Let me try this again on it's own threat... I would like to know how to assess the percentage of undercarriage life left on my Caterpillar D6D. I am always reading, "Cat *** for sale, 80% undercarraige..." How do they come up with such an exact figure? My machine only has a couple thousand hours on it, but I'd love to know how much life is left in the undercarriage... Start saving now!
Half the time I think the sales people guess but you can measure rail height, roller surface remaining, pin& bushing wear. grouser height etc to come up with a percentage. All those dimentions should be available at your dealer from the undercarriage rep.
There are special gauges that allow them to make accurate measurements. The Cat dealer here has a tech whose entire job is to measure tracks. They provide a very detailed report. Of course his real job is to sell tracks, although he's not obnoxious about it. The way Cat is they probably make all dealers do this. If you have a Cat already I'm sure this is free. If you're buying they may charge, I don't really know. I remember the tech having some kind of scanner to check metal thickness on roller shells, even.
Thank you for the replies... I hate calling our Caterpillar dealer, so I think my curiosity just went away!
undercarriage Cat has people, parts and service reps. or product support specialists, customer service reps. other dealers have the same thing maybe a different name. These are tough jobs because nobody wants to hear that they need to replace something(send money). Weather its Deere, Komatsu, or Cat they all have this service, and they all have each others spec to compare there machine to yours. These people do a job if you don't come on with a attitude they wont give you one.
undercarriage This may answer some of your ?. Go to Tractor parts . com ,schroll down to the picture gallery , then you will see some blocks with pics, click on the undercarriage measurement, you will see a trackhoe moving, go down alittle more and you will see read old IH Track school manual ( HERE ) click on this, maybe this will help to explain undercarriage and wear factor a little better before you get a estimate or have a listing that gives a percentage worn/left. Just reading this will give you the edge when you look at, buying , selling, making repairs to your own equipment.
Most of the people who give track ratings are spouting crap. 80% could mean amount of wear left or amount worn. All the components wear at different rates and it is very seldom that everything wears out at the same time. It is also becoming very common to only replace certain parts instead of doing everything at once. You will also see things like welded idlers, built up sprocket teeth and all kinds of shade tree fixes. So that 80% rating could mean anything the salesman wants it to be. There is a good tutorial available on the following site. Then judge for yourself if you want a salesman to measure yours. http://www.constructioncentric.com/forum/YaBB.pl
undercarriage info Back when I was a kid about 8 years old my father bought his first track press and I would go out with the men and do tracks, my little fingers could put the nuts on track bolts. I stayed with the track business till 1985 when a injury forced me to quit. I then sold undercarriage and serves for another 10 years then made the jump to selling equipment. I think I've got a good understanding of undercarriage. I would like to thank you, John C for your thread and the site that you recommended, www.constructioncentric.com I read over all of it, its easy to understand, complete in every way. If someone reads and understands whats on that site they will have a comprehensive understanding of U/C maintenance. That site should be a must read for everyone on this site, its that good Thank You
measure your own undercarriage, its not that tough. undercarriage measurments are the percentage of usable life left in a particular component. a good set of calipers and a metal ruler is all you'll need. get into your cat book and find their recomemdations for replacement (most of us will run them a good 30% lower than their recomendations or till they fall off the machine, which ever comes first ) and the new size, subtract the 2 and devide for percentage and that is your percentage of track left. example: my 8230 grouser height new is 3". my grouser height now is 2". terex says to replace at 1" that make usable life of the grouser 2". 3"-2"=1" considering 1" replacement wear, my track pads are at 50% (half of 2" of usable life). (these are not actual heights for terex, they're just easy to work with) the same holds true for all of the other components.
Thanks...BigIron Thanks for the info BigIron... A fellow Oregonian! Where in Oregon?
stjo46, Thanks for the comments on the site. I'll relay your thoughts to the people who put the site together. John C.
born and raised on the coast Tillamook, Cloverdale, then Wecoma Beach (now part of Lincoln City) now 10 miles North of Sandy. Counted 36 head of Elk in my back 20 tonight on the way in from work. Sounds like you may be from down south, Coos Bay or lower! Logged down there some time back.
