I know this is probably in the wrong forum, but, since it pertains particularly to dozers and the business I'm starting it here. I'm a younger fellar raised well in the country who's now in the big city working a nice management job where Powerpoints and presentation skills are a big deal. But, dang it, something's just not right. My job is good, pays me well, and I come and go as I please.....practically accountable to no one so long as nothing craters out. I'm very appreciative....grateful......living the dream....on and on. But I got an itch. I grew up around equipment.....run everything from a riding mower to a D-7 at one time or another....and have always loved the look, smell, feel, and sound of machinery. Throw in the enticing scent of diesel and fresh soil.......get out of my way. As a kid I loved nothing more than sitting and watching a old D-6B or newer D-5 (there were the primary rigs people ran here for all dozing jobs) digging a pit or tank or grubbing. To Hell with the TV or video game......nothing like watching a dozer work. Well, now I'm thinking about taking the big plunge into the dozer business. Give up the "easy" job and do what I really enjoy. Get out in the dirt, dust, grease, and mess and truly feeling fulfilled after a day on the job. My thinking? D-4C or JD 550G........1-ton/Super Duty diesel truck.....and 20' gooseneck. Equipment just small enough to avoid CDL and associated costs. Dozer big enough to edge into -6B/-5 areas yet small enough to handle "residential" and utility work. I could conceivably clean out a 1 acre stock tank and lay down a house pad with the same machine at $75/hour. Both good mesquite sprout grubbing rigs while also near-"D5" dirt moving units. The units I'm looking at are in the $25k range.......decent, 12-15 year old rigs........so I'm looking at spending around $40k in overall hardware plus insurance, etc. I figure I need, after all purchases, at the least $10,000 in free money to handle all problems and repairs for this type of operation to get going. Am I way out of my gourd? I'm sort-of part-time running a tractor mowing job at the time with an 8n and some biz coverage so I have some idea of the risks. I don't like the term "Cat Skinners" so I'm going the ask the Dozer Guys what they think. I see a market, a buyer, and a model to follow. I can potentially do any job depending upon the competition and time involved for my area. What do ya think? Am I out of my mind?
i can appreciate your feeligns towards getting out there...but this (in alot of the country at least) isnt the best time to take the plunge...also (maybe different in texas) but here that setup would get you in the CDL range easily...any trailer over 10k gross weight and any combined weight over 26000 lbs...just take a deep breath and think it over...i wont jump on your case for dreaming about it...but if you can afford to buy something smaller and some land somewhere maybe you could satisfy your craving without risking your lively hood in the process just my .02
Can you go 90 days with out getting paid? This includes fuel for your dozer and pickup. Parts if anything breaks down. Insurance, truck payment and a dozer payment. Not to mention everything you already spend money on (rent ect)
More importantly, can you do a good enough job that people would go out of their way to hire you over someone who they already dealth with?
I'd have to agree with the other 2. Maybe start a part time company and keep your full time job as your security blanket,that way you can feel around and see how your market is,rent a D3 from a cat rental store or the like and have them deliver it (avoid you buying a dozer and needing a float) that way if the work isn't there your out no major money. Big thing is word of mouth advertising and insurance.
First of all, I know what you mean. I am not cut out for a corporate, suit wearing, office job. I too love the smell of diesel and the like, but you will be in business and someone has to run that business. Of course a small operation wouldn't require a whole lot of paper pushing but it does require some. Taxes, insurance, corp tax, etc etc. I have a small site development and building company with 8 employees and a handfull of yellow iron and trucks. If I am lucky, I get to run some iron a few days out of the week. Of course you will be a one man operation in the beginning but the urge to grow your company comes with the urge to "break out" on your own and buy a dozer. Just keep that in the back of your mind. As far as the under CDL for a one-ton and D4 size dozer, just don't get caught by the DOT. More important than worrying about the DOT, it's just not safe to pull 18K LBS behind a 1-ton on a regular basis. You will need a bigger truck and a trailer capable of hauling your dozer. A class A CDL is not hard to get, so if you are going to be in business - then be in business and get what you need to do your job. Most importantly, as HeyUvaVT said, now is not the best time nationally to get into the grading business. Now I do not know your business plan or local customer base so take that as a generalization. My suggestion would be to stick it out at the current job and put away as much spare cash as possible for the future foray into the grading business. $10K in reserves is not enough for me to be comfortable in what you describe. One hydraulic motor or final drive for a D4 size dozer could be more than that to repair, not to mention waiting on getting paid, paying yourself, truck repairs, insurance, etc. I wish you luck in your endevor but you are the one that will need to make the decision.:usa
CM1995 I agree!!! JoeinTX If it were me taking the dive I would put my money in a large size track skid steer/new or like new. Alot more market than just a small dozer, moved easily, and as new machine you will get more return for your money! Just my 2 cents
JoeinTX, look in the General Industry Questions topic...there are quite a few threads asking similar questions in there.
