Being new to this world of earth moving equipment I bought my 1988 John Deere 310c Backhoe with 9900 hours on it not knowing what the life expectancy will be on the engine. If you can please tell me an ear full on what I should keep doing and what to maybe expect to keep an eye on would be great... and whats the highest hours you've seen or heard about on this type of machine's engine... I should have asked some people first before buying it about the hours and what to look for...., but I went on my experence knowing what a tired worn out engine sounds and looks like in cars and light trucks... I have to say out of all the used backhoes I looked at this one I bought the engine sounds very tight and solid, no noise coming from it at all, its a smooth well running engine and I'm very happy with the way it sounds and the color of the smoke and the amount of smoke coming out of it... I hate it when someone says they just rebuilt an engine and all you hear is a bunch of claddering and clacking, I don't know if thats normal, but I wont buy it when I hear that noise, and that I know there are the same engines out there that are very quite... I hope the air filters being brand new is not a heads up for piston blow by? it was dusty in there not like oil was wiped out of the air filter housing, and so far I ran it a little and they are still dry... So I'd love to hear what you guys can tell me, like the engine will last for another 9900 hours if I keep changing the oil and antifreeze...
If that's the original engine, and if it's been well maintained and well operated, it could go any minute now, or it might last another 5000 hours. Depends on a lot of factors from the past, and what you do with it in the future. JD engines are well designed and manufactured, but at 9900 hours, this one is right on the upper limit of the scale. Best bet is for you to do some oil sampling. Watch for wear metals, silicon, especially glycol. These engines are known for losing liner seals and also liner pitting. Look for excessive fuel in the oil, another area that Deere's are known to have trouble with. Good Luck.
When we evaluate trade-ins, we write off anything with over 8,000 hours as needing an engine. Doesn't ussually happen, but we allow money for it in the trade.
To reasure you a little, there are two Deere's in my best friend's fleet. The 310C has been used and abused by many, and is pushing 14,000 hours, the 310D has had a better life, and is running satisfactorily at 13,000 hours. The 310D is a turbo, the 310C is naturally aspirated. My own 310C has about half the hours of yours - I take comfort in your report. I work in forestry, and one of our veneer cutters has a 440 Deere skidder he calls the "Pony". It uses basically the same engine, and he sent it in for a Deere rebuild at 24,000 hours, figuring it should get done before something lets go and ruins the block or crank. (He kept that number quiet, because he did not want to get his logging rate cut by those figuring a machine only lasts 10,000 hours). Also, tree slashers often use Cat, Cummins and Deere 4 cylinder engines to run them. They almost always see 20,000 plus hours. That is due, in my opinion, to them running hydraulic pumps at a constant speed day in and day out. Not a lot of throttling, or shock loads, or dirt for that matter. Again, I hope this helps. John
Thanks for the information.... it helps a lot... Id like to share my experence on a little bit of what I was going thru looking for a used least expensive backhoe thats overall in fair and decent shape, something worth buying and putting a little money into it making it a great machine to own for a good while, and thats what I like to think I did after you hear what I was going thru looking for a backhoe over hear in CT. :Banghead Well to start out with the pickings for a least expensive good used backhoe are so bad over here in the CT area I was getting desperate after looking at about the 15th used backhoe, and that number does not include the 25 honest people I talked with over the phone first about what shape their backhoe was in so not to waste my time driving over to see it... And all these people wanted around the $8500.00 mark give or take for obvious junk beyond repair, to $13,000.00 for a backhoe that needed at the least another $8000.00 of work to fix major things like hydraulics, steering, etc... and they all felt were worth every penny for them and would not budge that much in price, some not at all.... but I'm not one to point out to them why their backhoe's were not worth it because I did my homework and priced out everything it needed to "just" get them to work safely to do the job they were built to do, but they were really junk, and that the few of them I looked at were worth what you can get for their parts and the rest what you can get in scrap metal.... Now this is what I found wrong on all different kinds of backhoe models and brands, like Case, Cat, JD, etc... it was not only the JD310's....... AND THIS IS WHAT I HAD TO FIND OUT ON MY OWN BECAUSE THEY DID NOT DISCLOSE THE SERIOUS PROBLEMS UNTIL I SHOWED THEM. Now I understand when someone is selling a unit for lets say $8500.00 and its got some serious problems, and they say