What's the deal with extra long shifters that are steering wheel high or higher?
More leverage when you can’t find one and you have to make one ? Seriously though I would compare them to ape hangers on a motorcycle. Somebody thought it looked cool.
I bet the tall shifter is really handy if you are one the cool kids driving around with the seat on the floor.
Like these. Ape Hangers: How High is Too High and Other Monkey Business - Harley Davidson Forums (hdforums.com)
It's a throw back to 60's show car/ street rod day's of Big Daddy Ed Roth. Nothing new,
ya, i never understood the seat on the floor thing or the sunvisor that covers half of the windshield. when i'm driving i like full visibility to be able to avoid stuff like pedestrians, wildlife, other vehicles etc. i think these are the same people who need at least 1000hp to pull the same load that i do at 460.
I once saw a video of a big rig drag where the driver was using the long shifter for exactly that, yanking it into the next gear. Not sure how long the transmission would hold up to that abuse but it worked for the one race.
I was watching a show about towing and a brand new 50 ton wrecker had a tall shifter which seemed odd in a tow truck.
A guy on a Ford truck forum was pointed in the apposite direction. He desired a short shifter, wanted to slam gears fast before RPMS dropped, making a jerky shift. I tried to explain rpm matching, double clutching, etc. I think his brain exploded, he disappeared. Poor ZF-6, wonder how long the synchros lasted
40? Since I started working, I have never been clean enough to own that interior...
37. Ya, I don't know how long it will stay that clean
i had a '67 Firebird with a white interior- hated the white interior but wish i still had the car
on the old Ford Louisville trucks with the long factory shifters ( 5 &4 trans), washboard roads would cause the trans to walk out of gear unless you were under full throttle
I drove a 47 needle nose KW butterfly hood 220 and a 5 and 4. It had long sticks 3 or 2nd (had an odd pattern in the brownie) was away and slammed into the glove box door!
Not sure of the tall shifter but recall my uncle, who passed away many years back, made a comment before I was old enough to really understand what he was saying. He said the worst thing they ever did was to come out with the column shifters in cars. Said the floor shifts were more fun when taking lady friends out for a ride.
With todays steering wheel holders, it makes up for a lack of genitalia size.
Do not, DID NOT EVER like Mad Magazine style Headliner scuffing Shifters or the Straight Handle Fist Shifters, took the extension off the Pete I drove, was awkward. Will stick with standard heights and standard style knobs.
One of the places I worked had a driver who was into the tall shifters. He asked me several times to order him an extension. Said it would help him shift better? I normally did all the parts ordering but told him he had to buy it or ask the boss himself. I didn’t get questioned often about what I ordered but I’m not sure I could have slid that one through.
All Big Daddy Ed Roth cartoon and Ed Roth customs with Eddy setting in one. Originator of the Rat Fink.
The Roth----------Rat Fink. 56 Ford Rat Fink eating a 55 Chevy
The late 90's early 2000's Mack RD686 with a fuller has a rather tall shifter, you would think for tall drivers, however that particular truck the heater box must have been designed for someone max height about 5'6", after a day running that particular truck my knee is sore from banging it on the heater all day. I put 16 ape hangers on my road king classic, perfect height right at shoulder height, took 3 tries to get the right height. After bending the Western Star shifter into a boomerang when the reverse gear snap ring groove broke, I had an shift lever from the mack, welded it to a new isolator I had setting around, put the shifter about dash board height. At least put a classy shifter on it. Notice the glitter.
You don't even need to be drag racing all you need is a guy named Tinker-He could tear up a ANVIL just looking at it. I was working at my previous employer the Ag company and there was this idiot that worked there named Tinker aka Tinker Bell. I get this call that he was stuck out in the country on a delivery and there was a air leak and couldn't shift the truck. I get there and he had been yanking the shifter so hard he bent the lever smashing the air lines into the floor board cutting one spaghetti line in two. I installed a union and got it back to the shop, removed and straightened the shifter and replaced the air lines. Then I had a discussion about finesse when shifting with Tinker Bell. The discussion went like this--T-Bell there is a spring loaded sledge hammer hidden in that cab now-make one more bad shift and POW it's right in the Kisser.
