So my machine would not start the other day and traced it back to the fuel solenoid. I disconnected it and it started right up. So I started checking the power to it and it had constant power to one wire and power to the other wire while it was in the run position. One wire is a ground. Then I was checking some other things and noticed the power went out to both wires. It's weird as it seems like it's an intermediate problem and keeps getting power and losing it. At one point it was barely lighting the test light up. I checked the solenoids and even swapped them out with the similar ones and nothing seems to work. I cleaned out the fuse fox and blew it out with air and checked all the fuses. Now it doesn't seem like it's getting power at all. Seems like it got worse when I blew air in the fuse box. ANyone have a schematic to this thing or the troubleshooting procedures? My serial number is 21302303.
The white and red wire should have constant power, from fuse 1 (20 amp) follow the wire back, and ensure it is getting power. Black wire is ground. Ensure it has good ground. Blue and white wire is signal wire. It only gets power while cranking. It gets power through the emergency stop relay, to the emergency relay, then to the stop motor relay. Inspect the relays, and swap with other ones. (If you do not have constant power at the white and red wire, you will not get power through the signal wire) Quickest test is to jump 12v power to the white and red wire (T in a power wire, so power can go back through the harness) Then see if it will start.
The 10amp fuel stop is for the signal wire to the relays (wire I highlighted blue) The 20amp fuse is labelled Horn, and should be just below the engine stop fuse (wire I highlighted red)
My white and red wire is not getting power. I didn't know it got power from that horn fuse. I'm going to check it out tomorrow. Where should I jump the power at, at the actual stop solenoid? Right now I have the stop solenoid out and a piece of tie wire tied to the injection pump so we can shut the machine off. So I take it if the red/white wire isn't getting power, the problem is in the wire going from the fuse box to white/red wire? Does the red/white wire actually come out of the back of the fuse box?
That's going to help tremendously. Thanks!
I am get switched power to the stop motor relay so I believe that side is ok.
Coming out of the fuse box, the wire should be white and red. If the fuse is ok, then the wire is likely broken between the fuse box and the fuel shut off solenoid. If you think the wire is broken, then you can narrow it down by checking for power along its route. Emergency relay should have power at pin 1 Stop motor relay should have power at pin 5 remember, the most likely place for a wire to break is where it hangs or can wiggle, so really check closely near the engine, as the harness hangs there. It will likely be within a foot of there.
If I need to, Can I just run a new wire from the back of the fuse box at that 20 amp fuse to the to the actual stop solenoid and then the 5 pin to stop motor relay, and 1 pin at emergency relay? I'm pretty sure I know which one is the stop motor relay. not sure which one is the emergency relay. Would be nice if they were labeled.
I would jump power to the fuel shut off solenoid first, (T in a wire) I don't like to hack and tear into the harness if I don't have to. Check for power at the locations I mentioned first, you may not have to run a new wire. You may find that the horn is causing your fuse to blow.
So k is the emergency relay that should have constant power at pin 1? Seems like some of the relays are combination relays as I don't see emergency stop 1 and 2.
Yes, some of the relays are combinations, and are terribly labeled. Your best bet is to look at the wire colors to help you identify the relays properly. Emergency stop relay1 and 2 are in the cluster. Emergency relay, is a combination relay with the lap bar, and coolant level
Ok thank you. I'll let you know what I find. You Canadians aren't so bad.
lol, Ill take that as a complement.
Gary, I just wanted to tell you thank you for helping me out. As soon as I put power to the wire to the stop solenoid that has constant power, everything worked. What it end up being is the issue is the terminal on the back of the fuse box marked horn was corroded and when I pulled on it, it just pulled out of the fuse box. Ended up fixing it by cutting both wires out of behind the fuse box and putting an inline fuse in. The wire going to the horn fuse was only used to power that circuit. Thanks again! My biggest problem with this is I never knew the fuse for horn powered the stop solenoid also.
Thanks for the follow up, always good to hear what the root cause of a issue was. Congrats on finding the issue.
Hey Garyhoff, can u send me the service manual for TL130 I have an issue with the wire harness , my email [email protected]
Where is the fuel stop solenoid on a TL140
hey Garyhoff, thx for these details
Medy, Sorry, I didn't send you any service manuals. Did you still need one, or did you get your issue figured out?
good day i got me tl130 no power at any of the stop wires only ground wire solenoid ....12v coming into relays coolant and safteyhave 12 but no 12v coming out to solenoid
its at the left hand side of the engine face fowrad in front the pump
Why are all my wires from the stop solidnoid gettin ground
GaryHoff The shutoff solenoid engages but the hold in doesn't engage because the emergency relay is not closing. What would keep that from happening?
