As I read through this forum, I noticed several pictures of graders with the tread on the tires oriented front on one side and back on the other side. My grader has the same thing but I thought it may have been a mistake. Now that I have seen other graders with the same thing I wonder if someone can explain why they would be installed that way. Would it be equal traction in forward and in reverse? But I would not have much need for traction in reverse.
If those are rear tyres and the photo is taken from the back facing forward, the one on the left of your photo is correct, the one on the right has the tread pattern reversed.
Yair . . . A correctly mounted tyre slipping under load can (in the right sort of mud) leave curled up 'worms' or extrusions either side of the wheel track . . . that is to say it is 'self cleaning'. I was always told drive tyres are mounted thus and steer or drag tyres the other way about. Cheers.
Exactly, unless getting unstuck (backwards) is more important than going forward. Combine tires are typically mounted backwards (like the right tire if that's the rear view)
Yair . . . Gotcha Delmer I didn't know that about combines . . . makes sense. Cheers.
They put tires on grain carts backwards too. Supposedly they pull easier.
Thanks for the info. I was just curious since I have seen several pics of graders with tire tread in opposite directions, whether there was a good reason for doing this. So to give the previous owners the benefit of the doubt, perhaps they had a muddy or uphill situation in which they needed good traction in reverse as well as forward. When I get new tires (these have dry rot), I will have both installed in forward position.
Yes, we are looking at rear of the grader in my avatar. I do see now that it does appear to be a front windshield and the front of a tractor! Interesting how they put these graders together.
A lot of tires have 2 arrows on them; one for powered tires, and the opposite way for unpowered tires. It works kinda like a ratchet, the powered way grips the ground and pushes the machine forward, the other way, the ground grips the tire and keeps it rolling, as opposed to sliding and digging in, or pushing up a pile in front of it. I run them that way on my spreader trucks, and it makes a big difference:
i have been told why a bloke mounted them backwards 1 they dont have much traction when they are "backwards" so if i get bogged like that i just stop hit reverse and back out using maximum traction to get out instead of using maximum traction to get bogged and having "no" way out 2 at high road speed (30-40km/h) they run smoother on the road with less vibration because of the way the tread contacts the ground during rotation i drove "sister" machines with tyres each way and i would say it was noticeable
I've always mounted grader tires with the chevrons going forward on drive tires. The front tires of a standard drive machine I've always mounted the chevrons facing towards the rear of the machine. Radials for snow and such seem to me to have the direction arrows molded into the sidewalls.
John C. , chevron is a new word for me so I looked it up. I need a bit of advice from someone. How important would it be to use strictly grader tires on My 402 Galion? For example, the tires presently on my grader have lobes on the end of the chevron, or is a straight uniform chevron equally as good? My main use for the grader is maintaining a dirt road on a tree farm. The land has rolling hills and the road passes over ravines (I wait for them to dry before grading) and some fairly steep grades. I was doing some ditching and got the blade 4-5 inches deep on the toe to nothing on the heel and this caused the grader to spin the tires. I really am not aware how much dirt my grader should be expected to move, but the engine has never bogged down. The governor keeps the RPMs and the wheels spin, so I am under the impression that more traction would be good as long as I do not bog the engine down. I am really in no hurry and I do not try to dig real deep. I am just trying to get Ole Gal in excellant working condition. Thanks for your advice or what you are thinking.
The exhaust hit a low hanging limb! Fortunately, it bent the exhaust pipe into a perfect 90 degree angle! Ha!
So Mitch, I assume that the front tires on your spreader truck are not pulling the truck, just steering. I see similar tires on spreader trucks around here but I never really looked at the direction of the tread. The local lime/fertilizer company uses a terragator for spreading, one big tire in the front and two large ones in the rear. I will check out his tire orientation when I go by his place.
Yeah, only the rear axle pulls. I started out with all 4 wheels the same way. I actually got the idea of turning the front wheels around from seeing them on graders that way. I looked at the tires on one of my 2 motorgraders and it had the powered/unpowered wheel arrows. In short, I have tried them both ways, and it makes a massive difference. With them turned like the rears, when you get in mud, they'll stop turning and pile mud in front of them, which sticks you. With them reversed, they keep turning. It works with those big tires, and my "little" 15-22.5 dry weather tires. As to your question, you might get a little better traction with ag tires, but the first thing I'd do is turn that backward tire around, it really does matter. After I did that, I'd look at putting some weight on the rear. I think that the main advantage of the R-4 (grader/loader) tire over the ag tread is it probably has better traction in reverse, and a little less in forward.
After turning that RH tyre it may also pay you to mess around with pressures to see if it makes any difference to traction.
I think I read either on the tire or this forum that normal tire pressure is around 15 psi. Would this be correct and good for traction?
Directional tires on drive axles are mounted tread forward to self clean, free rolling tires where the ground is turning the wheel are backwards
I don't think you can actually give a number for "normal", as what works with one brand of tyre on one machine might not work with another brand of the same size tyre on another machine. IMO it's all down to the flex in the tyre carcass, a tyre with a "rigid" sidewall could need far less pressure than one with a relaitvely soft sidewall (think bias ply versus radial maybe). A tyre that doesn't flex right will spin at the least provocation rather than grip. I would imagine your tyres are bias ply, correct..?
