I only use this machine clearing my own properties, so it's not in commercial use, but I tow a Takeuchi TB175 around with my 2006 F350 4X4 dually with a 6.0 diesel. I pull it on a 25' dual tandem pintle hitch equipment trailer and have no issues. I do have a SCT Tuner with a towing tune for the engine and tranny, but I've never had any engine or transmission issues in 100k miles. I also use the same pickup, or my old 1992 D350 SRW Dodge, to tow my Takeuchi TB145 and Takeuchi TL150 which I use to do some sublet work. Although I've towed the TB175 for years without any issues or problems, I don't really think my pickup wants anymore. With a 36" XDuty bucket and thumb on the 175 I think it weighs in just over 19,500 pounds. My trailer has two Dexter 15k oil bath axles (of course brakes on each axle) and weighs somewhere around 8k empty. Just wondering if anyone is towing much more with their pickup. Not bragging by any means, just don't think I can tow much more without asking for trouble. So far the worst I've had is somewhat heavier tire wear on the front tires trying to get everything turned in tight areas and only about 15k miles on a set of front brake pads even with the trailer brakes turned up quite a bit.
According to Ford, your maximum GCW for your truck is 15,000 lbs. with a weight distributing hitch, with 1,500 lbs. of that being on the tongue. Maximum GCW with a gooseneck is 16,700 lbs. All it would take is one accident showing you exceeded those limitations and you're done, regardless of what you think the truck is capable of or what other people are doing and getting away with. Verify this with your insurance company. A F450 or F550 only gives you 16,000 lbs. on a pintle, but you get 24,000 lbs. on a gooseneck.
I have a stock '08 F350 DRW 4X4 crew cab 6.4L and the towing limitations are the same as yours.
If you need to define GCW - http://www.irmi.com/online/insurance-glossary/terms/g/gross-combination-weight-gcw.aspx
Loaded question. No pun Intended....I would not tow anything bigger than 4 ton behind my pickup truck in terms of heavy equipment period....I drive a 2015 chevy duramax 3500 but use my tandem axle for all towing..
2015? Typo?
Not a typo...it's a 2015 chevrolet duramax 3500....that's right a 2015 model year...just picked it up about a month ago...
Sweet!
Not that I'm in the mood to spend the money, but Dodge, um, I mean Ram has 1 ton pickups factory rated to tow 30,000 pounds. http://www.ramtrucks.com/en/towing_guide/ I can pickup a 1999 F550 flatbed 4X4 with 130k miles and is in decent condition for $12k. It just doesn't have the crew cab and I really don't have a use for the flatbed.
Gooseneck trailers are not for me. I need to get down some tight roads and, unfortunately, I've learned that a pintle hitch trailer will positively track behind the tow vehicle around corners far better than a GN trailer. I'm not overly concerned towing what I do since I have for so many years and for so many miles. A really good trailer makes a huge difference. I can stop darn near as fast fully loaded with all eight trailer tires grabbing the ground along with all six on my truck.
Back in '81 we headed from mid Michigan to Indiana, home made heavy built with 4 mobile home axles under it, box full of spares. To grab a Trojan 100, healthy 2 1/2 yard machine, all of 12-15ton. After using the loader to burm dirt so we could get it on the trailer, all the tires flattened out. Unloaded , pumped 150# in all 8, loaded back up. And away we went Bumper pulled that dude back to Michigan with a 3/4 ton Chevy. Had a few flats on the trailer. Now those were the days. Sent from my rooted HTC Supersonic using Tapatalk 2 Pro
Well congratulations. You've been doing it wrong for so long you've forgotten what right is. Personally, I'm glad I don't share the road with you, and live in a different state. I pray you don't take someone's life on the road.
And then people wonder why there are those ridiculous laws and weight restrictions, and truck cops, etc. You can laugh about it and consider yourself lucky that you didn't kill someone. Don't think I'd be proud of that. I digress.
Maybe we need to change that name to sour puss. Most laws and regulations are in place for people who are doing things like this and don't realize exactly what they are doing. I have an 89 f350 that weighs 15800lbs according to the scale at the local quarry loaded with tools and I still pull skid steers and i have a 2013 dodge crew cab dualy and 25+5 gooseneck that I haul 14 2200lb hay bales on and have never had any issues. But I drive with common sense. You dont have to be first in the race. It seems that the OP has been doing this for a while and hasn't had any issues so as long as he keeps doing what he is comfortable with and takes his time there won't be any problems. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk
My only point is that under those conditions, all it takes is one fatal accident, and even if he is not at fault, he can lose everything. Anyone who's ego is larger than the engineers that design those trucks (I worked in truck R&D) is just begging for trouble. It just makes it easy for the judge. And ignorance is no excuse. Hope y'all's luck holds out. And I suggest y'all talk to your insurance carriers about this subject and report back.
Lil' Puss refers to my little 7,000 lb. dozer. :laugh
I occasionally haul a Kubota KX-121-3 (8000#) on a 14K 25' gooseneck. Truck is a Chevy C3500. It handles very well. We upgraded to the truck when we bought a gn horsecamper. The salesman told up that our 3/4t Ford would pull it just fine. Well, it did **pull** it fine, but I could feel sway in gentle curves even with the trailer empty. Weighed the rig and the truck rear axle was 300# overweight with the trailer empty. We upgraded to the C3500 and stability returned. As for manufacturer's tow ratings, IDK. I remember when the Chevy Chevette (1970's compact car) was rated to tow 3000#! Heck, there was no way to attach a sturdy hitch to the car, there was no frame, only sheet metal! 3000# would be a fantasy!
I couldn't agree more...I am 'performing' stunts all the time...I remember one time I could turn the wheels (front end) lock-to-lock on my '67 Ford pick up going down the road, I had so much steel in the box... But, I live in a rural area with few cars on the road... BUT, all it takes is a dummy in a mini van to pull out it front of you.... and YIKES! So, I am trying not to do this anymore!
