Hi There, I installed a Caterpillar 3304 engine into my 215 Excavator, but with a different radiator. The radiator I used was from the old 3204 engine. I now have water coming into the sump. The diameter of the inlet pipe into the radiator is just that bit smaller. I wonder if this could have caused the head gasket to fail or one of the liners to fail. Can these engines use the 3204 radiator? Thanks in Advance....
Don't know the specifics on the BTU ratings on your radiator or the needs of the engine but unless it resulted in an overheat condition I would be thinking there was a "preexisting condition" in the 3304. First guess would be liners or liner seals, next head gasket problem or bad water pump seals with plugged weep hole. See post today titled "Leaking water pump solved". If oil is also going into radiator then I'd be checking oil cooler. This could also cause water in oil, but usually it's both ways or oil only in coolant with the cooler failure.
Hi Kshansen, Thanks for your reply. I dont think there is any oil getting into the radiator. And I dont think the engine overheated at any time because the temperature guage is working. As far as i know the water gets into the sump very quickly. The level on the dipstick shoots up in no time....just after running it for a few hours. Do you think I should try using Block Weld in it (That pour in chemical)? Thanks again.
I think you should find the real source of the leak before adding rad core clogger to it. Drain and drop the oil pan and pressurize the rad, you should see something. That is likely why the engine you got was for sale. Later Bob
:iagree:exactly I'd also pull the valve cover so you can look down the push tube holes to see if there is anything running down there. If the level goes up fast it should be an easy one to find. The hard ones are when the only sign of coolant is in an oil sample report! 3304 is a nice simple engine.
Ok..i might give that a try. I hope i dont have to remove the engine altogether to get at the oil pan bolts (The front bolts are blocked by the frame of the machine). How do you pressurize the Rad by the way?? Thanks, John.
Automotive testers will fit the cap and you can pump it up to 10 psi. Later Bob
OK, Thanks Bob.:drinkup
Take the plate off behind the water pump first and look for coolant laying in the cavity. Very common leak spot. Later Bob
Or if you have an air pressure regulator and air supply just set the regulator for about 10 psi and connect to a fitting somewhere in the cooling system. Maybe remove the water temp sender and hook up there? Fill cooling system to top of radiator tank and hook up the air. If you can see the weep hole for water pump poke in there to make sure it's not plugged.
Thanks a lot for the replies Bob & Kshansen. I have a compressor with a regulator so I might try that. My only problem is getting the oil pan off with the bolts in the position that they are. Thanks again guys.:drinkup
That is one of the reasons I was thinking of pulling the valve cover, might be able to see something there. Not sure how much work it would be but wonder if there would be a way to block off the water to the water pump to eliminate that from the system. Could you actually remove the pump then block of the water lines going to the engine and pressurize it? Or maybe remove water pump and oil cooler and put pressure to the engine? Just trying to think of ways to narrow it down to exactly where the leak is located. Another idea would be to pull engine so pan can be removed and you could see where the water is coming from. I know it sucks to think about pulling it back out but that could be the fastest way in the long run. I'd like to help but don't think you would want to pay my air fare to come over there!
Your fault is most probably just the water pump gland seal failed, check the weep hole is clear or clear it with a long screw or a drill bit by hand. tctractors
Is it easy to get at the weep hole? Im not sure where exactly it is:beatsme. Might be a good idea to take off the water pump and change that seal! Cheers for the offer kshansen but I think its best you stay put alright
Guess to try and answer that would need to know the S/N of the engine you have or maybe the S/N of what it was in when new. Cat has used an assortment water pump designs over the years. Some mount very different to the front cover, at least the 3306's I'm familiar with. Okay, if you change your mind just let me know a little early so I can get packed!
On the 3304-6 water pump the big bit is very close the same, there is 2 types of top outlet with 1 being staggered, the later outlet is straight without the step shape, the weep hole is easy to get to, its at the lower side position facing out, you cannot damage anything by poking about. tctractors p.s. a water pump rebuild kit in the U.K. is around £35 and is easy to fit in around 2 to 3 hours allowing for cleaning up parts etc.