I had a Tinker, In mud season we were putting pannels on a 650 Deere, he was "helping" broke 4 bolts off the floor panels before I caught him for the righty tighty lefty loosy talk and took the air gun away. Then he broke 4 putting them on with a ratchet. I called him mongo. He thought the dump truck was a racecar, got a bunch of phone calls for driving to fast, he has a new job now, just couldn't have the liability with him driving 75,000 pounds around the streets, it was like a time bomb.
It is a wonder these crash boxes hold together as well as they do. My dad and grandpa did not stand for any grinding at all and I took it to heart. But some guys don't see it that way I think, as long as it got from point A to B they figured it was all right. It was my suggestion to go to automatics (Allison), some had to swallow pride but I was over the shifting all day long thing.
I met Ed Roth... he painted a couple signs for me. He was about the nicest guy in the world!
Your right BV. Through the years and all the Eaton twin counter shaft boxes I've rebuilt I bet that at least 20 had the keys broke on both front counter shafts, those front four are pressed on. The gears on those would move on the shaft not far from going out of time. Main shafts with a twist in the splines-probably 15.
Tall shifter on the roads here would would end up slapping me in the side of the head and knocking my s't out and I'd crash. Old boy I worked with would freak out if you palmed a shifter- " If you caint' float that in there with TWO FINGERS on top of that knob you aint' no driver!!!!". I can just hear him on the tall shifters- " Jeezus....."
Pretty sure the knobs are shaped for finger shifting with the lip by the high/low switch. I always shook my head at the guys who grabbed the shifter.....
on a similar subject, i usually tell anyone who asks, that those huge monster bug-killer stacks are just genitalia envy
Cab high stacks for me!
I looked at a '65 KW dump for my project here that had a 3-stick with clear gold metal flake knobs. I considered it just for the knobs.
@Hallback did you ever see that green logger (frame too), chrome nut covers on every nut & bolt, gigantor stacks and monster visor? Bet it had a tall shifter, too.
An old timer thought the same thing about suicide doors. Much nicer to watch a lady get out of a suicide door.
Was it the W900L?
Yeah. LIME green. Really, really lime green.
Probably white sunglasses too
This is a great video with Bob Spooner, At about 8:00 he talks about learning to drive, I am guessing in the 50's, and how the guy he rode with would rap your nuckles if you missed a shift, or were rough on the truck.
Fact is-nobodies timing is that good/100% all the time. As the day wears on a person starts to loose the finesse, it just happens. Really the main point is not forcing a shift. I don't drive all the time anymore, not as smooth as I use to be. Sometimes I just tickle them into gear, the way it is some days. Some of it depends on the brand of engine in front, I've driven Cats that were so smooth on throttle response you had to be pretty inept not to make smooth shifts. 2 stroke Detroit's you don't mess around you just shift it. One 855 Cummins may have quick throttle response the next not so. So in that respect being use to one brand or another can make the difference of looking good or sad setting in the seat As far as using two fingers to shift with-Eaton designed the air control knob to fit the palm of a hand. I use the palm of my hand to shift not fiddling around with two fingers {that's for people who think they are gods gift to a shift knob}. When driving in downtown streets stop light after stop light a person has to much to pay attention to- to be farting around playing shift wizard. The last part all depends on how worn or tight a gear box is to how good it's going to shift. If some one has changed the detent springs from the standard {Orange to the Green detent springs trying to hide a problem inside the box {popping out of gear} that can make it a tougher to shift. The other is the shift tower-there are three different heights {short, medium and tall}. Tall has been used in damn near all trucks the last 35 years, Short and medium was dropped years ago. Because the tall tower has more leverage and a shorter throw. And some Transmissions new or rebuilt just are sour apples when it comes to shifting. When Eaton changed to higher tooth count transmissions starting with the RTO14613 shifting became easier/smoother. The RTO 12513 and earlier were a lower/coarser tooth count and naturally were harder to shift. To use the term BV used {crash box}. The other factor is the oil inside, one that has fresh 50 wt synthetic is going to be slightly easier to shift.
