Hey guys, first time posting. I just got an emulator for DPF system on my 2015 Cat 259d and i am looking for the ECM wiring schematic. I'm trying to tie into Pin EB37, EB17, the GND and +15 terminal (ignition signal) Thanks in advance!!
Welcome to HEF brandon ! The CAT Guru's will need the machine serial. number to get you the proper information.
Yep just for kicks I checked on SIS and see there are 9 different S/N prefixes and who knows how many variations in each of those!
Hey guys sorry, here is the serial number CAT0259DCFTL03621 Thanks!!
Is the moficiation you want to instal somehow related to defeating a mandatory emissions-control device.? It sounds very much like it to me.
Schematic?
yes installing an emulator. machine has 1600 hrs and DPF is already clogged. Cat wants 20 hrs labor and $4k for new filter. It's an off road machine so i didn't think it was mandatory. Figured it was just something cat wanted to bless us with from the factory haha
Off road has to follow pretty much the same rules as on road now.
the manufacturers have to follow the same rules i know but the consumer has to as well?
If you get caught by the wrong person it could be very bad. If it ever goes back to the Cat dealer there's a possibility the EPA will find out.
oh i hear ya. My cat dealer said they don't blame me if i do a delete because of how outrageous the costs are. For the cost of replacing the filter one time, i can buy Cat ET and a scan tool. They told me at cat that it isn't illegal if it is for off road use only here in kansas but that they won't be able to do any DPF work on it if it is deleted.. I'm sure other states are different but i also did my own research last night and i came up with the same conclusion.
There are specific EPA regulations for what are referred to as "non-road engines". They are out there on the interweb. I'm sure yours falls into that category but if you choose to believe otherwise then knock yourself out.
Isn't there a factory scheduled service interval on the DPF on that engine? I think it is 3000hrs, but if you idle a lot or use other poor operating practices it will plug up sooner.
i don't know what to believe any more. I just know that an $8400 DPF filter job on my machine that has 1600 hrs is just short of highway robbery.. I guess worse case i'll have to buy a good scan tool and buy ET and fix it myself. Which i can get both for cheaper than what cat wants to replace the filter one time. Which obviously replacing the filter is just to get by for another couple thousand hours and then do it all over again..... The emulator was $780 shipped and i'm going to cut the DPF out which doesn't involve pulling the motor, and then straight pipe it. As if EGR's weren't enough to hit us in the pocket book before, now all this stuff. Not trying to sound like a complainer, i use these machines daily to make money and i'm already absorbing labor costs to try and alleviate some of the costs to beat the competition. A lot of my customers just can't afford to get any work done
yes cat said 3000 hours was the service interval on my 74hp machines. The tech that came out said he see's them go around the 2000 hr mark a lot. They get used for grade work, occasionally loading a truck and demo jobs. I do a lot of smaller jobs and as soon as a job is done, they get loaded up and on to the next one. So i wouldn't say that they set and idle for an excessive amount of time.
Is there a way to clean the dpf and then reset the software yourself? You know, keep the machine legal? You’re still having to do the work or removing it, might as well try to do it right
No there isn’t, unless you have ET. And I think I’m correct in saying it has I be a dealer version of ET as well because that’s the version with all the bells & whistles.
The thing is, to remove the DPF, the engine has to be pulled. You would think that it could be taken out easier than that but cat wants 20 hrs labor and $4k for the filter job. They said the machine stopped going into regen because it will only cycle so many times before it throws the code for the filter being clogged. If i do the delete, i can cut the old DPF out and won't have to remove the engine. Then straight pipe it. The emulator will tell the ecm that the pressure and temps in the DPF are within range and the alarms will go away. I'm obviously no expert, this is the just of what i have found with my research.. I figured worst case. I'll spend about $7k on cat's ET software and an adaptor for my laptop to cat 9 pin
Yes the guy i spoke to locally who does the all out tuning, said that if the alarms won't go away from the emulator creating the proper signals. Then it will need reset with cat ET. And the version you need has to be the CAT software which is very expensive. The plug to connect to the machine and PC is $400 and the software is around $6600.
Just my 2cents worth. Misdiagnosis of the DPF filter being clogged is, unfortunately, common. Most times, its a poor or clogged differential sensor or skewed EGT sensor output. If it truly is restricted, the source is elsewhere. As an aside, even with ET, where would you get the authorized pass code for resetting the emissions system? Can we start at the beginning? What are the fault codes present?
Before continuing, read what HMC posted above VERY carefully.............. This line of machines is proof of the old adage of trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot. Nothing is easy to access, especially the DPF which came along a decade after the product was first introduced and is therefore an add-on. It's been posted before that there are companies around who open and clean DPFs then reassemble, or in some cases do an exchange programme for them. Does the possibility exist that you could R&I the engine and replace/service the DPF, then take the machine to the dealer and have them erase the DPF Codes.? All the necessary R&I procedures are available so it's not like you would have to go into it blind. I'm not sure that is 100% correct. The version of ET that is available to a customer is not the all-singing all-dancing Dealer version, and I'm almost certain it needs the dealer version to reset Codes generated by things like the DPF. Customers cannot buy the Dealer version of ET, at least not officially.