I kind of did something similar. I had an easy job that paid well and didn't require allot of effort or thought. After awhile, I just got bored of it and realized that I wasn't living the life that I wanted. I didn't look forward to getting up or my entire work week. I just did it and waited for vacation or a weekend getaway. I've been in residential home repair/remodeling all my life, but always did it on weekends or evenings. Never made enough to consider it a living, I just put it away for my vacations. I decided to move to Texas and see if I could make a living at it. I was also tired of California, so just moving to a new place was excitement enough for me. I took out an ad in the American Classifieds free paper and waited for the phone to ring. It did, but it wasn't very often. I underbid my jobs, lost money and never heard from those people again. I tried printed out some cheap business cards and handed them out without any call backs. It was getting to the point that I was considering applying for a job at Lowes or Home Depot. After about three years of struggling, the market took a turn and home sales slowed down. I wrote a better ad that included that I'm licensed, my years of experience and I created a free webblog on google with pics of some of my work. I also ordered nice business cards from Office Depot and had some lawn signs printed up. The signs have really worked great, but when people get my business card, they go to my website and see my pictures, which they like, and I get call backs. I'm getting more calls for jobs then I can handle and my waiting time is over two months. I stoped advertising last year and I have bids out on half a dozen jobs right now. I think I'll get four of them due to the calls I'm getting and the plans we're woking out. Of course, this has nothing to do with starting out in the dozer business. I just tell you my story because of the similarities of starting out on a new carreer. I don't owe anybody anything, not even a truck payment. Having debt would have guranteed failure on my part. It was just too dificult getting established at first. Now it's all word of mouth and I'm feeling fairly secure. Before financing any equipment, I would seriously consider advertising for work first and then renting the equipment. Make less proffit off of the job to get the work and put in extra effort to get your name out. Plan on struggling for a few years and focus on becoming the guy people call when they need you. Once that happens, it's just a matter of keeping your clients happy. More jobs will pop up and you'll find that you might want a completely different dozer or tractor then you think you want right now. No matter what you think you want or know now, it will change once you start doing it for a living. Another big consideration to owning equipment in who will repair it? If you can't do it yourself, you will spend a fortune for others to do it, if and when they get around to it. As a small operator, you are at the bottom of everyones list. If you break down out on a job in the middle of nowhere, then you might be there for months if you can't fix it yourself. I know of a small operator who's so far overextended his credit that he has a dozer, two backhoes and a grader all broke down at different locations. They have been sitting for months to over a year. Another guy that I know of has a Cat D4C that he tows around behind a one ton duelly. He keeps busy doing farm work for people he knows, but decided to buy a Cat 312 excavator. He ran it for about a year, then Cat came a took it back from him. He said Cat offered him more money for it back then he paid for it, but he couldn't move it to other jobs and it just sat at one place for months at a time. I don't think Cat bought it back, but that he let them repo it. Another guy with a D5C had the transmission go out on him just a few months after he bought it. It had low hours on it, so this was a suprise. I think he said it cost him $30,000 to get it fixed. I have a backhoe, dozer, compact tractor and a dump truck. There is no way that I'd try to make a living with my equpement. In fact, if I need a backho on a job, I rent it and have them deliver a new one to me. That way, I know it will work and if something happens to it, they come out and repair or replace it. Getting the job done is what's important once it gets started. How you do it does not concern the client, but if you have a problem and can't finish the job, your reputation is shot. Good luck, I'd rather fail at something then to always wonder if I could have done it or not. Eddie