You're entitled to your opinion. As far as your judgements on me knowing what is right or wrong, I'll just toss that out with a grain of salt. The thread isn't about who can haul the most with a pickup, it's intended to see how much others are hauling with newer pickups rated to tow more than I'm towing. I have well over a million miles of towing on all sorts of roads and have yet to have a single accident. You probably think that is some coincidence, but it's not. Everything is relative. Compared to the equipment I ran in mining, my equipment is nothing but toys. Compared to my equipment, yours is toys. As I said earlier, it's not a contest or for bragging rights. I'm just curious as to what others are hauling. Unfortunately, all I seem to have gotten in response is your rants. No worries though, I'll consider them, although misplaced, good intentioned comments towards someone who, as far as you know, has zero common sense nor experience. However, if you are unaware of what new 1 ton pickups are rated to tow, you may want to do a bit of reading. Good day. Oh, FYI, when towing in populated areas I've had DOT cops weigh me 4 different times now on their (really cool) portable scales. Never have had an issue. Therefore, it's "Allgood".
I still think i take the cake on the risky scale. Mind you I was passenger. Not driver. His idea. I take risks, but nothing that wild. Sent from my rooted HTC Supersonic using Tapatalk 2 Pro
This is always a dicey subject with many opinions and experience, so let's all be cordial.:cool2 Personally I would not tow that much weight behind a 1 ton dually but that is my level of risk I choose to take. Last week I saw a 420D - 4x4, E-cab, extendahoe - on a dual tandem gooseneck behind a chevy extended cab single rear wheel 2500 in the parking lot of the septic tank pre-cast yard! That fool shouldn't be on the road and I hope the DOT impounded his rig before he killed himself or someone else.
Good on you. Aside from being a PACCAR test driver, I also drove lowboys commercially, carrying every piece of construction equipment you can imagine. So in that case consider all my comments and suggestions irrelevant because according to you I don't know what I'm talking about. I see the road you're headed down. Ya, it's "all good luck". Happy truckin'
That's a tail that will wag the dog. Wow! Scary.
To help get this back on topic per the OP, I tow a tow master T18 trailer with a 2013 F350 powerstroke extended cab srw. While we can all debate legal, safe etc, etc. I'm only here to share what I pull weight wise. Mini exes that range in the 4 to 6 ton class, compact wheel loaders up to 13k, and the larger of tracked skiddys. Total gross with equipment, accessories, chains and fuel; I've run in the 18k range. Pulls nice, stops great, no problems... Now, would I pull a tb175? No way. I'm glad you have safely done it, but time for a bigger truck!
I will agree with the other responses here. As someone who has tried it I do not feel comfortable with 24,000lbs behind a pickup no matter what the manufacturer says. But the real question is why do you want to? When you compare the running cost between a pick and a truck at weights like this it doesn't make much sense to use a pickup. Even if it was close the safety factor helps sway me towards a real truck.
I had an experienced construction crew boss that helped run a huge construction and concrete company give me the best comment on an old 86 f-350 we were fixing up about 10 years ago.... He said " Ohh those 1 ton trucks, they can haul anything, it's the stopping part you gotta worry about." Made me chuckle, But he's right, and steep hills and stop lights in town are the things that make me the most nervous... I tow a 10k pintle with a skid steer or mini ex on my 2012 f350 drw diesel flat bed dump. That truck will seems like it would pull a house of the foundation but like I said braking and steering is more important to me than payload capacity....safety first!...or at least a close second hahah
Most I have pulled with my 08 3/4 ton ford is a 210 skip loader. Grossed around 26k iirc. It was just a short trip in the outskirts of town. I WOULD NOT pull it any distance more then a few miles or with any grades at all. It felt ok but I knew it was pushing it. I only make that haul a couple times a year at most. That's on a gooseneck too.
Personally, I think it's a bad idea for 2 reasons: 1. Safety 2. If your setup is an 8 ton excavator without a dump truck, you're missing out on more work and potential income than you can possibly imagine.
I have pull a 6 ton excavator with a 2008 dodge 3500 single rear wheel cummins it pulled very well but as everyone else has said stopping is the problem.blowerman and murphy777 how are the new ford diesels holding up
Digteam6 I can't comment on others experiences but my 2013 F350 6.7 has been a great truck. The only issue I have had is replacing the drivers seat belt as it wouldn't retract. It's the strongest pickup I have owned and I've had a few. So far so good. The details of my trucks purchase -
Seems pretty spot on, I've towed 20k with an 89 F250 cross country, Trailer brakes were tops and adjusted, truck brakes were all new and adjusted, It would stop but you had to allow for it. No issues or troubles save for the high passes, 300 inline six did not like pulling that much at altitude. It'd top out at 52 on the flats. I'm much more at ease with the 99 350 dually diesel, all wheel disk brakes and hydraboost makes the braking feel like less work. I did stop mid x country trip and adjust all the brakes just to keep them in top shape.
Oh, I have a dump truck. The only problem is I bought it from a farmer who never had it off the farm. It's a 1975 single axle with a 5.5 yard bed that will certainly haul anything you can put in it's bed, however, it's only powered by a 366ci gasser. It seems like it was more made to haul a load than pull one. It has an honest 41k miles on it, and that's the actual mileage. Anyway, 'Lil' will be happy. I'm buying either a 2000 F550 4X4 with a 7.3 PS or an F650 with a C7 Cat from a concrete contractor I've been getting all the work I could ever want from. I'm leaning towards the 550 because of it's 4X4. I don't think I've ever loaded or unloaded on the road and, without 4X4, I would have been stuck about half of the time.
Probably not a bad idea to have 4wd available. I hadn't used 4wd in my F350 for over three years, so when I purchased my Ram DRW flatbed I decided just to get it in 2wd. This spring I've had several near-stucks just looking at jobs...and then scout out places to park my truck and trailer when I get the job. I'm beginning to question my decision.
On the question of 4x4 or not, I would never buy a compact pickup through 550 sized truck without it. I have it and not need it than need it and not have it is my motto. It'll saved you when you need it and get most of your money back when you sell it.
Thanks cm1995
After reading my post it came across as preaching which was not my intention but I am a matter of fact type of guy.
