It is a regular event on HEF for someone to post a question regarding Cat machine electronics, Diagnostic Codes, etc. For a large number of the questions posted the answer(s) revolve around the famous Cat “Click Box”, otherwise known as the 4C-8195 Control Service Tool. This tool usually hooks up to the machine Diagnostic Connector, and by grounding different connections in the electronic system, transforms the electronic dashboard of a machine into a Diagnostic & Calibration screen. After talking to some of the other members I would like to take the opportunity to start to create a thread to pull together information about the Click Box, for example: - · How it is built, including a DIY version that you can make for yourself. · What it is designed to do. · How to use one. · Tricks, Tip, & Traps about using it. · Extracts from Service documentation for common models. Please note: This thread is NOT designed to be a place where you can post your questions relating to specific diagnostic procedures. Think of it instead as a library of information regarding using the Service Tool. Please post any diagnostic questions by starting a new thread in the appropriate forum for your machine. It may well be that a member will link to this thread when answering and that’s how it’s designed to work.
I'm hoping now that other members will jump in here and post their contributions. I know for a fact that there is a lot of knowledge out there that can all add to this thread.
I'll give it a start with this Cat Instruction Sheet: Using the 4C-8195 Control Service Tool{0374, 0599, 0709, 7490}
hi
Certain track type loaders are unusual in that they don't require a Click Box - but that's only because it's already built into the machine wiring. The switches are located under the seat armrest, but they work exactly the same way as if the Service Tool was being hooked up to the Diagnostic Connector.
Here are the same instructions for medium-size track-type tractors D5 thru D8. the variants covered are from N to R depending on the model. Also covers the equivalent pipelayers.
And in case anyone was wondering how hard it actually is to make one, here's the inside of a real one.
Here is the actual service tool and a quick primer in its use.
If you guys need places to order the various connectors for this tool, post some more specific details and I can figure it out. Or even switches for that matter.
Excellent idea for a thread Nige! Even with all my time on SIS I’ve never messed with this particular tool. I reckon I’ll build or buy one now just because
Sometimes you just gotta have one because. I think it's a disease but if you have to have a disease I can't think of a better one.
Exactly!
And just to be clear, this thread was Nige's idea. He asked me a few days ago if somebody came up with a thread on this if we could make it a "sticky", and I told him that while I'm perfectly qualified to make threads stick, I'd be totally out of my depth trying to post anything about a click box. (To be honest, I didn't quite know what the thing was.) I asked if he could post something, and as you all can see, he took the ball and ran with it. Thanks, Nige!
Thank you Nige!
A couple years ago we had an M model dozer that would only obey the clicker box, ET wouldn’t get it to calibrate.
So following on from Mark’s post #4 above showing how a Click Box is constructed, here is a bit more explanation of how it works in an attempt to try to take some of the mystery out of it, because in truth it is not complicated. To understand it better you have to appreciate what is connected to the opposite side of the diagnostic connector at the CMS Module. The diagram below is an attempt to try to stitch together various different parts of a schematic to produce a simplified version of what the wiring looks like on a typical machine. Apologies in advance if it appears a bit of a lash-up but it was the best I could do without re-inventing the wheel. I have only shown one of the connectors from the Click Box because they all work the same way. As Mark showed in his illustration the original design of Click Box had a 4C-8196 Cable with two connectors (a 4-pin Deutsch DT male connector and a 4-pin male Sure Seal connector) that back in the day fitted pretty much every machine on the market. Today there is a more varied assortment of machine Service Tool connectors out there so if anyone is considering building their own box I would suggest take a good look at the Service Tool connector on the machine first. The machine wiring shows Pin #4 on the Monitor Service Connector connected to machine frame ground, Pin #1 connected to Pin #23 (Service Switch) on the CMS Module via wire #290, and Pin #2 connected to Pin #33 on the CMS via wire #291. As far as I am aware the wire numbers 290 & 291 are common to all machines that use CMS whatever the model but I stand to be corrected on that. So quite simply Pins #23 & #33 on CMS work on a binary basis. Either each Pin sees open circuit (normal operation) or it sees ground when the appropriate switch is closed on the Click Box. The Service & Clear switches each ground one particular Pin on the CMS, the Mode Switch grounds both Service & Clear contacts at the same time. Depending on which switch, or combination of switches, are grounded the CMS will perform different actions. Simples…….