Maybe start a part time company and keep your full time job as your security blanket,that way you can feel around and see how your market is Exactly. I'm not looking to give my two-weeks notice on Monday, go out and buy a bunch of hardware on a whim, and be in the dozer business. Too much stuff involved. I guess using the term "take the plunge" wasn't exactly accurate. Can you go 90 days with out getting paid? Not at all. But, it kind of feeds into the above. I could probably go half that time right now but I'm not in the mood for it for obvious reasons. More importantly, can you do a good enough job that people would go out of their way to hire you over someone who they already dealth with? I'm no master, but, I've done a fair amount of dirt work over the years with tractor and dozer. I understand grades and water diversion and leaving a place looking very neat when done. I've built and maintained a lot of ranch roads in everything from sand to rock. Cleaned out stock tanks with tractor and plow for the fun of it. Grubbed/raked mesquite for one year off/on for a neighbor rancher who couldn't do it and needed it done just for the enjoyment and seat time. Fix a broken tank dam.....work over an old dirt road....clear a pasture.....cut a fireguard.....I've done it at one time or another with one piece of machinery or another. Doze coal with a D-9? Never done it because we don't have that here. First of all, I know what you mean. I am not cut out for a corporate, suit wearing, office job. I too love the smell of diesel and the like, but you will be in business and someone has to run that business. Of course a small operation wouldn't require a whole lot of paper pushing but it does require some. Taxes, insurance, corp tax, etc etc. Here's the darndest thing. I was always brought up to aspire for college and grab the office job thing and I've been doing it. It's okay and I've done pretty well at it. BUT, it ain't always what it's cracked-up to be. You can do a day's worth of work and all but at the end of the day you look around and think "what have I accomplished here" and there isn't a damned bit of physical evidence to indicate you've done anything appreciable. Multiply that by weeks and months and years and you begin wonder what it's all for? Spend 8 hours working the ground and you can almost always see the results of your day. Spend 8 hours on the phone/computer/office/driving and at the end of the day you're wondering how you justify this to the company in order to continue doing it. Sorry, I kind of went off-topic there. More important than worrying about the DOT, it's just not safe to pull 18K LBS behind a 1-ton on a regular basis. You will need a bigger truck and a trailer capable of hauling your dozer. It sure is a concern. The one ton/Super Duty set-up here is one intended to induce the least cost when getting started. Not something I want to jockey around for the next 30 years. Can I get some business on a regular basis within a reasonable radius at my costs to justify going bigger without borrowing a whole lot of money? That's my concern. Now I do not know your business plan or local customer base so take that as a generalization. My suggestion would be to stick it out at the current job and put away as much spare cash as possible for the future foray into the grading business. With diesel at $5/gallon only an idiot (like me) would look at going into a business heavily reliant upon diesel. My business idea is two-fold: first, we are beginning to see urbanites moving out of the city and buying smaller parcels that they want to imrpove. New roads......clear my patch......need a bigger tank for stocking my Bass. Second, many of the older dozer guys in my area are getting older and winding down their operation due to age. Thus my zeroing-in on the slightly smaller machine that can do small jobs with an angle blade and still handle something a little bigger that an older D-5 might do. $10K in reserves is not enough for me to be comfortable in what you describe. One hydraulic motor or final drive for a D4 size dozer could be more than that to repair, not to mention waiting on getting paid, paying yourself, truck repairs, insurance, etc. Yeah, that's a mouth full. My "$10K" number is based upon after purchasing all needed machinery and getting the word around. I'm hoping to buy reasonably reliable rigs and being able work without any major problems for 6 months to a year and build up a little in the bank. Blow a tranny in a 550G and I could look at that amount and more as I sit and make no money. Oh boy, do I know and fear that. It's a pure crap-shoot. I'm not one to make rash or unthoughtful decisions. Hell, it took me 3 years to find the "perfect" 8n and the best deal on a 5' shredder before I actually went and paid money for them all even though I'd been around them for years and new a good one from a bad one. I wanted the perfect set-up. And I've spent almost nothing on them to this day all while running the rig regularly. Who knows????
