Okay to get to the point the machine has been sitting for 3 years. Last winter we tried to bleed the fuel system and burnt the solenoid on the starter out. Replaced the solenoid. Put new fuel in. Bled from the fuel and water sediment bleed bolt until just fuel flowed out. Next the manual says to bleed the injector with the bleed bolt while cranking. We did that until no air came out. Next the manual said to put the throttle lever to wide open with the injectors cracked open and crank. No fuel is coming up to the end of the lines. We then cracked the injector lines at the pump and cranked. Fuel didn't shoot out at all. I'm not sure if the pump is broken. The injector pump bleed bolt shoots out fluid when cranked, but not the injector lines at the pump. That's the only thing that makes me think the pump isn't broken. I don't know for sure. Any feedback would be awesome! Thanks in advance!!
Does it have an electric shut-off on it or is it a pull cable?? if its a pull cable, you'll have to remove the top cover to see if the metering valve is stuck.. It its electric, make sure theres power..
It's a pull cable. You're talking about on top of the injector pump? The bleed bolt that we loosened on the pump was shooting out fluid when we were cranking, so it seems there's pressure in the pump.
Yes, the cover on the top of the injection pump, held on by two acorn nuts typically. Be careful of noting which holes the springs go in and exactly how they're hooked up, take pictures. You have nothing to lose by removing the cable and snapping that shut off lever back and forth with your finger several times, then crank to see if there's any any fuel coming out the injector lines, or smoke out the exhaust. I believe the shut off is closed by the lever, opened by spring pressure, so snapping it back and forth might help it loosen up.
JB, theres a valve under the top cover that rotates and allows fuel to flow out of the pump.. Its called a metering valve. Most people, when they get done using there tractor/equipment, pull the stop cable and walk off.. The metering valve gets stuck in the shut-off position.. Disconnect your linkages and lift up the tc in a rocking motion, side to side.. The pump is going to be full of fuel so watch out.. I like to shut off the fuel at the tank or pinch the fuel line that goes into the back of the pump 1st. Then loosen the side cove to drain.. Theres a couple of springs and a peg that need SPECIAL ATTENTION.. before REMOVING the TC.. Just search CAV top cover or DPA stuck metering valve for specifics.. lots of info & videos. IF the MV is NOT stuck, theres pumping plungers deep inside the pump that are stuck.. not awhole lot you can do about that, but get it off and taken in for a tear down & cleaning.. IF the MV IS stuck, you can usually free it, by just moving it back and forth w/ your fingers. Your going to need a new tc gasket and as long as your there, new orings for the throttle shaft and shut off shaft.. You can buy these tc kits online for about 11.00.. or a complete seal kit from a fuel shop for 22.00. They sell kits online too, but they're aftermarket and cost more than an original OEM kit.. Good luck and you can email me if you need to.. just put, at a o l dot com after my screen name.
Theres a thread going on RIGHT NOW.. Bobcat 943 wont start.. that has pictures of the top cover removal and the springs you need to watch.. Its always best to SEE what your getting into first..
Thank you everyone for your feedback! You guys are extremely helpful because it does seem like something is stuck in the pump. Is it necessary to remove the pump or could it be done while it is mounted? It's raining where I am so I don't think I will open any covers on the pump today. I'm going to try and move the shut off valve back and forth manually at the pump first and see if that changes anything.
Crank the engine over while moving the shut-off lever.. 2 people if you unhook it.. The added fuel pressure may break it free.. MAKE SURE the throttle is wide open while doing it.. good luck The TC can come off w/ the pump still on the engine, if you have room..
I moved the shut off lever from inside and we checked on the fuel pump, it's working fine. At least it appears to be on the outside of the pump. Cranked the engine while pulling it in and out, still no fuel at the injector lines. I think to take off the pump cover I would have to remove the pump.
I haven't found 1 yet that I'v had to remove inorder to take the tc off.. and i'v been doing this for 30 years.. You might have to take off a bracket or filter housing.. but its your call.. what ever is easier for ya.. Plus, if you already have it off to see if the mv is stuck and its not.. your miles ahead on taking it to the shop.. What the #'s on the name plate?? 3233f651?? In case you didn't know, you have to go thru the front of the engine to remove the 3 bolts or nut & washer to free the pump from the drive gear.. The pump wont come off by JUST taking off the 3 mounting bolts on the outside of the pump..
Wow I thought it would just be the 3 bolts on the pump. Good thing I haven't attempted it yet! Lol. I will take off the cable on the fuel shut off valve next and try to move that manually. It's been getting down to 25* Fahrenheit at night recently. Is it possible for the valve to literally be frozen inside? I'll have to take a look again at the top cover when I get a chance. You're probably right thought, I won't have to remove the pump. Just looked like it at first. I'll post a picture of it when I get a chance. May be a few days until I'll be around it again.
please don't remove that pump you would need expert help getting back on and timed
Only if it has water inside, and then you have way bigger problems than the ice. It can stick from gunked up diesel from age/biodiesel/contamination. There are various solvents, acetone, flammable brake cleaner, seafoam, chemtool, etc. that have been used for helping to free up injection pumps. The cover is easy to take off, a little tougher to get back together right and without leaks.
