I'm interested in an early 1970's AC HD 11E dozer and curious about parts availability. Anyone know if you can still get most parts new for these? Undercarriage and such? It's about the right size for me, but if it's going to be looking for a needle in a haystack every time it needs something I probably need to look elsewhere. Thanks
I ran this one some in the early 70's....was a nice machine, weighed in at about 15 tons & was 140 HP. I believe getting parts will be a problem.
Yep. Definitely worried about the parts situation.
It's a good deal for free, or $100. that is if you have a cheap moving service. I would not want one even if free, I'd take the engine but would not want to have to remove it.
I hear you. I got a free Cat 977 a year or so ago that was running and operating, but it was only good for parts or scrap.
its a very late HD11E; i can tell by aircleaner. They were quite a good machine in its day; its about 1969 to 71 build.That later 11E shares most parts with later HD11 series B. Alot of stuff AC used was common off shelf stuff. But yes major stuff is hard to find. Track gear for HD11 was 7" pitch odball size. But down here many people retrofitted them with Cat D5 track gear; cat even had kits to update them in the 80s. But that would be history by now. Basically alot of it depends on your person mechanical knowledge; or a good friends knowledge. Cheers
Said to be a 1971 model, and that lines up with the serial number. I can weld, fabricate, build engines and transmissions, etc, but still not sure I'm up for getting a machine that has very limited parts availability, even if it would just be sparingly used on my buddy's ranch. thanks
YIKES!!
I'm guessing that will have the Buda engine and parts availability could be zilch. It was near impossible to get engine parts for AC loaders in the early 80s so most were repowered with Fiat.
That's where I'm confused. As I understand it, the earlier HD-11 dozers used the 516 cubic inch Buda engine, but the HD-11E had the A-C 11000 engine, also 516 cubic inch.
Maybe only a name change. MERV
I heard the Buda engines were re-branded into an Allis Chalmers....same engine.
That pic reminds me of an 11G loader that we used to pass by on a vacation route in NY state. It sat there for a few yrs, gone now though.
That HD11E has the direct injection 11000 engine. Last E/EP had roosamaster fuel pumps instead of american bosch; then the 11-B came out with Robert Bosch inline fuel pumps. LAst serial numbers for them go into 15000 numbers. Early HD11 had Buda HD516 engines; yes same cubes but totally different engines. with no interchangeability. And yes probably very few parts available. Am told some Gleaner combines used 11000 engines, but same story that was 50 years ago too Some bits are still available; got a waterpump kit came in a AGCO box.
Thanks for the info. The serial number is 13766 and that seems to line up with what the owner says - it's a 1971 model.
Nope that is the AC engine believe it's a 1100 series
Seems like every manufacturer came up with their own odd lift arms and bucket linkage designs back then.
berco track parts, weld-in sprocket not hard Berco or itertac chain,roller and grosser bar obtain local
Ok, now for some details on the attempted rescue. Picked up my buddy Will at 7:30 am and we headed to Victoria, TX. It's a 2.5 hour drive. Arrived and noticed that we didn't need a chainsaw and a weedeater to be able to get to the dozer; they had cleaned up the area around the machine several weeks ago. Too bad they didn't kill all of the wasps; we must have killed about 50 and went through 3 cans of wasp spray, which is a new record for me. Anyway, after taking a look at the dozer, it didn't take long to see that this was more of a parts machine than anything else. It's complete, but the undercarriage is in pretty bad shape -- the sprocket teeth have a knife edge and most of the teeth are chipped, too. The track chain didn't look great, although the pins and bushings didn't look to be in terrible shape. The worst part was the track adjusting yokes that move the idler gear - the rods were severely pitted, to the point where they had to substantially weaker than they should be. Most of the control levers were seized up. I managed to get the steering clutch levers freed, the transmission (6 speed manual) shifted ok, and the main clutch worked, but lever to control the blade never freed up, the high-low shifter appears to be stuck, the winch controls are seized up, and I had to undo the throttle linkage because it was seized. Engine was low on oil (barely reading on the dipstick) and I couldn't see any coolant at all in the radiator. Hydraulic cylinder rods for the blade were gouged and rusted, too. Batteries were dated 2001, so I'm thinking