We have 250 acres in middle TN, I was looking to buy an M5-111 to pull a 15 foot bat wing for mowing and buy a dump cart for pull river rock from the hollar up to use on the roads or pads. I was looking at trailers like this European style. Looking at Kubota's owners manual it looks like the tractor is only rated to pull 13,200 lbs. So if these trailers are 8000-9000lb empty it would be a complete waste. The M6-111 is only rated for 17,600. What is your guys thoughts? I need to come up one hill and then its flat ground for moving the rock around. m5-111 67,600 m6-111 89,750 US dollars +loaders but want cost comparison out there. Thanks for the advice .
Those look like really pricey trailers. How much hitch weight on the trailers and what can the tractor carry weight wise on the drawbar? Hard flat ground on your own property you could probably exceed the rated pulling capacity a little bit. I've seen farmers convert a dump truck pup trailer to pull behind a tractor. Other options are a standard dump trailer pulled by a pick up or 1 ton, etc. or finding an older dump truck. That's what I did, found an older plow truck with a dump box in decent shape for $8K.
posted the ratings for both tractors below, not a huge difference but is it worth another 22k to the price? I was really hoping to be able to put 20-30,000 lbs of rock in the trailer and pull it with the tractor for build our roads, I did a gmc 6500 dump truck and its way too small for what we are trying to do. Was hoping I could do this and not have another machine to worry about maintaining etc.
https://www.craigmylefarmeq.com/product/2022-new-herbst-14-ton-hi-side-stock-5979/ these are all around the 25-30k price range.
Even the M6 tractor weighs only 9600#. That means you should think of loaded trailer weights of 9600# maximum, even less up hill on rock roads. If you were disappointed in the performance of a GMC 6500, you will be very disappointed in the performance of the tractor with a trailer. If you kill the tractor trying to pull to heavy of trailer up the hill, or just lose traction and spin out, you will be going back downhill rapidly. It will not end well.
I just saw first video with a tractor pulling the trailer this one appears to be a 6135 John Deere. Im torn between buying a freight liner/peterbilt class 8 dump truck or a trailer like these. We need a tractor for mowing and was hoping it would do both well.
If it had a manually applied brake it would be a different story. I second Terex herder's sentiments. There is nothing worse than getting manhandled by a trailer like that. At least with a pull can you can drop the can and give it another try. Better to have too much tractor, by far.
The loaded trailer is going to be around 20 tons so think you'd want more than a 5 ton tractor to pull it. What are you loading the rock with?
Brakes on the trailer make a huge difference. I have a John Deere. Most of their ratings in the U.S. are based on the assumption that the trailer does not have brakes. Mine being imported from Europe has the trailer towing option which gives you an auxiliary 5 gallon oil tank for the trans so you don't run your tractor dry with the cylinder and dual glad hands for air trailer brakes and a flat face coupler for hydraulic brakes. My tractor weighs approx. 15,000# with 134 hp rating. The tag on the tractor states "permissible towable mass with assisted braking 34000kg" which translates to almost 75,000#. Without brakes or inertia brakes they do not want you towing more than the tractor weighs. What i would understand this is legal weights in Europe for on road use comparable to what we do on trucks in the U.S. That being said you will have a hard time pulling more than 17000# with that M-111 on anything other than improved surfaces. Ask me how i know....
why not get 1 of the 2-axel pickup pull trailers, it would take a few extra trips, but you will live long enough to finish it
That 6135 has twice the driving axles of the Kubota, half again the weight and power, and a manufacturer with a much longer history of making useful tractors rather than oversized lawn mowers. The video only shows pulling the load on flat ground, no grade. And they jack the volume on obnoxious music to distract you from what is really happening. The GMC 6500 had twice the horsepower of your tractor choices. Do you think you can get more done with less power?
Bluewave, I used to use a Herbst dump trailer an older version of the yellow trailer you posted as your first post. The tractor pulling it was 200hp, 4wd, weighed around 20,500 pounds. It pulled it ok up gravel slopes, it had very good brakes so went downhill safely as well. I didn't overload it, I think if you loaded it until it spilled over then traction and power would be a problem even for 200hp. That said, the same trailer was also used on 160hp tractor with full steel weights on front, that also pulled it around ok but sensible loads of 10-12 tonnes of crushed concrete, not the full spilling over load. Here in UK there are slightly smaller dump trailers holding 10 or 12T, might suit you if you don't need a big hp tractor for anything else.
so I ended up buy the M6-111 and an L6060 at the same time, and ordered a 12ton dump trailer from BERKELMANS WELDING & MANUFACTURING INC. After talking to them and a few other people this seems like this will be a really nice option. The owner of Berkelmans say they want to see 10 horse power per ton. One thing I noticed is Kubota rates these without the trailer weight https://berkelmanswelding.on.ca/12_ton_farm_dump_trailer.html
Yes, well spotted, I was thinking that may be capacity rather than gross weights in your Kubota specs. If your slope is steep, carry some rock in your loader bucket and light loads in the trailer. In dry conditions you'll do well with more heavier loading.
Those Berkelman trailers look pretty good.
315 cat excavator or a 333g skid steer
real happy with the pricing and talking to the owner of the company, they want you to have the right trailer for the equipment. I feel like if I can keep a full front bucket for weight, and pull 1/2 full a couple trips and increase the capacity until its full or we find the limit of the traction/safety then back it down.
Exactly right. You'll feel when you get to near it's ability to drag it up a slope, tires will start to scrub about more and you'll know you put too much on
Kubota makes very good tractors and engines. They didn't become the most popular compact tractors because were an inferior product. Because of their popularity they got into bigger and bigger tractors. That they are an oversized lawn mower is an arrogant statement. John Deere was sourcing tractors from Yanmar for many years to compete with Kubota. You also pay a lot for green paint. Comparing apples to apples Kubota is as good as anything else on the market.