Yeah... Just a bit south of Coos Bay in a little paradise called Bandon! www.petersfamilytrucking.com
I have a 550H John Deere with 1530 hours on it and had the track service man come and check the track for wear, it is a free service so I decided why not have him check it. Man was I dissapointed, I thought he would have all the tools and guages needed to do a real inspection, he came and I took him where the dozer was he gets out of my truck and looks at it and kneels down and rubs him finger on one of the bushing and says you are ready for the bushing to be turned and new sprokets installed. You might can run it another 300 hrs. The cost of this is $2650, I can't help but think he works off of commission on these jobs. I know it will need this done after a while but I can't tell its worn any more since I bought it. I think I have put around 250 hrs. on it. Does this seem like a fair price for turning the bushing and replacing the sprokets on this size dozer?
track service No the rep more than likely works on a salary, given the fact that he works for Deere how many 550H do you think he has seen in the course of the last year with around 1500 hrs on it. The rep should break down the bill for you, but here is what they are going to do, they get your machine they may have to clean the mud off. Then put it up on blocks and take the tracks off the machine and then bring them over to the track shop for the track service. At the track shop the tracks will be cleaned, the bolts will be removed from the tracks it will then be disassembled, then the reassembly where the bushings will be turned, giving you a new wear surface and the bolts tightened then it on its way back to the service shop. Where while that service was being done they have removed and replaced your sprockets. Your tracks are then reinstalled on your machine, its taken off the blocks and out the door back to you. All this work was not done by Santa's elves it didn't magically happen, but by men. You have incurred apx. 1800 hrs of revenue running time, if you have not planed for maintenance, this is one of the costs. By the way its going to cost a lot more if you run the bushing till they are cracked.
Some mechanic got his little feelers hurt... It's always the guy with no machines of his own who spouts off with the "you've received 1800 hours worth of revenue..." blah, blah, blah. Get your own thread to yank everyone's chain about the poor dealerships and their under-appreciated lives!
I don't know of any Deere product support people that work on just salary. All I know are on salary plus commission. They get a piece of every part sold in their territories. All the dealers operating in this area work the same. Deere does have procedures for measuring undercarriage and it does take measuring tools and specifications from a book to be able to say for sure whether or not the bushings need to be turned. In my opinion the rep was being lazy by not providing the proof of what he was recommending. Having said all that I would have to say I have not seen any of those machines make 2,000 hours of operation without needing a bushing turn. I don't think stjo46 is out of line at all in what he is saying and the cost is on par with what any track shop around here would charge. You are looking at probably two days of labor, some track seals along with some track pad bolts and the new sprockets. If you decide not to turn bushings you can expect them to begin cracking through at about 2,100 to 2,300 hours and I've never seen them go more than 2,500 hours without needing to be totally replaced. That is how tracked machines work.
Thanks for the advice JohnC. I probably will be through with the dozer at around 1800 hrs. I will probably then sell it because I will have done everything I needed to get done with it. I am picky with all my equipment and even though I am going to sell it I still don't want to mess anything up. I will keep a close eye on the bushing and shoot for the 1800 hr. mark.
Wow, I was in a Mood My earlier post was a little out-of-line... I had just received a phone call from a grumpy old lady that was relentless about getting two loads of topsoil delivered to her city parcel. So, although it was a complete pain-in-the-butt, I delivered 20 yards of dirt. Well, come to find out, she needed a permit to receive more than 3 yards of dirt within our city limits. I suspect I'll be getting a fine right along with her. So, sorry about the harsh posting!
I would like to add a couple cents worth. I have done a few track jobs. I have a friend I work with that is from the track shop. He is one of the most experienced track men I know, that is why I always try to get him to help when I have track work. We were on an excavator job and he made a comment about how bad the chains were. I called our track appraiser to have a look. After he "Measured" the chains and bushing with the proper tools he concluded the chains were still 25 percent. The point I am trying to make is, at the cost of undercarrage work, do not rely on someones guess. No one is that good. With the proper tools and someone that knows how to use them you can get a real close estimate on how many more hours you may have on the tracks. The undercarrage appraisers I know do not charge for the service. Most of your dealer that handle tracks would be more than happy to have a look at your machine.
That's what I was thinking when the track man came to me, that he would tell me about how many more hours the tracks could be run before needing work. Not the you bout need to turn them bushing and would't hurt to put some sprokets on there. That's like leaving it to tire salesman to tell you when you need a new set of tires.