CAT0299DLGTC00836 I went to grease up today and noticed the plate over the "bore?" (that's what the manual calls it) was missing. The grease zerts were sheared off and the bolts are broken off an inch inside the frame. Any suggestions?
I saw a mates 922 bout to have the same problem. Every time he changed direction the track frame would hammer against that plate. When I told what was going on he said the tracks and sprockets were worn and that's what the thumping noise was. So I hopped onto the seat so he could see for himself and seeing is believing. He was waiting for the delivery of a new one so wasn't to concerned .
My tracks and sprocket look good. I can't just order another plate because the bolts are broken inside the bore.
Drill and extract with an ez out. Either that or replace the torsion axle (which is $$$)
Those two bolts and the cover look awful small for the size of the track frame assembly. That would indicate to me that in normal use they are not going to carry much in the way of load. If that is the case then wouldn't the amount of thrust required to shear the bolts be an indication of something amiss (aka worn) deeper inside the assembly..?
Probably. What is the name/function of it?
Are there not bushes in the track frame at both the inside end and outside ends of the axle shaft..? Wear in those would be my first thought. #3 in the illustration below.
There is a spacer between track frame and torsion axle. Seen them break and then you get about 3/8" end play and it just pounds that little plate until the bolts fatigue and break.
Exackery. That was the thumping as per my earlier post. Jeffery, after you fix this side check the other side. You'll see the movement I described.
Assuming I can get the bolts out, I need to get a spacer and a plate and reinstall?
The spacers are item #3 in the 2nd pic Nige attached. You should be able to see them if you can get the track frame moved out and away from the machine slightly.
If you notice the spacers are missing you'll have to remove the track frame from the torsion axles to replace them, that may make it a little easier to remove the bolts. Usually a broken bolt like that will spin out fairly easy because it no longer has any tension on it, sometimes you can hook it with a small pick or you could try a reverse drill bit. Or as was mentioned, just drill it and use an easy out. If the spacer is there and you have to work on it as is, I would run it up on some blocks to get it at a better working height.
Jeffrey, If I'm reading 92U3406 & Tones right the spacers are on the INSIDE. There are four of them Item #3 (circled), so it's not just a case of getting a new one and installing it under the (currently missing) plate on the outside. Some disassembly will be required if you discover the inside spacer is missing, but as Tones said the disassembly may actually improve the access to remove the broken bolts. It's also my guess that, if you find the inside spacer is indeed AWOL, that the bushings in the outside of the track frame will also be pretty well pounded out as a result of the back-and-forth movement resulting from the missing spacer. Co-incidentally they are also Item #3 (but a different Part Number) in the second illustration.
I've replaced a few of those bushings. Not sure about the 299D specifically but on the 289D they're just a chincy little split bushing. Most cases they can be removed with a punch and hammer. New ones don't sit super tight and usually can be driven in with a bushing driver and hammer. Its not a super huge job to get the track frames off. Jack/block up the machine level. Then if you take the hose guard/guide off the frame and snip a few zip ties on the drive hoses/speed sensor wires under the cab you can pretty much just slide the whole frame out of the torsion axles with a pallet jack, forklift or overhead crane without removing hoses. Don't need to take it out super far, just enough to do what you need to do.
Track off first I assume..?
I've always left the tracks on the frame when I've done it.
I guess with them being rubber tracks it doesn't make a lot of difference weight-wise. I wanted to clarify for Jeffrey's benefit if the track needed to come off or could stay on.
For some reason I struggle with those rubber tracks. So if I can avoid taking them off I will.
So I jack up and level the machine, remove the the hose plate, snip the zip ties, remove the bolts and plate from the front torsion axle, get something that will lift it up, the whole frame will slide out. Does that sound right?
By the sounds of it, pretty much that's it. Just make sure that you securely block the machine chassis so that it can't possibly move while you are pulling & twisting on the track frame. Simply jacking up the machine frame and leaving it supported on the jacks is NOT acceptable in my book.
Pretty much. I wouldn't slide it 100% off, just enough to see if those spacers are there and not missing/pounded out. It can be a pain sometimes to get those torsion axles to line back up.
I'd leave to cab up and watch that you don't strain the speed sensor wires.
OK. Roughly how far out should I pull the track frame away from the torsion axel? 3 or so inches?
I got it out about 6 inches. Here is a picture of it. Not sure exactly what I'm looking for but I don't see a bushing.