The CMS has 12 possible modes of operation, of which seven are Service Modes. Not all Modes are available on all machines; the software installed on a particular machine determines the number of Modes that will be available. Each Mode appears as a number in the display area (2) of the main module. Use the Click Box to access each of the seven Service Modes starting from Normal Mode. The CMS performs a self-test when power is first applied, entering Normal Mode (Mode 0) when the self-test is complete. Mode 0 is the only Mode that does not appear in the display area as a number. To enter any other Mode, ground the Service and Clear inputs (i.e. the Mode Switch) at the same time. This action will scroll the Mode Number sequentially on the display area of the main display module. Removing the ground causes the CMS to enter the mode that corresponds to the number appearing on the display area at that time. The following illustration is an example. Removing the ground when the number "- 1-" present on the readout will cause the CMS to enter Mode 1 - Harness Code Mode. Probably the most important Modes for maintenance & repair are Service Mode -3- and Calibration Mode. Note: Service Mode is always Mode -3-, Calibration Mode can vary depending on the machine model. Generally for Track-Type Loaders Calibration Mode is Mode -5-, for Track-Type tractors it can be any one (or more) of Modes 5, 6, 7, or 8, depending on the particular model. Use the Click Box to access the various sub-Modes within the Calibration Mode. If any sub-Modes exist, the first one will automatically appear after releasing the Mode Switch on the Click Box when the number that corresponds to Calibration Mode for that machine appears on the display.
I think I mentioned in the video that you don't want to go into any of the other modes with out a book or someone who knows what they are doing. There is a lot of good stuff in there that doesn't take much of a misstep to create plenty of grief.
Wise words John. Always get hold of the correct service documentation before starting and if in doubt ask..
Some of the early F series wheel loaders used an LCD CMS monitoring system The mode switch is not used. Instead the scroll switch is placed in the up position with key off, then the key is placed in the on position which places the monitoring system in to service mode The later F series wheel loader used the VFD CMS monitoring system this system had only 4 modes and mode 1 is the service mode Mark
Mark250... That is new to me. I've never found a place to plug the clicker box into on a F model wheel loader. Do have any hints to where I should look in the future?
Hi John,I have always found them under the steering column Mark
Thanks Mark, I'll do a lot more looking from now on. Does anyone have a list of what the Clicker Box works on? I used it on the following; dozer models R and early T, larger wheel loaders models G and H and now F, some articulated haul trucks like the early model 725 through 740. The box says it can be used on H model graders with a different harness connector but I haven't done that yet. If we can add to this I'll make up an easy to read list that we can post.
Good information Mark. I did not know that. Check the list of TTT on Page 1 John. There is a list of S/N prefixes in SENR8367 a mile long. I know it can be used on certain N-series tractors, and as far up as certain models of D10/D11.
I see the list of dozers and track loaders but don't see a list of wheel loaders. I've always wondered if the small wheel loaders had the connection but wasn't able to find one on them.
I have not stumbled on a list of equipment that the "Clicker Box" can be used on but just doing some basic searching see mention of using it on a 938F and IT38F amonge others, not sure if those would qualify as "small wheel loaders", but for someone who worked on most loaders 966 up to 992 they would seem to qualify as small. If someone has a serial number or even a prefix they are wondering about I just did an "Advanced Full Test Search" in SIS with no S/N listed and just the 4C-8195 part number of the "Clicker Box" and selected "Testing and Adjusting" EDIT Did a little more looking and if you go to the instructions I posted in the #3 post in this thread and scroll down to page 8 you should see this: Screen shot from that page, not the complete instructions.
John, I can answer your question regarding H-Series graders. The Click Box can be used on the following Serial Number prefixes but it needs a different cable (P/N 138-7795) to replace the original 4C-8196 Cable that connects between the Click Box and the CMS connector on the machine harness. Anything that is not on the list below it will NOT work with. 12H - CBK, AMZ, & 125-prefix. 120H - CAF, ALZ, & 124-prefix. 135H - CBC & AMX-prefix. 140H - APM, CCA, & 126-prefix. 14H - ASE-prefix. 160H - ASD & CCP-prefix. 16H - ATS-prefix. 24H - 7KK-prefix. I'll see what info is out there regarding the Medium Wheel Loader and ADT Product lines.
