I have a customer who has a pond about a 1/2 acres in size on the side of a mountain. the previous home owner let trees grow on the back side of the dam. Most of the trees are poplars atleast 2 feet in diameter a couple of them are 3 feet in diameter. the back side of the dam is concave and very steep I think the pond must have run over the dam at some point. my question is should I grub the stumps or just cut the trees low and then add more fill. I don't know which poison to choose. thanks in advance for your help
Well pics are worth thousands of words in this case... But here are my thoughts, roots seek water and its would be hard to tell exactly how big the root ball would be. If there is water in the pond, grubbing is a dangerous proposition. What is downstream of the dam? Awhile ago, an operator hit an 8" 160 psi water main, and it flooded out two houses and wiped out a swimming pool... you have much more stored energy than that. In this case I think, cut low and fill is mediocre. De-water, grub, and rework the affected section is best, keewaying the fill as you go.
Just wondering, if the dam is been overflowed, how full is the basin with sediment? I'm thinking it long overdue for a complete rework. Expensive proposition for sure but may be best solution in the long run.
Grubbing the stumps may lose the intergrity of the dam. Stump grinder would take the stump below grade and integrity of dam would not be compromised.
couldn't it be said that the roots left to rot in the dam would affect the integrity of the dam as well? Seems I had heard somewhere that foreign matter other than the base dirt that the dam is made out if left to rot may cause seepage.
grub them, poplars don't have that big of a root system. and the back side of the dam dosen't really do that much but hold up the core of the dam.
2-3 foot in diameter trees will at least have a 6' root ball... you can grub them if you want... just video tape it for me so I can put it on you tube when your done.
if the dam is only 6-10 feet thick then i wouldn't call it a damn but a berm
Import some beaver's.... they make quick use of those type of trees.....lol
Grampa I'm laughing
What is the composition of the material in the dam? Is it a berm or spillway?
Thank you all for the responses. I will try to take some pictures. What stumpjumper said made me think. thank you stumpjumper. If the owner does not want to drain and then deal with the trees then I will structure the contract that the owner bears all responsibility, liability, etc for any problems. The top of the dam is about 15' wide. the riser pipe is also leaking so it should not be hard for a reasonbile person to understand that draining will make fixing the riser possible, allow for clean up sediment buildup and remove the trees and their stumps without the risk of a blowout.
I know it seems like the more expensive route now but what you said about other potential problems really makes me think and wonder what else? what you said about protecting yourself is a good start. At the risk of sounding like "while we're here" ............... you probably should see if the landowner will agree to the necessary fixes in order to keep your work from potentially failing. A person can have all the things in the world written up in a contract and all liability assumed by owner and etc. but that don't free you from challenges on that issue.
Not sure how big of a pond this is but I'd opt to cut them off at ground level and treat the stumps and then dig out the pond and use that fill to add dirt over the top of the stumps, without oxygen and being covered it'll take decades to rot down the stumps and roots, if you don't cover them with dirt they'll rot in a few years, any structural damage done by the trees has already been done by the growing trees in the first place, if its held this long, cover them up and pack it down and forget about them, as for settling, freezing and thawing will allow it to settle anyhow over time to take up any decomposition of stumps, but this all depends on how many there are and how big they all are and how thick they are, again a picture is worth a thousand words
No matter how long it takes the stumps and roots to rot they will eventually leaving potential leakage channels that could cause the dam to fail. I think if the failure of this dam could cause any potential damage downstream, the pond should be drained and the dam rebuilt and maintained so this situation will not repeat itself.
well said sir! I've never had a customer mad at me for fixing it right. Mostly they are disgusted with the fact that they ended up with a bum rap to begin with, and when all is said and done they know full well that it was the right thing to do.
Those roots run a lot further than most would think. I'm cleaning out a tank right now and finding roots in the silt at least 60' from the closest tree.