this machine is worth $18500.00 in good shape, I can understand that, but I've been there done that and the dollars never fell in my favor, I would end up spending a total of $27000.00. I'm talking the hoe arm at the base that connects to the swing frame on one unit was cracked just about all the way thru at the bottom making that situation ready to kill someone standing near when being used...., the hydraulics on one another was so messed up it needed a fortune in part to get it to work the right way because the metal flowing thru it took out everything from the prior pump blowing up...., on another backhoe the oil was heating up and all the hydraulics were hard to control, I didn't know what that was about.... and this other guy started his backhoe about two hours before I went to see it because the hydraulic system would not work until the fluid was hot.... Every one I seen the people had started it prior to coming out, and even with most after running for a while the engine was skipping and didn't sound good... another unit where the top arms to to loader bucket where they mount to the frame that comes up off the body had such stress cracks all over the guy said he never knew it was like that.. oh the list goes on with major things wrong with machines they all felt were worth too much... is this like that all over? I don't think it is? I swear I was going nuts looking at such obvious junk.... and over the phone they were saying different.... now I was willing to get one of them junkers for lets say 1000.00 then I'll baby it along fixing what I can with out spending much on it knowing when to stop fixing it, but not with these people, they all felt they had gold.... So I paid $15500.00 for mine and feel I can get just about all of what I spend on mine when I sell it... I base that on with what I've been thru out there, but then I'd hate to hear I didn't talk to the right people... but so far I spent another $1500.00 on it and thats for many hydraulic lines and all synthetic oil for the engine and hydraulic system, I put Amsoil in it thats suppose to be the best and is not sold in stores, only thru distributors which is what I became to just get it cheaper... So has anybody have a similar experence?
Been there. I looked for a good used backhoe in the $20,000 range for over a year. I finally realized that most people who use a backhoe are commercial users and usually use one until it is about worn out before replacing it. I finally ended up buying a one year old New Holland LB75B with 240 hours from a farmer for $32,000. It wasn't my preferred brand and was $12,000 over my budget but at least there was nothing wrong with it. So far I have not regretted my decision.
Yes, Joe. My first backhoe in 1992 was a must-have thing that youth makes you want badly while being blind to its faults. (we do that with women too, but that would be another thread). It was a JD 410B 4x4 with 6,600 hours running a hoe ram. It had a 4-in-1 bucket, and I think that is what caught my eye. Anyway, it was basically sound, but the hoe had almost 2 feet of side-to-side slop, the front axle U-joints were shot, and the front loader arms were cracked, I think from holding the machine up during hoe ramming. I kept that only 3 months, having my eyes opened up for me. Then, I shopped some more. I came home with a 1986 Case 580 E. Lots of hours, but original and in decent shape. I welded in a cutting edge, did a complete service, new teeth, new tires and away I went for almost the next three years. It was actually a great little hoe. I still prefer it for fine grading to my JD. An opportunity in British Columbia saw me sell that one in 1995. The next owner did have trouble with it - cracked swing cylinders, cab rust, and an operator who didn't check the oil - scratch one 4 cylinder Cummins. Then, when I got back here from my BC opportunity, I started to shop again. A bachkoe is like having 4-wheel drive on your pickup - once you have it, you will never be without again. Well, in 1997, they were pretty darn scarce here, expensive, and, like you found out, mostly junk. The 310C I bought was bought over the phone. I did have my father give it the once-over while on vacation near where it was for sale. It had been a long-term least to Ontario Hydro, was maintained by the Deere dealer, and didn't have a pile of hours on it. It also is only a standard hoe, something of a rarity here, so there was not a line of people waiting to buy it. Anyway, I sent a float to bring it back, bring back the other 2 buckets plus a frost ripper, put new tires on it, another full service, and minor things, and it has been OK. There is lots of junk out there, and almost as many forgetful sellers too. You don't have anyone to justify your purchase to except yourself (and un-said women, that's still that other story ). Service it, fix what needs fixing, and don't be afraid to pull hard on the levers. John
This is what I ended up doing, I only wanted to spend up to 10K, I'm now into it for 17K and I still needs to address the brake chatter, no way I'm having that done by someone, I'm going to do it... other than that its a great machine... oh yeah, now I see the swing arm pistons are sweating a tiny bit..