Your definatly going to need a top cvr gasket to keep it from leaking.. see post #5..
Hey everyone, I've had a busy week and haven't had much time to play around with the machine, also it's been rainy where I live. I will not be taking off the pump. I will be taking off the top cover, just have to find a gasket somewhere local maybe. I wouldn't want to pay for shipping on a $3 or $4 gasket. Thank you all again! Plenty of insight on this site!!
Cant read it.. 3238F???
Yeah, looks like it says 3238F3E0 .
IF its a 380.. the pump removal is easy.. 3 bolts under the cover, 3 bolts outside & will only go back in the front gear 1 way.. master splined. Fine tuneing of the timing is done by rotating the pump.. There is a mark on the mounting flange of the pump and degree * marks on the engine block.. or make your own.. but NOT ontop of the factory marks. IF it were mine, I'd try to get it running 1st and then go back and fix the leaks.. no sense in spending 25.00 for a gasket kit if you just have to send the pump out.. just my opinion.
I was only going to take the top cover off and check if the metering valve is stuck inside. That's the gasket I would need correct? Unless I take the pump off I will need a gasket there too. I would hope that I wouldn't have to take the pump off and it would just be the mv. When we opened the bleed bolt on the body of the pump and cranked the engine it was shooting fluid out. So wouldn't that mean that maybe just the mv is stuck?
It only means the fuel is getting TO the pump.. Yes, the top cover gasket is the one you have to replace. like I said, you can get a small, put together kit, that has 4 orings, a tc gasket and 2 fiber washers that go under the 2 top nuts.. for about 11.00 on the web or at your local fuel shop, but an entire kit only costs 22.00 + tax. The mounting gasket for the pump comes in the gasket kit.
Awesome! I'll check around a few stores in my area and see what we can find. I appreciate the tips.
I have the gasket o rings and fabric washers. I am about to be taking off the top cover today. I watched a few videos and will be taking pictures. I've removed the fuel filter and water sediment separator bracket and am removing the lines to the injectors to make it easier.
Quick question too, is there some sort of grease I could put inside the top cover, if my MV is stuck to assure it won't happen again?
No.. the fuel is the lubricant.. Use some sort of lube on the orings tho.. I like vasoline instead of grease.. some engine oil will work also. Steal some veggie oil from the kitchen in a pinch.. lol Post your pictures so we can help others..
Okay great. I'm going to need one more day tomorrow. I'm out of time. I only got the fuel filter bracket off and the injector lines. It's about 20* farenheit here so it gets pretty cold holding a wrench in hand lol. Tomorrow I will have the top cover off and will have pictures to show my procedure!
Bummer.. I'm walking around in shorts and a t-shirt.. Don't forget, the pump is full of fuel.. your gonna get wet if your not prepared for it. Stay warm.. TPG
Haha lucky you! I'd much rather be in warmer weather for this lol. I understand though. Sounds good. Thank you in advance. Will talk tomorrow, take care!
I have the top cover off and it looks like something the MV was stuck shut! Where the metal arm connects to the MV inside the pump to what that part pushes on seemed stuck until I freed it with my finger! I feel like we're almost ready!
You can see if its fixed w/o putting the cover back on.. just hold the governor bracket towards the MV while its cranking.. and wait for fuel to come out of the loose injector lines.. IF IT STARTS.. PULL the bracket back the other way, towards the engine.. Good luck.
I give up. I saw your message after about testing it with the cover off. I put the. Cover back on and all the injector lines and all the brackets and fuel still didn't come out of the injector lines. I feel like it could have gotten stuck just as easily again, it seemed like it could have, even with vaseline. I moved it back and forth with the cover off to try and keep it free but then when I'd pull it to off it I would have to jiggle it for it to come back to the open position. I almost feel like I'm not going to work on it again until spring... so frustrating. I thought fuel was going to come up to the injector lines for sure this time, I'm really disappointed.
Try it again w/ the cover off.. If it doesn't pump then.. the pumping plungers inside the pump are stuck. The pump has to come apart to fix..
I don't know if I'm going to be able to get to it without taking off the injector lines again. I may have to come back to it in the spring, unfortunately. We were so close. Pumpguy I wish you were here lol. It's not getting any warmer here until March.
ok then.. better save your pennies over the winter.. a rebuild isn't cheap.. a fuel shop is going to charge 600.00 +.. good thing you know a guy.. wink wink..