I always had a special place in my heart for heel boom shovels, but never had a chance to operate one as a kid. The experienced operators made it look so easy, but I found out in later years on the East Coast just how much skill it takes to play a cable crane of any type like a guitar. Particularly a dragline in my case. A Northwest 41 with air controls, to be exact. My dad had one dipperstick shovel at Vail that was pretty slick. I'm thinking it was an LS-98. I recall watching one outfit (Roberts Brothers, on the coast) log a piece of pretty wet land with several dipperstick shovels in about 1967. Basically, they were hoe chucking, cable style. One day, when time permits, I will scrape up the few pics I could contribute. For now, I will just beg to see a few shots of cable shovels, if anyone has some to spare. Puh-leeeeeeeeze?
I started that thread about a year ago but it never really took of.....
Roberts bros. from montesano actually developed the "scissors boom " which I believe Skookum manufactured. similar but different from the "dipper stick " shovel front. just a info tidbit for you . brent
Good info. Thanks. I lived in Central Park as a kid, and watched Roberts Bros. log off the far side of Higgins Slough. It was quite a sight. I'm thinking the machines were P&H, but I might be wrong. They could actually walk the machine through the soft spots with the boom, much like a modern day hydraulic machine. I believe at least some of the Roberts boys, or their ancestors, got their start with Saginaw Timber. There were several gents with that name employed with Saginaw. There were many well known names in logging that got their start with Saginaw, including John McMeekin, aka Oakville Johnny. And here's another little tidbit: Oakville Johnny used to go to school, in Oakville, of course, with a gent named John Damitio, who owned the Brooklyn Tavern for many years. My dad knew the Roberts brothers, and the one thing I recall about them was that they could be ticking along just fine with a side as it was rigged, and the main man (I forgot his first name) would pipe up and say, "Hold it, take it all down. Let's try it another way and see if it works".
Years ago, there used to be a guy in Montesano, or 'Monte' as the locals call it, named Milt Benedict. He had a small shop building and yard on the outskirts of Monte, on the east side of the main drag (not the bypass, the 'old' main drag), on the right. He bought, sold and repaired cable shovels, and his yard stayed packed with 'em. I used to bug the crap out of my dad to stop, and let me have a look. If only I had taken some photos. I miss those rough old, loud, smoking monsters. But of course, when I went back there in 2002, the building remained, but all the scrap iron was long gone. I felt a little better, though, when I found that the old drive-in with the 10-inch tall ice cream cones was still there, as was Sylvia Lake, where I caught my first fish. I still have that photo, in fact. The one thing that I could not understand, for the life of me, was that when I went back in 2002, y'awl were playing modern music, and driving modern cars, instead of stuff from the Sixties. It just didn't seem right....
Roberts Bros boom in action. I knew I had this but it took me an hour to find it.........
You are da MAN, CL. Two questions, if I may: First, any idea as to the make of those machines? Also, why don't I see any counterbalance out back?
Your right he is the man !!! looks like the Hyd. heel boom of today
I asked my dad earlier this evening, and he said he thought those machines were Units. I believe he's right, because they have that look about them.
This machine isn't a Unit. I believe its a Bay City just by the look of it. The Roberts Brothers machines were Units (I have some pics but cannot find them this second but I will!) and they had several of the units. The boom above was built and sold to these 2 fellows and mounted on this little crane they already owned. Lots of these Bay City machines still in that area and most just have the 40' lattice boom- used alot around the canneries and commercial fishing fleets for slinging nets, drums, fish boxes, etc. I'm 98% sure this is a Bay City by the pics I've taken of other Bay City's on the Harbor. Most also have no visible counterweight- also hadn't noticed that until you mentioned it. They must have been draglines and not designed for lifting......?
Bay City. Now there's an obscure name. Almost as obscure as Marion. I have seen very few of either brand.
I have the full colour brochure from Skookum-Tyee on that Scissor Boom, I must dig it up and scan it for you guys. I imagine it would have been tricky to operate, much like a cable backhoe.
Saw this behind a gate near a project we start next week. Hope to get more pics after I get permission to walk around it. Looks to be in nice condition.
Wow, I'd love to have that one at our museum!
Great old pictures and makes for many memories for me. I ran a Link Belt dragline cleaning ditches a long time ago. Even ran a cable backhoe just like that B E 30B. The steering brakes were down below. You could drop down the pans and clean the oli and grease that had leaked on them and they would work for a short while. Those smooth pads made it slide off a truck darn fast, had a 6X6 that would lay in front of the track to make it turn, when loading.