Well you forgot to take in account the travel time if watchzeitgeist is going to have me fly in to do the job. So need to factor in an additional 10Hours. Actually the draining and refilling of the coolant could be half the work depending on how nasty dirty the machine is but as it was just installed should be fairly tidy. One reason I always tried to keep equipment I worked on as clean as possible makes finding problems and repairs much faster!
what all did you have to change? I have a similar problem. a bad 3204 engine and i have a good 3304 engine out of a d4 dozer. I was wondering what all you had to change to make the swap
Well both engines are for a 215 excavator. I kept the old bottom mounts from the 3204 radiator and bolted them to the mounts on the 3304. The bottom pipe was the same diameter so it fitted on ok, just had to extend it a bit to reach the radiator outlet. The top pipe was smaller on the 3204 radiator so I welded a smaller pipe to the 3304 engine outlet. I got the part from the air intake of the 3204 engine (Attached to the turbo). Then I made up some support bars for the top (To go around the radiator) and attached them to the support bars from the engine. Hope this helps
Did you have to change bell housings and motor mounts to get the 3304 engine to fit where the 3204 was? i have called Cat and they told me that i had to. they also said they did not think the pumps would mount. they thought the engines and bell housing set at a different level?
Is it a 215 excavator your working on or a Dozer? The Front mounts didnt need attention as they were the same. The back mounts were different though. I got the mounts (from the 3204) drilled so they could be bolted to the 3304, however they had to go on upside down (The corners needed to be cut with a grinder also). The sides of the Bell housing of the 3304 is about 2 inches smaller in diameter so you need to get a spacer plate made up to fit between the mounts and bell housing. When it came to fitting the engine to the machine we used two 4 (or five im not sure) inch high nylon spacers to fit underneath the mounts so that the Oil intake pipe at the pump could reach the hydrualic oil tank. It was just pure luck that we found those spacers lying about! I suppose you could make up some metal spacers as well. The pumps on the 3304 were from a 215c excavator so they were newer and the intake pipe was a bit higher If i remember correctly.
i am working on an excavator 215 that has a bad 3204. i have a spare 3304 engine out of a d4 dozer. i have talked to several junk yards and they say it can be done but not for sure how and what i need. What do you think?
Unfortunately i have no experience with the Dozer engine. The front mounts might be different. If you found a scrapped 3304 engine from an excavator then you could do it no hassle. You could get the front mounts, the bell housing (if you need it), and the flywheel. Also see if you can find a 215B parts book on ebay. That book covers both new an old hydrualic pumps. Here is a picture of the 3304 from an excavator...
A sad day for me, my D4H II started with a light ticking and the next thing I know is a rod out the side of the block. Question to anyone out there is it seems the 3204 has a bit of a dubious reputation for being not so great. Is a 3304 in a series II machine a viable option? The question is what mods if any are required to get a better engine in a machine with 6000 hrs. I think an upgraded radiator is inline, but how about the engine to transmission adapter? Direct fit or not? Seems with all the bad press on the 3204 why go back if I can fit with a better engine.
The exact same thing happened our engine. A rod came out of the block. My 3304 is running fine with the 3204 radiator (Touch wood!). Compare the transmission adapter part numbers in this manual.....it might give you an idea what changes need to be made. http://www.ebay.com/itm/CAT-CATERPILLAR-D4H-LGP-SERIES-II-TRACTOR-DOZER-PARTS-BOOK-MANUAL-8PB-9DB-/321692072029?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ae657785d With this Manual...... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Caterpillar-D4H-Series-III-Tractors-Parts-Manual-Cat-S-N-8PJ-9GJ-/121699511554?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c55db2d02 I have a caterpillar filter guide that tells you which machines had which engines installed in them.... It says both the D4B and the D4C had a 3204 engine..... The following machines had a 3304 installed...... D4E D4H 2AC1-3999, 3AC1-3999, 8PB1-3999, 9DB1-3999 D4H II powered by 3304 Engine 9DB1-UP D4H III JA powered by 3304 Engine 8PJ1-UP, 9GJ1-UP D4H LGP powered by 3304 Engine 2AC1-3999, 3AC1-3999, 8PB1-3999, 9DB1-3999 4NK1-UP D4H LGP II powered by 3304 Engine 2AC4000-UP, 3AC4000-UP 8PB4000-UP, 9DB4000-UP D4H LGP III powered by 3304 Engine 8PJ1-UP, 9GJ1-UP D4H XL powered by 3304 Engine 8PJ1-UP, 9GJ1-UP
Thank you, very helpful. My D4H II is serial#8PB0 w/ Powershift transmission. If it's doable I'm all in. I'm a little under educated on the different 3304's out there though. I think I'm after 3304 9z?? This would be the same engine installed in '93 on from what I gather in the D4H XL III. Somewhere in the area of 125 hp vs. the 95hp I had in the 3204. That's a nice upgrade in ponies, particularly when it's in a more dependable engine. The XL III has a bigger torque converter. Would 125 hp be compatible with my tranny? I can't see how as long as temps stay down. I see there's an 85 hp 3304 and don't want to go down in horsepower but I don't know the specifics in terms of internal components in the 3304 to make such a range in horsepower. Any pointers on what to look for when trying to chase down a 3304 for my dozer? I really appreciate the help.