Wait, two fingers fancy style or two fingers in the cup above the high/low selector for pulling rearward?
That depends on whether you drink from a demitasse cup three fingers raised or grip a regular coffee cup.
I found the FR(O) style 10 speed could be a bear to shift depending on which one you got. RT(O) 9 speeds and their variants seemed to just swallow up a shift so much easier, like the spaces between the teeth are bigger or something. I think TS said the FRO was some kind of Euro thing which would explain why they had to make it harder. I used to shift with some sort of "light touch" sort of grip until my wrist started really bothering. After a couple hundred shifts a day. Holding the palm knob in the palm really was a lot more ergonomic.
Speaking of transmission abuse.......
You can't mention Ed "Big Daddy" Roth without including perhaps his most famous car. It had a tall stick for steering, gas, braking and shifting. I think good shifting just comes with spending more time in the drivers seat. I got a dump truck with a 9 speed and had never drove a tandem before. Looked online how to shift and after some problems at first kind of figured it out. Biggest problem was not realizing the lower gears needed to be shifted at only about 1200 RPM's. Shifting is easier once you get some speed and you can get a 2nd chance if you miss a shift. In high range you can shift around 1600 RPM's. I'm sure if I took a driver course would be very beneficial but I just use the truck on my own property. Ed Roth's Beatnik Bandit - Kustomrama
Well that one will not be on the road long
I find it interesting that they had Celine Dion cranked in the back ground.
After reading this thread, I think this pic is appropriate. A 72 that I owned for a while and what a truck should look like on the inside.
92U,that video wore me out just watching it. i'm sure some throttle components are likely to wear out too
Probably about 90% of those shifts were unneccessary lol.
Play Baby Herders.
The FRO series are a Metric box and use a different rear fork set up for low and high range. Plus its uses a pre-machined one size blocking washer between gears on the front main shaft. The old RTO series used a blocking washer that came in several thicknesses to set coaxial clearance between gears on the main shaft, and on assembly that clearance was usually set on the high tolerance side. Where with the FRO-RTLO later low inertia transmission the blocking is the same thickness on every gear on the main shaft and tend to run a little tighter a little less slop. But some rough shifting transmission can be related to how tight the shift bar housing is also. many things make for a sour shifting gear box.
Pops52 yours is new compared to my 1966 aluminum tilt, the sign lettering was also my work.
I think that guy drives for the company i work for i always wondered what he was doing to the truck.
Like shift forks worn to 2/3's their original thickness and rusted up interlock pins. My RTO-15615 was horrible to shift because of that. Hopefully it runs a little nicer with that all fixed.
Tell me it still has the original 335?
Ho No-Warmed BCIII 400. It's been gone for years now.
Threads like this make me sad I was born to late to get to drive these beautiful trucks. I have always felt more comfortable in a truck that drives like a truck.
It's the tattoo's I don't understand.
Ahhhh! The Fast and the Furious shift pattern!
I have a 1420 3A in my twin steer.
Can you remember that? Practice in your sleep.
I can't figure this one out to save my life. Dad has this in an old John Deere 4020. Not sure what else it came in. I'm just happy to be moving in the proper direction when I let out the clutch....
Is this a joke or is this really in something out there? Imagine trying to find the neutral gate from 19.... Its like a corn maze
The 20 speed is a joke
Oh no that was a special transmission Studebaker used behind their 1959 tandum powered by a 6-71 inline. Not only was there no power you ended up winding the shifter in a knot.