@EddieWalker I've followed your expoits on places like TBN for the last few years. You've taken a great big hunk of "the dream" and made a Hell of a thing out of it. Hats off:usa Here I sit, a mere guy who loves the sound and feel of the bulldozer, who is trying to figure out how to obtain it without incurring bankruptcy and borrowed money to do it. Buy any darned moderately priced dozer off of EBay today? Probably could but I want to hear it, smell it, feel it, check its fluids, and see where it leaks. That isn't a quick process and I may take years doing it. For me, "taking the plunge" means a half-decade or so to the chagrin of my girlfriend. Several years ago I was offered a free IH 250 trackloader.......ran when it was parked....just take it off my property as I'm getting ready to sud-divide, etc. Great! A day of looking it over........trashed UC......patches welded on the valve covers of that wonderful V-8.....olive drab paint visible under the post-coat of yellow. That "free" machine had a lot of $$$$$$$ involved for anyone wanting to make it a runner. Sheesh. Nice guy but I looked at it and never called him again. Scrap iron. There's a thread in the "Trackloader" section here about a guy in Finland who bought a D-41 from Ireland that doesn't operate well in all gears and upon insepction had a tranny case full of milky-white fluid. Clearly been submerged, misused, or poorly maintained in the past. No offense, but no chance here. I'm not that guy. It had bettery show reasonably clear fluids, reasonably clear reaction time, a good motor (with little blowby, extra exhaust and bad injectors, etc) a tranny that doesn't sound like a mess, and a day in the sun without needing serious attention for me. I've just described the perfect machine, I know, and I'm willing to wait for it......for my "plunge"
I am chasinge the same dream. Due to low interest rates and a little bit of equity me and my better half were able to re-finance and keep the same monthly payment and get enough funds to get the basics with a little reserve in case a problem arrises. I found a single axle 1984 F700 dump truck with 120,000 miles on it for $4,500. I picked up a 2005 Kaufman 10 ton trailer for $4,500 (probably could have done a little better on that deal). The JCB215E I just aquired ran me $17,900 with sales tax. I work full time at a local chemical plant. With my shift rotation I basically work 14 days and have 14 days off. This gives me plenty of time to focus on getting the buisness rolling and still beable to pay the bills. Not having a monthly payment for equipment will be a big plus. My plan is to take my time and build a reputation for myself. From past experience in the home improvement buisness most of the work I aquired came from word of mouth. I know things are going to be slow going at first especialy with today's economy. Thats why I am going to take it slow and just operate like its a side buisness. Any work I get will just be money in the bank. I guess I am kind of fortunate to beable to do it this way. Hopefully in a years time I will beable to go full time. That is the goal anyway. If things don't work out atleast I will beable to say I gave it a go and I should beable to recoup some if not all of my investment in the equipment if it holds up and I treat it good. You can bet I will. Its alot different than renting something. It tends to get your respect when your forking out the money for it. Anyway Good luck. I feel its better to give it a go than to always wonder "What If"? Just don't ruin yourself financialy in the process.
Anyway Good luck. I feel its better to give it a go than to always wonder "What If"? Just don't ruin yourself financialy in the process. Gotcha there. There isn't a soul who was just inherited a gob of cash to do with as they please on this board who then made it a profitable biz. Everyone had to start from somehwere less than desirable and figure things out. I'm not trying to be a hot-head in my posts.............farthest thing from it. But, at the same time, I'm not a newb with wild ideas and no idea of the market or equipment I'm dealing with. I am not looking to leverage job/mortgage/immediate future on them either. It's to the point that I could conceivably do this monetarily without endangering any of the above should it go good or bad. In a year or two I'll still be talking about this and talking about my buys if there are any since I'm only into paying cash or trades straight up. Once done, I go into the biz with a clear head and no lingering debt trying to make it work. The only thing I don't own is my vehicle and our house and zero credit card debt. Oh well, again I go off. I'm going to buy any and all parts of this endeavor and know what's needed (and price accordingly)..... no interest involved. You either figure things out or you don't. And there's not much anyone else can guide you over unless they've done the same thing for the same people over many years past,
Yes Joe...you are crazy . Welcome to earthmoving! In seriousness, I think you will have some more informative responses to come.
Yes Joe...you are crazy. Welcome to earthmoving! Yeah, heck, I know. There aren't many I'm aware of in the biz that aren't either broke or dead... ointhead Just my dream and a few thousand dollars to throw in a big whole shy at this point. In seriousness, I think you will have some more informative responses to come. I'm sure there will be some more who relay their very real instances to come. And I'll believe pretty much believe every word they have on the topic. I, out of good sense, won't disregard any of them. Nothing like experience and dealing with people. My only hope is to get some sort of return, with known problems along the way, while trying to spend some time doing what I really enjoy. If I can do that, I am good.