I think it's funny that people on this forum can talk about all kinds of heavy equipment in a civilized manner, but when they start talking about pickup trucks everyone gets all pissy.
like
4x4 is a good option until you need it.....then it's an absolute necessity. I think you'll find that you'll be more happy than Lil, owning an F550 with a 7.3 that's 25 years newer than your current dump truck.
Ah, I really didn't take it that way. As I mentioned in one quote; I just assumed the one fella's comments were nothing more than good intentioned comments. He doesn't know me, know where I drive etc., so although I didn't really get much out of what he said, I took no offense at all. My name isn't really "Allgood", it's just a phrase I always end up saying. I try to see the positive in any situation and apparently (too frequently) say "No worries, it's all good".
Lol. Yup.
We'll spoken Allgood, nice to see people who promote positive & friendly attitudes toward others..
Seeing as how pickup truck brand selection is a form of religion for many, and any internet mention of the word "pickup" is rarely without the appearance of some owners-manual-thumping-brand-loyal advocate predicting the imminent demise of anyone and all who do not drive the chosen brand,...... I'd say that this thread has been remarkably civilized.:tong
My new ford diesel is great, its super quiet, I average about 13-14 mpg loaded or not....on its own the truck weighs about 10800. Of course it eats up front passenger side tires like all fords do but it pulls and hauls very well, I only have about 29k miles on it now, things have been good, I might buy the extended warranty because I am sure when repairs come along they will be expensive. The new diesel motors are to smart for their own good, the heated mirrors were a great upgrade so I could see how many snow banks I could back into.....
i thought the gcwr was like 20k for an f350 and the gvw was like 15k on an f350
My '92 F450 didn't do that, and '08 F350 DRW 6.4 doesn't do it. What's up with that?
Who's riding shotgun? lol
I don't know why it does that.... my 06 f 250 did the same with the front passenger tire, and now my 2012 f350 is doing it also, I think the design of the straight front axel may have something to do with it, and it comes out of alignment. Around 25-30k miles, I can see the wear belts on the outside of the tire. Joispoi - My three girlfriends ride shotgun.....hahahah I wish, unfortunately I think it is the rough roads and frost heaves that cause the issue. I just put 6 new tires and an alignment on the truck for the tune of about $1200.
1200 for tires and alignment you got a heck of a deal. Your lucky to get a decent set of rubber and mounted and balanced for that price let alone a $350 allignment Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk
Interesting..... I recently noticed my chevy is doing the same thing, front passenger tire. But its wearing the inside of the tire.....
I agree. 162k on the F450 and 93k on the F350. I recently shelled out $2,200.00 for six tires and alignment, and I was gettin g a good deal after shopping around. "Chub" always rides shotgun. "Slim" never does. :laugh
Yeah I think 1200$ is good, I got 17 inch 10 ply hancook dynapro tires. Im not sure if they are the best tire or not, but they cost me about 180$ per tire before taxes. they were 5 bucks less then the BFG rugged trail TA that came on the truck, and they have a more aggressive tread. The place I get my tires and is very fair and the owner is top notch, In the last year I have spent around 4000 in tires for my car and my wife s truck and now my truck with same guy, he knows how to keep people happy.....I apologize for taking this thread way off topic....wasn't the original thread something about the superbowl or the world series??? hahah
Those chevys have an independent front suspension, I really like how smooth they ride. you could have and alignment issue as well. I didn't mean to generalize that a lot of fords wear out front passenger tires, but my last 2 have, and by no means am I a brand specific truck person, it was just that the ford had the price and options that I needed at those times. I would buy another ford tomorrow if I needed one.
Pretty much all the Fords (all 4x4) I have owned will "cup" the outer edge of both of the front tires. I just keep them rotated to wear evenly.
that is exactly what my tire guy said....I need to pay a lot more attention to tire condition, and I could probably get alot more mileage out of my tires
My 99' Ford F-250 4x4 wears all the tires perfectly evenly. The only time they wear unevenly is when I needed to replace worn front end parts or needed an alignment.
All my vehicles gnaw the inside of the tires first. Have had alignments done and still eat them up. May need a new shop. Anyway as the thread asks. What's the largest ex with p/u. How about a enclosed, non dump pick up. My van weighs about 8700 lbs. I'm loaded for bear, it's a GMC extended savana 3500 I can put a 28' extension ladder inside and close the doors with all glass intact. I drag a tb 135 at 7636 lbs my trailer is 2100 lbs It pulls and handles this quite well with prodigy elec. brakes on both axles. Rolled the scales this morning at 18,100 lbs. tagged at 20k. Now I pulled this same setup with my other 2500 standard van once and that was enough. The tail wagged the dog. Really have no intention of hauling more as we have to drive for all the idiots that actually own the roads. But as I said it does fine and I choose to call this enough and not tempt fate. Trying to post pic from iPad but seems not possible
too much?
It would make me nervous! That trailer can push you into a jackknife in a heart beat. I personally would not take it to traffic speeds.
Probably....I wouldn't run down the highway at speed with it but around town would be OK if you are a good safe driver and not a complete tool... Be safe....
Looks pretty good stormdodger, again its not getting it rolling but knowing how long it takes to stop, newer trucks like yours with four wheel discs and abs do a good job, give it a try stopping from 40kmh on a good road with the trailer brakes disconnected, this will give you a good idea of the stopping distances. If it will bring it to road speed and feel stable that's fine, just keep in mind your stopping distance is 2x or 3x usual and if you find yourself using the high boost brake options, check your trailer brake lining often. Another point is the trailer brakes are manual adjust and will need adjustment every thousand miles or so to keep them optimal.
Yup.
I see that the new 2015 Ford pickups have a 40,000 GCVW and something like 32,500 tow rating. I may not be to the exact pound, but they had to top the 30,000 tow rating that Dodge came out with for their 3500 diesel pickups. It sounds to me like having the right license, right trailer (with the right brakes) and right tie down equipment is going to be the most important question. When it comes to pickup trucks being able to pull the compact excavators, that isn't going to be the issue. Those other items I mentioned are. Unless, of course, you are trying to pull that weight with a single rear wheel pickup.
