I've got an opportunity to purchase a CAT 420D, but I don't know what to look for when I inspect it. The unit is an '02 model, with low hours: 422 . I don't know much more than that right now, but I'd like to know more about what to look for when I get there. I haven't operated a backhoe loader since I was a much younger man -- my Dad was a dairy farmer -- so I feel like a real rookie now. Regardless, I never actually did any mechanical repairs on his machine, so I guess I am a rookie when it comes to buying one of my own. Knocking, smoking, tire condition, leaks, the electrical system and overall appearance seem simple enough to inspect, but the more technical issues -- like pins and bushings -- are not something I have any experience with. I've got a narrow window of time to look at the machine, so I'd really appreciate any helpful advice you might be able to give me. By the way, I fully understand that operating a machine and working on one are two entirely different things, so please feel free to school me as much as you care to ... I'm all eyes Thanks very much for your time and your consideration ...
with a machine with only 422 hrs. there shouldnt be many problems at all, its practically new. When I purchased my 01 fermec(terex) 760 it had 180 hrs. and i pretty much got a new machine for a lot less. If the machine was an owner/operator, which by the hours it might be they are usually well cared for. good luck
Thanks John, As the machine is really an unknown quantity at this point, I'm not really sure what to make of it. Just in case, though, do you know much about checking pins and bushings? Any thoughts appreciated ... By the way, how do you like your Terex 760? Have a great night ...
with only 422 on the meter i probably would not even bat an eye about it as far as wear,when i got my case it had 500 more hr's on it and it was really nice just a few years newer.
Look for these things to start. #1 Why is it for sale (this may be a very simple and logical answer, but inquiring minds want to know) check oil (discoloration, fluid separation), radiator (discoloration, fluid seperation), hydraulics (discoloration, fluid separation), differential. Look over engine for leaks, discoloration of paint (overheating) Look at the undercarriage for dents, anything broken, badly scraped
Hello up in Stoneham Cat320, We're in the process of buying forested property in western Mass, and the 420D would be used for various purposes out there. First, I'd like to get some "state specific" information about owning & operating a machine such as this in Mass. The 420D will be used privately, for now, but one never knows about the future. In other words, I have no plans to use it anywhere but on the farm at this point. Do you know of any reason why I'd need to register it if it stays on our own property? I'd also like to ask you about transporting a backhoe in Mass. I see that you own a 1-ton Ford. What type of trailer do you use to move your machine? Is your truck a dually? Does Mass require special licenses and insurance for you to pull the entire rig (machine and all)? I suppose I could just have the unit "dropped off," and sort of let things lie, but seeing that you live in Mass, I thought I'd ask you for your thoughts in this regard. Please feel free to comment as much as you care to ...
Thanks hose Great advice, Hose! The machine is for sale because the guy that owned it passed away. The woman that now owns his business (his widow) is now selling off the assets. As for the rest, I'll have to check all of them as soon as I can. By the way, I'm assuming that by "discoloration and fluid separation," you mean that I should look for foreign liquids -- such as water or coolant -- that's mixed with whichever fluid I'm checking. Is this correct? Also, when you mentioned the "differential," did you mean that I should test the gear oil in that as well? Thanks again ...
case 580 superL hey guys im a new member to this site and i need to get my 3 posts in before i can start my own thread so i figured i would jump into this one. I have been running a case 580 super L for a guy. He charges me hourly for the machine and then i can go charge whatever on top of that rate for the jobs that i do. he wants to sell the machine to me now. it has 25% tires but only 1750 hours on it. what do you think it is worth? i was going to offer him $30,000 for it. Do you think that is a good price?
You are right on! It seems that you 'know' the machine and who owned it, so you would likely know if it had been swamped or somthing like that. head gasket and stuff. But you are pretty close to this machine so there should be nothing like that going on.
The machine is out of state A friend of mine "heard about" this machine and turned me on to it. Actually, I've only corresponded with the woman who inherited it and she doesn't know much about the machine, which seems reasonable under the circumstances. :beatsme Therefore, I'm sort of starting from scratch (so to speak) with the machine. Thanks again for the solid advice. And to everyone else reading this, please keep it coming ...
Ok logger, that does kind of change things. 422hrs, is the meter working!!! Now you're going to have to check on that. You can get a general look at the machine and see if its really at 422hrs or 2422. Once you get to it make a determination if it really seems to be 422 or if the meter could be out. 422 is not out of the question but we all agree that it would be sweet to be at 422 again. When are you going to see it? Can your friend take some general picutres for you?
Once again, all great points. I've seen four photos of the machine and it looks pretty good. Other than surface rust on both buckets, the rest of the machine looks rust free. One of the photos shows the meter reading, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's accurate, so that point is well taken. I'm trying to make arrangements at the moment, but I hope to see it this week. I just want to do all I can to become better informed before I travel to see the unit. Many thanks for being so helpful ...
I think every man should own a backhoe, even if it is a Cat!!! Ha, No problem at all. I'm glad we can help out and put some things on your mind. Does it have an enclosed cab? EROPS Do you know about the "IT" models? would be a 420D IT Integrated Tool carriers, basically a quck-detach bucket system to switch you to forks and other attachments.