I think it would be better to work full-time for someone else in the earthmoving business first. Thats obviously not the same thing as running your own show but you would be building up experience and contacts and getting a better idea if its really what you want to do while still getting regular pay. Keeping your current job and trying to get established with part-time work is v tough. You will be v limited in the jobs you can take on and you will have zero free time. I think it would become an awful drag real quick regardless of how keen you are.
Lots of good information, look at ALL of it. You didn't mention if someone else is in your life, that will have to accept the ups and downs of life in the dirt contracting field.(rainout, breakdowns, or being left alone, while your out making lots of money, these all take big tolls on even the best of people). Be honest with who you really are, do you have good disipline to work when you might want to do something else? Can you enjoy, and do your own repairs? The failure rate is very large in the small operator category, but i have watched some of the biggest go down as well over the years. But then ask yourself, why is there so much big iron being built ? who buys it ? and where do you see yourself in the picture ? I'll give a picture of what I have seen as both contractor, and salesman. Working as a small contractor for builders, they would start small making good profits, then try to expand too quickly, get hit with a dip in the market, then can't last the duration. (be careful of how much they owe you at any given time) As a salesman I helped many people go into business with the use of rental purchase plans. (they really work well) Most small contractors work on referal basis because of their good work, and personality. What happens a lot of times, someone starts small, gets enough work that they need a second, or more machines, they hire people, then they hire a superintendent, the money starts to flow, and after a while the super is running the business and talking to the customers, the owner is enjoying the fruits of his labor, out on the lake in his fancy boat. The next thing the owner looks up and the super has started his own business because of his face time with the customers. (and the cycle repeats):beatsme The best thing about working as a single operator, is when something goes wrong, or breaks down, you know exactly where to lay the blame.:drinkup Ron
You didn't mention if someone else is in your life, that will have to accept the ups and downs of life in the dirt contracting field.(rainout, breakdowns, or being left alone, while your out making lots of money, these all take big tolls on even the best of people). Be honest with who you really are, do you have good disipline to work when you might want to do something else? Do, do..... We work similar jobs and are use to seeing each other only maybe 2-3 hours a day if that. No kids. She's all for me starting my own biz so long as I can sort-of hold up the money end. As for working instead of going to the lake or going fishing (I think this is what you meant)........operating equipment, and in particular running a dozer, is my going fishing or going to the lake. I enjoy it and just working in general very much. Can you enjoy, and do your own repairs? Ah, here's my biggest weakness. I've done a little wrenching around equipment, primarily ag tractors and implements, but not just too much on dozers. Peripheral stuff. I am in for a steep learning curve when it comes time to fix a thrown track or broken axle or whatever out in a pasture somewhere. Being honest with myself. But then ask yourself, why is there so much big iron being built ? who buys it ? and where do you see yourself in the picture ? I'll give a picture of what I have seen as both contractor, and salesman. Working as a small contractor for builders, they would start small making good profits, then try to expand too quickly, get hit with a dip in the market, then can't last the duration. (be careful of how much they owe you at any given time) I'm aiming to be a one-man show. I know what you mean and I've seen it myself. #1-I want to see the day that I have more work coming my way than I can handle. #2-I know all too well, in my current job, the pains of employing others and don't want to have to worry with that with this. Too much trouble. #3-I want to plow all (what...?) income back into my one-man show and me personally. Not buying more equipment hoping to handle extra work or employees. Times are good? Great. Wonderful. I'll look to work 12+ plus hour days getting it all in with an eye to the lean days when work isn't so forthcoming in the future. All the extra I can make will be rainy day money for the future. Most small contractors work on referal basis because of their good work, and personality. What happens a lot of times, someone starts small, gets enough work that they need a second, or more machines, they hire people, then they hire a superintendent, the money starts to flow, and after a while the super is running the business and talking to the customers, the owner is enjoying the fruits of his labor, out on the lake in his fancy boat. I simply can't imagine a scenario involving me that would wind-up remotely like that. First of all, I can only pray to have than much activity. Secondly, as I've learned through the years, the best way to lose a business is to decide you know everything about it and take time away from it. It can go squirrelly wrong on you in a heartbeat if you're not engaged with it. The best thing about working as a single operator, is when something goes wrong, or breaks down, you know exactly where to lay the blame. Yes. When you're running your own operation, there's only one person to blame or reward per the results. Work like Hell and do a fine job.....feel good about it. Do something stupid.........got no one else to blame.