Andy, I found that pic in my "Wheels of Time" magazine. The title said "Shift Happens" However, in my formative years, 68-73, I had the joy of spending a little time in a 1960 IH Emeryville cabover with a 10 speed roadranger and I swear to this day it had that same shift pattern!! Linkage and shift tower so worn you just stirred the stick & hoped for the best. Regarding you're previous post, the old trucks are more fun to drive now than they were back in the day. Dave
This is the John Deere Synchro Shift. Introduced in the 10 series in the 1960s, they offered it as an option into the late 70's/early 80's. You don't shift sequentially with it. You choose the pair of synchronized gears that provide the ground speed needed for your task at hand. If you're going down the road, start in 6, get load moving, then shift up to 8 and roll coal. The 1-3-R or 2-5-R groups were great for loader operations as you had a slow gear to load the bucket, and a faster gear to travel to dump, synchronized with a reverse gear. They were certainly an improvement over the old 4 speed gear boxes offered at the time, bit with the introduction of the PowerShift transmissions, they became outdated pretty quick. I racked up a lot of hours on a 4020 with a synchroshift when I was a teen moving and staging round bales out of fields
IMO the syncroshift was far better for loader work as you did not have to go back down through the gears, over through neutral and back up into reverse like on the powershift. the quad-range starting with the 30 series wasn't much better because of the 2 shifters. after putting in a few thousand hours on the jd 4010-4020 and 30 series, anything else was clumsy until the shuttleshift came along for loader work. i am no longer a deere fan, but the 4020 was probably one of, if not the best, all-around ag tractor ever built. they only lacked mechanical FWA and a decent cab
Nobody likes a Quad Range, especially the single stick quad range in the 40 series. We had a 4020 console with PowerShift and tricycle front at one time on the feed wagon. That was a really nice application. Tight turning, easy to shift gears while watching mixer while it fed out. Today, I'll take a 7x10 or 6x10 series Deere over the 4020 any day. Quad Range with partial power shift and power reverser. Loader work in our 7810 is almost as efficient as using a wheel loader. No clutch, just flip the reverser and the other direction you go. Same with our 6410s. We also had a 6420 and 6330 with that set up. Works great feeding cows or working in the fields.
You know I sorta like all john deere tractors. I make alot of money fixing them
This behind an E9 500 is still my favorite combo of all time.
And then we have this oddball. Anyone driven one of these? Early 60s
I can't provide specifics but I seem to remember an uncle (now passed away) telling stories about an early Man truck shift pattern. Apparently it only had forward and rearwards movement on a single plane, however you had in raise or lower the stick for each gear. Said it was very easy to raise/lower to much and miss a change. Any one else have any first-hand experience?
That's a Mack 9 Speed over gear with 3 sticks above
3 sticks? That’s got to be worse than texting and driving
Main transmission, Auxiliary transmission, and Hi-Low range.
When were those around?
Could you please explain how this was shifted?
Mid to early 50's 60's It was nothing more than a 5 and 3 with a low range for off road, hi was actually direct. So you had a whole other set of gears in low range for crawling around. B71 220 Cummins power below.
Might be a little more worried about the wasp nests than the shifting.
Ah-nothing better than swatting yellow jackets shifting and trying to look where your going at the same time.
Bench seats and a 4 on the floor made for cool dates. Kids today have no reason to shift down even if they have a straight stick. Bucket seats ruined that.
Well Nurse Diesel will put a kink in their straight stick!
That is a really cool old Mack.
226,000 total miles.
Shows Rode Hard those 226,000, sure that isn't 1,226,000?!
Is it your truck? It looks like it would be a good candidate for restoration. Is that the original paint color? I kinda like it.
Guinea Green interior is OE
No not mine. Sun baked-It's lived on a farm since 1959, only second owner.
Very few low milers out there Shame it is going to rot
Speaking of a farm....
Look at those black berry vines!
Oh yeah-that real nice 37 too!
There are 6-7 abandoned farms like that by me. The state used a law they snuck in about cow shiit runoff killing fish to take these farms. The Chehalis Indian tribe backed it & boom, we have stolen farms. They were walked away from and many still have the tractors, ballers, ect left behind.
Just sad.
I thought that kind of stuff only happened here in Commiefornia............
I’m in the market for a rig for my “Mystery Ship” here, add darker green exterior paint job to match the camper and a trailer to match to hold solar panels and car we would be in style.
You are on the Smallish side, and the missus too, would do alright in a Dog, HOWEVER they are Tight Confines!!!