LS 98 and M2 Berger around 1974 I can't remember who took this picture, no one I can ask I'm standing on the deck and the yarder engineer, shovel operator, hooktender, riggin slinger, and one of the choker setters are all gone.
We ran a Manitowoc 2300 for a number of years. Always adjusting frictions and brakes. The machine was a pit for grease. Caught fire more than once welding on it. We ALWAYS had stuff on hand to put out the fires when welding. No fire dept. for many, many miles. We sure got plenty of grease on us making repairs. My Dad and Uncle were on the roof knocking pins out of the gantry. Wearing their 'caulks'. Norman swung the sledge while my Dad held a hunk of round stock against the pin. He slipped on the metal roof and hit my Dad in the cheek with the sledge hammer. I remember my Dad laying on the couch that night with blood pouring from his sinuses. Never went to the doc. Told me that nobody ever hit him that hard in a fight, but he stayed on his feet. I would have cried like a girl.
That reminds me of a time when a rigging slinger was standing by the pad of a Madill 009 when we were towering up. We used to loop the strawline through the eyes of the two I-beam arms (that hold the pad down in position when the tower is up) during the move as a safety in case the pins fell out. During the tower up, one of the arms stayed in the up position. Well he was down working on pad when that arm came down right on his hard hat. He was staggering around the landing trying to be useful but they had to haul him off. He got a golden hard hat award for his troubles - quite pretty it was. He traded it for a case of beer....
I recall back in about 1967, seeing a brand spanking new 30-B cable hoe sitting in front of Cecil Bignold's shop in Montesano WA, and being amazed at how far modern technology had come. Seeing this one collecting dust is somewhat ironic, looking back...
Here's a good reason to NEVER get under any load. We were logging big cedar on the coast. Norman latched onto a huge log to load on an off highway truck. He boomed up as far as he could with our Manitowoc. Had to drag the log across the log deck. The outside track coming off the ground. The off highway truck pulled down the road and waited. Norman got the log in the road and now that the boom was over the end of the tracks he could hoist the log. BARELY! Frank Miens backed his truck under. Norman sets the log in place and swings around for another. That's when the mainline broke. That blew my mind. It should have broke under the heavy load, but it just took one more pass through the sheave, or maybe it had stranded and bunched up coming back through. I swore to never get under anything suspended again. I'm still alive. Seen some weird things over the years though, and more than one dead guy. They'll tell you 'don't get under the load'. I say, "don't get under anything".
I still use that old saying when I fix airplanes 'never stand under a load'. I've trained others to do it as well. Another one we use is 'don't put your fingers where you wouldn't put your *****'. That one has a greater affect.
One of my first jobs in the bush when I was just seventeen was working as pad man and tong man on a old cable shovel for a very cranky old machine operator building logging road, I couldn't do anything right or fast enough for him. Every time he stopped for a coffee break I would have to grease the machine, the flies ate me alive even though I had covered myself in diesel fuel and by the end of the day I was covered in grease and sweat, such great times.
I worked for a similar crustacean oiling on a Northwest 41 dragline after I graduated high school. He was one cranky old fart. We managed to get along somehow, until one day when he was replacing the main line. He looped the end back around and set it in place in the keyway, shoved the key in, and started pulling the line tight by hand... then the end of the cable popped out of the keyway, rared up, and hit him a lick right square in the kisser. Messed him up pretty good. I started laughing, and it went downhill from there. When the smoke cleared, I found myself driving a water truck, so life was good.
Hahaha! You guys are describing my Grandpa!
One of the stories I remember about them old shovels; Back in the 50's they had two Northwest Model 5's that built all the grade, and they were a pretty crude machine compared to the 41, or an American 750. The pad man actually had to set the digging lock, which stuck out the front of the carbody. It had three positions, one of which was free both ways, the other fully locked, and another that allowed the shovel to move forward only. Anyway, the oiler set the digging lock to the freewheeling position, and when the operator dug into the bank, the shovel took off backwards down the hill, and clattered over a really steep bank. The operator pole vaulted over the controls and survived, a bit bumped and bruised. The shovel.... well, nothing left but wheels and bolts. The safety guy came out and gave the operator Hell, because he was supposed to stay in the machine!
P&H sitting in the gravel pit at Alaska Roadbuilder's in Soldotna
Manitowoc 2300. or at least what's left of one. Roadbuilder's pit, Soldotna.
Insley Parked along the Kenai Spur Hwy, north of Kenai. Lots of John Deere tractors on display here too.