Sounds like your just about ready, and I would say go for it!! Being creative, and resourceful in the field will make a big difference in your bank account. I'll give one example of what happened last year. Now days my big equipment stays parked most of the time. My wheel loader had sat so long, the right front tire had gone flat and the tire bead had broken away from the rim. I had to use a 20 ton jack to raise the axel and take pressure off the tire. Not having a big compressor the air volume was not enough to push the tire out where it would seal (I used a rope around the tire, twisted tight, and even used grease to stop up the gap) nothing seemed like it would work. It was too late to call a tire service (a cost of $150.00 or more) So I went home for the night and thought about what I could try. There was a power pole about 10' away from the loader, and it occured to me that I could try one last thing before calling the tire company. I stopped at Harbor Frieght and bought 4 of their smallest and cheapest vise grips($1.49ea), I had a section of clothes line cord (the kind of stuff you buy just because you might have a use someday) and off to the pit I went. Each wrench was clamped to the lock ring, (which was wedged inside the tire bead) at 4 equal spacings. I then strung the cord through the jaws and around the pole, put a piece of pipe through the 4 strands and started winding, this pulled the ring into position, but because the angle was not quite right, one side would still not seal. The cord was right at breaking point, so i took a chance (after letting the compressor tank fill completely) and leaned into the two lines on the side that would not seal, This was just the last bit needed and the air took over, the tire filled, and i went on about my day.:Banghead (boy I love that banghead) I do use the vise grips more than I would have thought.:drinkup These are the kind of things you do on your own, if you operate by yourself, but if you have a crew, this kind of stuff can really go wrong:ban I have been in and out sense 1972, have accumalated lots of old junk, the closest to making a real profit seemed to be when I declared retirement status, parked everything and let the weeds grow. Best wishes Ron
Hi Joe I have been in business for myself for 9months now (in Australia not US) running a tracked skid steer and tipper. Yet to make a profit by a long shot but am fortunate to have a partner who can pay the bills while the business grows. I left a good paying white collar job to start my business. Had very little experience on skid steers but went and did a course, got my licence and jumped in feet first. Practiced out the back of our place (large reserve) and did some work free for friends. Am yet to screw up other than running over a water meter ointhead once. Am having trouble breaking into the market here despite good advertising as a lot is word of mouth and many builders will let a project sit for weeks waiting for there usual bloke to turn up rather than finding someone else. :beatsme I am confident that things will pick up in time. Just about to start a letter drop of the suburbs to build up more business. If things dont pick up soon I will probably pick up a flexible part time job just to keep some income when I have downtime. But overall its worth doing, and its real enjoyable working for yourself and I find myself grinning on the machine from time to time, well most of the time. My only advice would be to pick a niche market and provide real customer service. My niche was a tracked skid steer which could work in the mud and did less damage. I am just starting to pick jobs up that only my machine can do which is good. I am finding that once I get a client I pick up repeat work simply cause I am on time and take an interest. Oh, and you only live once and are a long time dead. Follow your dreams if you can. cheers mate big dazzler
Hi big dazzler! Hang in tight. You hit right around something I think is really important to the one man operation. My best years of operation were the ones 1972-1982 in which I worked mostly for homeowners, small builders, and small general contractors, very few jobs ever required more than two or three days. In some cases as many as three little jobs in a single, but long day. Someone calls and you have a very fast response time, if not, most will waite as much as a week. I messed up when I tried to diversify and take on a new thing. I proved that a small Bobcat with an air ram breaker could put a swimming pool hole in solid limestone rock,(we swept the top and spray painted the outline on the surface) It was a very tight place, and every bucket load had to be taken out to the street and put in the truck. I was on that job a little over three weeks, and fuel cost for the compressor, truck, and bobcat, took every bit of my profit and then some. My main loss was 4 of my steady builders could not waite and found other people to do their work. The pool company would not step up to a higher price for this specialized work. I moved to custom mixed dirt (one of two in Austin 1982) and just about to turn the corner, within two weeks 3 pieces of equipment, and 1 Wife BROKE:beatsme. Broke and single I went to work selling Bobcats, and in late 1986 equipment sales flatlined, I left QE and started mixing garden soil again. Due to good customer relations a man owner financed 5 acres of LI zoned land, and the gravel under the dirt saved my bacon. The whole point is keep things going that are simple and quick. A list of what worked very well for me. 1. F-650 Ford/with 12' stake side dump bed/ twin cylinder(very important) 2. 