You won't be cutting out that DPF without removal of the engine regardless. Unfortunately it is about a 20 hour job. A guy who's done a few of them can get it down into 17-18 hour range. Too frequent regens can either be due to a faulty sensor reading or from the engine itself. Last time I had one of those machines throwing a code for too frequent regens it was because it was dusted and burning oil.
A general question about the 3000 hr DPF service. Does it normally require RR engine and replace the DPF, or is that due to component failure? I have a 289D with the same engine, (I believe) the guy I bought it from said Cat had to do a service at roughly 3000 hrs, but I didn't get the idea it was an 8k project. Not that it would surprise me . . . Mine has about 2400hrs and currently has no issues, just wondering how many pennies I should start stashing away
I've done it pulling the engine and on the 279D/289D I've done it by lifting the cab and removing the dividing wall. Each method takes about the same amount of time. I just hate removing the rads and trying to spline the pump back into the engine. Honestly its not an overly difficult job. Only bad thing is you'll need ET to reset the DPF info in the ECM. Also, I believe it has the DPF serial numbers programmed in as well so if one where to do it themselves they'd need to ensure they write that info down. S/N is pretty much inaccessible once installed IIRC.
What exactly needs to be done though? Does the DPF just get removed and replaced, or is it taken out to clean and then reinstalled?
Normally just a cleaning and reinstall. Cat does offer reman units IIRC. Its actually a 3 piece assembly. DOC, DPF and the outlet. You'd have to split them into their individual sections for cleaning. More or less just a handful of gaskets and possibly temperature sensors as they sometimes break off in the DPF. Pretty much all the parts you'll need. Highly advise checking the drive coupler if you have the engine out, they often are starting to show signs of fatigue after 3000 hours.
Pull it yourself... it’s not that hard edit: not sure why the photo loaded upside down...
As someone already said, pulling the motor will also give you a chance to replace this piece of *****... not sure what they were thinking when they designed this thing
How is the cleaning done? Is it something done by Cat in a machine or something, or can it be done manually?
Is that plastic?
Cat will probably try to sell you another DPF. There's places everywhere that clean them, just type it in Google and it'll probably give you a few places local to you that will do it.
Again, what fault code(s) are making you think the DPF is restricted, vs a sensor issue?
He Hey did you eve r find eb 37 eb 17 ? I am trying to do the same
•299 START REMOVING THAT HOG LOL (THE ENGINE) •CATEPILLAR 259-279. POSSIBLY 289. Years (2018/19 - 2023/24) *(NOT POSITIVE)* So make sure you check first! **DO NOT PULL ENGINE** •DPF CAN BE REMOVED FROM MACHINE IN 3 PIECES. With the right set of tools being the most common used. (Metric wrench/Socket set) bring a few extensions/ swivels / stubby wrench set and caps to remove the cooling pack - NOT NECESSARY BUT MAKES 10x more room and enjoyable for how unemployable it is! •That is a catepillar factory written statement. In a tight tight spot both itself and all mounting bolts. It’s doable though! •I just hit 4400hrs and got the regeneration maximum soot levels (limp mode) soot levels were @135% LOL. •Start by removing the cooling pack and capping each line as it’s removed. Your cooling pack consists of hydraulic fluid, coolant, and turbo boost intercooler. And you’ll need a 2nd hand or I went ahead and strapped it up x4 points and lifted off with my mini excavator. •After that’s gone, wow 20-30 mins, maybe an hour…. So you thought Not that bad but about 3-4 hrs off and 3-4 on… doesn’t sound ideal but beats a $8,000-$10,000 Catepillar repair bill and machine down for who knows how long. Grab a buddy and tell em let’s go have some fun. •So not sure of exact removal order as I originally planned to pull the motor but got curious, there’s a mounting bracket below DPF with (4) - (14MM) MAIN MOUNTING BRACKET BOLTS -PIC4REF- IF YOU HAVE SOME PATIENCE THAT PROCESS IS ABOUT 2HRS NONSTOP but I advise just suck it up the whole process sucks. Worst bolt is between exhaust muffler off turbo and firewall. Once that one is loose it’s game over. •Once the DPF (4) main mountain bracket bolts get removed with a few of the rear brackets removed individually (You’ll seee what I mean), some exhaust sensors (x2) and the DPF pressure sensor (x1) unplug all as they’re in the same spot and tuck them over DPF. Carefully locate the o2 style sensors on each side of the DPF and remove the one completely (LINE WRENCH WORKS BEST) from DPF Filter and leave resting with others. Now start removing the x16 through bolts on housing starting with the right side looking from the rear. Spin it as needed (TIGHT BUT DOABLE) •Now you’ll think oh yeah we don’t even neeed to take that other side off, let me tell you, unless your bending something, hoping and praying not to break something or just want to try it. Remove the last 8 bolts and it comes out WALL-AH MAGIC OF REMOVING THE DPF WITHOUT ENGINE! •I’m new to the forum and not sure if you can send private messages or post phones numbers so if your looking to (UPDATE / CLEAR ECM CODES - INSTALL **UPGRADE** DPF FILTER WITH AFTERMARKET SENSORS FOR BETTER FILTER CLEANING) shoot me a message!
At 4400 hours if you don't pull the engine and replace the drive coupler you will wish you did at some point in the near future . . .