FORD Diesel Trucks Suck ! the only thing worse than a diesel Ford truck is , well nothing....
Care to elaborate? The 7.3's were great engines, the 6.0's were plagued with problems, no experience with 6.4's and the 6.7 has been a great engine so far. That's my personal experience.:cool2 I have owned several- 7.3's, several- 6.0's and currently have a 6.7 in my truck. Still own a 2001 7.3 I bought new.
Agreed. The 7.3 was an awesome motor ! No disagreement there....it's been all down hill in flames since though....Ford stuck my 6.0 straight up my ass and I will never buy a FORD anything ever again. I just bought a brand new 2015 Chevy 2500 Duramax HD and it's pretty hard to beat in terms of a modern diesel..great motor and hooked to the Allison tranny makes it's a truly great package. Quiet, powerful, loaded with great options....averaging 21.1 miles per gallon driving in the hills of Pa...Best diesel on the road today IMHO.....
My 2012 6.7 is great, quiet, smooth and more power than I know what to do with... I agree the 7.3 is a great motor, so far no problems with my hot rod, But I do feel like comparing trucks is a total personal preference, I go with best value for my money, and the sales and service staff that is going to give me the best treatment. IMHO All brand new 1 ton trucks are over designed, and bulky looking. What happened to square hoods and real metal? On another note I really like the power windows in my truck, and the heated mirrors.
Thats only for the F450's. I know they call it a pickup but is it really? I'm not so sure myself..... They have 19.5's with 4.30 gears, they require commercial registration and insurance like a regular truck. Dont get me wrong I would love to have one, but I'm not completely convinced its a "pickup". While were kinda on the subject, how do these auto manufactures get away with this false advertisement? We see this Then we look at the ratings from the manufacture here http://www.fleet.ford.com/resources/ford/general/pdf/towingguides/15PrelimFLRVTTgde_Apr17.pdf Maybe its just me but I don't see a SRW truck in sight rated for more than 16,500 lbs. I would be shocked if the load pictured was less than 20k. So what gives?
Well I will just consider the source of that statement and write it off. I have a un-chipped '08 6.4 dually 4 x 4 and it pulls anything I have, anywhere, anytime, with barely an effort. In Washington state you will need a CDL to be over 25,999 GCW if you have a business. If you get caught getting paid for dirt work and hauling without a CDL it could get very expensive. And ugly.
You may be delighted to know that the Duramax engine is a Japanese Isuzu. But then you probably already knew that.
I prefer Reliability, the 5.9 mechanical injected cummins, or the 7.3 IDI IH, just one hot 12v wire, either mated with a Nv4500, the 6.34 creeper, not the common 5.61. I'd gamble the aluminum 5600s or zf5/6s, Point being, no computer, manual gearbox. Odb2 and auto shifting is nice, until they stop being fancy or automatic, respectively. Sent from my rooted HTC Supersonic using Tapatalk 2 Pro
I think it has to do solely with marketing - the folks in the marketing dept. aren't verifying it with the engineers. Remember the old truck commercial, I forget which brand, where it carried 1 competitor crossways on the bed and pulled the other one up a rocky incline? That was priceless..
Then there was the one that showed the icebreaker ship of about 30,000 ton displacement getting stuck in the ice, a crane swings out, lowers a F350 overboard, they hook a hawser to the bumper hitch, and the pickup takes off like it's nothing, pulling the icebreaker like it's a bass boat,.
That combo might be legal depending on how much weight is on the trailer itself. You can legally register the truck higher than the manufacturers gvwr. Trailer might be 5k machine is 14k so gross 19k behind an f350 isn't impossible.
You mean you can register it for a higher gross Combined weight, right? I was under the impression the GVWR of the truck was non negotiable and the GCWR was more of a guideline since its not on the door tag. Legally they don't care what your dragging as long as the pickup doesn't have to much weight on it. My point was the manufacture rates it to tow 16.5k (best case scenario), meaning the don't recommend you tow more than that. Then they show it towing a 20k.
My personal works truck i have used are as follows: 1996 chevy 1500 4x4 1997 ford f350 4x4 drw single cab 2004 ford f350 4x4 drw extended cab 2006 ford f250 4x4 srw extended cab 1999 ford f550 4x4 drw single cab 2002 ford f550 4x4 drw crew cab 1970 ford f600 drw single cab 1997 ford fseries (f700). Single cab Etc I currently have a 10k, 14k, 10 ton, and 20 ton tag among others. I move buildings and heavy machinery very often. I have broken pintle hooks and several trailer tongues. I have almost been wrecked several times by loads. Here are my thoughts. Load placement runs hand in hand with braking power. I recently towed a building package on a 14 k trailer to Va.using a f550 i could not drive faster than 60 due to improper tongue weight. Almost all factory work trucks especially ford come with inferior draw bars and hitches. I have meet several people that have beat the hitch straight off the frame on long distance hauls pulling campers. Staying under a class 5 truck for hauling the f550 is king of the road. Good gearing , braking and strong frame it has. I have pulled 20,000lbs + with an f250 sw it will Do it. I only do it in emergency breaks downs or such. The manufacture ratings are a scam and a bunch of lyes, They are for marketing and general guides. Some times they are way too much to be safe. The only effective and safe way to move weight is with a tow vehicle that has more weight than the load and/or the load is putting weight on the tow vehicle by tongue weight or it is balanced over several axle points. The heaver the truck the safer it is. The more weight you can put on the rear axles the safer you are. Of course. Your tow rig and setup is only truly tested in failures. Lossing tires, axles, and trailer brakes have happened to me. Wet roads hard stopping and too much speed will wreck you. It is very easy to get used to pulling to much then failure occurs. If it happens to you at the wrong time you will die. Single rear wheel trucks losing a tire pulling a load at speed will kill you. 14k trailer have axles that sit above the ubolts. Over load the axles and the bolts break and the axle will come loose Emergency procedures will kill you in an overloaded rig. Do not play. If you can cruise along at slow speeds you are fine. 40 mph or more and the risk goes up quick. If you want to see how tuff your truck is try driving it with out the trailer brakes, see how well it does not stop. Then think of what will happen under hard braking and they go out. My f250 got 13k on the last set of brakes front and rear. I have moved into tandem axle haulers and bigger trucks but it seems the bigger the truck the more you put on it and big is never big enough. My tandem dump Has scaled at out 86k, way over weight and it will break something. To me an f550 pulling ten tons is good. i would go more if it was a short slow trip. It feels safe and seems to handle failures ok. Having the proper weight on the rear axle is important. The older f550 to me are better than the new. Also Ford ran a lot of scams with their f450s recently putting on smaller wheels and taking away the beef. Then the next year putting back on better parts due to customer concerns. They have also done that with the f550s here and there to. The trucks with the dana 135 rears running 4.88s are brutes. The auto trans are all crap and the 110 rear axles are not as good as the 135s. The new weight ratings are beyond me. It seems that in the old days they were more worried about keeping the number under the cdl regs even tho the trucks will do more. You can put 10 k on the bed of a f550. Personally i think f550s should have air brakes standard and front and rear locking diffs, heavy push bumpers, manuel zf-7 trans and 7.3 motors beefed with more bigger forged parts with 100 extra ponies. Zf 7 is my new trans patent basically a zf 6 with another higher gear for highway speeds. Problem is the average guy is not ready for that kind of hauler. And ford does not want a work truck that will last more than 200k. They need repeat business. Thats why the zf-6 is being phased out. It is heavy duty and almost impossible to break.