the machine has been sitting for about 20 years. Electrical problems started with the batteries and battery cables. We charged the two 12V batteries in the dozer (they were dated 2001 and hooked up for 24V) and they would each read about 12.5 volts after charging, but we only got about 3 - 4 volts at the starter so we had some battery cable/connection issues. The push button starter wasn't working either, so I hooked the 24V jump pack positive clamp to the lug on the starter solenoid where the hot cable came in from the battery, and grounded the jump pack negative clamp to the starter ground. Then I used a screwdriver to jump to the other large lug on the solenoid and just got the whirrrrr noise from a starter that was spinning but not engaging. The starter solenoid is on top of the starter and reasonably easy to get to. I tried to disassemble on-site but unable to remove the solenoid from the starter because there was a nut holding the starter solenoid actuating rod (not sure if this is the "official" term) in place and the actuating rod spun when you turned the nut. The starter solenoid actuating rod has to pull in, towards the front of the starter, in order to push the starter pinion to the rear to engage the flywheel. The actuating rod was spring loaded and I was able to push the actuating rod in, towards the front of the starter, with a pry bar. When I did that, the starter pinion moved to the rear and into the flywheel teeth. However, we were able to watch the starter solenoid actuating rod when I jumped the two starter solenoid lugs with a screwdriver and the actuating rod didn't move in or out. If I had been able to get the starter solenoid off, I think there's a decent chance that I could have disassembled it and at least figured out why it wasn't cooperating. There was an inspection cover not far from the starter that I was able to remove to view the flywheel. The teeth on the flywheel weren't perfect, but they weren't chewed up, so the issue wasn't a bad spot on the flywheel, at least not that I could see. I turned the engine over using the pry bar on the flywheel, so I was able to actuate the starter on different spots of the flywheel with no change. Debating on whether or not I want to go out there with a new starter, to the tune of $450. I won't end up buying it, but if I get a few videos out of getting it running again, I'll make the $ back eventually off YouTube.
I'd just fix the old starter, likely right there. And I would not want that machine if it was free and the shipping was free, though I'd take the engine and some of the steel, as long as I was not removing or cutting it.
Yeah, I'm not planning to buy it. I just want to fix it, see if it will operate, and walk away with busted knuckles and a lighter wallet.
Why?
I enjoy a challenge, but I don't want a long-term relationship and all that entails.
I didnt either but ended up with 2 kids out of the deal
Yeah, I learned my lesson on the Cat 977H. Got it for free and it ran and operated, but that was still too expensive. Should have left it right where it was.
I could always use some $ help you could lighten your wallet here.
Why put any money into it?
Youtube content.
The downfall of society
I actually don't think I'll need to spend much on it. The S terminal on the solenoid was hiding under the battery cable and I was jumping the starter using the two large lugs on the solenoid. That was spinning the starter without actuating the rod that pushes the starter pinion into the flywheel. My buddy and I figured this out once I got back home. I'll still pick up a new starter locally, but if I don't need it, and I don't think I will, I'll return it when I get back. Anyway, I plan to return on Friday morning. I'll jump the starter correctly, and if the engine cranks over, I'll remove the fuel filters, replace them with new ones filled with fresh fuel. After that, I'll crack open the injectors and bleed them while spinning the engine over. If that works, I'm thinking it will start, perhaps with a whiff of ether. And from there, I'll see if it will move and steer and I can try to free the linkage so I can operate the blade.
Primary reason is I want to see if I can get it running and operating again because I enjoy resurrecting old iron, but yes, it will end up on my YouTube channel. I don't make much off my videos, but this one could bring in a few hundred $ over the course of a year or two, so that will help pay for any parts, fuel, etc.
This whole thing is just exhausting
Why not look for machines that people might actually consider buying that aren't basket cases to begin with? The HD16 the guy bought for his development is a good example. There was some history and the owner had an idea what might be wrong and helped fix the problem.
