This is my first post but I have been lurking in the shadows for a while now. I have been looking for a Backhoe & came upon a 1987 Ford 555 & I have a couple of questions & this seems to be the place to ask. The engine and Tranny are in good shape. The owner had a new injector pump & injectors installed & had the fuel tank relined last year. It starts right up & the hydraulics seem strong. Cosmetically it is a mess but that is a easy fix. It needs rear tires & has a lot of rust in the cab. The floor is almost rusted out & there is rust on the walls, & the doors & glass are shot.. He really has not take care of it & needs all new grease fittings but it has no leaks that I can see but the hoses are dried. Now the bad news. Most of the pins if not all of them need replacement and it needs breaks & both steering rods & linkage needs work. The front bucket needs to be replaced & I need a wider digging bucket on the backhoe, right now it has a trenching bucket. It has no welds. I haven't even checked the lights or electrical. He wants $5000 for it but would probably take $4500. It is going to be an "around my property machine" digging out stumps & moving dirt. The property is hilly so the breaks are a must both foot breaks & hand break. I really can't do the work on the breaks or pins myself as I don't even know where to start. So my question is do you guys think it is worth getting involved with it in the condition it is in & what do you think a mechanic would charge for breaks & pins, worst case scenario labor & parts. I can do most of the small work like the grease fittings & cosmetic & rust work & the electrical work. I know this machine is a monster & it is, as you guys know one of the cheapest 1987 machines I have seen & I have been looking for a while. The location is in the Hudson Valley N.Y. Any input is greatly appreciated. Thanks Jerry
sounds about right Most of these hoes go for 9k +
Appears like it has had basically no routine/preventative maintenance ever... so I would question the tranny/engine/pump.... the pump and injectors recently were probably done just to get it to a 'running state' Sounds like an ok price if you like working on things... and have the knowledge/experience but without these it could become either a money pit or a yard ornament.
Tires, buckets, hoses & pins alone will bring the cost up around the $15,000 range is my guess but others may have a more sound opinion. On the machine repairs I've done myself is all I have to go by.
If you don't want to learn to work on it, then talk to your banker and buy what you want. It will be cheaper than hiring somebody to fix up a junker, 99 times out of 100.
The predecessor to the 555 was the 4500. In family transaction; grandfather's estate to grandson, a 4500 just sold for $4500. Triple nickel was a good machine, but a neglected 555 is a money pit. If you are in a position of paying for skill you'd do better buying a better tractor. $4500 sounds good, I'd bet the tractor will cost $10000 by the time it's in nice shape. Willie
your absolutely right after all said and done its gonna cost the same to buying an almost better 2nd hand machine. I bought a case 580c for 3500 Looked like this after about 6000 bucks it looks like this. https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=4b0c8545ea9a5100c782e1857a234dba&oe=58E1C959 lets see ring and pinion rebuilt injection pump (Pumpguysc) did this for me Paint and some other odd things I bought like the 2 extra buckets and a quick coupler . I love to work on my own stuff so it was worth it to me
That looks like a great machine there John you do good work. Thanks for all the good info guys The thing is it does sound like a money pit to me . Cheap to buy but really expensive to keep going plus I don't want to spend the time fixing it up. I just checked it out today & thought I would ask about it. My time line is I would like to have something I can start using this spring. I could buy this one & run it & it might get me a couple of years, maybe. But I would rather spend more money for a machine in better shape that is running & use it now. There seems to be a few good machines around my area but before I spend 10 or 12 G,s for one I have to be sure I didn,t miss a good $7000 one.Thanks for the advise it is well taken. I will keep you in the loop. Thanks again The Dog
Thank you lucky I made it good with this machine. Its a nice overal machine now and I can resell for what its really worth and make money on it still. Sadly this is staying with me for a very long time that is why I have it like this. It already payed for its self and I have a lot more work lined up for it already this spring where in hudson valley do you live IM in schohaire country
A good 7000 one will probably only need 2 or 3K. Get the best one you can afford - there's plenty of work to do on a good machine if you're working it. Low dollar equipment and you aren't a mechanic? - unlikely to end well.