As to the excavator my f550 pulls a tb145 (11,000 lbs plus trailer weight) great and it is safe. My 250 does it also but you can tell it is over loaded with a bumper pull. F250 feels good to about 9k plus trailer. F350 is about the same maybe 1500 lbs more. The trucks are sensitive to where the load sits on the trailer. Goose necks feel safer But i prefer bumper pulls.
Nice write-up Georgia Iron... My Dodge 2500 v-10 is rated to tow 13.6k pds., but I wouldn't do it for any long trips. Mostly, I do short hilly and windy trips (West Coast Mountain country). My 14k trailer with an 8k excavator was my limit (total weight ~12.5k). Getting tongue weight just right was always my concern. A few inches forward or aft with excavator on trailer made a big difference in towing experience...too much tongue weight and the front felt squirrely. Too little and the back end of truck was not happy. Accidentally had trailer loaded with near 6tons of fill, and truck had issues with pulling it up a steep hill...in 4L, it didn't feel like I had a load. No idea why it took me a while to figure out that one...thereafter, 2H for flat and straight, 4H and 2nd gear for downhills, and 4L for steep uphills. A wee bit off topic - loading and unloading was my pucker moments. Finding a flat and hard surface to unload was primary...wheels chocked and jacks on end of trailer (welded some on) made it tolerable. All the stories I've heard in my hood regarding excavator/skidsteer disasters were during the loading or unloading process. Since there is few flat areas around here, folks would load/unload excavators on slopes. What would happen is while the excavator is perched on end of trailer, the tongue would lift rear truck tires off ground, thereby losing truck brakes, and the whole kit would go for a ride down a hill. Some ended badly, especially if hill was a long one. Slow and steady wins the race. Also helps to have a little weight in truck box...
I had a similar experience once too melli. Unloading an 853 Bobcat off a bumper pull trailer attached to a flatbed dump F350. I was late teens at the time and still green as hell. The truck was parked headed downhill in a subdivision, I didn't chock the wheels. As I crested the rear end of the trailer, the trailer had a small section of beaver tail and then ramps, the rear of the 350 came off the ground and away the whole kit and caboodle started heading down the hill. All I could do was get the skid off the trailer as fast as possible and catch the ramps with the bucket teeth, luckily when I got the machine off the rear end of the truck came back in contact with pavement and stopped. It was quite a butt puckering experience.
Doh! Good save. My local trucking guy ended up in the hospital over a similar incident...says it was so quick he didn't have time to react (Has a nice head gash scar to remember it by). A neighbor got a skid rental, and in a rush to load before closing time, had everything pointed downhill at rental shop. The whole kit made it onto the highway (right angle approach)...luckily, up here, it is a quiet hwy. Still can't get that youtube vid of a guy down south who launched his truck and trailer in the green space between a divided hwy out of my head...it was hilarious looking...can't stop giggling. Apparently, the guy ended up ok. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zX6iXVKs4XM
F250 TB145 10Ton I want the op to post up pics pulling the Tb-175. I want to see how it loads up. My 6.0 does not like pulling this trailer empty much less with a load. I had to use this trailer in a pinch to get my machine. I blew a tire and lost a U-bolt on my 14k bumper pull so I had to use this beast of a trailer. It is SO heavy. Rear springs are toast in my truck. My 6.0 hates this trailer and load. LOOK AT THE MILEAGE. Can you say SUCK. 3 full seconds to the floor just to get it to start moving. My F-550 pulls the above night and day different. It is like comparing a loaded down truck to one without a load. I have a tractor that weights 14k, and I might have pulled it down the highway with the 250. It was not fun and I would not recommend it. The F-550 however does it much better. From stopping to being geared right. Both my F550s are down at the moment. SO I had to use the 250. I can not keep up with equipment repairs. These machines are so heavy on the trailer. It is hard to put it into words.
Not really, that's too much weight behind a 3/4 ton pickup.
Looking at my above post i am referencing the tandem gooseneck trailer. The 10k trailer and truck work very well together. A f250 pulls the 10 k trailer and load like it was made just for that. It works very well together. You will find that a 150 truck feels over loaded with a 10 k trailer. The reason the ex is not on the 10 k trailer is because it is too heavy and will cause the steel wheels to crack and leak.
Doesnt look to me like it would physically fit on there...... For all the bad i will say about a 6.0 pulling power was never one of them. I always thought it did a great job with a load.