Good for you John, thats the way I learned too, I spent my hard earned $800 on my first car at 16 years old that should of went to the junk yard... Your so right John, I stopped justifying what I do a long time ago to anyone, what I bought was the best situation I had to work with at that moment, but of course the best way to buy anything is to not need it at the moment, but make sure you will retire what its going to replace eventually... I have one regret tho, I wished I picked up on some more of the worn out hyd lines and what ever else was wrong, like the brake chatter being real bad so to use the problems more as a bargaining chip in price, but you know how it is with some guys knowing the business, and always have something to say knocking me down when I point out the problems, they say "go and buy a new one for 120K if you want one brand new".... I wish I knew a come back for that and every time I tried to get him to lower the price from 15K he kept saying that he thinks he has it listed for more than 15K and would have to check.... after I did see on his computer he did have it listed for 18.5K for sale, but that could have been a sales tactic, but anyway he was like hitting a brick wall on anything I said, he was like go away if you don't want it because my stuff sells, and get this, we have competition with over seas, this guy sells all the good used equipment he scouts for to exporters, and they go right down to the docks and get loaded right on the boat so fast its crazy, this is why anybody thats trying to find a nice what ever it be go down to the docks and waive good by, because it was just sold for 3 times of what you would pay for it, and I seen this is the same for cars and light trucks .... and this guy I bought my hoe from is someone who sells billions of dollars of equipment each year, so I guess he knew the one I bought would sell for 15K.... but I did get to split the cost of new rear tires for 15.5K and delivered... Since my tired old butt is so worn out and tired of fixing things on my back I was not going to lay under the machine and reach up there to replace all the hyd lines behind the seat that work the hoe, so I took out the seat and floor section and all the hyd lines were all right there :notworthy that was nice... So it makes sense to fix it up inside, I'm painting the floor since the out side has been painted up nice... lever boots, etc... :drinkup I have to say when I get done with the brake chatter this is going to be the greatest 1988 JD 310c Backhoe for someone who wants to buy something, get in it and work.... so I'll take a guess that its got to be worth lets say 20K to someone who wants a nice looking great running backhoe with a heated cab, nice paint everything in sound shape :beatsme
You still have that brake chatter problem?
I pretty sure he still does. My machine has it too, but I'm not overly concerned at this point. I'm interested though in anything you could share to minimize the chatter. John
Did you change your oil yet?
Sorry about the gap in posting back.......... I still have the chatter, not like it was at first, where when ever I stepped on the brake going slow or fast it was bad. Since then I've changed the hydraulic fluid 3 times, when I first changed it with the cheap $30 bucket from Sam's Club I noticed a difference, it was a little better, so I ran it for a while then changed it again with Sam's Club hyd. fluid, it seemed better but was still not good. So the 3rd time I changed the hyd. fluid I put in AMSOIL ATH Fluid which is suppose to be the best out there, so after running it for a while its gotten better but this is where I'm at... when I'm going 2 to 5 mph down a little hill I can moderately apply the brake and it don't chatter as I'm slowing down, its when I'm just coming to the complete stop it chatters a lot, but no where as bad as when I'm using the loader bucket and I have to be heavy on the brake , like as I'm going back and forth where its necessary to hold your mark so you don't bump into anything or miss your mark, and I'm heavy on the brake so not to slide backwards, its chattering really loud and is just not right.... I know in most cases like in cars being I worked on cars for over 30 years you will get brake growl thats normal, but this is flat out teeth rattling chatter... But I believe it should get better in time with AMSOIL??? I think?? and I'm worried about putting in possy slip additive because of its unknown affects on the main hyd pump being all the hyd fluid eventually meets up thru the filter and its design.... I don't know if its because its gotten pretty hot out now around 100º in the shade, or its because I just put in AMSOIL and it might not be up to par, that I'm hearing the hyd fluid making noise as I work the loader, like the fluid is too hot as it passes thru the valve and its making that high pitch squeal, it never use to do this before, but then it was cooler before.... I'd like to see if I can put in another fluid cooler somewhere?? And last to mention I might start a new post on my stabilizers, the right one makes noise like it needs oil in the joints, but I'm hearing that squeaking coming from the control arm and valve as I work the levers, and now that its hot out the left one is making the same noise.... so I wonder why when it was cool out the right control valve for the stabilizer was making that squeak noise? at first I thought the arm it self needed to be lubed that how much it sounded like a dry squeak...