I know I used a "Click Box" on a 2KR 980G, believe it was to calibrate the hyd. controls, it's been over four years so I may be wrong.Also recall seeing something about the "Click Box" actually being included with the 988H as shipped, relive that was how we happened to get the one we had!
I've used it on both the G and H model large wheel loaders. Especially the 980 and 988 sizes. I was only chasing fault codes on those so didn't know that the controls could be calibrated with it. I was told the clicker was included with the 988G but the dealers would pull all of them out before delivery. I hadn't seen one on a new H model.
Just noticed the typo "relive that was how we happened to get the one we had!".That should have said "Believe" ! I'm only guessing that the one we had came with the 988H as I did not know we had one till one day, maybe a year or so after getting the machine I was sweeping the shop office floor and noticed a box under the desk! No idea who put it there, might have been set next to desk then someone bumped it under there??? Not even sure if anyone at the quarry has any idea of what it is as the guy who more or less took over from me had no training on Cat equipment and had all of maybe 2 weeks to work with me before I retired!
Here is something from the CMS Service Manual. Typical electrical schematics for various wheel loader/wheel dozer models, Integrated Toolcarriers, wheel skidders, wheeled compactors, and Elphinstone Underground Loaders. The assumption being that if you are working with any one of the listed models that is equipped with CMS it ought to have a connector for the Service Tool located somewhere relatively accessible.
As It's been over 3 years since I have laid hands on a Cat or any machine bigger than my old Farmall BN I mow my yard with I'm a little rusty on some of the terms. I was looking at a 980g wiring diagram and see a connector labeled as "ECAP Service Tool Connector" and in the instructions for calibrating hydraulic controls I see this reference to the "Click Box": 1. Connect the 4C-8195 Control Service Tool to the service connector. The service connector is located behind the fuse access door in the right rear corner of the cab. Is the "service connector" the same thing as the "ECAP Service Tool Connector"? Either way what does "ECAP" stand for? ---------------------------- Well I guess I can answer part of my questions. Seems the ECAP connector is NOT the one for the click box. At least in some machines it is related to an engine control system. I'm now thinking, at least in the wiring schematic for a 980G the clicker box connector is called the "Service Mode Plug" with four wires connected to it two of them being #201 grounds one #290 wire and one #291 wire. Also checked a 988H schematic and did a keyword search for "Service Mode Plug" and it found it there too. So if one is lucky to have access to a PDF version of the schematic for a machine that could be an easy way to find if there is one and where it is located. Once you find it in the schematic it should tell you the connector number and most of the schematics have a section that shows where a connector is if you know the number.
On the big wheel loader the clicker connection is just under the harness connector for the lap to computer. I've been using those years. I just didn't know there was a clicker box connector for the F models and the smaller wheel loaders. If I get near one I take a look and some photos.
Different connector ECAP stands for Electronic Control Analyzer Programmer
