't take much to wreck them through operator error. Like many other operators, my hearing isn't all that good, some of it caused by these engines but a lot of it from the whistling of turbos on engines like those in the D8H, etc.. Our own faults but back then nobody worried much about hearing loss, what with rock and roll, Thrush mufflers, etc!
2cycle diesels (love them) I have worked on 3-71,6-71,6121T, 8V71TI,12V71 16V71, 6-110, 12V149 with 2 roots & 4 turbos, 3-268A,8-286A 8-278,12-278,12-567 and 16-567, and throw in a Fairbanks Morse 10 38 1/8D and they all screamed and now I wear 2 hearing aids But I think my real hearing damage was caused by M2 .50 cal. and 7.62. Also some very loud 4 stroke ALCO 251 V16's all were Marine engines inside steel hulls
Yes, any of those things would do it! Kinda like an old friend of mine whose hearing was not very good. The doctor asked him if he thought anything could have damaged his hearing...he replied.."ya. five years in the artillery"!
I am with you on the V8 Mack makes me just slobber listening to it Wishthatthey still made the superliners here in th US and the v8 was a option but the tree huggers got their way again as per normal .