Hello! I am an Industrial Design student working on a project that is aimed to create a skid steer loader/compact track loader specifically designed for the construction industry. I am looking for your answers to the following questions as well as suggestions of your own. Your feedback can lead to the manufacturing of a brand new skid steer designed just for your line of work! Concerning the needs of a skidsteer on a construction/demolition jobsite, what would be the best for a skid steer/CTL? - Rated Operating Capacity? - Tracks vs. Wheels? - Most Essential Attachments? - Enclosed or open cab? - Manual quick attachment/Hydraulic quick attachment/Electric quick attachment? - Essential features? (float, radial/vertical lift, parallel lift, smooth ride system, high flow) - What could be improved on the machine to save you time when working? - What size trailer would it need to fit on? - Any other thoughts or suggestions you have, let's hear it!
Everybodies dream machine is going to be different. Your king of the hill machines are rated at 4000 lbs lift and weigh in at over 12,000. Guys like the high ROC, but many get concern about the CDL requirments to haul the the thing. If you could come up with a high ROC machine that weight say 8,000 that didn't fall apart, you may have something. Enclosed cabs with air are quickly becoming the standard.
So what would YOUR dream machine be?
I would think something under the 10,000 pound operating weight, operating load of <4,000, tipping load <7,000, breakout <8,000, 12ft long, 6.5' wide, 12" ground clearance, tracks, 9ft dump height, =<90 hp, =4ppi, All the technical out of the way, I now get to one of MY most important things and that is the access of mechanics to various parts. They always seem to cram things in where they are inaccessible, need to have panels that are easily removed to get ENTIRE access to the motor, and hydraulics.
The cab is nice, but we do need a way to lower and raise arms and move the machine while the cab is up, at least in my opinion, maybe a wireless system control for a dealer or mechanic? Just a thought... O and length was with a standard bucket
That's an impressive list of machines you have there. Do you have a favorite? If so, why is it your fav?
These units require plenty of service. Clean up the internals. Make it easier to service. Some are a nightmare and I say design engineers are to blame. Good luck with your project.
After running several new ctl's here lately, I have settled to a Bobcat T650. It has an airconditioner that will part your hair. With my kind of profile, that is important. Just joking, but I like the option of foot controls, radio, cup holders, easy to see out of, big cab, great dealer close by that has rentals for 40% off when yours is in their shop. Price is high and the door opens out. But that air will feel good coming from the roof. Did I mention I work in Oklahoma where it is hot and humid?
bamadude; You have a difficult design job here. IMHO these machines are kinda like swiss army knives, they do a lot of job's but really none of them well, or as well as a "specific job designed" machine would do. I might qualify that last statement by excluding small "dirt work" jobs. A mulching guy would have a very different "ultimate" machine than a demo guy, or a paving guy. I have told friends that if money were not an object, I'd have the biggest rated (wheeled) machine (wt. & hp), a Bobcat all wheel steer, and a (big) CTL. I know that this does not help you much, there are a few things that would apply to all is serviceability and as little reliance on electrical BS gizmo's as possible. I want as little dealer "dependancy" as practicle to keep my **** running.
Too many machines are one-size fits all. There should be add-ons and features to make the machine a "forestry class" or "landscape class" or "excavation class" by adding guards, tire/ride options, or piston pumps for running high-demand attachments
Yes! For forestry work steel tracks are necessary or at least recomended, but not for landscaping... Another thing that changes is desired weight balance. Rear visibility has always been an issue. Landscapers and tree people would love a ctl setting atop a mini excavator chassis, the ability to rotate around without turning around would be awesome for them. In gereral it would be nice to have a rear trailer hitch as well.
The ultimate construction/demolition skid would be one that does not break down. It seems that most of the skids I see in the construction/demo area are not well maintained so it would make sense to build a machine that will be reliable.
You said it in a nut shell, MAINTAINED. Things are going to fail after x amount of hours, but on a daily I think with the maintenance we do around here we are pretty much on the top end of things, like I said the occasional hose,track, motor failure these things happen...
"It seems that most of the skids I see in the construction/demo area are not well maintained so it would make sense to build a machine that will be reliable." Manufacturers do make an effort to build in reliability. If the contractor will not do PM nothing the factories build will remain reliable. It sounds as if you are saying the contractor can neglect their equipment and if it breaks down then it is the manufacturers fault. You can't hold manufacturers liable for neglect. No hard feelings but what are you smoking? Ciao.
lol
don't be stupid...I guess I have to spell it out for you word for word. I am saying build a machine that would be reliable with less maintenance:Banghead. And learn how to use the quote button when you quote someone.