Just run John Deere Hygard, your brake chatter sounds like it isn't going away any time soon. I think its time to pull those axles out, I am thinking there was some kind of failure at one time and their is metal in beaded into the disks. Before you drain your current oil get a oil sample kit and send it out. If you don't have access to a kit or where to send it let me know and I will send you one for whatever they cost these days. You just drop it in the mail and they can send you results. Your other problems sound oil related, so I would work on getting your chatter fixed first and go from there.
What a disappointment to have put in what I thought was the best hyd fluid ever made (AMSOIL ATH) and to now start hearing a noise from the loader hydraulics, and its not because the fluid is too hot from the weather... I'd like to run it a little longer with AMSOIL to see if the brake chatter gets better, but don't know if I can damage the hydraulics while they are squealing, sounds like that high pitch squeal as the fluid passes thru the valve as I raise and lower the loader bucket.... almost like the sound when the oil is being pumped into your furnace oil tank, and you hear that high pitch tune squealing as your oil tank is being filled... it never did that before even with the cheap $30.00 a bucket fluid from Sam's Club... I will put in the JD Hygard hyd fluid soon, but I wanted to run this AMSOIL a little longer, but I'm wondering if I can damage something with the noise from the loader hydraulics by doing that, I'd like to give it a little more run time to see if it keeps getting better, because I'm happy with the results of being able to go down my driveway thats a slight hill and ride the brake with out any chatter, I feel like I want to keep doing that just in case this AMSOIL ATH fluid will seep in the brake disc and things will get better.... wishful thinking anyway... What are some of the things having the oil sampled will tell me? thanks....
Expected Hours Out of an Engine Would love to hear from the Deere Factory Dealers on this one. The thread seemed to digress into other ancillary topics. How many hours does the OEM affiliated Dealer feel that an engine should last, if maintained under the recommended PM schedule, by a factory authorized Dealer? :beatsme
We are basically looking for any type of metal in the oil above normal levels. These will tell us if we are getting contamination that is causing all your little problems. I would do some cycle times to get a feel for the pump performance also. Your noise in the control valve may be caused by some contamination stuck in an orifice. Amsoil is an great oil, but really isn't necessary in this machine. John Deere is the best product to run for this machine and should be a little less, should be....
Thanks.... I'll get that oil looked at soon... I almost feel like calling the prior owner and ask what was the oil he was using.... the guy I got it from bought it from auction and it came with the service file....
It doesn't really matter what oil they used at this point. The service history records would be nice, you can also find out what dealer it was taken to then call up and have the records printed out.
i have on my mf965 1994 28.000 hours and the engine sounds very good, i used STOU engine oil and didn't have any problems...except with the injection
We have a cat 950f with 30 000 hrs. It's the yard loader, everyone runs it, some of them shouldn't. Power is getting low but still starts and runs well. Burns little oil. AK
Where is the best place to get these "oil sample" kits and does it matter how many hours are on the oil when sent in? I just changed my oil, LOL. thanks guys, awesome site!!