I hear you Grady so my search continues. I think if this 555 had at least some basic maintenance & care It is something I would have bought. But I think in the last 10 years or so it was just run into the ground. At least that is how it looks. For 3 grand I would have bought it, do the brakes & run it a while. If it looked like the drive train & hydraulics were strong then I would start to rebuild it. Giovanni I am not to far from you, just outside of Kingston in Ulster Co.
oh ok your about an hour hour 30 mins away. Whats your budget Ive seen some decent cases for 5 6k
Hea Giovanni, If I could find a nice one for 6K I would be all over it but I would go to 9, 10k.
Private message me a phone number Ill text you some if I come by any . I troll CL all the dam time its a bad habbit LOL I spend to much money
Another thing to consider when looking for a machine is finding a 4x4. I rented enough machines before my purchase to realize it's essential, especially when it comes to snow removal.
I respect a guy who knows his limitations, but it's too bad you can't work on it yourself. I just bought a 480c with no brakes. The hard part was getting the floorboard out. I read the manual and watched some you-tube videos, and dove in. Come to find out, the wheel cylinders where leaking, a 25 cent o-ring in each wheel cylinder fixed that. Then it was the several hours of penetrating oil and working with all the linkages to free them up from rust. I now have the left side sticking on me, so I will take it apart again and clean up the roller/wedge assembly. It does take some patience and perseverance.
I don't think I'd want a 4x4 backhoe for under $10K if I was paying somebody to work on it. If you need it, you'll have to pay for it, but I wouldn't expect to find a decent one cheap. If you don't have hills, 2wd works fine for snow, the front tires aren't even on the ground when pushing snow.
I push snow with a 2wd machine on hills no issues. Just gotta use your head. Im going to invest into a set of chains soon tho
Being in the Catskills my property has a a lot of hills not to much flat ground. I have not been looking for a 4x4 exclusively but if the one I end up buying is a 4x4 that would be great.
4x4 will make the price range go up rapidly. All depends how much your willing to spend
My first backhoe was a two wheel drive John Deere 410. I rationalized it was plenty heavy enough to push snow without chains. One wild ride on a hill not very steep convinced me chains were an absolute necessity! Willie
I doubt I will be pushing very much snow at all, don't go to the house much when there is snow on the ground. Basically want it for the other 3 season's.
I was wondering if anyone has any knowledge or experience dealing with any of the auction sites like AuctotTime, Machinery Trader places like that. I guess other then CL & word of mouth that's about it. Or are there other backhoe sites?
Machinery Trader is not an auction site. Auctions are for gamblers. You have less opportunity to inspect before buying with auctions. It's unpredictable, prices might be great, or sell above retail. Willie
Bought my backhoe off ebay. Unless you can inspect in person I don't recommend it. I specifically asked the seller about brakes and leaks. He said all was working as it should. The tractor showed up at my place 650 miles away with no brakes, spewing hyd fluid, 4wd not working, and wouldn't run longer than 5 minutes. I had little to no recourse since I trusted the guy and wired cash. On my 575E the brakes require taking the rear axle apart. Talking 2 to 3 grand at the dealer. I am operating on fairly level ground so I can get by without 4wd and brakes. Had to fix all the other stuff to use it.
LOL...Everyone here probably remembers my story, bought my 2004 4x4 210LE from a Ritchie Auction in Sacramento CA for $12k. A guy I had inspect it onsite said it was good, Ritchie said it ran...got it home and it ran alright, with a frigg'n bad rod. Barely got it off the trailer. $10k later I have an amazing tractor but I have $25k in it and a crap load of work. There is no free lunch, BTW...I would not be without 4x4. It truly expands the capabilities of the tractor. Just compare a 2wd truck to a 4wd truck...what do you have?