Here's the list of medium/large wheel loaders, wheeled dozers, compactors, & ITs. Still working on the smaller ones. As above any Serial Number prefixes for a certain model that are not listed below the Click Box will not work with as far as I can tell. I need also to have a look at ADTs. 834G – BCP1-Up, 6GZ1-Up 834H – BTX1-Up, BTX1000-Up 836G – BRL1-Up, 7MZ1-Up 836H – BXD1-Up, BXD1000-Up 844H – BTW1-Up 844 Series II – BBN1-Up 950G – BAA1-Up, AYB1-UP, AYD1-Up, AYL1-UP, AXR1-Up, AXX1-Up, AYS1-Up, 2JS1-Up, 4BS1-Up, 6NS1-Up, 3JW1-Up, 5FW1-Up, 5MW1-Up, 8JW1-Up 950H – N1A1-Up, JAD1-Up, M1G1-Up, J5J1-Up, K5K1-Up 962G – AYE1-Up, AYG1-Up, AXS1-Up, AXY1-Up, BAD1-Up, BAB1-Up, BAC1-Up, 3BS1-Up, 5AS1-Up, 5RS1-Up, 4PW1-Up, 6EW1-Up, 6HW1-Up, 7BW1-Up 962H – N4A1-Up, M3G1-Up, J6J1-Up, K6K1-Up, MAL1-Up 966F – 9YJ1-Up, 1SL1-Up, 8BG1-Up, 4YG1-Up, 3XJ1-Up 966G – AXJ1-Up, AXL1-Up, ANZ1-Up, AAH1-Up, 3ZS1-Up, 9RS1-Up, ANT1-Up, AWY1-Up, AWZ1-Up 966G – 3PW1-Up, 3SW1-Up, 8XW1-Up 966H – A6D1-Up, RYF1-Up, A6G1-Up, A6J1-Up, TAL1-Up 970F – 7SK1-Up, 9JK1-Up, 7PL1-Up 972G – AXN1-Up, AWP1-Up, AXP1-Up, 7LS1-Up, 1EW1-Up, AAW1-Up, AXC1-Up, AXE1-Up, ANY1-Up, 4WW1-Up, 6AW1-Up, 9GW1-Up 972H – GTA1-Up, LCC1-Up, A7D1-Up, A7G1-Up, A7J1-Up 980F – 4RN1-Up, 5XJ1-Up, 8JN1-Up, 8CJ1-Up, 3HK1-Up 980G – 9CM1-Up, 2KR1-Up, 2SR1-Up, AWH1-Up, AXG1-Up, AYT1-Up 980H – MHG1-Up, A8J1-Up, JMS1-Up, KZL1-Up 988F – 2ZR1-Up, 8YG1-Up 988G – BNH1-Up, BNH1-1631, 2TW1-Up 988H – BXY1-Up, A7A1-Up 990 – 7HK1-Up 990H – BWX1-Up 990 Series II – BCR1-Up, 4FR1-Up IT62G – AYA1-Up, AKP1-Up, 6PS1-Up IT62H – M5G1-Up
Hi Nige you can add these to your list
John, here's what I could dredge up as regards ADT's. I'm going to put in in more than one post to try to make it understandable. Like Track-Type Loaders, early ADT's actually had Service and Clear switches on the instrument panel as illustrated by the diagram below. The list of machines so equipped is below:- 725 – AFX1-1097 730 – AGF1-1010 735 – AWR1-624 740 – AXM1-1376 740EJ – AZZ1-339
Later ADT's don't have the switches installed but they do have a 4-pin Deutsch connector for a Service Tool located right next to the 9-pin connector for ET. 725 - AFX1098-Up, B1L1-504 730 - AGF1011-Up, B1M1-410 730EJ – B1W1-184 735 - AWR625-Up, B1N1-320 740 - AXM1377-Up, 740 – B1P1-621 740EJ - AZZ340-Up, B1R1-193
From the Serial Numbers listed below onwards there is no Service Tool connector shown on the Electrical Schematic. HOWEVER on connector J2 of the Powertrain/Chassis ECM, Pin 61 is listed as "Service SW I/P" and Pin 62 is listed as "Clear SW I/P". These are the same two pins to which the chassis wiring harness is connected on earlier S/N machines for the Service Tool. I'd be pretty certain that if you hooked wires up to these pins plus made a connection to chassis ground a Service Tool would work. 725 – B1L505-Up 730 - B1M411-Up 730EJ – B1W185-Up 735 – B1N321-Up 740 – B1P622-Up 740EJ – B1R194-Up
Wow! I've never seen a truck with the service and clear rockers. I have done inspections on trucks with the four pin setup and all worked fine. I've seen the "B" series trucks and they only had the big connector for the lap tops. I don't recall if they even had the test button anywhere to shift the monitor panel. I'll have check that out also. Thanks for all your efforts on this project!
Here are a couple of extracts from the Schematics John.
Just an example of how Cat can hide things. As I recall the 769D S/N 5SS00621 we had at the quarry had switches on the dash and some behind the drivers seat. I could look into if it is important but recall to do some of the clicker box type things you had to push a rocker on the dash and one behind the seat at the same time. That could have been to clear the count for the number of loads or some such thing.
Newest Cat truck I actually had to fix was a 773 with the electronically controlled transmission and traction control. It was all LEDs on a big panel behind the seat. Big rock trucks around here aren't real common and don't show up in the used market unless they are thirty plus years old and worn out.
It appears as though Ken's truck was a similar set-up to the early ADT's. The CMS Clear (17) and Service (20) switches are built into the circuit breaker panel in the rear firewall of the cab between the operator's seat and the Electronics Bay.