Less maintenance? I mean come on change the oil, keep your filters clean, keep your equipment clean, don't operate it like a jacka$$. I don't seem to have much of a problem... Like I said earlier, things are going to fail over time, but that's the nature of what the equipment is doing for you. Could always go back to a shovel? LOL
I come on here and try to help the OP with his question and then have to deal comments like this. All I said was build a reliable machine and you and another guy have to ruin this thread with mindless drivel. Please get back to the topic
Ok, less maintenance got it. Great suggestion. :deadhorse
Less maintenance? Oil change intervals are over 500hrs now Hydraulic oil intervals are 3000-6000hrs now Coolant can be as high as 12,000hrs. What more do you want? I think a better air filtration system maybe wth a respirator would be nice. Our filters are plugged within a couple days. Better filtration for cab too. our cabs stay clean but the filters fill immediatley.
Rear 3-pt hitch option for pulling scarifiers. Lift capability on that Enclosed cab with ac/heat, an ergonomic option for controlling the bucket tilt and lift. One that makes sense. Like for robotics operations where you see them wearing a glove with strain gauges to detect the motion of the arm hand. Wouldn't have to be that complicated, but you get the idea. Forward side and backup cameras. So you can see what the bucket is doing. Bucket level indicators in the cab. Single Variable toggle switch control for tracks. Straight goes forward, straight and slightly left goes slow arch to left. Rotation of the toggle stick spins Indicator if bucket is about to dump backwards( on your head). Laser grading controls? Huge lifting power Turbo diesel. Standard bucket with hydraulically retractable teeth? And drop-down scarifiers underneath facing rearward a Allows breaking of soil while backing out with a load then loading freshly broken sod next trip. All the brainstorming my engineer mind can think of at the moment
The very best and most efficient way for a design engineer (I worked in R&D for years), especially a student, is to take a sabbatical and work in the industry. Work in the operating environment, get to know the demograpghic, operate and get to know the machines. Only then will you know first hand what people are talking about. Then go back and break out the "CAD" and go to work.
Great skid steer would be (wheels) tracks these days can not stand up to gravel and rock they just get shredded and rollers break, we do retaining walls with sandstone and 50mm gravel and cant have tracks because of that reason, Design a whole new system! go another step and make them stand up to gravel and rock like excavators for instance, Also with the curl rams that tilt the bucket down and up make the bucket points and ram points avoid having dirt or soil fall over them for example when you have a full bucket and it spills over the back falls right through the linkages and gets grit and dirt in the pins and wears them down, maintainces is fine, mabey beef up the newer designs skid steers today are starting to get more fimlsy and weaker, other then that try make the cab as luxury as posible every operator loves a nice cab! jordan
Why does it have to be "a construction" skid steer? Is a skid steer any less challenge on a ranch/farm? Why not have two or three different powered units? All being able to interchange quick disconnect (not all will run high demand attachments) style? The more attachments that are interchangeable between models would mean a lot to the end user. Particularly if they are considering an upgrade at a later date. I'm looking at used units for my first skid. I have a new farm. It's mostly second growth pine. I have a dozer for clearing and road creation, so what I need is a smaller unit for other misc. work. Loaders, scrapers, post hold diggers, hay forks, the whole list. I don't want to have to buy a "farm tractor" for those other needs either.
a machine built similar to a "tranformers" autobot with a book of coupons when delivered new so I can finish tricking it out. one machine cant please everybody. some folks need to be handed a shovel before operating a skid steer so they will learn to appreciate a fine piece of technology. I would be happy at this point with anything that has a cab. brush hogging sucks with no cab. and I don't care what the book says, I will be changing the oil/filter every 200 hours because I love the machine so much. got lots of enjoyment from my case 70xt this year.
Even though I ended up buying a 2012 NH L220 with OTT, I think JCB's/Volvo's "new generation" side-entry design is very close to my "ideal". But, they do need some improvement. Refer to the thread , post #56 & beyond for the desired improvements. I agree that a SSL/CTL is not just a "construction" machine. They are just a portable power unit that are used for a whole variety of things, so the need for flexibility & versatility is key. And I agree with most of the comments on the need to make serviceability as easy as possible & accessible. The design engineers really need to service a SSL before they are allowed to help design one!!!
Anyone heard from the OP? I smell a red herring...
Somebody mentioned spill plates ontop the bucket, think that would be a great idea. I see it very often guys overfill the bucket and drop crap on the pistons. We have a bobcat 650. They made it easier to grease, easier to service, and as far as I'm concerned having a/c, heat, and radio in a bobcat is outstanding. We load triaxles with it, do a lot of backfill, sanding the trench,hot topping, and sweeping. For what we do serves it's purpose very well. For ctl's my favorite is still a gehl ctl60, no thrills, not most comfortable, but easy to operate, and for the power it did have I think it was matched to the machine right. I prefer pilots but we have all hands and feet though. A few few sub contractors have pilot machines though, does anybody else have difficulty getting use to the newer electric controls? I thought older cats and cases with pilots were great, to get in a brand new one now I don't like them at all....