WoW!!!!! You guys are trusting souls. There is no way I would pay any kind of money for a machine without me putting it through it's paces & inspecting it myself. I guess what I should have said was machines that were close enough to inspect that were going to be auctioned. Something about the same distance away from you that you might drive to see a CL machine. There might not be alot to see but it would increase what you could look at. It seems to me that a lot of machines on the auction sites want you to come and inspect anyway. You make the arraignments, go & test it, if it looks good you bid. Basically the same thing you would do through a private sale. Plus a lot of these machines are for sale at the inspection site you might be able to negotiate a deal right there. Might be a bit of running around but we are not talking chump change here.
What you can inspect at an auction site or most places where a piece of equipment is for sale is just the basics and while you may be able to tell the difference between an exhaust leak and a noisy valve if you are an experienced mechanic, that isn't always the case - ask Plongson. Many serious problems don't show up until the machine is worked for a while at operating temp - something you just can't do in most cases. I'd still want to check it out and look the guy in the eye when he tells me how great a machine it is.
HA, That's funny you should say that Grady about an exhaust leak. I had been looking for a 4x4 skip loader for quite a while (Case, JD, Cat). Backhoe's are like on every corner but I needed a skip, and they are just hard to find around here. They also tend to bring more than I was willing to pay at auctions for the condition and I kept losing out. The Ritchie Sacramento auction tends to have quite a few, I believe because of the agricultural application. I had a guy I had met at previous auctions that was going to be at the Sac auction and he offered to look at a machine I was interested in. He said it sounded OK but it had a bad exhaust leak. All else looked fine, hydraulics, transmission, wear points...So I bid, and to my amazement, I won the bid...at an amazing price. A week later the truck arrives, I start it up and it's hammering so bad my wife jumped back thinking something was going to escape the engine block at a high rate of speed...LOL...so much for an exhaust leak. Well, with a new engine the tractor is AMAZING. The guy that inspected the machine was at least correct on the condition of the rest of the tractor. It's still worth more than what I have in it, but I did all the wrenching myself...you HAVE TO, else wise you will be so underwater you'll never catch a breath. The lesson learned is, there is no free lunch with a tractor. You get what you pay for and if it's too good to be true...bet on it being too good to be true. You might hit Mega-Bucks on a good tractor for cheap, but it's a LONG bet. A good rule of thumb is..."The more you spend on a tractor, the less you will have to work on it"
I know buying at a auction is risky, because I have seen the stuff sent there by the places I work at. I remember a decent John Deere backhoe we had at a place I worked at several years ago. Ran fine except it got coolant in the oil over time. It was probably a o-ring on a cylinder sleeve leaking or something like that, but the mechanic didn't want to mess with it, they told the brass they needed a new one and the old one got sent to the auction with no hint as to anything being wrong with it. A guy I used to work with bought a loader/dozer from a auction, everything looked fine, everything worked fine, till he used it for a couple of hours. Then it would not move. Pulled the filter out of the tranny, all clogged up with paper looking stuff. Cleaned it out, everything was fine again for another day or so, then it did it again. Come to find out the clutch material in the tranny is flaking off and keeps clogging the filter up. So it's now a $12000 yard ornament till he decides what to do with it.
^1+ for everything. I've seen a outfit steam clean the chunks out of a bad final on a Hitachi excavator, refilled it with fresh oil, and set it on the lowboy headed for RB. It'd move back and forth 10 feet like a normal person would try out at the auction yard, but it was going to be expensive at about 11 feet. A down right dirt, rotten, filthy thing to do, but it gets done every day of the week. Buyer beware. Greyson
So I am wondering, honestly how many of you guys have bought a machine that you actually sat on and ran for 3 or 4 hours and dug holes & took out a stump & moved 10 yds of dift from here to there before you bought it?
Prolly...not many. Sometimes ya just gott'a go with your instincts and hope for the best, and hope the gremlin's are busy elsewhere...
Rev a machine up to 1500 rpm or so check all the hydraulics by pulling all the levers until they bypass then run the machine up to some thing solid and see it it will spin the tires in 1st and 2nd this would help some one with out a lot of experience check a few things out in a short period of time. I'm not that great on explaining much but others here have lots of good advice.