720 Bobcat loader(or your choice)keep it as small as you can(too many reasons to list), 825 tires/tracks (it would almost float on water:notworthy A smooth bucket with teeth above the leading edge. 3. A 6' backhoe attchment (you always wish for more) but this gets most jobs done. 4. one INDUSTRIAL grapple bucket (farm units will not hold up) 5. 12' utility trailer tandem axel, rated at 6500 pounds or more. I modified mine to carry the grapple bucket on one side, a tooth bucket on the other side, I would attach the backhoe and pick up a smooth lip bucket, and drive the loader on, with the backhoe just touching the two bucket sides, i then extended the smooth bucket forward where it and the hoe bucket set on the tounge rails of the trailer. This all balanced very well, and when not using the tracks they rolled up and sat in the tooth bucket on the side. I could pull up to a job, unload and detach from the backhoe, attach any of the three buckets, and lift the trailer off the ball if needed, in less than 5 minuets. I had one metal building contractor in south la. say it was the most versital setup he had ever seen, and unless the job was really big or heavy, he could use me and eliminate a lot of minium billings from larger contractors. And the last thing, DON'T be a "good o boy" and give away to much work, I look back at all the things I did for free, and it added to about 20% or more, and when it all fell apart that was the very thing I needed for repairs or replacement.(you feel good about what your doing at the time, but it will bite you later on.) Sorry to get carried away, but some of this is very important to build into your startup habits. :Banghead Ron
I've wanted to do the same thing for a long time. Didn't have the money I needed, now I have the $, last year there where no machines in my area available. And jobs seemed to have dried up. Don't go to work for someone else. All you do is watch them make the big dollars and you get your little chicken feed and basicly go broke, hmm been doing that for most of my life. What you need to do is find some big out fit that wll have you do work for them. I've always been told finding the work is easy. Its finding an outfit that will pay you for it, that is the hard part.
@BD We sound like the same dude only seperated by a continent I would pretty much expect the same from my one-horse operation as you're seeing. How long before you bail out and kick yourself in the pants for taking the chance? My only advice would be to pick a niche market and provide real customer service. Well, that's kind of my thought too but am I aiming for the "right" niche? I'm looking to go a little smaller than most around, add a little versatility, cut prices a little.........but still compete for a large variety of jobs. Some say I should just concentrate on the small side (ala skid-steer, etc) and worry only with that. Others say if I'm going in the dozer biz that I should go all out and buy the biggest, newest, and most productive rig I can finance with the associated costs of truck/trailer transportation. Me? I'm looking to try to cover as much of the potential customer base as possible doing a large variety of jobs with one unit and the least operational cost. Probably not the most efficient in time or size in either extreme but able to compete whether it be landscaping a half-acre town lot or clearing ranch pastures of overgrown mesquite. I also see the bigger jobs being harder on equipment and more fuel consuming, so, why even try to do them? My niche is the small to medium jobs most common using a small to medium unit most reasonable. Sounds like your just about ready, and I would say go for it!! Oh, Ron, I'm far from going for it.... I want to go for it like yesterday but it ain't there yet. Still cobbing away money and workin' for the man but looking for the light at the end of the tunnel. Wanting to see if my thinking and finances jig up with everyone elses' so that I can do this in a few years time after a little more scratch is acquired. Am I sensible....insane.....comittable:Banghead Most likely the latter two, but, what are you gonna do? The most sensible and secure thing to do for me is to hang with my company, through more thick-and-thin, and try to squeeze all I can from them in another 30-40 year's time or so. Then, act out my wildest fantasies and play in the dirt.
Well I to am a newbe at this, BUT here is my two cents.... I guess dreams is what make the world go around, If lot's of us did not try or new things,,,, WHO would???? My Dad has allway told me, if you try a new project, just remember, it is like when you where a baby trying to walk, UP's and downs, some failures, bumps, bruses and hurts. BUT if your truly set your mind to mission completions, you will drive on to that happiness or suggess..