Fortunately I've been too busy to log on here for a while. Unfortunately, I'm having some issues with people paying after the work is done. For some reason "Payment at the time of the work being satisfactorily completed" seems to be interpreted as 'Net 150 days'. :Banghead I've never had to get courts involved, but short of physically threatening people (which my attorney has very strongly advised against), I don't know what else to do. Anyway, I only have a picture of coming home one day pulling the TB-175 behind my F350 (which has been gone for a while now) and none behind my 4X4 F550 with the 7.3 PowerStroke (feels much weaker than 6.0 IMHO) and Dana 135S with 4:88's and locker with a 14' utility flatbed. Anyway, here is the 175 behind the F350 which pulled it fine but admittedly felt a bit more, um, squirmy than behind the F550.
That's one heck of a load.....those TB175 are no light weight peice of machinery. Personally I wouldn't haul it with that truck but each to his own.
LOL, I got burned so badly for trusting GM and owning their stock for decades that hell would have to freeze over completely AND Government Motors would have to drop off a fully loaded 3500 4X4 crew-cab diesel that would have to sticker for over $65,000 to make up some of what they took from me (with a 10 year bumper to bumper warranty...not that it would be worth anything being GM can file bankruptcy again in 3 more years) before I'd even remotely consider driving ANYTHING from Government Motors. If I sound bitter, that's an extreme underestimation of how I feel about GM and the millions of families they financially wrecked while they pocketed tens of BILLIONS of tax dollars that will NEVER be repaid. I ran a 6.0 PSD Ford for 7 years towing what everyone seems to agree is heavy loads, without having a single problem, and sold the truck for $1000 more than I paid for it when I bought it 1 year old. What was that you said again? I'm glaring at the letters GM so badly I couldn't make out anything else you said... (also, please note, I'm severely ranting at the company - I'm not getting into any brand comparison; only extremely angry with a company that literally stole tens of thousands of dollars from me and millions of others)
You are the one and only person ever to sing the praises of the infamous FORD 6.0.......there are millions of Interweb posting documenting the woeful failure of the 6.0.... But yours was fantastic ! I'll take your word on it...you should head to Vegas because your the luckiest man in the nation.....Well done on hauling the 175, I didn't mean I would not haul it with a FORD, I meant I would never haul it with a pickup of any flavor.....minimum safely in my mind would be my tandem, which by the way is a FORD 9000, with a fantastic CAT 3206 motor......great truck !
Well, all I can say is that you can see the pic. I'd have no reason to speak highly of something I wasn't happy with. As you noticed, I'm not shy about speaking my mind if some company/vehicle/etc. burned me. I had a motorcoach with a Cat C7 in it. It was a torque monster and a great engine. From a history of working in a heavy equipment industry (my stuff is just little toys), I can't say that I'm familiar with a Cat 3206 at all. I'm reasonably certain we had a water truck with a 3208 (eight) in it, and it was a gutless piece of excrement. There again, there may be zero similarities between the two engines. I did test drive a motorcoach with a C15 in it and it was like a freaking race car that was 45' long! No doubt Cat has some very fine engines and pieces of equipment out there.
Pulling a load is the easy part, stopping it when you have to is another story.. I have had a few stupid moments in my life where I pulled way to heavy of a load behind a truck. Two come to mind - a Bobcat 863 and BC 334 excavator on a pintle hitch trailer behind a 1994 F450 flatbed dump. The other was putting a 321CLCR on a tandem tag behind a tandem dump. Been there, done that and by the grace of God nothing happened. Old enough to quit pushing my luck.:cool2
Good show. That load is up there with the heaviest i have seen. Three other pulls come to my mind. I have pulled a 14,500 farm tractor on my f250 srw. I think my trailer weights 5 or 6 k. Mine appears a little shorter than yours. You still have me beat weight wise. Once, while in downtown atlanta some guys pulled beside me with a 10 ton trailer and a small 20 k size bulldozer on it. To this day i still cant believe they were rolling with that load and an old beater ford 350. Then once while traveling i20 in alabama a srw dodge passed me pulling a full sized 4x4 back hoe on a gooseneck. I kid you not he was running 80 mph with the load. I backed off and let him go. His truck was screaming. I did not have time to get a pic of either but both of those guys i remember. Cm. i am curious as to the tag / dump story with the 321. According to my spec sheet that machine weights about 53k. What was that like pulling. I might have moved a 953 on a tag with a full load of gravel at some point in my life. I believe i was pushing 110 k. My 400 horse old mechanical cummings was sreaming at me but it did it. The stopping seemed fine but i did not have any hard stops.
That 321C had a progressive link hyd. thumb, QC and 2 buckets on the trailer. The tag trailer was rated at 54K. It was way too much weight on the trailer, I though she was going to twist in two making turns. Only did that trek for about 2 miles. If the tag had a 3rd 20K lb axle I would haul the 321D we have now on it. No QC or hyd. thumb on this one.
We had a customer who demo'd a new E80 excavator a couple of months back. He loaded it onto a three axle gooseneck pulled by a 3/4 ton Dodge. He seemed confident, but it made me cringe a bit.
I would pull a 8 ton on a gooseneck behind my F250 on a tandem dual gooseneck. Single wheel axles aren't to my liking.
I looked.at his load pic again and still can't believe that it is a bumper/hitch pull load. He has the record. I was almost wrecked again by my 10 k trailer and f250 hauling a 7300 lbs machine a few weeks ago. I was rolling about at about 78 mph s On the interstate HWY when I felt a vibration I knew one of my.tires on my trailer was starting to separate. I have new 10 ply tires rated at 2700 lbs each. Load Range d 15" wheels. I backed off the speed and soon after it blew. It went in to pieces and looked like a grenade went off in it. The trailer swung left then right and really tried to toss the machine off with the whip effect. If you don't believe in chains I guarantee it would have tossed the machine right off the trailer. I was able to safely stop and change out the tire. That is the second time the trailer and tire combo tired to kill me. Anyway i went back to the shop took out my plasma torch cut the fenders off the trailer. I went to the tire shop and bought 16" wheels and the strongest trailer tires they carried. My 10 k trailer now runs 14 ply tires rated at 3750 lbs each. I mounted the new wheels and tires and adjusted my fenders about 4" up. now my trailers all use the big tires that the 14k trailers run. I had the wheels and tires balanced $1200.00 later. I rolled to S.C. pulling the machine, standard bucket and a grapple bucket. I came back loaded at max with my f550. I had to put one of.the buckets on the back of.the truck to take weight off the trailer. I had a 5000 lb building under the machine. The tires did great and helped me get through a very heavy pull for about 180 miles.