I haven't. Same with cars, I've done a ten minute test drive and an hour inspection and taken the whole picture together. I've bought stuff at auction when I knew nothing like some of the previous examples, I've bought stuff at (even junk consignment) auctions where I knew the honest seller, and sometimes you can get a pretty good feel for something. I didn't bid, maybe should have but didn't really need it, on an old air compressor, it was almost all original and the few parts that had been replaced over the last 50 odd years were laying in the trays. The oil change hours were written in marker on the hood indicating it had been used relatively regularly right up until the owner got sick. It was a beautiful evenly weathered dusty machine with no huge oily spots and no too clean spots. A dead battery so you're just going by looks, but that's a lower risk than a "clean"/pressure washed/spray can rebuild machine at a consignment sale. And old cast iron is just way more durable than new hydraulic pumps and power shift clutches. Your ideal seller is a retired guy who bought that Ford new in 85, and doesn't have a use for it anymore, even if it has a lot of hours and hasn't run in five years, you can usually believe the story. Next best seller would be a govt machine where you can call the guys that ran it, they'll tell you what's up, unless they're planning to bid themselves and that's not nearly as common as you'd think. Plenty of businesses sell direct too, and they have their reputation to be concerned about so a contractor getting rid of a old backhoe isn't a bad way to buy. They have a legitimate reason to sell it, it's obsolete. In the northern tier of states, consumer protection laws are more strict than further south, selling in person usually carries some legal protection, that you shouldn't expect to use, but will keep a halfway reputable seller from scamming you, there's still outright thieves out there that don't care. That consumer protection doesn't apply to any consignment sale I've seen, pressure washing it and sending it to the sale is the norm, the market decides what it's worth based on no promises from the seller.
No. I bought a John Deere 410 the day after an auction. A dealer bought it from a local farmer at auction. I bought from the dealer. I went and asked the farmer about it. He replied that it was a good machine with excellent brakes. Believing him, I paid $7000. I never made it home. It leaked pretty bad from someplace in the mid section. To get home, a friend who happened to sell oil came along seconds after it failed to move. The tractor looked very good, had minimal wear to backhoe, and loader. The seat looked good, it had no welds anywhere. First dig was great for the first 15 minutes, then the hoe lost power. It'd barely lift the empty bucket. The loader was painfully slow. I wasn't all that concerned, there was a dealer 25 miles away. They'd know what was wrong. That's when I discovered John Deere had closed all the local dealers. My nearest dealer was 80 miles away. They'd send a mechanic. Estimated cost to diagnose was $1500. They couldn't promise to diagnose in one day. This of course wouldn't include a repair. Ultimately, lots of time and energy was wasted trying to find a mechanic who understood JD hydraulics. Ultimately, somebody suggested an infrared camera. Oil was flowing where it shouldn't. Ultimately it proved to be a bad backhoe valve. New Hampshire Hydraulics believed the valve had been defective new. Parts were unavailable. A new aftermarket valve was available at a reasonable cost. Then the joystick controls weren't the required width. With all the bugs worked out, I sold it for $12000. I replaced the machine with a beater Case 580K. It was in use daily, but rough. I paid $13000. We replaced a lot of bushings, seals, pins, hoses, gaskets, and bearings. We cleaned it up, and painted it. Sold it for $17000. I had a chance to buy a near twin 580K that had been given lots of TLC for $17000. It had third loader valve, a big plus for me, but no extend a hoe. The bad news was three lever, foot swing control. I couldn't get used to it, so I switched controls, and dipper from one tractor to another. I'm a good mechanic, welder, and master electrician. My son is more of a mechanic than I. I can justify some repairs as costing less than paying a professional. If I had to hire all this, it'd bankrupt me. Willie
Delmer I think you hit the nail on the head. I was not trying to be a smart ass just a realist. Basically it is a gut feeling thing. Even at an auction I still would not buy a machine without at least talking to somebody who is selling it and inspecting it no matter how little' I want to look some one in the eye just to get a feel if he is lying & to go ask him about this leak or the smoke coming from the the rear tire or the dry grease fittings. I can,t say I was always right but it gives you a feeling in your gut. This way when you get it home & it will not move or start and you start to puke as your wife plants flowers around it that gut feeling turns to a deep burning sensation in your ass hole as the blood starts to flow out.