Here is the front. I don't see a bushing here either.
On the inside there is a thick washer.
That’s the spacer. There should be one of those "washers" in both the front shaft and also the rear one.
You can see the split on the bushing at about 9 o’clock on the photo. It looks like the split in the other bushing (your 1st photo) is at the bottom. The bushing has a very thin wall, as 92U3406 mentioned before. I’ll leave him to comment on the condition of the bushings and the spacer and whether or not it is reccomended that you should replace them.
Here's the specifications for the spacer. Inside diameter 63.5mm Outside diameter 88.9mm Thickness 9mm Looking back at that photo of yours and judging by the way it is hanging on the shaft I would say the inside diameter is worn and probably the thickness also.
The bushings don't look terrible. I've seen much worse. If the grease groove is still visible all the way around and not getting faint I'd leave them alone. They aren't hard to replace if you wanted to do them. That spacer looks pretty rough. It shouldn't be that sloppy on the shaft. From what I remember, 1 side is flat and the other is beveled. Beveled edge faces inward, towards the torsion axle, flat face to the track frame. If its dished in where its supposed to be flat it needs to be replaced.
There is.
Changing the inside spacers requires removing the whole track assembly. Is that a huge job? Seems I read it is very difficult to align those torsion axles back up.
Considering that those spacers are what limits the sideways movement of the track frame on the torsion axles (and is likely what broke those bolts in the first place) I would say you're going to have to go in there and replace them. Have you measured them yet and compared what you have to the dimensions above.? I'll be honest, to me they look fcuked.
OD on the rear spacer is 88.8mm. ID is around 63.14 mm ( hard to measure the ID while it is on the shaft)
Front are the same. I think they look sloppy because the back of the shaft has an increasing bevel that the spacer presses onto.
Did you try to measure the thickness.?
8.3mm rear, 7.65mm front
10% undersize on one and 20% on the other. I’d replace both if it was mine. They are only $18 each. New bushings are $60 a shot.
Cost isn't the factor. I'm leery of pulling the frame out and screwing something up trying to get it back in.
My opinion, not that you want it, would be that since you're so close, pull the track frames, put in new bushings and new spacers, grab a buddy to help get the track frames back on(I usually find the offer of some kind of meal with beverages helps),grease the snot out of it, and head back to work without a worry of it breaking again....at least for a while. Grease is your best friend with that setup, I wouldn't be afraid to grease those axles every time you use it.
Solid advice.
92U3406 also mentioned the possibilty that the torsion axles might "spring" a touch when the track frame is pulled right off. That could obviously cause difficulties to get the track frame back on the axles again. Depending on which way the weight is biased on those axles, one or more small ratchet straps might be just the job to hold them in place against the forces trying to move them off-centre and make slipping the track frame back on again a doddle.
Axles with some hours on them are a little easier to manipulate. New ones suck. It definitely takes some muscle to manipulate them. I've had to use soft slings and comealongs to get them aligned to go back on sometimes.
I've replaced a few of those axles and, for me at least, the track frames slid straight on. YMMV. Back to the original post, I suspect that wear isn't what caused the broken bolts. Why do I think that? Because the grease fittings have been broken as well. I suspect the retainer was sheared off by a rock or something.
I tend to agree. I think the bolts are crap--all of them are rusty with significant thread wear. No matter what I was going to replace all the bolts.
I've been re-reading the post and I'm a little confused when we talk about spacers. My understanding is there is only one spacer--the one on the inside. On the outside there isn't one--just a split bushing and the cover plate. Is that correct?
I figured it out. No outside spacer.
Those grade 8 bolts are tough. I can't get a drill bit to make any progress.
Maybe a short length of thick-walled pipe just small enough in diameter to fit in the hole, then slide a welding electrode down the inside of the pipe and weld the pipe to the bolt. Allow things to cool and hit it with a pipe wrench, you might get lucky that way.
I got them drilled. One came out with my speed out. The other was a SOB. My speed out actually snapped off inside. Kinda of screwed now. Nige, your idea of welding a pipe might work. I was actually considering welding a whole stud in there and putting a nut on it.
So long as you don’t blow through the wall of the pipe (that’s why it has to be thick-walled) while welding it should keep from damaging the threads as you screw the whole shooting match out. If you want you can weld a nut on the end of the pipe.