I pull a Bobcat 335 on 13k rated trailer behind '08 F350 DRW flatbed. With thumb, angle blade, and cab, it is close to 10k lbs. It pulls very good on the 18' bumper pull. I get everything weighed and try and stay under the recommendations. My truck is heavy, though, with the flatbed at just over 10,500 lbs with tools. I do okay on tires but not great. I'm running Toyo AT and got 6 plus free rotations for about $1300. Keeping the trailers in good shape is important. I go through tires because many trailer tires are crap. I just found some that I like, though. I think they are made by Hankook and so far they wear well. Steel belted instead of bias.
That's a great price on tires, are they 17's. I bought 4 18" BFG's for my SRW F350 last year and it was just shy of $1K. I also started buying better quality tires for my little tag-alongs, it's worth the extra money not having to change a tire on the side of a busy interstate.
I always have to unload to change a tire. i have a compressor which helps but I'm always weary of jacking my trailer with a load on it. Makes for a miserable morning or ride home. What brand tires do you (or anyone else) recommend for trailers? I try and go one load range above the rating if possible but have still have plenty fail. I had an "upgrade" from my trailer dealer and 3 out of 4 tires separated and they were one load range higher than I needed. I will get the the name of them. I have had 7 out of 8 "maxxis" tires separate, too.
I have had very good luck with Power King trailer tires
My trailer tires are not balanced. There again, I doubt I ever haul a heavy load more than maybe 50-60mph even on an Interstate; and I am rarely on any Interstate. I'm almost exclusively local in my hauling. I did put new tires on early this year because the date code on my trailer tires were, um, a bit dated and I didn't want to have an issue even though there was still plenty of tread. I trade off doing snow removal in the winter with a local tire dealer and he hooked me up with a set of "Loadstar" (a cheap Chinese brand I'd bet) ST235/85R-16" load range F tires mounted for about $140 per tire. They are rated at 3960 lbs per tire at 110 psi. That gives me over 31k worth of tire load hauling on the trailer, and I know I'm putting a few thousand pounds of tongue weight on the truck. I've had no issues. Lately, I've been just crawling my TB145 onto the flatbed of my 550 and not using a trailer. I am thinking I've already posted this picture. Anyway, I got rid of the little toolbox on the flatbed (since I have boxes under the bed) and, with the stick towards the front, I don't have anything hanging over the end of the bed.
Yeah, I've never really heard of balancing trailer tires; I guess if they were real pieces of crap, it might make them wear more evenly?
balancing trailer tires. The trailer shop did not balance the tires and wheels that i bought. The trailer i changed the wheels and tires on has always pulled straight and rode smooth with the old 80 psi tires. The new wheels are heavier and taller with the bigger tires. As soon as I took it for a test drive I knew I had to have it done. One wheel tire combo was 8 ounces out. One was 1 Oz out and 2 were 3 ounces out. The 5200 lbs axles have slightly smaller bearings and races as compared to a 7k axle. With long pulls the vibrations can cause excessive wear. I took them to a tire shop they looked at me with cross eyes and was like we do not normally balance trailer tires. I pushed the issue and it rides smooth other than bounce when empty due to the high psi tires. Those dam load star tires.and the eurkrete tires pis me off. I bet I have lost 12 of those. Never again will.i buy those brands. Of coarse it might be or probably is my fault. I am always near or over.max load.
I usually haul my equipment ( 12000-18000lb loads) with my Tandem dump truck. However on occasion I have hauled it with reservation behind my GMC 2500 long box crew cab that has a 4.10 rear dif and 6 speed tranny. When I registered the vehicle, I spoke with the Alberta Commercial vehicle office. I asked about hauling limitations and got different answers depending on the office I spoke to. I ended up calling a main office to get clarification since I couldn't find a clear answer in the 4 different publications that cover commercial vehicles. They said that they can and will check for the lowest limitations. Regarding trailers, if you are not exceeding the hitch capacity, tire capacity, tongue weight or the weight on rear axle, they don't care what the recommended weight by the manufacture is. I checked my hitch which was supposed to be good for 12500lbs, but only with sway bars and switched it out for a 18500lb hitch that allows for 2500lb tongue weight. My trailer holds 22500lbs, so I could over load the hitch and still be under on the trailer. As many have mentioned already it is the stopping that is really the issue. I have had one situation where a guy passed me while going down a steep hill and then proceeded to slam on his brakes and turn off the road. That is when I found out that GMC's integrated brake controller is connected to the ABS system. When my tires started to skid, it turned off the trailer brakes as well. Boy was that exciting. I quickly grabbed for the brake controller and manually added full trailer brakes. It was way too close. Dump truck is the way to go for me.
Equip Junkie….I have gone through problems on both of my factory equipped brake controllers on both of my fords, (06' f250 and 12' f350), the lights and signals would work but no power would run through the brakes… the dealers kept telling me it was my trailer and I needed a new one or the grounds were bad etc… I've had my trailer overhauled electrically twice in 5 years to check for these issues but still would get loss of brakes going down the road at 20 mph on smooth ground. I bought a mid grade aftermarket trailer brake controller and installed it in both trucks and never had a problem since. the factory installed brake controllers are to finicky and complicated and apparently have a dislike to my ugly old trailer.
murphy777 and running down the road hauling anything without brakes is no fun. I have a high end brake controller in my tandem and it works awesome.
You can have a straight truck at 26K to a trailer at 10K without a CDL Source: http://www.dol.wa.gov/driverslicense/cdlrequired.html
Hey Congrats Brother. Nice Rig.
Thanks. The truck has a smaller CAT engine in it, but it does exactly what I wanted it too. It gets me those extra jobs where a customer needs both. Been a great combination. Saving up for a mini excavator now.