The 555 is/was a well engineered hoe with a lot of breakout force for its size. The good reputation is evidenced by many city maint dept's and DOT having had them in the fleet. Many good posts in this thread regarding cheap iron; if it is inexpensive there will be gremlins to chase for sure. Heck a rear tire will run past$650 too. But older machinery is easier to work on for those of us working in a home shop or barn and yard with limited equip lacking state of the art diagnostic computer gizmo's etc..
My CL story: I saw an ad " rusty but trusty Ford 4500 for sale" on my local CL classified site. I called seller on a Sunday and He said come and get it while you can 3 other people are on their way(typical B.S.) seller tells me it just needs a new battery to run and some paint to look decent yet he was too busy with other projects to mess with it. I hastily paid asking price and had it towed to my yard. Drained the oilpan to find a watery fluid then realized tractor had sat out for years with water collecting in exhaust pipe and down into manifold and beyond then freezing and thawing . I bought a used 3 cyl diesel engine when I had it split I noticed the torque converter was damaged(probably why it was parked) new starter motor, filters and oh yes that new battery and now I have a decent 4500 TLB. I got suckered and salvaging my pride was the biggest motivator to get the work done . I never could have paid to have it done and it probably would not be worth it either!
Besides pride, it's nice to know how the repair was actually done. I have equipment with engines and transmissions I've personally rebuild, so I know for a fact clutch packs got new retaining rings, I looked at every scratch on the main journals, Bearing got preloaded to spec, etc. Then when you jump on it, you feel a little more comfortable knowing that there's not some hack repaired drivetrain in it (or at least knowing I'm the hack that turned the wrenches). Greyson
I am really starting to get cold feet. Is there any body out there with a story that goes" I bought this used 30 year old backhoe the guy I bought it from said there are a a few leaks and needing new brakes but she runs really good. So I fixed the brakes & leaks & other then normal maint. & a few small repairs & new hydro. pump & tires it has ran good for the past 4 years since I bought it." This really sounds like a big floating crap game.
I have heard stories like that from people.... however knowing the people are the kind that wouldn't tell you if they got hosed but they always tell you the stories about the killer deals they get. Unless you get really lucky and are in the right place at the right time... the best thing you can do is keep on researching as it will put you in a better place to make a good informed decision that could save you from a lot of heartburn later. I am sure there are good deal still out there from time to time... the trick is beating the professional 'equipment flippers' out because there is big money to be made by snatching up grandpa's low hour pride and joy so they just slap some new paint on it and triple the price.
1st backhoe 1974 580 B paid $6000.00 sight unseen for a guy in a coffee shop told him to deliver it and I'd buy it. Used it to develop my property as I learned to run it. Put $6,000 into it over that time ( new rear end had done by a shop) the other little things I did myself. Sold it for $12,000. 2nd one 1981 580 C paid $10,000 used it 5 years made a few bucks with it ( approx. $40,000 a year on the side as I was a carpenter in summer and logger in winter). Dropped a valve replace the head and piston myself ( gaskets, rebuilt head and piston $600) got $17,000 for a trade in on a 580 Ck 4x4 extenda hoe with $10,000 so $27,000. Probably put a few thou. into it over the years i had it ( hoses, seals,tires) sold it for $30,000 and bought a 2004 580 SM for $52,000 in 2006 which I'm still using. I sold every machine in better shape than I received them and they all had over 12 to 15,000 hrs on them. I wish I had of bought a backhoe years earlier than I did. Along the way there were numerous repairs I haven't mentioned but nothing major. The last 2 I've been making a pretty good living with so they earn their keep.