I'm a sucker for something that's a real challenge, so a 50+ year old dozer with no history, limited parts availability, and that's been sitting for 20 years is right up my alley. Again, I'm just trying to get it running again; I can't envision a scenario that involves me loading this up on a lowboy and bringing it home, even if they paid me to do so. I know it's difficult to understand why I'd go get someone else's machine running and then walk away, but that's what I enjoy doing. Some folks sitting on the couch all weekend watching football games. I like turning wrenches on forgotten old yellow machines. When I get ready to buy something to hang on to, I'll be looking for a D6C or something similar. I'd like vintage, but preferably something that has decent parts availability.
It's all about the Youtube content. You build up a sizable list of subscribers and that's where the money is. If finding and fixing junk equipment happens to garner viewers and it's what one enjoys....well that's a bonus.
Yes i see
I may need a machine in the future to do some work and thought about buying something that would pay for its self but the more i think about it and as time goes buy it doesn't seem like a good ideal.
Well, there's not a lot of $ involved. The income jumps when I post something popular, but a typical month is $300. Currently have 10k subscribers and 53 videos.
The concept briefs well, but I think you'd need to spend $10k or more on something that runs and operates but maybe needs some TLC.
Everybody starts at the bottom.
Dropped $700 at Napa today - remanufactured 24v 40MT starter, a 24v solenoid for a 40MT starter, two fuel filters, and a gallon of Rotella. I think the starter and solenoid are both good, but the dozer is 2.5 hours away, so I'm bringing them just in case. Speaking of the starter, the 40MT starter, which was original equipment on the dozer, was apparently superseded by the 42MT and then the 42MT was replaced by the 39MT. I think the 39MT would be the best option (lighter and spins faster), but I'm not 100% positive that it's a direct fit, so I'm going with the 40MT. The original fuel filters on the dozer are really rough looking, so if I get the engine to spin over, I'll remove them and replace them with new filters filled with fresh diesel (spiked with 2 stroke oil). The oil was barely reading on the dipstick, so I'll add a gallon. If I don't use the new solenoid and starter, I'll return them to Napa on Monday.
16 minutes ago Add bookmark #11 Day 2 is done, and she's still not a runner. I tried jumping the starter solenoid again but on the S terminal this time, using jumper cables to connect two Group 31 12V batteries wired up for 24V. Got the solenoid to actuate, but starter wouldn't turn the engine over. Cleaned up all the contacts and grounds and still no luck, so I fabbed up several cables with new 2/0 battery cable, good lugs, etc (brought cable, lugs, and crimper just in case). Connected everything again, and then I got the starter to spin, but not very fast and it ran down the batteries in very short order. While I was waiting for the batteries to charge up, I added some grease to the track adjusters and as expected, both sides have blown seals. Given the extreme amount of slack in the tracks on both sides, I think that rules out being able to operate the dozer unless you just want to drive a few feet forward or back. Also removed the fuel filters and replaced them with new filters, topped off with fresh diesel. The diesel tank was bone dry, so I added 5 gallons and then drained it a bit to get the worst of the crud out. Got the batteries charged and tried again but still running the batteries down very quickly, even when I added the 24V jump pack. Thinking it through after I left, I believe the clutch is stuck to the flywheel and/or the winch is engaged. If/when I go back, I'll pull the inspection cover off the bellhousing and see if I can tell if the clutch is stuck. Winch controls are frozen in place, but I should also be able to disengage at the winch itself. Might take cutting the cables and some minor disassembly. Anyway, I'd like to hear the old girl fire up, but it's 2.5 hours each way and I've made the trip twice already. We'll see.
As long as it would turn with a starter, I've started such old sitting around forever things with in 10 minutes or so. And I would only use 1 gallon of diesel to do it, and likely some of the special "Bunny" too. LOL
Diesel Creek on YouTube has a video about starting a AC HD 11, check it out
Yep, my buddy sent me a link to it yesterday. Thanks
It's turning over very very slowly. Need it to spin over faster and for longer before it will have a chance to start, even with a dose of ether. thanks
You have to drive 2 and a half hours to find a hopeless machine??? Shoot I must have it easy here! I get you are doing it for YouTube but if you are putting that much effort into it you should at least take it off his hands and scrap it. The recovery and cutting it up alone would be better content then yet another starting an old diesel engine video.