Yeah no brakes reminds me of crazy college days! I will say that the engine/gearing control in my 2012 f350 when I have it tow/haul is nice, it uses the low gear and helps keep your speed in check when coming down long hills, it is still not a jake brake but it definitely saves me from jamming the brakes as often. I am trying to stay away from getting any bigger trucks, because of weight issues, and as a landscape stone mason, luckily I am not hauling huge amounts of material so my need for a tandem or larger single axel is very low. I see a lot of "gypsy" firewood haulers in my area with pickups and a huge pile of firewood on the back and I swear that the front tires on these trucks are not even touching the ground…..scary.
If you read the full regulation carefully, you will see that third block is a little misleading. It is referring to the combined gross vehicle weight of the vehicles, so the largest truck you can pull a 10k trailer with is 16k, not 26k.
This is correct, we have been nicked by WSP for towing our 14k tilt or 14k dump trailers behind our F450's with a 15k GVWR. The total combined GVWR cannot exceed 26,000. We have a 26k service truck and can't even tow an air compressor unless the driver has a class A.
You can tow a trailer under 10k with a 26k truck with a class B, can't you?
Yes.
Nope. It's referring to the GVW of the traction unit only That's because the trailer is 14K. Stay below 10,001 and the weight of the trailer becomes a non factor
No special license is needed anywhere in the USA
I had another close call today, while towing about 11k lbs. I had to slam on the brakes to avoid an idiot making a last second left turn. The machine was pushing the 550 and the tires were locking up. I managed to stop it , I was only going about 25 mph. After working through a red light and getting up to speed, 50 mph. I noticed sparks coming from under the trailer. I thought man, I must have thrown a chain. Reckly, I had a Jerk and a pop and had to immediately pull over. I blocked the lane and noticed an entire wheel was missing and my u bolts were dragging. I got off the road and a nice guy pulled in behind me and said he saw the wheel rolling down the road for about a 1\4 mile and knew where it went. He took me to get it and dropped me back off at the truck. I was thinking were I could get some lug nuts. I looked at the hub and every stud had snapped clean off. I had to unload the machine and go get another trailer. I have never seen this happen before.
WOW ! That's a little scary. I have never seen anything lime that in all my years....what do you think could have caused all of those studs to shear off .....Wild....Glad your OK and got your tire back too....
The way I understand it is, the wheel studs are not supposed to have the weight on them. If the lugs loosen and the rim separates from the hub, the wheel studs will snap off if the lugs get weight on them. That is the only thing I can think of. A worn rim can also cause it to not lock to the hub correctly.
Interesting...again I'm glad your OK, that could have very easily gone all wrong..I'm heading out right now to check torque on all my equipment trailers lug nuts...
The rim would have had to be loose in order for them all to get sheared like that. On the bright side, at least you know that your brakes are working well.
Broken hitch. It has been a while since this thread has been posted in. I thought I would post a pic of my drawbar/bumper pull hitch on my F550. I have been working the truck pretty hard, with heavy loads and 300 mile trips. The hitch tubing spilt in half and the lower front and rear welds broke out of the tube. Due to constant breakage and blow outs, I check my rigs closely and often, if I am on bumpy or rough roads I stop around 3 times to check straps and chains. Lucky I caught this before I lost the receiver. The factory made units use fairly thin tubing, they can get a lot of flex in them over time especially if you hit longer highway trips and have heavy tongue weight. I have also seen two different ford's that had bolt on hitches, the trailers beat the bolts off and through the lower part of the frame and the whole unit pulled loose from the truck frame. On the F550 cab and chassis, the flat bed is made different, it sits on top and is welded in on the sides. So it can't pull through the lower frame lip. We also have the hitch pin holes egg shape and ruin over time with use. They are 1/4" wall tubing with a 2" 1/16 opening for the 2" receiver to slide into. I would use 1/2" thick receiver tube if I could find it but no one seems to have a square tube that thick in a 1/16th over. I now use a welded in solid 2" 20k steel square bar with a flange face that a 20k bolt on 2 5/16 ball assemby can bolt to with 4 1/2" bolts. I have snapped a 14k sold steel hitch in half pulling a skid steer. So I moved away from that to all 20k parts. I hand built a cool home made unit that is 3 times as strong as factory, pics to come. If you run heavy, it will break. I guarantee it. Check your rigs often.
Since this post. I got my plasma cutter back out, cut out the 10k trailer axles and mounting hardware and upgraded the axles to 14k and welded in 14k mounts. The 10k mounts were 50% worn through. I did this to get an 8 lug setup up on a down graded 14k trailer I had that was rated at 10k. I then tracked down 14 ply tires that are rated at 4080 lbs each. So far my blow outs have stopped. Trailer rides way worse but no blow outs yet. Wish I had started out with a 14k and 16" rims. Live and learn.
Here are some pics of my broken factory hitch and my new homemade hitch. I was going to try and save the 2" receiver tube. I decided against it.
Tube hitch. Solid 2" draw bar welded in. Yes my F-550 hitch is tuffer, than yours! Ford take notes... 30k stated payloads, better to use thicker tubing, like 1/2". Lets start building stronger hitches. Make them hold 40k if the truck is rated for 30k. *Note this broken hitch is not factory ford. It was a factory made unit that came on the flat bed. Ford uses 3/16" metal in some we have. All the pin holes, key hole and ruin over time. Like this.
I'd rather see a 4:1 factor built onto hitches. I wonder where the failure started on yours, any guesses? which broken weld was the most rusty? I have a 550 with a knapheide body where the icc bar is built into the flatbed dump, do not think its a great idea to tow that way so cutting the icc bar off and making a drop extension for the frame. Its not a big drop but want to make it strong and cross braced so it'll handle side loads happily. On your hitch where you're really running the balls off of it, any way to tighten it up so there isn't so much slop? My thought was you have a solid tube in the back so maybe a 1" nut welded on the end of the hitch with a 1" bolt to pre-tighten against the pin when its installed?
That's what I was thinking, like a heavy duty pintle on dump trucks. The failure looks like it was from surging of the trailer, pushed the receiver tube and broke the weld. Forgo the receiver tube and install a true pintle like this one -