I agree, a 6135 small frame is 7-12 months out and 110k at the local dealer, Kubota has 1-2 M5 M6 units showing up each month, makes it more valuable to me, to be able to use it than waiting on delivery. I had big balls and was upgrading to an M7-152 until he brought me the quote of 148k plus loader, said I'll stay on the porch at this point.
It'd be great to see a picture of your tractor and trailer when they show up
ill post photos when they get delivered tomorrow and the trailer will be here right after Christmas
Not much of an update, both tractors got delivered right before the cold front hit, went from 48 to -8 in about 4 hours. Next morning neither would start due to fuel being gelled up. Had to rescue 911 and put fuel treatment in both to get them to run. Going have to weld another step or make a cable step for the 6060 I can't physically get in it right now, but the M6 is a breeze to get in and out of. (wife said stay out of her tractor anyways) L6060 and M6-111
Got a call from Berkleman's welding today, the industrial tires (back of photo) are stuck in Vancouver and he can ship my trailer with these style flotation tires instead. Im not seeing any downside to them being 18 ply and rated for 9500lb each. I was thinking the industrial tires may resist puncture by stick or rock better. Any thoughts? This is just an example photo Bill sent me, my new one should be similar to the orange one in the back. edit: I sent the photo back to Bill asking them if they thought about putting transport pins in this location so I dont have to chain or strap the bin down to unload when it shows up
I think those tires would be fine, especially if they are wider. You don't need a traction style tire on a trailer. I wouldn't be going over jagged rock or roots that had a potential to puncture a tire. If you have to pick it up just run a strap under the frame or pick from the tie down points.
Are the flotation ones wider? I have had better luck with the industrial pattern as far as punctures, the flotation type seem to have a softer belly as far as sharp things getting through. But if they're wider that might be a bonus, or if there's a long wait for the industrial ones - is there sharp stuff among the river rock you're planning on hauling?
I think the tires are similar to what you'd see on older large 2 wheel drive backhoes. If the weight rating is similar they should be similar ply's.
They are the exact same size as each other and both 18 ply, the turf tires are rated for 9800 each and the industrial style tires are 8000 each
just the occasional tree stump, he said the other tires were supposed to be in before Christmas and they have been stuck in Vancouver. I just made the chance to run the turf tires and see how it goes.
They appear to be a stronger tire.
Not trying to burst a bubble but drove Dump Trucks here, 12 ton equates to around 10.5-12 yards of stone depending on fines and water in the fines, Not gonna be much better than a overloaded tandem 12yd dump truck and harder to set spread with. Would have gone to a Class 8 truck with a 18 yd bed, a true loader tractor or excavator and dealt with tractor and mower separate, I know trying to accomplish with less machines yet this will be disappointing.
tractor is just to pull trailer I’ve got a cat 315, 710 or 333g to load the trailer. I don’t think a tandem truck would make it up the slope out of the creek. Equipment isn’t the problem I couldn’t afford a 75t rock truck or I would have had one
Trailer arrived today, haven’t played with it yet. Weighed around 7700lbs according to the scale in the excavator
It looks to me like that would haul 7-8 cubic yards. Here pitrun weighs about 2500 pounds per cy. That could be up to 20K. Plus the almost 8K in trailer weight, your just under 30K. I think that tractor is way too small. Horsepower is only part of what matters pulling a trailer like that, especially one that cant brake for itself. Weight of the tractor pulling it also matters and that Kubota is way to light to safely manage that much load. I think the tail would very quickly wag the dog with that set up. I would want a min. of 180 hp MFD tractor to pull that ( Magnum 7130 or Deere 4760) these weigh around 18K. and would be heavy enough to maintain control of the trailer. My opinion of course. The trailer does look good.
We just used the 6060 to move it to a the back empty. Gonna load it down and try the m6-111 tomorrow, I’ve only got flat moves about 300 yards for a lot of the work and then loaded up hill and empty going down
I am anxious to hear how this is going. I looked up your Kubota and it weighs just under 10K. Pulling 30K with no brakes and likely no duals on the kubota, I am curious how this would work. If you keep it slow, I think it could work, but I could see this trailer making the brakes a high wear item on a smaller tractor. However I have never pulled anything like this with a tractor so I am curious. We used to pull semi grain trailers with an 8450 dualed up and a 3788 Dualed in the back and it could be a handful if you were not careful. Not exactly the same obviously.
Surely that trailer has brakes on it? Ours sure do.
This little ramp was greasy so it needed a little shove to get going. Was better further in when had a run up.
We have been moving 10 yard loads all morning without the tailgate and it’s a perfect setup. For these flat loads I kinda wish I got the 16 ton trailer. I have a couple 1 mile trip loads to do this afternoon and will be able to give good feedback. I ordered the trailer without brakes at the advice of berklemans welding. He said if you don’t use the trailers all the time the brakes become a huge problem. For my use it’s short flat loads, then up hill out of the creek loaded and back down empty. Still going to take the creek trips in steps to figure out the comfort/safety level.
we are over 1000 yards moved since the trailer arrived, No issues at all, really kinda wishing I went bigger with the trailer but this setup seems like the perfect size combo for each other.
any regrets over the tire choices?
ended up with the r3 tractor style tires, I really like that they do not slide around on the side hills only downside is the mud clods falling off down the drive way
Have you tried it coming up the slope from the creek yet?
not yet, only made about 100 trips, 300 feet in 1 direction, I will be able to next trip home.
If you finish up with the trailer and want to sell it I'd be interested.