JoeinTX, I notice your posts are pre-economic downturn and just wondered how things are going for you? Did you "take the plunge"? And, how's it going? I too complacently belong to a corporate world, but live on a small farm. Grew up building swimming pools with my dad, backhoe, dump truck, bobcat...pre-CDL. Every day I ask myself, what the heck am I doing. Just curious about your success? Any regrets?
This story can be told a million times with only the names changing. I was engineering in LA when i decided i wanted something to do on the weekends. One thing is certain, if you are the type to be self employed, you will never ever be completely happy in life. After quiting, and going home to farm i can honestly say that i am living the life i was meant to live. No worrys about middle age breakdowns and the like for me. My life is by no means easy, but its the life for me. Back to my story, i hung up my pocket protector and got into the hog business. Borrowed a pile to build my first barn, and have been borrowing ever since. I now own many farms, many barns and many pigs. Unfortunately, the last 4 years have been a total loss, with no end in site. The fortune in this business seems to have dried up permanently. Because of this, i am just setting out in the heavy equipment market. I have a large sign to install, and then i'm going to wait for the phone to ring. I have a few jobs lined up this summer, along with a pile of work of my own to do. Not sure how it'll work out but like so many others on this thread, its worth a shot.
Good fortune with the attempt Watglen. I tried the equipment operation business for many years first with a small dozer 10K lbs and than adding a small excavator 10K lbs. I originally hauled the dozer with a 14K gooseneck trailer and my 1/2 ton 4X4. Not a great idea in Northwest AR. since everything is up and down hills. Since the equipment also was used to clear my property and help me build my house it had that to help amortize the costs. Never made much money doing it though I did feel I got my money back over the years. Work in my area is Seasonal. Everyone gets Spring fever and starts going gangbusters. Than the heat of July/August shuts things down. Sept things pick back up only to end November. Pretty much nothing happens than until Spring again. It is also a real poor area with low wages so many can not afford much done. I have seen many others try to get into the business in my area only to fail because of the Seasonal nature of available work. The ones that succeed are the large firms that bid the jobs unavailable to the small operator. I sold the excavator years back and I still occasionally do some dozer work from word of mouth. It is enough to pick up a bit to allow me to keep some equipment. (just bought a 1981 D31P-16 which may or may not be worth doing so :beatsme ) I think if a person is going to succeed as a small operator they need a substantial population close at hand with a burgeoning building boom going on.
I meant to say, you'll never be completely happy working for someone else. oops
JoeinTX, I notice your posts are pre-economic downturn and just wondered how things are going for you? Did you "take the plunge"? Wow. Had to re-read the thread.....figure out what year it is........so on. Got laid-off from my good corporate job last March. Bad. They provided almost a year's worth of severance pay and benefits to me afterward. Good. Still getting checks in one form or another from them today. Very good. But. I never did go through with the dozer biz or any of the purchases I was contemplating due to this and the economy. Instead, with my newly-found free time and and the paychecks still coming in, I decided to try to boost my fledgling tractor/mowing operation since I already had all of the equipment free-and-clear to see if it I could turn into something more. Recurring ad on Craigslist, hundreds of business cards printed and distributed among friends and family and through a good friend in the real estate biz, some flyers placed in areas where real estate people would hopefully wander across them.........grand net total was 0 solid responses. This economy is one giant sucking sound on steroids. Nobody is spending money on anything. Shed the GF in the year since........stumbled-upon a job in the manufacturing/warehousing sector (of which I knew nothing and still today know little about but they keep paying me to show up, go figure) and count my blessings. Not making the money I used to but just treading water and waiting for things to someday improve and maybe I'll give it a whole new go someday. :usa
The advertisement that worked best for me was in the Services Offered Classified section of the Local Newspaper. Everything else never produced anything. Though I did pick up some from having a sign at my driveway (very low traveled road).
The one thing I will say about owning your own business... which occurred to me in 08 as the SH*T hit the fan on Wall St is this: I will most definately be the last one to get laid off at my company . I would advise anyone looking to get in the biz right now to consider a CTL and Mini Ex over a D4. Capable of virtually the same work load, but a whole lot more versitile.