I’m having the same problem on a TL 130 it has no power on the hold wire
Fuse box area was corroded and I just had to run a new wire with the inline fuse. Checkbthe schematic.
When I have issues with the hold wire not seeing voltage, or randomly losing voltage, I usually find one of the triple relays has bad solder joints. There are two, and they are the only relays that easily disassemble. You can resolder them or replace them. Like in this thread vvvv HeavyEquipmentForums
I’ve checked everything i know to check the fuse and fuse box I change solenoid checked the ignition switch swapped relays around , and still know power on the red hold wire , the white wire is working the way it should it has power for a few second’s but the hold wire is dead
Does any one no where the Red hold wire that connects to the fuel solenoid gets it’s power ?
Attached is TL150 diagram. The hold comes through them triple relays, albeit just one part of each triple relay. This diagram is close enough for what you're chasing.
heyMccall you always post helpful information. Thank you
Hey Gary could you send me a service manual on a 2007 TL 130 , please send it to [email protected]
I'm still trying to figure out how you guys get to the BACK of the fuse panel. Mine is in the right hand "pedestal" under the stick control. I have the same problem. Installed a new solenoid and it would start with it being out, just to test that part after going to the trouble of lifting my cab to get to the thing. Went ahead and installed the solenoid and it'll crank but no start. Usually these type of sudden or intermittent electrical troubles occur where a wire terminates in a terminal inside a connector, or somewhere where it is subject to a lot of movement or vibration. As these machines age, the wiring gets hard and brittle and can break more easily. The ends of wires where they're crimped into a contact get badly corroded as they are very poorly protected which was my case. Mine wouldn't crank at all when 30 minutes before, it was running fine. Found corroded wire ends in terminals on a few relays in the kick panel so I cleaned all that and soldered the new terminals on. That corrected the no crank. Now on to T-shoot the no start problem.
Fuse panel back side access. Lift cab Remove panel under seat Undo instrument panel and let hang Unbolt 4 fasteners on console Unbolt panel fuse bank is on
Thank you for that. I got it out and found that the wiring on these machines are done a lot like an F-22, not much slack for future repairs or re-terminations of contacts inside connectors... At any rate, I found the large yellow wire had green corrosion on the backside of the fuse block. I checked it for power with a probe through the jacket of the wire and it was hot. Checked that side of the fuse and nothing. Pulled the fuse and that leg had corroded off inside the fuse block. Now I have to figure out how to get that female end out of the fuse block so I can re-terminate that wire, reinsert it and install a new fuse. I have never "de-pinned" a fuse block so I need to get at it with some sort of removal tooling I suppose but I just can't see it good enough to tell how these contacts are locked in there to accept a fuse. When I get this all done and running, I want to edit these posts with the photos I took so it helps the next feller.
I bypassed the block like the last guy did with an inline fuse, the entire contact had corroded out. Fixed that yellow wire with the light green on the other side and it still won't crank. This is the most tempermental machine I've ever worked on. It cranked fine when I changed that stop solenoid out but failed to start unless I took the solenoid out. That's why I changed it. However, it would crank BEFORE I took the fuse block out and even would with it laying in the floor and now suddenly, it won't hit a lick at a snake. I have a higher serial number so the wiring diagram where the light green wire goes is not the same as the original posters machine. I'll have to print this diagram out on something larger than printer paper so I can see it and figure this out. Presently, I am fixing obvious stuff and will just have to keep poking around until I figure this junker out.
Found another power wire in a connector rotted out of its terminal, just turned into green goo. I cannot find replacement contacts for any of these connectors on this machine. Takeuchi dealer wants to sell you a harness so this makes 6 wires I have had to install butt or spade terminals on to bypass the connectors/fuse panels they are in. I would like to know if there is a way to test the "Safety Relay" while I have it in my hand? I can hear the starter (which is brand new) try to do something then stop. I'm thinking I may have a start switch maybe going bad or the safety relay. I took the relay out and found no corrosion in the connectors which was a first. Probably because it is protected by a rubber cover where it bolts to the frame. I also took the assembly out of its case and everything is spotless inside so it was sealed good. I cleaned the burned coil contact with an ignition file and want to bench test it before I order one. Any tips???