Since there are no guarantees on used equipment - unless you buy from a dealer, in which case you will pay dearly for it - it is a gamble and the more you know about what you're looking at, the better you will probably make out but still no guarantee of that. Life is full of risk and if you don't have the stomach for it you can either rent a machine or just call someone who has the equipment to do what you need done. Those "outrageous" prices charged by contractors become more understandable once you've owned your own machine. Just ask yourself how much you'd want to do the same job. If you don't plan on doing most of your own maintenance and repair work, it's hard to see how a more than lightly used machine makes sense - unless you have an indentured equipment mechanic at your disposal. Playing trucks can be an expensive hobby. It's been my experience that if you work it - you'll break it - and the older the machine, the sooner and more often - but except for that.... Roll the dice and good luck.
A good Inspection should tell you if the machine is healthy or not
When you go to an auction, it's safer to buy a machine that's part of a huge lot being sold by a large company rather than a single piece being sold individually because large lots are being sold because of bankruptcy, pending bankruptcy or some other kind of financial reorganization. A single piece can be that someone is getting rid of a mechanical problem. I bought an old cat skid steer that had the hour meter missing, which is generally a bright red flag, but it was sold as part of a huge lot by a big company in distress and turned out to be a pretty good cheap skid steer. If the engine oil is fresh and the belly pan is clean, it could be indicative of a doctored up crankshaft or some other lower end issue. Often sellers will do a routine oil change and find trouble and decide it's a good time to upgrade. You just have to put yourself in their shoes and figure out if that's probable. When I bought a 26 year old excavator at Ritchie Bros last summer, I brought along an allen wrench to check the oil in the finals, drained a little on a napkin, looking for metal particles. Got lucky again. Guys buying machines to work their own property need equipment that's easily and cheaply serviced, usually by themselves. Instead of buying an electronically complex machine with an air conditioned cab, they gamble on ragged machines at 15% of new price or less. If you can buy a machine for $10K and put 300 hours on it and then sell it a few years later for $10K, you have saved yourself a ton of money but it wasn't risk free or stress free.
Don't you wish these machines could talk and you could walk right up to them and they would tell you what is wrong? We need a backhoe whisperer. The one place I worked at that got rid of the backhoe with the leak in the engine oil, they had rules, none of the employees could bid on anything over $500. They had a big stink years ago, the mechanics in one of the shops elsewhere where sabotaging the equipment, it was taken out of service and sent to auction, and then they would buy it, fix something simple they did to make it not run, and then sell it for a nice profit. They got caught, thus the $500 rule. Of course they probably still get a "friend" to buy it for them. Another problem; Some people genuinely think a machine is ok when it's really not. If it makes a noise or does something else weird, as long as it keeps running and digs, they don't worry about it.
Luckydogs new machine next to mine Overall a nice machine needs some work but I will be taking care of that for him. Inspection went great and its at my place safely.
I've never figured out the picture thing, but my 580K is a great machine. I paid 17000 10 years ago. It is four wheel drive, had I think 2900 hours. I converted it to John Deere controls, and added extend a hoe, and thumb. I've replaced some parts, but the single most expensive thing was a torque converter seal the dealer replaced for 1000. Now, it's just shy of 5000 hours. Much of that time is patiently waiting for me to weld something. I used to turn everything I welded to be in position. Lately, I just adjust height. As I age, I find it hard to see if I can't get my head the correct distance from weld. I joke that I use it for everything, including dentistry. Willie
Sorry it took me so long to report on my new purchase but I just got back from upstate NY and didn't have a internet connection where I was. So after looking for about 8 months I finally bought my first backhoe. As Giovannix12 said a pretty good machine. It is a Case 580 Super E with 4in1 front and extendahoe. Its been used but not abused. Giovanni & His Dad came & checked it out for me & did a great job. They went over it front to back & top to bottom. It is now at G mans house and he is going to do a few things on it for me. G is a young man who has been around heavy equipment since he is 10 years old & his father has forgot more about machines then I will ever know, so when Giovanni says it is in good hands believe me it is. Between myself & G man we will keep you posted on the progress. Stay tuned.