Our 940 Volvo came with the front tires on the correct way. One of the owners thought they were on backwards, and got the boys in the shop to flip them around. Now she slides instead of turning in sandy material or mud. First trip to the tire shop will fix that.
Nige, I am sure these tires are bias ply, although I could not find any indication on the tire. They are nylon Mohawk Chief, and and they show very little bulge as might be typical of radials. They certainly have very stiff sidewalls which may be due partly to being old (like me). Mitch, Since you mentioned the arrows, I also looked for arrows on my tires indicating the direction of travel. I thought I understood the proper orientation of tires. Only one thing is clear to me now, I do not understand tire technology!! The pictures are of the tire on the left hand side of my grader which I thought was on correctly, but would you look at the arrow!! I can not believe what I am seeing. The arrow indicates that this tire is turning in the wrong direction! So as you should be able to see in the photo, the chevron angle is pointing in one direction and the arrow on the sidewall is pointing in the opposite direction. So I check on the tire on the right side of the grader. The arrow indicates that it is turning in the correct direction for the driving wheel! I do know one thing for sure, one of these tires is on correctly! Both of these photos are of the tire on the left hand side of the grader.
TBH those tyres look well past their sell by date. The rubber looks really hard and cracked, the carcass is probably about the consistency of a kidney stone..... A distinct lack of flexibility there, could be the root cause of your traction problems. Ref bias vs radial, is the size marked on the tyre sidewall in the format 12.00x24 or 12.00R24....? First is a bias ply, the second is radial. Others may disagree but to me the arrow on the left side tyre can say what it wants but judging by the tread orientation from your earlier photos that tyre is installed correctly, it's the right side tyre that's on backwards.
Is it possible that the tire has been re-capped. When you look along the edge of the tread it has that appearance.
Good spot, that tyre looks very much like a re-cap.
Nige, The format is the first you list as 13.00x24 so that is the bias ply. Thanks. I did look for a date on the tire which I could not find like would be on a car or truck tire. Do the newer tires have a date stamped on them?
Perhaps the tire was installed according to the arrow, and not the tread design.
Yes, newer tires have a date code on them. That one has a 3090xxx number on it but who knows what it means. The old date code didn't specify the decade, for car tires at least. That tire is from the 70's at the latest, maybe original to the grader, 50's?
You're only going to get so much traction. A lot of it comes down to how you feel and handle the machine. A skilled operator on your Ole Gal can do more than someone without a clue on a 24 Cat. Mind you, newer machines make blade adjustment easier and quicker for that moment when you can feel that she is going to break traction. I can honestly say that besides our little Puckett, Alitec, and Mauldin, I have never driven a 4 wheel grader. I have no idea how they feel. I would suspect that you would lose some stability without the rear tandem wheels, as well as traction. As far as tires, and tread design. I always found Bias tires are out of round after sitting, and are more prone to flats. I ran a grader for 6 years with a truck tread, or highway tread, and besides muddy conditions, I still managed to get by.
Don't they put the tyres on backwards on french machines?
AFAIK earthmoving tyres don't have a date on them as such that you can decipher. All manufacturers (at least the ones I've dealt with anyway) use a code within the Serial Number to date tyres, but unless you have the code it's just a number. As for those rear tyres I would seriously consider replacing them with new, radial for preference but anything new is going to be better than what you have on there right now.
Pretty funny for a guy who's toilet spins the wrong way when you flush. LOL Being from a province where the minority french seem to have all the say over us english. I will admit that I have my beef with them, but they are not all bad. We have a mechanic here that will be sadly missed when he retires this fall. If he laid a bolt down 40 years ago he knows where. If he can't get the parts, he can make them, and he is not one of these guys that rolls his eyes when you tell him what you think the problem is. One of the things I like best about him, if you are the only english person among a group of french, and one of them speak to him in french, he always answers in english. I think he puts his tyres on the right way.
Just wondering about the date being on the tire. I need to search for tires at a good price so I would like to avoid getting "old" new tires at a bargain price because they have been sitting around for years. I hesitate to buy on eBay even though they were a good price (2 for $841.00) and free shipping. I have read some negative and positive views on tires made in China so am steering clear of them. Anyone have suggestions on brands and online purchasing? I need to local search also since a good price might be included in an installation.
https://www.kenjones.com/Scripts/XListSearch.aspx?XGID=OTR_1300x24
Sorry, my geography is off. I thought Delaware was closer.
Ha! That,s ok about Delaware. . It is surprising how many people in USA do not know DE exists! Even though DE is considered the first state. I did check the website and called them. They do not have radials so I could not get a price for them. He said $125.00 to ship to me.
I can imagine that radials would be pretty pricy, but if you spend the money, then you have something. Other people get by with Bias ply tires, and that is all they had for years. Another option, if you want radials, would be recapped tires. A couple of our loaders run recaps, and my old 730 champion had recaps for years.
Two wheel drive combines have the back smaller steering tires mounted backwards. The 4 wheel drive models have all four wheels mounted in the traction forward mode.
It is very common around here for the owners of 2wd combines to turn the front (drive) tires backwards. Then, if it starts to slip or sink, you can sometimes back out. Also, it is much easier to rig to pull a combine backwards, so it can help more when pulling out backwards.
Big tire the right direction!!
I checked the local tire shop today. The price for a bias tire mounted was $460.00 mounted and $800.00 more for radial. I think I will check out recaps before I buy anything.