I worked on & aroung a old Lima cable shovel in the 80's. It was mounted on a 4 axle carrier with 4 out & down outriggers . It had an extra drum we used to yard logs with. It held 3-400' of 3/4 line. I was honored to be one of the human haulbacks (we usually had two), on this machine for a while. It could sure keep a guy in shape. We used it to pick up the odd corners for the towers. Once the slip was plugged, the human haulbacks became landing chasers, clean up the logs.........then go back for more.......
Mantiwoc shovel in Forks WA Found this nice looking one behind the Thriftway in Forks, WA
Somehow, Jeremy, I figured you would have posted a pic of this machine, since you were up that way poking around Dahlgren's! I have been looking for the pictures I took of that Mantiwoc in Forks for quite a while now. Must not have ever got the pics loaded into my computer, or they are on one of the sd cards I can't find from that day. Thought it was kinda odd to see it sitting in that parking lot
-ran across this site and your info on roberts scissor boom,and was wondering if you had any pictures of the logging in the central park swamp-my dad was one of the roberts bros and ran shovel on that job-have lots of roberts bros pictures but none of that job-the scissor boom was the first shovel you could pull logs towards the cab (or pull or push yourself along)with power and speed,also very dangerous if any lines broke,the first pratical shovel you could shovel log with, besides throwing the tongs on the other line machines-thats ken roberts standing on the shovel track
Well, I WILL be darned! Small world after all these years. I was a young lad back then. Little Bro and I used to fish Preacher's Slough a lot. Caught mostly suckers, but it was still fun. When they started logging on the other side of the slough, I couldn't wait to tell my Dad. I still recall what he said, in so many words: "Oh yeah. That's Roberts Brothers. That's one sharp outfit. They even invented a new shovel boom that may revolutionize logging". We lived on Fairway Terrace, one house from the end, right behind the late Ira Blackwell, and beside Norville Schaben, another Gyppo back then. My Dad worked for Weyerhaeuser, and Roberts Bros did some logging for him. He told me in recent years that he got so tickled with them at times because they would be rolling along fine, cranking out the logs, and the boss would say, "Hold it, let's try something different". So, they would rig up a different way, and try it that way. I'll PM you my dad's name. He is still alive. You may have heard his name mentioned now and then, depending on how old you are. Sorry, I don't have any photos, only memories. Contract Logger, aka Rusty Grapple, would be your best bet. Now, if you have some photos of Milton Benedict's yard in Monte back then, I would love to buy a few prints. I'll throw another name at you: Cecil Bignold used to punch out a lot of roads for my dad. He also did a lot of business with Friend and Rikalo, including building the original Bay City Dock. Sam Rikalo helped me to pick out a trombone when I joined the band at Central Park School. I still have it. Don't be a stranger around here. Would love to see some Roberts Bros. pics if you have some to post. Also, do you have a copy of Finley Hays' book on Saginaw Timber? There are several photos of the Roberts boys to be found there. Mr. Hays stated that he was working for one one of those gents when he topped his first tree.
Alright, in the interest of resurrecting a thread near and dear to my heart, I'll share an extremely corny joke: What did the Chinese LS108 operator say to his boss when his shovel broke down? "Linky no worky". ROFL. Sometimes I kill myself!
I'm a Roberts ancestor. I grew up hearing about the Central Park Swamp logging. My Uncles (The Roberts Brothers), my Dad, my cousins and my a couple of my brothers made up the crew. I have some old scissor boom pictures in a catalog that Ken developed to sell logging equipment.
If you have some pics of your family logging the Central Park Swamp to post, you would have a whole bunch of friends for life. Do you remember Milton Benedict's shovel yard in Monte? I LOVED that place as a kid. Seems like I remember he had a thing for Limas.
this picture is off the internet just using it as an example. there is one almost the same near sault saint marie ontario. i look at it every time i pass. its so amazing they used these machines with cables. love the old stuff wish i was around back then to see it all.
Hagara Brothers used to have one even older than that sitting out in front of their shop in Central Park, WA. There used to be another very similar machine sitting dead in a rock pit just west of Elma, WA on the main highway.
There were some gents named Roberts who worked for Saginaw Timber years ago. Finley Hays was working for someone named Roberts with Saginaw when he topped his first tree. I would love to know if these same Roberts Brothers either worked for Saginaw themselves, or had ancestors who did.
Linkbelt LS98 hiding behind a deck of logs.
I have a 1942 Bucyrus-Erie 15-B that I would like to rig for handling small logs into a museum sawmill. The time period we are depicting is pre world war II. Would a heel boom be accurate for the period? Would it be more historically accurate to use the lattice boom and end dogs? Do you have any other suggestions or ideas about how something like this might have been set up? We try to work with logs in the 12" to 24" diameter range. Thank you, Evan
maybe a heel boom without a grapple riser ?? isx