That's old school right there! Then again looking back it was just part of the package cat had to offer for diagnostics. Myself With a let's say Automotive background, its the equivalent of jumpering the A.B terminal on a 80s GM vehicle to get a code flash! Man I'm dating my self.
jeff112, Sure sucks at time to have someone talk about 1980's vintage as "old"! Now if you want real old school we could talk about rebuilding the magneto on my 1947 Farmall BN tractor I mow the back yard with! Guess I'm not the only one who has old stuff like that as NAPA dealer was able to supply all the parts needed in a couple days!
It's actually still being used today.
I made one over 10 years ago and it's worked well. I used a small project box; mine is about 3"x2.5"x1" and the smaller size is good at times. The project was good for learning about electrical components and where to buy them.
Don't leave us hanging. Post a pic to take the mystery out of it for the noobs ......
This came up in another thread. The question was if you don't have access to a Click Box can you McGiver something..? The answer is that you can - read on..... Go back to post #16 on Page 1 where I tried to explain how the Click Box interacts with the machine electrical system. Forget the Click Box part for now and concentrate on the wiring between the "Caterpillar Monitor System" and the "Monitor Service Connector" (MSC), a 4 pin Deustch connector with male pins in it.....
It can be done with nothing more than 2 pieces of 18SWG automotive cable each about 6" long plus 3 Deustch connector sockets, although the last items are somewhat optional. They do make the process far easier though. The machine connector looks like the one in the photo below. The two gold pins next to it are typical of the pins you'll find inside it. The mating sockets to those pins are like the one shown installed on the twisted end of the wire. Using them makes it easier to connect the wires. Strip both ends of the two pieces of wire. Twist one end of piece together to form what looks like a chicken wishbone common at one end and with two separate ends at the other. Crimp a Deutsch female connector pin to each of the bare ends. I would make the wires longer than shown in the photo. I just knocked that up to illustrate what the assembly looks like.
This is what you do: - 1. To access the system in order to clear the Logged ones the Monitor Panel has to be put into Service Mode, so the idea is to duplicate the Click Box procedure of grounding both the Scroll and the Clear contacts of the Monitor System at the same time. This is what the Mode switch on the Click Box does if you look at the wiring diagram in Post #16. 2. Connect one of the separate ends of the cable to Pin #1 (wire #290) of the MSC, and connect the other one to Pin #2 (wire #291) of the MSC. The pin numbers of the connector are stamped on the back of it but I always use the Wire Numbers just to be sure. 3. Turn the key on and let the panel do the self-test. Connect the common end of the wire assembly to Pin #4 (wire #200) of the MSC. The display panel should change to show -0- which will then change every couple of seconds to -1-, -2-, etc . 4. When the display shows -3- remove the wire from Pin #4. The -3- should disappear from the Monitor and the first of the list of Diagnostic Codes should appear. Be aware that every Code is displayed in two steps. The first is the module recording the Code (e.g. 030, 081, 113), the second is the Code itself (096F03, 248F01, etc.), so even though the display will change to show one after the other on an endless loop it's all really one Code that you are seeing. 5. If the first displayed Code is Logged, you can clear it - go to the next Step. If it is Active you will have to Scroll to the next Code on the list - go to Step 7. 6. Remove the wire from Pin #1 of the MSC, leaving only the wire connected to Pin # 2. Then touch the common end (that you previously removed from Pin #4) briefly back to Pin #4 which will ground the Clear connector of the MSC. The Code should disappear and when it does it should be replaced by the next Code on the list. Continue clearing until a message END or three dashes --- appears. This indicates that you have reached the end of the list of Codes in the Monitor. 7. To Scroll to the next Code in the event of coming across one that is Active, remove the wire from Pin #2. Connect a single end of your wire assembly to Pin #1. Briefly touch the common end of the wire assembly to Pin #4. The current displayed Code should scroll to the next Code in the list. Be careful, if two consecutive Codes are the same module (e.g. 030) you might think it hasn't scrolled. Give the new Code a couple of seconds to display completely before deciding whether the list has scrolled to the next Code or not. 8. To summarize. If you clear a Logged Code the next Code on the list will automatically appear. If the next Code is Active you will need to Scroll past it on the list to access the next Logged Code. 9. There is nothing at all to stop you going through the complete Code list twice or even a dozen times if the mood takes you. 10. Once you finish clearing Codes the Monitor has to be put back to the Operating Mode again. Repeat Steps 3 and 4 above but obviously forget the first bit because your power is already on. The display will start at -3- and go upwards through each Mode in turn. A Monitor may have as few as 6 or as many as 10. Keep at it until it shows -0- again then disconnect the wire from Pin #4 and you're done. The display should then return to the normal Operating Mode that you had before you started. Remove the wire assembly completely and put it somewhere safe.