A big thing will be to check for dry rot on stuff(tires, hoses, etc.) If the hours are accurate, it has sat for most of its life and some things will have dried out. It's not a deal breaker, but something to be aware of. Ours had just under 3,000 hrs when we bought it and now has almost 4k. We changed all the fluids, e-stick wear plates, and had to replace one rotten hose. The only major unplanned thing was a new turbo, because we hadn't been letting it cool down before shutting the machine off. The fan for the cab is a little quirky, but 4k hrs of dust will do that to any machine. Other than that, I wouldn't trade it for any other machine. Smooth controls and tons of engine and hydraulic power. Click Here to see the tree we took out
Man, you are insightful! Do tell ? Do you something about CATs that I don't? Please don't hold back By the way, great call on the cab. No it doesn't, and that's the rub. The machine will be used in the northeast and, as we all know, it gets cold up here. I realize that it probably sounds a bit crazy, but I'm also researching what it would take to enclose the cab. I'm assuming that an actual CAT cab would be very dear indeed, so I'm looking into the alternatives. In fact, I just got off the phone with a guy down in NJ (Fremar) who gave me a quote. I'm also assuming that I'll have to get a heater as well. I've seen the 420D IT on the web and it looks great! Is there any way to add this great "quick-tach" feature to a plain 420D? opcorn
Not a single thing I can say bad about Cat backhoe's. I'm just a Case fan and we get enough ribbing so when we have the opportunity to throw a jab, well you know. I came up through the Case ranks and they have just been good to us. I've only been on one Cat (416C). Until the 2 hurricane's I had a local Case dealer and had a nice relationship with them. (even though we've only bought 4 machines from them or anyone else for that matter). I don't know about adding a cab, it's probably very $$$. Adding 'IT' will simply be ridiculously expensive. Plumbing, new loader arms, new pilot station levers and on and on.
Great photos! Thanks, 420. Your advice is also very well taken. Yes, the machine probably has spent more than its share of those 5 years dormant. I found your words about the turbo to be very educational as well; I forgot all about that. As for the job you depicted in your gallery -- great going! I too will be using the machine for clearing trees and stumps (along with various digging jobs). The only difference that comes to mind, however, is that I need the trees for lumber. We're blessed to have quite a few 1st grade and veneer grade saw logs in our trees, so I have to be careful with most of them ... which probably means a lot of regular old stumps to dig up. How much of a pain is removing stumps for your 420D? By the way, your machine has ours beat all to [you know what] in one important area: a cab . I'm green with envy. ointhead
Gotcha! The machine I used back on the farm was a Case as well, and I don't remember my Dad having a lot of trouble with his either. One thing's for sure, though. I'd be a right dimwit to criticize anyone's machine. God bless all the folks that do this sort of work. By the way, you mentioned the "2 hurricanes." Where are you located? Are you in the NOLA area? opcorn
We are based in Beaumont, TX. But our locations hit the hardest were Sabine Pass, and Newton. Water/Wind destroyed the shop in sabine pass. Downed tree removal almost put us under in Newton.
You do need a mass hoisting license to run a machine. Also its not worth it buy a truck and trailer to move it around once in a while. I'd look for an older truck if your going to use it on site. Go to the Massachusetts dept of public safety webstie to get the application for the hoisting license.
It will dig out stumps are good or better than any other backhoe. The lifting power of the backhoe end is limited by stability first. What that means is you can pick up enough weight to lift the front end up or fill the front bucket with dirt and get more lift farther out. Some machines are hydraulically limited, meaning you run out of power before lifting the other end. With the bucket filled, I can dig stumps out almost as far as it will reach. Obviously different trees have differing root systems, so some are easier than others. We have no A/C, so summers are a little warm, but the heat works fine in the winter. I should also note, it is one heavy beast. Ours with the e-stick, heavy counterweight up front, 4n1 bucket, cab, drive shaft guards, and stabilizer cylinder guards weighs in right at 20,000lbs. Needless to say, mud is not its friend. Not that a 16k lb Cat, Case or Deere will be a whole lot better, but more weight never helps.
Hey Handlogger - welcome to the forums.:drinkup I have an '03 420DIT and it has been a good machine. One thing about the D model cat backhoes is the parking brake - extremely week. Of course a parking brake not working on a backhoe is really not an issue with so many parts you can stick in the ground. The only other issue I have had is the A/C, not a problem with an open cab- obviously. One suggestion would be to take fluid samples: oil, hydraulic, coolant, gear oil, etc, and take them to the local Cat dealer for analysis. I fluid test all of my machines at every fluid change and it will tell you if something is wrong. I think the charge for each analysis is $12, when the machine is out of warranty (it is included while the machine is under warranty). Cheap insurance when buying a new machine, but be careful to take a clean sample at the correct operating temperature, as specified in the manual. If the machine checks out with 422 hours and the price is right, it should supply you with years of service.
Welcome to HEF kwag82! :drinkup
Please keep it coming Thanks for the words, Mike. I'm very glad that someone from the state I'm planning to work in wrote back. There's nothing like getting it directly from the source ... Thanks again to you as well, Cat420. It sounds like the 420D is one serious backhoe indeed. Obviously, you would know. I'm still jealous about the cab, though ... and great job on those trees and stumps! Thanks for the warm welcome, CM. Your suggestions are very well taken indeed. Can you elaborate a bit on how the samples are actually taken? If not, do you know where I could read the procedure for doing this? And thanks to anyone I may have missed. And to anyone reading this, please keep it coming. It really means a lot to us ...
Try calling the local CAT dealer (or the selling dealer - hopefully it's the same) and talk to someone in product support. Give him the serial# of the machine and see if he can give you some info on it. He may have info on warranty work or PM work that would help confirm/deny the indicated hours. You can also arrange for them to go look at the machine for you to give you feedback on it (they can take oil samples for you). This'll cost you a little bit (not bad) but I think it would give you some piece of mind.
Another great post! Thanks for the fine advice, Gmads. I've got the serial number(s) from the machine, so this might be a great path to take. Have you heard of CAT techs going "on the road" to check out a piece of equipment? If that's really possible, it seems to me that it would be well worth investing in! Really helpful post!
Having someone out from Cat is expensive. I've had them out and the rates they charge are ridiculous. Do you know any local mechanics?