As much as I like old iron I don't need any more long projects and that is just what this machine is, a project. Very sad though. They were good machines in their day. I last ran an HD 21 in about 1976 as a ripper tractor. Had to take the torque converter in for repair and it wiped out one of the rear bearings on my little pickup. I seem to specialize in orphans but this summer upgraded to a near new Case 321F and CX80. Both terrify me they are so complex I know I will struggle to repair them and they are built with planned obsolescence and to be not fixable by mere mortals or even trained service techs. My reliable little PC40 and Schaeff loader will need to be for sale. Both barn kept for the years I have owned them, used lightly and taken care of. If you must get an old dozer get a TD7, 8 or 9 or a Case 450 or 550 or a Dear Something.
Ether won't do anything if it doesn't turn over fast enough. It would more likely make starting harder because it would increase compression some.
master clutch is a oil clutch, so should not be siezed. Winch control levers appear to be in nuetral, and even if it was in gear drum would turn. Just remove floor plate and check driveshaft turns freely with master clutch diengaged. Re track adjusters, which grease nipple did you pump grease in ?? rear grease nipple is just a dust seal. forward nipple is the adjuster. They need to crank over relativly quickly to start, same goes for any diesel. And did you properly bleed it ? For that serial number i suspect it has a roosamaster fuel pump, which im not very conversant about. But do know they have a plastic drive ring that can can self destruct and block fuel flow. Someone else might know more about those pumps
Recovery and cutting it up would be an interesting video, but I'm not sure that I want to sign up for that. Really need to thrash on my race car so I can have it ready for a race in early March. Thanks
Yeah, I think it's destined for the scrapper, but maybe someone will still buy it for parts. If/when I get an older dozer, I'm definitely going for something with parts availability. thanks
Good point. I don't think it's spinning nearly fast enough for ether.
Gotcha. If/when I go back down, need to have someone watching the winch while I spin it over. Good point. Will do that, too. Pumped grease in both. The seals on both sides have numerous holes and leaks. No, it's not bled. I have fuel to the injection pump, but no fuel leaving the injection pump. Here are a few pictures of the injection pump - can you identify which one it is? Thanks!
Roosamaster
If its a direct drive get the blade up, and in a highish gear and start pulling or pushing it around the field, that should spin it fast enough.
Greetings bulletpruf, I am that HD16 guy. I'm like you... I like the old iron. Love the diesel creek videos. I have been documenting my exploits with the a 65 home subdivision on here and have considered starting a youtube channel for it. As the guys here can attest to, I've had my bouts with equipment but like you... I am persistent enough that thus far I am ahead of the game over buying something modern. My HD16 is a great example. Purchased it for the monster ripper it has on the back which has made an unbelievable difference in breaking up hardened clay that I have to move to the tune of 30 cy to start then ultimately another 30 cy. The HD16 effectively wouldn't move when I found it. Found the issue to be in the modulating valve control to the torque converter. Was able to bypass and have been using it every day since... just looking for a good weekend to tear into the modulating valve and find out what the obstruction is. Currently pursuing an ol PC300-5 Komatsu excavator. Will be checking out your youtube channel.
re these youtube videos; is a guy down here in new zealand named Marty T has done quite a few videos about equipment rescues and saves. He did one video about rescuing a D4D that was abandoned cast on the side of a hill with a thrown track, been sitting there for several years. Anyhow he comes along with some mates and handtools. Gets engine running and manages to get track back on and gets her back to work. Finishes road it was trying to do and drives it out to safety. Point about all this is; in the 18 months i think its been on there; he has had 3.3 million views ! No idea what the $ return is ?? But he must have made some $ from it
Glad to hear you saved it! Do you have a link to your thread on it? FYI - just posted the video on this one; I think it's too far gone to save, but I'm still enjoying wrenching on it.
The thread for the development is HeavyEquipmentForums The thread for the A/C HD16 is HeavyEquipmentForums
Thanks, I'll check out the threads. Scott