I got a whole box of these things, had no idea what the application was. But I have found lots of use for the ends as pig tails in all kinds of harness repair. Part number is 208-7451. Looks like the harness for the Click Box?
I don't think so. It seems to be a harness that is part of a 212-4503 "Conversion Arrangement" for a 924G of 3DZ/3PZ/6YW/9SW/AAB/AAN Serial Number prefixes.
There is an extra harness that comes with a click box that I've never used. Directions in the box said something about setting the transmission shift points in a 140H grader. I just threw the thing in the box in the back of the truck. Haven't looked upon it since.
I think you're referring to #3 John......
Well shoot. Thought I might have enough harnesses to make a couple hundred click boxes. Just out of curiosity what would a " Conversation Arrangement " be ?
Found it! I knew my old clicker box was around somewhere. What blast from the past!. There was a Caterpillar special instruction with part numbers and instructions on how to build one, I recall. Can’t say that I’ve used one since the days of grunge music.
Looks nice, I guarantee you if you sell it or take it apart to fix something else the next day someone will have a problem with an older machine that need this to calibrate something!
You would probably (or maybe not) be amazed at the number of owners of machines from that era who come to HEF looking for help on Diagnostic Codes or calibration.
What could I be do wrong I can get the mode 3 up and scroll thru the code but I can’t get to clear and they are not active
I am working on a D6t.
Please read the instructions at the start of the thread. "Please post any diagnostic questions by starting a new thread in the appropriate forum for your machine. It may well be that a member will link to this thread when answering and that’s how it’s designed to work. " Post a new thread in the dozer section. Give the Serial Number, what your Codes are, photos of the monitor panel, etc, etc.
If you are working with the click box, I usually push the button to clear and hold it for about ten and twenty seconds. When I let up the button I wait to see if the screen has shifted to the next code. If not I'll try it again. If it still won't go out, I'm afraid you will need someone with the laptop and software to go in an see what is going on. Good Luck
Have a question: maybe I missed something, but want to make sure about pin out. Is pin out used for these is standard for DT series connector, or CAT came up with their own?
Cat has an electrical fitting with two copper wires sticking out that you can insert into the back of the harness connectors and touch the back side of wire connectors to check voltages. You have to have a schematic to identify what each wire does and usually I had to use the cook book for individual identification of each wire in each harness connector. I don't recall seeing a pin out connector box used on anything after the Komatsu Dash 3 line.
I probably can ID contacts by the diagram that you guys posted in this thread. Was hoping to build it without taking anything apart. Especially that dozer. The seat is rusted and don’t want to move, and connector is really hard to access behind that seat.
Sorry if I am asking what I should already know, but which connector are you referring to, how many pins in what arrangement, and is it for flash codes or CANBUS?
Are you referring to the 4-pin DT connector.? If so it is standard, and the machine will have the corresponding plug in the wiring harness. If so please take a look at Post #16 on Page 1. The "Monitor Service Connector" pinouts on the machine wiring harness are generic and identical. they even use the same wire numbers on every machine.
Yes, that’s what that dozer had, just DT 4 pin. Was wondering whether the numbers on those schematics are the same as Deutch designed them, or CAT connected them in some other fashion.
The Pin numbers on the Cat schematic correspond to the numbers moulded into the back side of the DT connector.
It works well for the square connectors but gets tricky as hell on the round connectors which has always frustrated me
Same here. That 9-pin round connector that’s used for the ET cable I always had to go round it a couple of times to figure out which letter on the back corresponded to which pin.
I believe the last time I used a clicker box was underground at the gyp mine on a R1700G LHD. U-joint failed and blew a hole in the transmission case. Had to use clicker box to override the transmission pressure sensor so parking brake would release to tow machine, if I remember correctly.