Wet brake noise Run the Deere oil. It has a additive for wet brake systems. I have seen the same problem happen on the Deere wheel loaders before. You my also have glazed the brake disk and piston from over the years of use. If you notice a change in the noise just from changing the oil then I would not think you have a worn out brake disk. I have not seen many worn out disks in my 14 years with Deere equipment repairs. Not saying it couldn't be worn out but doubtful. Try unlocking the brake pedals and just brake with one or the other brake and see if the sound is only in one or the other brake disk. If the brake lines are installed correct the right pedal controls the right brake.
hello, cant help jumping in because im currently negotiating on a jd 310G.The tractor is great ,(1400 hrs) except for the same brake chatter mentioned here.I dont know if I should buy or pass it up.I have other equip with wet brakes and have never had this issue.
industry average backhoe engine life According to our research with Construction Equipment readers, the average 14-foot backhoe loader engine lasts 8,500 hours. The typical range (80 percent of experience) extends from about 7,000 to 12,000 hours. These are average numbers -- reports of use from everyone from owner/operators to multinational construction giants. For a story about backhoe component life, read Contractors Report Real Backhoe and ADT Life Best, Larry
I figured I keep everyone up to date about my brake chatter..... So far I'm happy with the way things have turned out..... I did nothing but change the fluid a few times, no additive, and the brake chatter went from the worst chatter ever from the softest touch of the brake peddle to now I can glide along and moderately applying the brake peddle with out any chatter, I still get the chatter but only when I'm slowing to a stop which is not bad, and a little harder on the pedal creeping along I get chatter, and at the last second of a long moderately brake application..... I think the machine is okay now because of hearing some chatter is normal.... Now at least when I go to sell it at some point the guy won't go running to his truck... Oh yeah, I did adjust the three allen head set screws on each side of the axle, the piston stop screws that level off the brake disc to the piston when hitting the brakes, but it didn't look like any of them were way off, but of course they may have been off a little being were talking very little tolerances not noticeable to the eye? So not sure if that made a difference in the way of creating a better or another contact surface, like backing and easing up on the hot spots between the brake disc and piston...
brake chatter One thing I've seen from working on customers equipment is that the help will get plain hyd fluid and not the UTH because it is cheaper or don't know better.Was this machine a 1 owner operator and did his own maintainence?It's possible someone used AW32 or AW68 in the tranny/rear end not knowing it doesn't have the wet brake additives that a common sump oil like UTH has.I've been to farms where the help was using the wrong oil in the equipment.I had to replace the brakes on a ** tractor because they were seized.When I pulled the axle apart some of the brake friction material came off the disc and was packed up between the plates.When you changed the hyd filter was there any bits and pieces or metalic sediment in the filter housing?I also became an Amsoil dealer and use their products in just about everything with no problems.It's possible the Amsoil being a superior product may have stirred up some sediment.I've changed plenty of hyd oil and filters over the years and sometimes when a cover has been removed you can see sediment laying on the bottom,in nooks and crannys and doesn't drain out.As far as engine life goes be sure to use a coolant conditioner to keep the liners from pitting.I've replaced a few of them over the years also with pin holes in them right above the lower O rings.You'll know if that happens,coolant will end up in the oil and the engine will run hot because the radiator level will drop.Also when you see the vent tube breathing like a steam engine you'll need at least a set of rings.
To touch on some of what your saying I did get the file with the history on this machine since it was put in service, it was a one owner unit and maintained very well according to the records. I even called the service company and asked what he used for oil/fluid being the backhoe runs great with 9K hours, he said they used Castrol for everything. Since I started getting all my oil/fluids at the JD dealer things seem okay. I did get the coolant additive for the electrolysis along with new antifreeze thats pre-mixed at the JD dealer..... When I was looking at used machines I seen that a unit owned by a private do-it-your-selfer rather than a unit owned and maintained by a business is where I seen the difference in how it was kept up, it looked to me that a private owner uses all the wrong oil, fluids & antifreeze at the bargain stores buying the cheapest fluids out there that often don't meet vehicle requirements, where a unit maintained by a pro using the correct fluids the machine was in great shape.